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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    What? It's a wagon. It's just kinda short.



    I've always liked those Audi Allroads. But, I hear they can get expensive to keep running.
    MC Shawn you're one of my favorite posters on here, however, that is not a wagon.
    NTFTC

  2. #302
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    Oh come on man!

  3. #303
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    What makes it a hatch is the wheelbase and no rear overhang. Wagons have the wheelbase and overhang to give you a useful rear cargo area.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    Oh come on man!
    Everything's going to be okay...just post it in the "sports cars that you haul your bike in" thread...
    NTFTC

  5. #305
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    Lol !

  6. #306
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    We had a chance to visit some dealers while up in Portland for Thanksgiving. Drove the V60XC and the Golf Alltrack.

    We really like the V60. Good power, quiet, solid, good handling, comfortable seats, good rear seat room, sharp looking, and with the new for 2017 2.0L inline 4 cyl turbo pretty fuel efficient (35 hwy IIRC). The one we actually drove was a new stock 2015 or 16 demo with only a couple hundred miles on it. It had the old inline 5 turbo and was marked down significantly.

    The Alltrack was nice and certainly less expensive, but it felt like it too. The new 1.8 tsi engine had less umph than the Volvo's, especially off the line.

    Leaning towards the Volvo. Any reason to not get the older inline 5 other than less fuel efficient? Any reason to be leery of the new 2.0L turbo? It has the same hp rating (240 hp) and nearly the same torque, but gets 5-7 more mpg. It gets 3-5 mpg more than the Alltrack as well with 70 more hp. Win win.

    I was really smitten by the R. Good looking car and even more sporty. $53,000 though. Ouch.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-volvo-v60r.jpg  

    Last edited by KRob; 11-28-2016 at 04:14 PM.
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  7. #307
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    I think you should wait for the V90 Wagon

  8. #308
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    I love my R Design V60. My T6 is Polestar tuned. Goes like stink. I like fast so didn't consider the T5 after driving the cross country and thinking it was a little underpowered. The ride quality is good for our crappily maintained roads. The suspension feels a tad soft when you really push it hard around corners. But the cargo space is handy. I was turned off by the alltrack once I saw it didn't come with the more powerful 2.0 engine. As for the V90. Beautiful but a big vehicle. The infotainment is a big upgrade but engines are the same.

  9. #309
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    I would Google around for reliability info on the Volvo. I had a 2000 S80 and it was the second worst car I've ever owned (after a 92 Hyundai), and I've had a lot of cars. It was actually very nice inside and out, but by 100k miles it was in rough shape and had an insane amount of work done on it already. Any drive longer than 2 hours was a gamble. I seem to recall my parent's 242DL being problematic too. There were a lot of clever ideas on the S80 which didn't last. It was the first year of the model though, and I know they "fixed" stuff for the following years. I dumped it when the alarm kept going off while driving and the transmission started slipping and shifting harshly. I found a disturbing quantity of Volvos from that era at the junk yard with < 130k mi. I swore Swede's should stick to furniture after that, but I ended up with a Saab 900 two years ago. Not as nice, but fun and the engine+tranny keeps going, though everything outside the engine bay is falling apart. Once the Saab dies, I'll be looking for a AWD, manual wagon under 5 grand.

    In case any wonders why I put up with the Volvo, I got a smokin' deal and figured it would "impress" the soon to be father in law more than my beat up Toyo pickup and motorcycle. I still have the pickup and motorcycle.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    Any reason to not get the older inline 5 other than less fuel efficient? Any reason to be leery of the new 2.0L tubo?

    I was really smitten by the R.
    I have an '05 V70R with 240,000KM. The engine has not given me any issues. The body looks great and fasteners can still be undone even though it's been exposed to Canadian winters and a lot of salt.

    The R is 300HP with HP turbo v.s. 265 in the regular V70 2.5T. I mention this as one of the dealer mechanics told me that they have customers with mods to 400+HP and haven't seen reliability issues.

    As with most turbos, a soft foot rewards you in the mileage department. I do use 2 litres of oil between changes (I do them at about 8,000KM - or the second time it asks for a quart of oil between changes)

  11. #311
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    The new T6's like mine are actually 2.0s with turbo chargers and superchargers and 8 soeed box. My wife has a 15' with the 3.0 V6 Turbo. It's smoother but was less fuel efficient, 6 speeds and only a few more horses stock

  12. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    The new T6's like mine are actually 2.0s with turbo chargers and superchargers and 8 soeed box.
    Oh yeah, the salesman did mention that. No wonder I was smitten with the R. I like fast as well. The super charger really gets rid of any low end lag from the turbo (not that there was much).
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  13. #313
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    And the polestar tunes are about $1000 and can not affect warranty unlike other aftermarket tunes.

  14. #314
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    And the polestar tunes are about $1000 and can not affect warranty unlike other aftermarket tunes.
    The R delivers 300 hp, correct? What does the Polestar tune add?
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  15. #315
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    I'm not sure about HP and don't really care. I'm way more interested in torque and being able to use it all in the mid range. It adds about 25 lb feet but also makes the throttle way more responsive and the shifting quicker and it keeps it in gear whilst cornering hard. It's definitely noticeable over stock. I flirted with V8 Mustangs and Camaros and Chalengers. Whilst I love the V8 rumble the max torque is just not there at low RPMs like in turbo / supercharged cars. I like that you don't have to work the revs as much.

