Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 37
  1. #1
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643

    New question here. Installing XX1 crank questions

    Finally got around to installing my XX1 crank, or attempt to do so atleast when I ran into a problem on my '12 Scalpel.

    From reading the manual for the frame, the manual for the xx1 crank and measuring the bb myself it is a 73mm bb.

    However, when I put the crankset on with no shims as the xx1 manual stated, the chainring grinds against the chainstay. I used the flat faced BB shields.

    Should I put a shim on even though the manual says it isn't required?

    For a 68mm bb the manual states that 1 shim should be used on each side.

    Thank you for any help!
    Last edited by Vegard; 03-19-2013 at 09:24 AM.

  2. #2
    don't stop
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    105
    Not certain if this is your problem, but the XX1 crank comes in two widths ("wide" and "narrow" on their website, or 156 vs 166 mm q-factor width). I'd first start be confirming if you bought the narrow version - if so, you might be out of luck. Adding extra spacers does not move the chainrings out, it only fills in the extra space between them and the BB shell if you have a 68 vs 73mm width.

  3. #3
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643
    I bought the q168, the q156 also fits the frame, but only by the width of a hair.

  4. #4
    LA CH╚VRE
    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    9,375
    The only thing that changes between the 156 and 168 q-factor cranksets is the spacing of the crankarms themselves, the chainring alignement doesn't change (different q-factor, same chainline). So it does seem like the issue is in your installation.

    There are two spacers to fill the gap when on a 68mm BB shell that should not be put when installing it on a 73mm BB shelled frame, you're okay there. But there is still a wider spacer that goes on the driveside and the instructions seem to indicate the bearing sheilds should not be flat faced... logically, they should be flat faced on 83mm BB shells but not on 73mm BB shells but the instructions are not very clear on that. SRAM's instruction are always very basic, not too good frankly, but pay attention the their drawings.

    So, don't use the spacers highlighted in green here, but do use the others...

    Installing XX1 crank questions-xx1crank.jpg

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  5. #5
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643
    Thanks Dan, here's what I have to work with:


    When I use no shims the 36t digs into the chainstay. (steel guard saved the carbon)

    When I use one of the supplied black metal shims it covers the 'teeth' on the spindel so the crankarm can't be screwed fully on.

    When I use 2 plastic shims it does seem to fit together, although only with 2-3mm to spare between the 36t and the chainstay.
    I should probably find some metal shims to replace them with asap.

    --

    Another issue is that the preload doesn't seem to do anything? If anything it makes it less roomy on the drive side.

  6. #6
    don't stop
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    105
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous View Post
    The only thing that changes between the 156 and 168 q-factor cranksets is the spacing of the crankarms themselves, the chainring alignement doesn't change (different q-factor, same chainline).
    Yes, of course that is correct. My brain must still be in weekend mode.

  7. #7
    LA CH╚VRE
    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    9,375
    Looking at your picture, the green SI bearing sheilds didn't come with the XX1 crankset right? Don't use those, but only the black 'SRAM 30mm spindle' sheilds. Don't use the two black spacers that are on the upper left corner of the printed manual either (that's the spacers for 68mm BB shells). The wave washer and thin transparent shims (in the ziplock bags) should not be used either, they're required on cranksets that don't have the bearing preload adjustment ring.

    Speaking of the bearing preload adjustment ring, make sure it's set as close the crankarm as possible before you install it. If it's already backed too far, it may be what's causing your issue.

    So bearings pressed in, SRAM bearing sheilds (not sure what side, flat facing the bearings on 73mm BB, flat outward on 83mm BB? That's the unclear part of the manual), then on the driveside, just before the crankarm, use the wider black spacer that's left of the manual.

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  8. #8
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643
    Should both shields have the flat side face against the bearing? That puzzles me as the picture in the manual only shows one of the indentations on the shield facing outwards.

    So far I have to say that I'm not impressed with SRAM manuals, then again after having done this once I should be set for life..

