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  1. #1
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    It's Official, no more Max 140 Leftys......

    Yep, no more will be offered, I think there's been some murmuring, and assumptions based on '08 info, but I just spoke with them, they will not offer the Max, anymore. Baffles me, as it worked much better than it's 110 DLR2 cousin, which was, and still is, plauged with issues. I guess it's a function of not being able to make enough, to keep up with demand, and since they offer more bikes with a 110 compatibility, that one stays, the Max, kiss it goodbye. I recommend hording behaviour starting today, or, sell me yours, as I LOVE this fork. Bad decision Cannondale, hmmm, one of many as of late. Sigh.......
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

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  2. #2
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    awwww...that sucks

    I might have to stock up on some parts Craig

  3. #3
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    Yeah, we saw it coming... it's sad. It was the best fork in it's travel range: light, stiff, trouble free, easy to work on... Does that mean my Prophet is worth more or less now?

    By the way Mendon, a friend of mine has been given the old 'we don't touch Lefties, we send them back to Cannondale for service' crap from a local shop (same shop has been servicing a Headshok of mine a while ago, I guess they are just getting lazy)... I suspect he needs a Quad Seal as his boot is filled with and thus leaks oil from the bottom, no more front brake, yuck... I think I'll have him order a Quad Seal kit and do the job for him. Do I need special tools to do that? Castle tool maybe? Okay now I'm the lazy one, there is a thread that expalains it all somewhere...

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  4. #4
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    Do I need special tools to do that? Castle tool maybe?

    Max, no special tools required. Silly DLR2's? Castyle tool needed. Ah, now I get it, the want to encourage Castle tool sales.......
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

    - FrostyStruthers



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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by MendonCycleSmith
    Max, no special tools required. Silly DLR2's? Castyle tool needed. Ah, now I get it, the want to encourage Castle tool sales.......
    LOL! They could have just made the castle tool needed to work on the Max!

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  6. #6
    shut up and RIDE!
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    no more Max 140? thats insane! I'm glad I have both of mine.
    '11 Surly Pugsley
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  7. #7
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    It's making me re-consider selling my Prophet at the end of the season...

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  8. #8
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    suck... thats all i can say. lefty is the main reason i ride cannondale. and now now leftys in europe and no max? ... whats next bikes made in Asia?

  9. #9
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    Let's all take a deep breathe.....

    HAAAAAA!

    Okay... now go read my R.I.P. post on the Max and pay attention to the comments posted...

    The Max may just be in a maternity vacation for a few months...

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  10. #10
    Like catnip for people
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    please tell me this is a sick joke!

  11. #11
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    Nope, no joke, and whilst I'd prefer to be as hopeful as Dan, it's just a pipe dream. They've killed it. To paraphrase my inside rep, whom I trust implicitly, always gives me the straight deal, " we've just found that other products Fox et al, offer are similarly competetive on performance, cost less, and allow us to offer consistent delivery times. Trying to make the Lefty using various outside vendors has become an increasing problem, QC issues, late delivery of parts, etc". All this was delivered with a feeling of reading from a script. Sounds as though they are being asked to toe the company line, as opposed to being sounding boards for alot of angry customers, and deliver the message to highers up, that the cheapskate method is unpopular with loyal fans. Guess I'll have to buy a Trek now.........
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

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  12. #12
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    This is sad, it's part of what makes Cannondale who they are, next it'll be the 110mm Lefty. Cannondale is loosing it's identity no doubt, and they're loosing me as a customer.

  13. #13
    7hz
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    Quote Originally Posted by MendonCycleSmith
    Trying to make the Lefty using various outside vendors has become an increasing problem, QC issues, late delivery of parts, etc".
    I wonder if the Fatty will go the same way? Will Cannondale drop all their custom forks?

    I will agree with the company line - the QC sucks in a massive way! Two Fatty forks shipped half way round the world, one fails in 1 month, and the replacement doesn't even make it out the bike shop door... that is hopeless.

    I dunno what QC issues the Max had though, I though it was a more reliable one?

    have to also wonder why C/dale don't make these fork components in house, I don't understand how hard that would be, just have to machine the components and fit together surely? Not as if they are cheap after all...