  16. #316
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    So I sold my blue BMW:



    And got another car:



    Wait a minute, is that another BMW wagon?

    It is, but this one has something special that you usually don't find on wagons.



    Enhance:



    Rawr! I super pumped to be back in a stick shift car! Of course I just broke my right collarbone so shifting is interesting right now, but that'll heal and then I'll be double clutching like I should be instead of granny shifting.

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    So I sold my blue BMW:



    And got another car:



    Wait a minute, is that another BMW wagon?

    It is, but this one has something special that you usually don't find on wagons.



    Enhance:



    Rawr! I super pumped to be back in a stick shift car! Of course I just broke my right collarbone so shifting is interesting right now, but that'll heal and then I'll be double clutching like I should be instead of granny shifting.
    No need to double clutch, just heal and toe. Up front that is. Camel toe in the back!

  18. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    No need to double clutch, just heal and toe. Up front that is. Camel toe in the back!
    Sorry, that was a fast and furious quote.

  19. #319
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    Nice. Truly unicorn status. How long did it take you to find it?

  20. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristian94568 View Post
    Nice. Truly unicorn status. How long did it take you to find it?
    A long ass time. The majority of these are priced in the true crackpot range 5-15k above KBB. This one was listed right at KBB, so I hopped a flight out and drove it home.

  21. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    So I sold my blue BMW, And got another car.

    Wait a minute, is that another BMW wagon?

    It is, but this one has something special that you usually don't find on wagons.

    Rawr! I super pumped to be back in a stick shift car! Of course I just broke my right collarbone so shifting is interesting right now, but that'll heal and then I'll be double clutching like I should be instead of granny shifting.
    Congrats. I looked for at least 1.5 years for an E91, manual, sport package car, RWD preferred. I drove one locally and it was amazing but missing a few important options and pricey with high miles. After that every car that came up for sale was either way overpriced, too far away, or missing some combination of colors or options that I wanted. Sport package was a must for me, the seats are much better. I was probably being way too picky, but that is how I am. I ended up getting a new Golf R instead, and it's fun to drive while being useful but the E91 has a really nice combo of sportiness, comfort, and utility that is nearly unmatched.

  22. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustMtnB44 View Post
    Congrats. I looked for at least 1.5 years for an E91, manual, sport package car, RWD preferred. I drove one locally and it was amazing but missing a few important options and pricey with high miles. After that every car that came up for sale was either way overpriced, too far away, or missing some combination of colors or options that I wanted. Sport package was a must for me, the seats are much better. I was probably being way too picky, but that is how I am. I ended up getting a new Golf R instead, and it's fun to drive while being useful but the E91 has a really nice combo of sportiness, comfort, and utility that is nearly unmatched.
    Yea, I used to have a 2006 Sport Package RWD sedan and it was amazing. I kick myself all the time for selling it. At the time, I figured I could always pick up something like it in the future, but BMWs have really changed for the worse and I was relegated to the used market to find a car that I wanted.

    The sport seats are really nice, and I don't have them, but I plan on putting some M3 seats in. I really want a sport package steering wheel for it too, but the zsp airbag costs a damn fortune (~800) and I won't buy a used one.

  23. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    Yea, I used to have a 2006 Sport Package RWD sedan and it was amazing. I kick myself all the time for selling it. At the time, I figured I could always pick up something like it in the future, but BMWs have really changed for the worse and I was relegated to the used market to find a car that I wanted.

    The sport seats are really nice, and I don't have them, but I plan on putting some M3 seats in. I really want a sport package steering wheel for it too, but the zsp airbag costs a damn fortune (~800) and I won't buy a used one.
    I did also test drive a 2014 328 wagon but the F31 platform got too big and lost a lot of the sportiness of the E91, even though it is more powerful and faster. I also considered swapping the sport seats & steering wheel into an E91 but the hassle and cost made it seem easier to just buy a car with those already equipped. It's unfortunate they are so rare.

  24. #324
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    I managed to find an 08 e91 328xi with a 6 speed manual, sport package, last spring, I jumped on it, even though it has a few too many miles on it than I would like.
    I really like it, the stock suspension was trashed, so I threw on some ST coilovers, ride MUCH better, and doesn't bottom out anymore (it was brutal before).
    Its got 210k on it (kms), and I really want to keep it a while as I know I won't find another.

  25. #325
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  26. #326
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    Nice! A4 or S4? From the mirrors looks like an S4, but no V8 badge? Then again, I have the same mirrors on my A4 3.2 manual, so it's tough to tell! Had a custom hidden hitch built for mine that gives a bit more ground clearance.

  27. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Nice! A4 or S4? From the mirrors looks like an S4, but no V8 badge? Then again, I have the same mirrors on my A4 3.2 manual, so it's tough to tell! Had a custom hidden hitch built for mine that gives a bit more ground clearance.
    Hi! Its a Stage 2 B7 A4. Caps are from a S4 Lowered on ST coilovers and peelers from a A6.

  28. #328
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    Nice. What tune ? I had a GIAC on my Audi when I had one.

  29. #329
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    Nice. What tune ? I had a GIAC on my Audi when I had one.
    Awesome. GIAC is a good tune. I have a custom written file that works super well with my upgraded high pressure fuel pump and high flow cat.

  30. #330
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    Even better. I had Cobb tune on my BMW 135i and now a Polestar on my Volvo. Aftermarket ECU tuning is the best.