  9. #9
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643
    Popped the crank on with both shields facing outwards, all is fine until the crank is torqued to spec. There is a slight wiggle in the spindle as I can push it back and forth roughly 1mm. I assume that's what the preload is for, but when it's tightened to a point where it stops the wiggle it also prevents the cranks to spin as free as they should.

    I feel like a newb, oh wait I am.

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Thatshowiroll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    1,144
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegard View Post
    Popped the crank on with both shields facing outwards, all is fine until the crank is torqued to spec. There is a slight wiggle in the spindle as I can push it back and forth roughly 1mm. I assume that's what the preload is for, but when it's tightened to a point where it stops the wiggle it also prevents the cranks to spin as free as they should.

    I feel like a newb, oh wait I am.
    I have the same problem with my preload nut. It's barely tight, tighten more, and crank stops turning. I'm glad you asked this. Looking forward to the answer.

  11. #11
    LA CH╚VRE
    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    9,375
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegard View Post
    Popped the crank on with both shields facing outwards, all is fine until the crank is torqued to spec. There is a slight wiggle in the spindle as I can push it back and forth roughly 1mm. I assume that's what the preload is for, but when it's tightened to a point where it stops the wiggle it also prevents the cranks to spin as free as they should.

    I feel like a newb, oh wait I am.
    So currently this is with the sheilds flat sides against the bearings? I think I get it now... Tightening them presses the sheilds against the outside race of the bearings but they only should press against the inside race, that's probably what prevents the crank to spin freely. The sheilds spin with the crankset so should not contact the outside race that is static, fixed into the frame, makes sense? I should have thought about that before (I blame too few coffees).

    Let's screw the SRAM manual at this point. Flip the sheilds so their flat faces are facing out and add the wave washer between the preload collar and the non-drive-side sheild. The wave washer will take the additional gap flipping the sheild will create and make it much easier to get the preload just right. Tighten the collar (after the crankarm is tightened) enough to have the wave washer compress a bit, but not to the point it becomes completely flattened. If you can't get it tight enough, use one or more thin transparent washers next to the wave washer.

    You'll be the XX1 crank expert when this is all set! It would have been easier for me to get it right straight away but I haven't installed a XX1 crankset yet (and not many SRAM cranks either), I'm a Hollowgram kind of guy! But maybe I should apply for a job at SRAM to design their manuals...
    Last edited by Dan Gerous; 03-21-2013 at 07:43 PM.

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BoostN7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    665
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous View Post
    So currently this is with the sheilds flat sides against the bearings? I think I get it now... Tightening them presses the sheilds against the outside race of the bearings but they only should press against the inside race, that's probably what prevents the crank to spin freely. The sheilds spin with the crankset so should not contact the outside race that is static, fixed into the frame, makes sense?

    Let's screw the SRAM manual at this point. Flip the sheilds so their flat faces are facing out and add the wave washer between the preload collar and the non-drive-side sheild. The wave washer will take the additional gap flipping the sheild will create and make it much easier to get the preload just right. Tighten the collar (after the crankarm is tightened) enough to have the wave washer compress a bit, but not to the point it becomes completely flattened. If you can't get it tight enough, use one or more thin transparent washers next to the wave washer.

    You'll be the XX1 crank expert when this is all set! It would have been easier for me to get it right straight away but I haven't installed a XX1 crankset yet (and not many SRAM cranks either), I'm a Hollowgram kind of guy! But maybe I should apply for a job at SRAM to design their manuals...
    I know where to come when I upgrade to XX1 with Hollowgram cranks
    and no, I am not missing the other half of my fork....

  13. #13
    LA CH╚VRE
    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    9,375
    Quote Originally Posted by BoostN7 View Post
    I know where to come when I upgrade to XX1 with Hollowgram cranks
    Haa!
    It should be easier with the XX1 Hollowgram, only need to mount the spider, BB install will be just as before if you update a current Hollowgram but the upcoming Hollowgram SISL2 have clear instructions already...