    Quote Originally Posted by jiar577
    This is sad, it's part of what makes Cannondale who they are, next it'll be the 110mm Lefty. Cannondale is loosing it's identity no doubt, and they're loosing me as a customer.
    Well, they may have lost me in about a weeks time, as I am on the verge of handing back my 2 1/2 month old Caffeine with it's non-working Fatty. Fuggin shame as I love it and don't want to swap it out, but what hope is there? 1 1/2 months without a working fork, the summer is almost over and this has seriously messed up my rides. Shame.

  14. #14
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    Omigod.

    This is horrific.

    The Cannondale that I have known is changing, and I don't like it.

    Damn you King James!

    This is all sounding like pressure from the higher ups. Not letting Cannondale do it as it always has... Getting rid of the "lets be innovative and different" ... In favour of the "Hey it's cheaper to get someone else to make it" WTF!

    First a Taiwan made Cannondale, now getting rid of the lefty because it's too expensive???
    DAMN YOU!!

    (Can you tell I'm unhappy? )


    I predict that all cannondales will have boring names like "big hill", "tree jumper", all will be made in Taiwan by Merida and will cost twice as much as they do today.

    *sigh*

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7hz
    I dunno what QC issues the Max had though, I though it was a more reliable one?
    I couldn't agree more. Not that I'm some kind of expert on Lefty Max's, but I always thought the Max was the more reliable fork. I always hear about the Speed/DRLs with the problems.

    I mean, I can possibly understand their logic. Drop it from the All mountain range because it's cheaper to just use a Fox( 140mm + travel and all), keep it for the purists who want lightweight, stiff forks on their XC machines... But this is just bullsh*t

    If it's being dropped to be replaced by something better (A lefty 170mm maybe? ) , well fair enough. I'll be happy...

  16. #16
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    wow. this is absolutely idiotic on cannondales behalf.

    first, anyone who rides the 140 max knows there is no comparison so the argument that there are comparables is purely based on the numbers (and i mean these $$$$$ numbers). probably a decision made by some roadie MBA.

    second, in a time where the 140 max is finding increasing usage and appeal as a 29er fork in an emerging 29er market the 140 max is going to be discontinued ???? ?????? I dont have a MBA from Wharton but this seems silly to me .......

    soon cannondale will have none of the qualities that keep myself and many other customers coming back - MADE in the USA (not that bikes made in other countries are somehow inferior) and INNOVATION. HELLO EXECUTIVES innovative means different from what the rest offer - oh wait c-dales executives arent reading this - their probably driving their boxter to the golf course

    idiots
    Last edited by elgordo; 08-13-2007 at 05:28 PM.

  17. #17
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    I hope Cdale people take a look at this thread.

  18. #18
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    I'm thinking about buying an 08 caffeine F1..my first bike...now i'm gettin scared!!

  19. #19
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHKNPLUKR
    I'm thinking about buying an 08 caffeine F1..my first bike...now i'm gettin scared!!


    Nah, buy one, the 110 is a nice fork, and they should have figured out how to apply Loctite by now

    It's as Elgordo said though, the 140 is a great niche product, for a market they are pushing into, fine time to drop it. I sell Titus as well, and those guys are all over the boards, and understand the reach that they have. Cannondale has chosen to ignore it, and most of these words fall on deaf ears. The head engineer for the fork program was on for a while, but got chased off when he found out he "shouldn't" be contributing. Another engineer contacted me when I posted a rather scathing note about something, I responded to him, and never heard back from them. I'll say it again, the actual faces and voices of the company are wonderful, but the real story is, straight from a friend who used to rep for them (and left due to that, and got sued for his trouble), it's a good old boys network now, in the upper management. Buddies get hired, and or promoted, based on who they know (or their golf score maybe) , which is the WRONG way to run things. Man, does this tick me off. I wish Pegasus LLC would just sell it alreay, to someone who gives a flying f#*k
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

    - FrostyStruthers



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  20. #20
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    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
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    Don't take my word for more than what it is but here is my personal analysis of the 'why' of this move. I base my reflexion on past Cannondale moves, on how I'd run things if I was the big man at Cannondale and on a few things I do know but that I probably shouldn't...

    --------------------------------------------
    THEORY #1


    First thing: the 2008 Prophet line, no more MX, no Lefty Max, it sucks, I know.

    Second: remember the list of 2008 models I posted a while ago? Remember the two new bike lines with boring names? The Trail 130 and Big Mountain 160? Are they in the 2008 catalog? Nope.