  31. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    Even better. I had Cobb tune on my BMW 135i and now a Polestar on my Volvo. Aftermarket ECU tuning is the best.
    Nice!! Yeah it makes a huge difference.

    Thinking of going into a Volvo V90 Wagon after my Audi retires (or Audi decides to do manuals again or brings the RS6 to the US market)

  32. #332
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    So I sold my blue BMW:



    And got another car:



    Wait a minute, is that another BMW wagon?

    It is, but this one has something special that you usually don't find on wagons.



    Enhance:



    Rawr! I super pumped to be back in a stick shift car! Of course I just broke my right collarbone so shifting is interesting right now, but that'll heal and then I'll be double clutching like I should be instead of granny shifting.
    No matter what, a wagon with a stick is cool as hell. I don't know how much longer manual transmissions will be around (or manual driving for that matter), but for now enjoy operating a lever that mechanically engages the gears in the transmission (instead of being attached to a sensor where you ask the computer for a gear change).
    2016 Banshee Prime, 6-speed

  33. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    double clutching
    Heal and toe!

  34. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    Heal and toe!
    Cmon man, I'm working on the healing part...


  35. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    Cmon man, I'm working on the healing part...

    I said heal and toe, not shoulder and elbow. Do you know what heal and toe means?

  36. #336
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    Do you know the difference between heel and heal?
    I'm a mountain bike guide in southwest Utah

  37. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentfoe View Post
    Do you know the difference between heel and heal?
    I do, but my damn iPad doesn't!

  38. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    I do, but my damn iPad doesn't!
    but you can't proof read anything you type prior to hitting the reply button ?

  39. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    but you can't proof read anything you type prior to hitting the reply button ?
    Ha, yea. I thought he was making a play on words about my first collarbone comment so I replied with another. No biggie though.

    Anyway, I do know what heel-toeing is, however I have big feet and the BMW has close pedals, so it's more like "big toe-little toeing" for me.

    The double clutching comment was a direct quote from fast and furious:



    Which is not factually correct, which makes the quote funny. In a drag race, you'll want to speed shift with you foot on the floor instead of double clutching.
    Last edited by msrothwe; 12-20-2016 at 11:13 AM. Reason: embedded video

  40. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    but you can't proof read anything you type prior to hitting the reply button ?
    Did you happen to proof read this ^ ? At least I know proper capitalization and spacing. You can't blame that on a device.

  41. #341
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    Hah. And it's double de clutch if you're British.

  42. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    Hah. And it's double de clutch if you're British.
    I have a feeling he's dumbish!

  43. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    I have a feeling he's dumbish!
    Dumbish? Cmon dog, that ain't even right.

  44. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by msrothwe View Post
    Dumbish? Cmon dog, that ain't even right.
    Yeah I know, but it was funnier than shit!

  45. #345
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    Hello,

    I'm thinking about getting a 2017 Audi A4 Allroad. Can anyone please tell me if a large 29er trailbike could fit in the cargo area, rear seats folded down, without removing a wheel? I'll be coming from a Jeep Grand Cherokee (WJ) and my large Yeti SB4.5c fits with a little room to spare in its rear cargo area. Thanks to anyone who can help me out!

  46. #346
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    My '07 Subaru Legacy GTB 2.0 turbo


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  47. #347
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    You will need to turn bars at least 45 degrees to make a large bike fit.

    Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk
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  48. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by hak View Post
    I used to have a 2005 Subaru Outback XT Wagon (with 2.5T engine, chipped, estimated nearly 350hp). Wanted more go. So got this wagon 3 years ago. It definitely goes, running about 600HP now. Snow tires became a must for the winter (it's RWD only and big fat semi slicks are the warm weather tires), the winter kicks are pictured on OZ rims. Summer tires go back on next week.

    Finally got my roof rack situation addressed (3x 1UPs on factory aero cross bars) so I don't have to use our other car to take the crew biking away from home.

    Attachment 1070432

    "Wagons rule and girls drool" - my 9 yr old
    I have the same car. Are you able to operate your liftgate/hatch with the 1up racks on the roof?

  49. #349
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    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-15133768_10209622151783507_2068227076_o.jpg

    2001 BMW 325i with 5spd MT, 157k miles and running strong

    May be letting go of her soon... not enough room for bikes/gear.....

  50. #350
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    So we had our search narrowed down to the Audi Allroad, Volvo V60 cross country, and Golf Alltrack. Then when we were in Portland picking up our Jetta SW my wife notices a Subaru Outback on the lot. "Hey, what's that car? That looks nice."
    Oh, nothing. It's just an Outback.
    "Are they good cars?"
    A lot of people like them, but I'm not sure I could own one.
    "Why?"
    Well, they're kinda boring and come with a certain stigma.
    "What do you mean?"
    Well it just seems like the only people who own them are granola crunching, crappy-strappy sandals wearing hippies, and lesbians.
    (No offense to Outback owners or hippies or lesbians. I was just trying to throw her off the scent).
    "So what? They look nice. Let's test drive one. "

    Ugh. Ok. I've honestly been curious about the Outback for quite awhile so agreed to go drive one.

    This past weekend we were in Salt Lake and test drove a few cars including the Outback.

    Long story short: it was nice. The seats were comfortable. The interior was quiet and well appointed. It handled the 8" of snow on the streets with more confidence and sure footedness than the Volvo or the Audi and we could buy a brand new, fully loaded one for the price of a low mile, year or two old version of the other two.

    But it's boring and ubiquitous and practical. My wife is nothing if not practical and she really liked it. Ugh. I feel like you buy a car not just with your practical side, but with your heart.

    Now what? Even I have to admit that the Subaru makes more sense, but I'm just not sure I can do it.

    Help. Any practical reasons why I shouldn't buy the Subie?
    Last edited by KRob; 01-26-2017 at 10:24 AM.

  51. #351
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    Amusing story there KRob. I can't give you any advice but my story is that I drove a Toyota Tacoma Prerunner and when it was time for a new vehicle in 2014 I was dying to get a BMW 1 Series.

    It was hard to admit to myself, but that car wasn't practical for my needs so I figured I'd get another Prerunner or something that could do everything my Prerunner did, but with better gas mileage...and in my price range.

    Enter the Outback! Now, the Alltrack wasn't available then but I may have looked at that, your other 2 cars weren't in my price range.

    The car has been great, I actually like the way it looks, and while I don't care what other people think of it...I think that stereotype of the Outback driver is pretty much gone. I personally don't see that type of person in the Outbacks I see around my area. For the record, I do eat granola bars, but I don't wear crappy strappy sandals and I'm not a lesbian or hippie. My wife describes me as a redneck, but in a loving way...I guess because I take it out on the trails for maintenance and drive it to NASCAR races.
    Last edited by TheGweed; 01-26-2017 at 05:34 AM.
    NTFTC

  52. #352
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    I had an Outback. Granted that was a long time ago but I sold it because it was "tinny". Lots of road noise and it just felt like a can. I haven't been in the newer ones but I can guarantee that it will drive like most of the other Japanese cars. Followed that up with a Toyota Highlander and then a Mazda CX-5. Mostly wife's cars but I spend plenty of time in them. Of the bunch the Toyota was the most solid but it doesn't drive like a European car. Plain and simple.

    If you want something that is fun to drive go with the Audi or VW even if it's a wagon.
    "Fart in a paper bag, after eating the #17 plate from filibertos. STRAVA!" M77Ranger.

  53. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post

    Long story short: it was nice. The seats were comfortable. The interior was quiet and well appointed. It handled the 8" of snow on the streets with more confidence and sure footedness than the Volvo or the Audi and we could buy a brand new, fully loaded one for the price of a low mile, year or two old version of the other two.
    This, and the wagon utility, is a huge reason they are so popular. Here in Alaska, it's probably the #1 most common car. AWD imports are unusually popular here, because american manufacturers don't offer all their lines in AWD, like most european brands do. The subaru outback wagon will handle snow and sloppy driving conditions at least as well, if not better, than any other AWD car, and do it at 2/3rds the cost of the Euro models, more like 1/2 when you start talking about some of the higher end Volvos and Audis. The ground clearance and impressive AWD system is nearly unstoppable. We've gotten a huge dump recently and my BMW does alright, traction isn't an issue, but I have to be careful with depth of snow and especially bumps where it's packed into ruts/ice/braking bumps, etc. The outback will just eat all that up and not have any issues at all. If you want to get places in the mountains or in poor conditions, it's a great vehicle and that's where it's strength lies.

    The newer ones are quite nice, with their driving aids and interior features.
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  54. #354
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    Thats a pretty funny story. I had the exact opposite experience when we were looking for a wagon with my wife. Granted, we were looking for used vehicles, and it was a few years ago. My wife hated the subaru. Bland interiors, uncomfortable seats, tinny, underpowered. We ended up getting an A4 with the V6 and manual transmission and she loves it.
    The new 2017 Outbacks have addressed the 'tinny' issue I hear, but id make sure I get the 3.6 engine as I dont think I could live with the 2.5 with a fully loaded vehicle.
    If you want to be practical, the subaru or VW is the obvious choice. If you want to have big grin on your face every time you sit down in the car, id go with the Audi or Volvo.
    Also to be fair, we dont use the Audi on anything extreme in terms of fire roads or tougher to access spots (it just doesnt have the clearance). Lucklily I still have my FJ80 for the more adventurous days. If this is going to be your ONLY bike vehicle, the clearance on the subaru would also make more sense in your case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Thats a pretty funny story. I had the exact opposite experience when we were looking for a wagon with my wife. Granted, we were looking for used vehicles, and it was a few years ago. My wife hated the subaru. Bland interiors, uncomfortable seats, tinny, underpowered. We ended up getting an A4 with the V6 and manual transmission and she loves it.
    The new 2017 Outbacks have addressed the 'tinny' issue I hear, but id make sure I get the 3.6 engine as I dont think I could live with the 2.5 with a fully loaded vehicle.
    If you want to be practical, the subaru or VW is the obvious choice. If you want to have big grin on your face every time you sit down in the car, id go with the Audi or Volvo.
    Also to be fair, we dont use the Audi on anything extreme in terms of fire roads or tougher to access spots (it just doesnt have the clearance). Lucklily I still have my FJ80 for the more adventurous days. If this is going to be your ONLY bike vehicle, the clearance on the subaru would also make more sense in your case.
    I agree with what Buzz says..depends on where you live a little. CO and UT are great places for subies but If the grin factor takes over go for an audi. If you live in the mountains where clearance is of issue and or your roads are rough, even though i'm a Audi guy, i'd have to go with the subie.
    I've got an S4 Avant and clearance is a big issue (ripped 3 oil pan guards off in snow) and my suspension is VERY finicky and down right delicate (grant it i have a heavily modified track/autoX derived susp (Ohlins, 034 and too much more to list)). I live in a city with baaaad roads (DC) and spend average 2k a year on suspension bits and maintenance (mostly upper control arms, bushings and the like) and unfortunately for me i just don't have the knowledge, tools and patience to work on my car like i do on my bike (read $$).
    From what i hear subies (at least the old ones,) are easier to work on..just open the hood and the room you have to get around is much more..an audi requires 1 hour of pulling stuff out to get to where you need to get to.
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  56. #356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Bland interiors, uncomfortable seats, tinny, underpowered. The new 2017 Outbacks have addressed the 'tinny' issue I hear, but id make sure I get the 3.6 engine as I dont think I could live with the 2.5 with a fully loaded vehicle.
    Yeah, that was kind of the impression I had about subarus and frankly figured driving one would bear that out and my wife would drop it off the list, but this new Outback is roomy and impressively well appointed inside. And the seats (and the seat warmer in particular) were very good. Only the Volvo had better seats. My wife buys a car almost 80 percent on how the seat feels (and the color... rolls eyes).