    My take is: Cannondale were going to replace the Prophet by the Trail 130 line, available in both alloy and carbon versions as an All Mountain trail bike. This bike would be getting a new Lefty Max or whatever the name is. The Big Mountain 160, also available in alloy and carbon, would be replacing the Prophet MX as a longer travel aggressive All-Mountain, trail, light freeride bike. Lefty on that one? I don't know, this one would need a new version as the current Lefty Max wouldn't have enough travel but it might just use a burly Rock Shox, Fox or whatever fork with a Thru axle and all the bells and whistles that are now trendy and a must to be competitive. For both bikes, the current Lefty Max, as good as it is, is now a bit behind on the market, not that it would be better with all the gadgets like Travel reducing things and fancy valving from planet Mars... Cannondale needs to follow the market or lead the market. The current Max is too basic from a marketing point of view, for me it's a good thing but it's hard to sell a fork that costs that much when it has much less gadgets that what the others are doing...

    Now, those two new bikes and Lefties were not ready yet to be introduced along the 2008 range so they just kept the Prophet but simplified the line without too much investments, just to fill the gap in the range in the meantime. I expect new bikes, with or without new Lefties, as mid-year models or as 2009 at the latest...

    Now, someone copy this post somewhere and bring it back in a year to see how far off I was or if I'll be able to brag 'I told you guys!'

    And don't worry, there are probably people at Cannondale reading this and I'm sure they knew that the reaction wouldn't be good in the true Cannondale aficionados. I know they check my blog and they still care about the public's reaction even though some tink they dont...

    That was thery number 1. Are you ready for the theory number two?

    --------------------------------------------
    THEORY #2


    Much simpler. They saw that I was probably going to get a new Scalpel so they said: "If Dan doesn't use the Max anymore, it's not worth keeping it!" So because of me, the Max is dead... Sorry guys!


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  21. #21
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    Mendon, me and you should run things in Bethel...

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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    Don't take my word for more than what it is but here is my personal analysis of the 'why' of this move. I base my reflexion on past Cannondale moves, on how I'd run things if I was the big man at Cannondale and on a few things I do know but that I probably shouldn't...

    --------------------------------------------
    THEORY #1


    First thing: the 2008 Prophet line, no more MX, no Lefty Max, it sucks, I know.

    Second: remember the list of 2008 models I posted a while ago? Remember the two new bike lines with boring names? The Trail 130 and Big Mountain 160? Are they in the 2008 catalog? Nope.

    My take is: Cannondale were going to replace the Prophet by the Trail 130 line, available in both alloy and carbon versions as an All Mountain trail bike. This bike would be getting a new Lefty Max or whatever the name is. The Big Mountain 160, also available in alloy and carbon, would be replacing the Prophet MX as a longer travel aggressive All-Mountain, trail, light freeride bike. Lefty on that one? I don't know, this one would need a new version as the current Lefty Max wouldn't have enough travel but it might just use a burly Rock Shox, Fox or whatever fork with a Thru axle and all the bells and whistles that are now trendy and a must to be competitive. For both bikes, the current Lefty Max, as good as it is, is now a bit behind on the market, not that it would be better with all the gadgets like Travel reducing things and fancy valving from planet Mars... Cannondale needs to follow the market or lead the market. The current Max is too basic from a marketing point of view, for me it's a good thing but it's hard to sell a fork that costs that much when it has much less gadgets that what the others are doing...

    Now, those two new bikes and Lefties were not ready yet to be introduced along the 2008 range so they just kept the Prophet but simplified the line without too much investments, just to fill the gap in the range in the meantime. I expect new bikes, with or without new Lefties, as mid-year models or as 2009 at the latest...

    Now, someone copy this post somewhere and bring it back in a year to see how far off I was or if I'll be able to brag 'I told you guys!'

    And don't worry, there are probably people at Cannondale reading this and I'm sure they knew that the reaction wouldn't be good in the true Cannondale aficionados. I know they check my blog and they still care about the public's reaction even though some tink they dont...

    That was thery number 1. Are you ready for the theory number two?

    --------------------------------------------
    THEORY #2


    Much simpler. They saw that I was probably going to get a new Scalpel so they said: "If Dan doesn't use the Max anymore, it's not worth keeping it!" So because of me, the Max is dead... Sorry guys!


    I'm putting my money on Theory 2 dan


    since we are hypothesizing .......... heres my take (i mean wishful thinking ......)

    The Big mountain 160 will need a Lefty Max 160 that can also be limited by 30mm for a Max 130 29er and Cannondale will introduce a new line of trail bikes the WHATEVER 130 in 26 and 29 format. A Single pivot FS 29er with 130 mm of travel and a LEFTY now we're talking. That company has its Sh$%*%*t together and sees where the market is going

    oh wait no cannondale is re-vamping the scapel (sorry dan I know you like the new design and all) but why on gods earth would you invest time and resources re-vamping an antiquated 26" soft tail format

    read my lips CANNONDALE, reasonable travel (110-140mm) FS 29ers is where the market is going. Join in or BE LEFT IN THE DUST

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by elgordo
    I'm putting my money on Theory 2 dan


    since we are hypothesizing .......... heres my take (i mean wishful thinking ......)

    The Big mountain 160 will need a Lefty Max 160 that can also be limited by 30mm for a Max 130 29er and Cannondale will introduce a new line of trail bikes the WHATEVER 130 in 26 and 29 format. A Single pivot FS 29er with 130 mm of travel and a LEFTY now we're talking. That company has its Sh$%*%*t together and sees where the market is going

    oh wait no cannondale is re-vamping the scapel (sorry dan I know you like the new design and all) but why on gods earth would you invest time and resources re-vamping an antiquated 26" soft tail format

    read my lips CANNONDALE, reasonable travel (110-140mm) FS 29ers is where the market is going. Join in or BE LEFT IN THE DUST
    26" wheels wont die... 29ers have advantages but also disadvantages and depending of the rider, the riding style, the trail and it's conditions, they can be better or worse than 26ers. To me, 26" wheels are still superior, not antiquated at all...

    Cannondale will sell much more Scalpels than all the 29ers they could make. Let's be honest here, the light suspended race bike market is still much bigger than the 29er market and Cannondale knows that. If everybody wanted 29ers, don't worry, Cannondale would make more as they are in the buisness to make money (more now than ever). That's for now, the ratio will grow toward 29er wheels but I don't think we'll see 29ers outselling 26ers anytime soon... I personally don't like 29" wheels, they weigh more, tires too, they accelerate slower, they are flexier (good thing for bump absorbtion, not good for cornering). I could see it on some trail bikes that are aimed for tall people who are more into having fun than going fast but for smaller people and racers, I think 26" wheels are much better and I have learned to take Mr. Gary Fisher's crap with a grain of salt (Genesis sucks!). Of course, that's only my opinion, everybody has his... I'm getting way off topic here am I?

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    Mendon, me and you should run things in Bethel...
    That would be glorious!
    '05 Prophet 1000
    '09 F3
    '93 Delta V 700
    '08 F6 Lefty (son's)
    '08 F6 (daughter's)

  25. #25
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    *** I've posted it on the 2008 info thread by mistake... so I'm reproducing it here too. ***

    Really, there must be a good reason to Cannondale drop the Lefty Max off. Maybe we can't tell by now, but only time will tell, and we will be staring in wonder when Cannondale go for Round Two (Round 1 being the new Scalpel and minor tweaks in the rest of the line; well, 2008 is already knocking at the door...

    I'm really placing my bets on carbon bikes in 2008. The new Trail 130 and Big Mountain 160 will shake up the things a little (yeah, I'm being humble to consider it this way...

    My chance of ever get a Prophet are now all gone. I know how good it is, but with the new bikes just to come in within a few months, I won't go the Prophet way anymore. Also Dan pointed some interesting considerations about the Lefty Max being a bit updated, and with the evolution of new suspension forks, the Lefty Max HAD to be reconsidered.

    I'm really into all the integrated system Cannondale preaches and does extremelly well (differently of newcomers which are now bragging about integration when they only had the guts years after Cannondale get into the game and show how to score high with simple yet brilliant concepts), and that defines Cannondale as much as it works. So I think it's as much umprobable that they will leave such a good concept behind. That will live on the new bikes, and for sure we'll have good surprises.

    Now I'll probably wait 'till the new bikes (Trail and BM) to show up. I'm really impressed with the Rush, and even more with the Rush Carbon, but I'll wait to know for sure what bike to pick, just not to be regret after a while. But with any of them, I'd hardly be.

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