    Oh, and yes, I'd definitely have to get the 3.6R. We drove the 2.5I and it with its CVT was underpowered in that big of car.
    Last edited by KRob; 01-26-2017 at 10:43 PM.

  57. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    This, and the wagon utility, is a huge reason they are so popular. ....
    The newer ones are quite nice, with their driving aids and interior features.
    We have really rough, snow/ice rutted roads in the winter for about a month or two every year. Big storms. Back roads aren't plowed or get a big mound in the middle then it all freezes and stays for weeks. You have to drive very carefully and with some planning to get around in the Jetta. The Outback would be almost as good as a full on FWD SUV for that stuff.

    I was impressed with the driving aids and interior features. They rivaled the $60,000 cars. Was not expecting that from a Subaru.
    Last edited by KRob; 01-26-2017 at 10:41 PM.

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    My wife would agree 100% on making sure the seats are comfortable. One of her pet peeves is how the drivers seat is almost ALWAYS, more adjustable/comfortable than the passenger seat. Why doesn't the passenger get the same controls and adjustments? They are in the car for just as long as the driver. To be fair she is on the smaller/lighter end of the human scale, so she finds the 'average' seat not comfortable for her.
    Often only the higher priced vehicles will have the same seats for driver and passenger.

    So that decides it for you then? Happy wife, happy life?

  59. #359
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    This would pretty much decide it for you then. You will be scraping that middle rut with the centre of your car in the Audi or Volvo. Sounds like you need the most clearance you can get. The recent 'snowmageddon' (which wasnt really much snow at all, just that we never get any, and when we do it is a shit show) we had here in Vancouver had me having to be very careful in the Audi in terms of clearance.

  60. #360
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGweed View Post

    Enter the Outback! Now, the Alltrack wasn't available then but I may have looked at that, your other 2 cars weren't in my price range.

    The car has been great, I actually like the way it looks, and while I don't care what other people think of it...I think that stereotype of the Outback driver is pretty much gone. I personally don't see that type of person in the Outbacks I see around my area. For the record, I do eat granola bars, but I don't wear crappy strappy sandals and I'm not a lesbian or hippie. My wife describes me as a redneck, but in a loving way...I guess because I take it out on the trails for maintenance and drive it to NASCAR races.
    Yeah, I don't want to pay what a new Volvo or Audi would cost, but have driven some nice lightly used ones that fall in the same price range as a new Alltrack or Outback. Having said that, warranty and repair issues would be more expensive (and more hassle since no dealers close) with the Euro brands.

    Old stereotypes die hard, but I agree, not many people drive outbacks around here (redneck/mining country) and none of the ones that do fit the stereotype.
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  61. #361
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    When I was shopping for a new car recently (had my eye on a Subie for a while), I looked at all the small AWD wagon / CUV types. I wanted something just a bit smaller and sportier looking than the outback, and bought a Crosstrek. Took it out in the recent snow, and it's incredibly capable. I also have to take it into some pretty rough areas for work, so the ground clearance ruled out some of my other choices. I opted for the limited for the leather, and nicer options. It's the first car in 24 years of vehicle ownership that I truly love, and wouldn't really change anything about it. They get dinged for being under powered, but I've never had any issues living here in the mountains. I was more focused on MPG than having a sports car in wagon trim, and I'm averaging about 28-29mpg now that it's just about broken in.

  62. #362
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockman View Post
    I had an Outback. Granted that was a long time ago but I sold it because it was "tinny". Lots of road noise and it just felt like a can. I haven't been in the newer ones but I can guarantee that it will drive like most of the other Japanese cars. Followed that up with a Toyota Highlander and then a Mazda CX
    The CX5 and Highlander (as well as the Q5) were on my list but the wife didn't want an SUV/Crossover this time. More of a lifted wagon. We loved the Jetta SW but needed/wanted AWD and a little more ground clearance.

    Fun factor: To be fair this will be my wife's car but since it will be our primary travel car I'll get plenty of seat time too. I got a 1st gen Tundra for my vehicle out of practicality (pretty much need a truck around here for hauling my dirt bike, the trash, wood etc, and beating around the back roads marking course).

    But I do fancy myself a bit of a car guy and at 55 am starting to have some mid-life crisis car desires. Maybe get her/us the Outback for our main car then buy something fun for me once the final kid leaves home (this summer!!!!).
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  63. #363
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    My wife would agree 100% on making sure the seats are comfortable. One of her pet peeves is how the drivers seat is almost ALWAYS, more adjustable/comfortable than the passenger seat. Why doesn't the passenger get the same controls and adjustments? They are in the car for just as long as the driver. To be fair she is on the smaller/lighter end of the human scale, so she finds the 'average' seat not comfortable for her.
    Often only the higher priced vehicles will have the same seats for driver and passenger.

    So that decides it for you then? Happy wife, happy life?
    Speaking of pet peeves. On our Jetta SW the passenger side visor doesn't extend to cover that spot towards the rear edge of the window when the sun is low and on that side. The driver side visor does. It drives my wife nuts! The Volvo almost got kicked off the list for that infraction alone. The Subie had it covered.

    I'm slowly talking myself into going with the Outback (You guys aren't helping.... but yes, happy wife, happy life), then working on getting me a fun car later (E46 M3, WRX STi , GTI, or E39 M5 or 540i wagon or something).

    To her credit she has let me exercise my car preferences to some extent even in our family/practical car purchases over the years. For instance she used to hate wagons and we've owned 5-6 of them over the years.

    Stay tuned. Our buy back appointment for the Jetta SW TDI is February 10th.
    Last edited by KRob; 01-26-2017 at 10:39 PM.

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    Sorry pal. I've got nothing bad to say here about the Subie. In fact, I wanted my wife to purchase an Outback, but she preferred the visibility of the Forester instead.

    The Outback can fit a 29er in the back easily. If you want some performance, get the 3.6R instead of the 2.5. The adaptive cruise control is very convenient and works even in bumper to bumper stop and go traffic. The new ones are not tinny at all. They're more like luxury wagons with full time AWD.

  65. #365
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    I love my R Design V60. My T6 is Polestar tuned. Goes like stink. I like fast so didn't consider the T5 after driving the cross country and thinking it was a little underpowered. The ride quality is good for our crappily maintained roads. The suspension feels a tad soft when you really push it hard around corners. But the cargo space is handy. I was turned off by the alltrack once I saw it didn't come with the more powerful 2.0 engine. As for the V90. Beautiful but a big vehicle. The infotainment is a big upgrade but engines are the same.
    I too, really like the Volvo wagons. My sister has a sedan. That turbo really has a kick to it.

  66. #366
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    ^ Thanks yes, over 300 horses out of a 2.0L is nuts. Kent, I cross shopped the the Allroad when I got my V60 and although list prices are similar I got a way better deal with the Volvo. If you push them they can work some great deals. The outback is a solid car just a little boring if you ask me. If it's your wife's car less important but for me I still get s buzz when I out my foot down in the T6. As mentioned I wouldn't want a T5 Volvo. I do think the heart should play as big a role as the head when it comes to cars!

  67. #367
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    The CX5 and Highlander (as well as the Q5) were on my list but the wife didn't want an SUV/Crossover this time. More of a lifted wagon. We loved the Jetta SW but needed/wanted AWD and a little more ground clearance.

    Fun factor: To be fair this will be my wife's car but since it will be our primary travel car I'll get plenty of seat time too. I got a 1st gen Tundra for my vehicle out of practicality (pretty much need a truck around here for hauling my dirt bike, the trash, wood etc, and beating around the back roads marking course).

    But I do fancy myself a bit of a car guy and at 55 am starting to have some mid-life crisis car desires. Maybe get her/us the Outback for our main car then buy something fun for me once the final kid leaves home (this summer!!!!).
    The buy back on the TDI is hard to pass up but it's just enough car to satiate the same crisis car desires. Luckily I have another vehicle for the snow so I think I'm going to keep it and pocket the 5K.
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  68. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    ^ Thanks yes, over 300 horses out of a 2.0L is nuts. Kent, I cross shopped the the Allroad when I got my V60 and although list prices are similar I got a way better deal with the Volvo. If you push them they can work some great deals. The outback is a solid car just a little boring if you ask me. If it's your wife's car less important but for me I still get s buzz when I out my foot down in the T6. As mentioned I wouldn't want a T5 Volvo. I do think the heart should play as big a role as the head when it comes to cars!
    There's a used 2015 V60r T6 with ~45k miles in Vegas for $30k. More miles than we'd like and still no awd or ground clearance, but this would tick my fun-to-drive mid-life crisis boxes. I think I'd rather pay $45,000-50,000 for a new one though if I could get them to come down that much.


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  69. #369
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    That's a lot of money. I just looked in Autotrader. I didn't realize they're quite so rare. I walked into my local dealer 10 minutes away and they had one. Looks like I got very lucky. The older 3.0L is quick. We have that in my wife's XC60. But the 2.0L I have is 8 speed and also way better on mileage and has the on / off when you're stopped (which you can disable) and an economy button which really helps fuel consumption on the freeway.

  70. #370
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    I'm loosing my mind. Comparing the VW Sportwagen and the Subaru Impreza. VW has bigger cargo area but with impending tariffs I don't know what that means for maintenance. The Subaru is now made in Indiana (where I do a lot of riding) but the infotainment system is app based and that (rant ending in get off my lawn). So the compromise is a used Outback and I don't need the 4wd/mpg trade off. There are so few choices...

  71. #371
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    2017 VW Alltrack 6 speed manual. VW load bars with Kuat Trio.

    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-alltrack.jpg

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    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-207833_10150143855851831_3068447_n.jpg

    another jetta in here - chip-tuned, 6 spd TDI
    it's been lowered, but in the near future, i'll be lifting it with tiguan and tow suspension and bigger tires. the back end really sags once i throw in road trip gear, bike/rack, and people in the back seat. doesn't help with the sub in there, too

    fun as hell car to drive, tho

  73. #373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner View Post
    2017 VW Alltrack 6 speed manual. VW load bars with Kuat Trio.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Wow, I didn't know the 6mts were available yet. When did you get yours?

  74. #374
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    I just saw this on VW Vortex!

  75. #375
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    Took delivery on Jan. 27. Long story short I was able to find a scheduled build in process at the factory in Mexico and put a deposit on it before it left the factory. Replaced a TDI Jetta sportwagen.

  76. #376
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    I call it the clam. Got a nice deal certified used. 1up racks going up top when cross bars come in.


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  77. #377
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    Ready to ride!


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  78. #378
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    We've had our new Outback for about a month now, so I guess it's time to update this thread.

    We got the Outback 3.6R Touring and had a Curt hitch installed. It really is a very nice appliance..... ur, I mean car. Not sure the Outbacks can still be considered wagons though. This car is very crossover/suv-ish.

    I got an E39 M5 as my consolation prize to help with the mid-life car crisis. So it all turned out well.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-img_1371.jpg  

    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-img_1345.jpg  

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    You horrible people have made me spend way too much time pursuing a wagon... but I got a '17 GTI instead. It's a hatchback, not a wagon, can I join the club now? I haven't stuffed a bike in it yet, but definitely a more entertaining drive on twisty roads than my Transit 350 WAGON which did not seem to qualify to join your club

  80. #380
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    We've had our new Outback for about a month now, so I guess it's time to update this thread.

    We got the Outback 3.6R Touring and had a Curt hitch installed. It really is a very nice appliance..... ur, I mean car. Not sure the Outbacks can still be considered wagons though. This car is very crossover/suv-ish.

    I got an E39 M5 as my consolation prize to help with the mid-life car crisis. So it all turned out well.
    You happy with your outback decision?

    I am killing 2 birds with one and getting an e61 bmw 535i xdrive wagon. Taking the risk with the n54 powerplant but biturbo power is an alluring temptress
    Quote Originally Posted by fitek View Post
    You horrible people have made me spend way too much time pursuing a wagon... but I got a '17 GTI instead. It's a hatchback, not a wagon, can I join the club now? I haven't stuffed a bike in it yet, but definitely a more entertaining drive on twisty roads than my Transit 350 WAGON which did not seem to qualify to join your club
    Getting closer. But I would give a pass as I like vw a lot

  81. #381
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    We've had our new Outback for about a month now, so I guess it's time to update this thread.

    We got the Outback 3.6R Touring and had a Curt hitch installed. It really is a very nice appliance..... ur, I mean car. Not sure the Outbacks can still be considered wagons though. This car is very crossover/suv-ish.

    I got an E39 M5 as my consolation prize to help with the mid-life car crisis. So it all turned out well.
    The M5 is a fun (and brave) choice. What year is it?

  82. #382
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    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by wsp4me23 View Post
    You happy with your outback decision?

    I am killing 2 birds with one and getting an e61 bmw 535i xdrive wagon. Taking the risk with the n54 powerplant but biturbo power is an alluring temptress

    Getting closer. But I would give a pass as I like vw a lot
    I had no real problems with my n54. Just had to replace coils frequently. As long as your shop is honest they'll diagnose the misfire and just replace one st a time.

  83. #383
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    Good to here. I am not new to "unreliable" german cars. Owned several audi 2.7t and as long as you are vigilant on maint and don't just let stuff go they repay with a smile.

  84. #384
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    PS get it tuned. I tried Cobb and GIAC. Just stage 1 though.

  85. #385
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    Oh ya that is of course a must. Cobb and JB4 tunes are on my radar. Leaning toward Cobb, ic and intake and done. KW v3 coilovers once shocks need replaced and an m5 rear sway. Extent of mods I will be doing which is enough. Gone full retard on too many cars so this is going to be very minimal. Maybe a mtech aero kit?

    Did you like your Cobb or GIAC tune better?

  86. #386
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    I liked flexibly of Cobb the best. Switching tunes was so easy. I tended to just run the aggressive linear throttle map the most. I'd go for a reflash versus piggyback like the JB4.

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    Was thinking same. Plus with Cobbs suite you get a functional code reader and other useful tools. Probably the route I will take.

  88. #388
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    The M5 is a fun (and brave) choice. What year is it?
    It's a 2001. It was owned by my son's BMW shop owner and is super clean.... but brave is right. Insanely expensive to maintain and repair. Fun is right too.

  89. #389
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsp4me23 View Post
    You happy with your outback decision?
    Yes. My wife loves it (except the mpg) and it's very functional for our needs. It looks nice, is well appointed inside (we got the full meal deal), and drives fine (though not that fun). I didn't fully appreciate how well the Jetta SW handled until I started pushing the Outback into corners a bit.

    In hindsight we could've gotten a new xc60 or V60r for what we paid for the two, but now we both have what we want.
    Last edited by KRob; 03-21-2017 at 11:52 AM.

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    We looked at the outback, forester, vw alltrack, golf sport wagon, etc...came to the conclusion we are just not brand new car buyers. Seeking out more car for the money, but with that comes more headaches sometimes.

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    We looked at the outback, forester, vw alltrack, golf sport wagon, etc...came to the conclusion we are just not brand new car buyers. Seeking out more car for the money, but with that comes more headaches sometimes.

    Recently sold my wifes s4 avant and it is tough finding a replacement. Regret it a bit.

  92. #392
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    I considered an S4 (4.2L V8) wagon for awhile, until I realized that it wouldnt be a good daily driver for the wife. The fuel consumption is terrifying and I didnt have the bottomless repair budget as a backup in case things started to go south with the engine.
    If its been well maintained, you hopefully wont have to worry to much about things like the VANOS, timing chain guides. Depending on mileage, you will want to do the rod main bearings as well.

    Have fun with it!

  93. #393
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    Yes. My wife loves it (except the mpg) and it's very functional for our needs. It looks nice, is well appointed inside (we got the full meal deal), and drives fine (though not that fun).

    In hindsight we could've gotten a new xc60 or V60r for what we paid for the two, but now we both have what we want.
    The new XC60 was recently announced. Looks pretty nice. My only beef with our Volvos are the center buttons for the infotainment. But that's addressed in the XC90 and new XC60 with a bigger touchscreen. I was also impressed with the price of the Thule (Volvo branded) cross bars and ski rack. I got the aero ones.

  94. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    I considered an S4 (4.2L V8) wagon for awhile, until I realized that it wouldnt be a good daily driver for the wife. The fuel consumption is terrifying and I didnt have the bottomless repair budget as a backup in case things started to go south with the engine.
    If its been well maintained, you hopefully wont have to worry to much about things like the VANOS, timing chain guides. Depending on mileage, you will want to do the rod main bearings as well.

    Have fun with it!
    The mechanic/shop owner is a super cool guy and I'd seen this car when were down there having work done on my son's 330ci and really liked it. Then it showed up on the local classifieds for less than I thought he'd sell it for. Several texts and sleepless nights later the deal was done. He's basically replaced everything as soon as it started to wear or show any signs of failure. Other than some very slight wear on the leather side bolster on the driver seat the interior is pristine including new shifter and all four power window regulators. No VANOS rattle, new radiator, belts hoses, water pump, thermostats, etc. I asked him what he thought might be the next thing to need attention over the next year or two and he said, "tires. Sooner if you smoke 'em".

    Of course, there's no way to predict every failure, but big repairs/maintenance items will really slash into my bike budget so I'm hoping it stays good for a long while. Yeah, definitely not going to be a daily driver.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  95. #395
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsp4me23 View Post
    I am killing 2 birds with one and getting an e61 bmw 535i xdrive wagon. Taking the risk with the n54 powerplant but biturbo power is an alluring temptress
    Ballsy! Just FYI, there were manual trans versions of these made, you can find them if you look.

  96. #396
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    Ya, the wife needs an auto, sadly.

  97. #397
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    The new XC60 was recently announced. Looks pretty nice. My only beef with our Volvos are the center buttons for the infotainment. But that's addressed in the XC90 and new XC60 with a bigger touchscreen. I was also impressed with the price of the Thule (Volvo branded) cross bars and ski rack. I got the aero ones.
    Yeah I saw that. Pretty sharp. I wonder how long before we see the new V60 wagon. I've seen the new V90 wagons (and the new Panamera Sport Tourismo!!!) and they get me all a twitter..... though too pricy for me.

    Mercedes is coming out with a new E class raised all-wheel drive wagon called the All-Terrain that might be pretty cool too.... though I don't think there are plans for a US release just yet. Some nice Diesel and hybrid options coming too. Maybe that'll be the next upgrade when the wife gets tired of the Outback.
    Last edited by KRob; 03-21-2017 at 01:39 PM.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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    www.stuckinthespokes.com

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    I like the V90 but it's big. I think the S60 sedan is next on the list for an update. So would assume a wagon too. But my V60 has the most modern engine / transmission. It's just the stupid telephone number keypad that annoys me. I tried an F-Pace really liked it. New RR Velar looks cool. Panamera Wagon looks nice. Sedans are fugly to me. I liked the Macan but small and very pricey with a few options but fun as hell to drive. New Q5 coming soon too. I love Wagons but some of these crossover SUV thingies are nice. My first car was a 78 Datsun Bluebird Wagon.

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    2010 V70 RD with Kuat carrier.

    Show us your WAGONS!!!!!!-fullsizeoutput_819.jpgShow us your WAGONS!!!!!!-img_4208.jpg

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    I was looking for a wagon recently that is fun to drive and not European. Currently own an Audi sedan and I am spending more on control arms than gas.

    Does not exist. I also tested the small crossovers (CX5, crosstrek…) they were lame as a lame duck. Handle like an SUV and not as much space as I hoped. When I tried 0 to 60 I actually gave up halfway.

    The last thing left to try is a used Acura wagon. No more new wagons in the US. Looks like wagons fell out of fashion for crossovers, which are not the best of both worlds, IMO the other way around.

    Is there any model that I missed or should I just give up?

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