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BoostN7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    665
    it's going to be really hard to resist buying that when it comes out. I think I'm gonna wait for my XX cassette to wear out, then replace the whole lot. Might save some weight whilst I'm there. Even with a bike like mine, I can still improve it; but for a price
    and no, I am not missing the other half of my fork....

  15. #15
    LA CH╚VRE
    Reputation: Dan Gerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    9,375
    No news, I guess Vegard has everything working smoothly now and can't stop riding!

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  16. #16
    Nor­wegr
    Reputation: Vegard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    643
    Sadly no, there's still a tiny glip in the crank when installed. Haven't had the time to do anything about it yet..

    Will try using one of the wave washers aswell

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    93
    just wondering if this was ever resolved. Looking at XX1 for my Scalpel 29. I am guessing I will need the 168 version and a lot of different spacers, etc?

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: freak6767's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    63
    Just got XX1 installed on my Scalpel29 today, didn't find any issues, everything went smoothly.
    I used the 32t q168 in 175mm for the cranks.
    Mavic SLR for now (Reynolds is supposed to sell their XX1 freehub at the end of the month, so i will put them back then)

    32x10 is more than ok for hitting the road to the local trails, and enough for downhill.

    Going to the trails tomorrow for a proper test, but already definitely not disappointed!

    Cockpit is very neat!

    Will post pictures if it can help.

  19. #19
    don't stop
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    105
    I just got my XX1 crank. There was no bearing shields, wave washers, or thin spacers in the box? Only the big black spacer with the lip on each side. Did something get missed, or are all those other small parts coming with the BB30 bearing kit (and/or, my trigger 29err whenever it comes).

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    171
    Quote Originally Posted by freak6767 View Post
    Just got XX1 installed on my Scalpel29 today, didn't find any issues, everything went smoothly.
    I used the 32t q168 in 175mm for the cranks.
    I also just installed an XX1 BB30 crank on a Scalpel this morning with the stock 32T chainring with no issues whatsoever. The likely culprit with the OP is the 36T chainring. Perhaps there's not enough chainstay clearance on the Scalpel for a 36T with a 49mm chainline.

    Check this document for measurements: http://cdn.sram.com/cdn/farfuture/Yp...ifications.pdf

  21. #21
    don't stop
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    105
    What spacers came in your XX1 crankset box?

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    171
    The BB30 crank? None. I've got a GXP XX1 on another bike as well. No spacers were provided with either of my cranks. I used the hardware provided with the Sram BB30 kit (shown above from another mtbr user).

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation: freak6767's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    63
    I just used the black spacer provided by Sram with the XX1 crank, nothing more. (on the chainring side, and nothing on the other side)

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    86

    Installing XX1 crank questions

    Same here. Just the wide spacer that came with, on the chainring side.

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation: freak6767's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    63
    Just a quick follow-up, after installing the XX1:

    I did my first proper ride with timed event this sunday, 42Km.
    While the the whole ride was perfect (dry condition, then mud part, the XX1 was just solid and constant! amazing), I am now left a day after, with some huge lower back pain, like I've never experienced before!

    Same bike that I used to do 50Km last week, similar condition.
    Only the XX1 changed on this bike.

    Do you think it's pure coincidence, or Q-factor of the XX1 cranks might be wrong? (I bought the 175mm with Q168)
    I still have my XO crankset, I'm gonna measure it.
    But would a change in QFactor, causes such back pain that fast?? (I heard you could sometime feel it with your knee, and more often on road bike where it's more important)

    I don't know what's going on...! 2 rides with XX1, same bike as before, and huge back pain each time now !

    arghhhhhhhhhhhh!
    Last edited by freak6767; 04-15-2013 at 03:28 AM.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Some questions about installing a new fork.
    By bcon in forum Shocks and Suspension
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 01-22-2012, 09:35 PM
  2. New crank questions
    By Triaxtremec in forum Drivetrain - shifters, derailleurs, cranks
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-08-2012, 07:31 PM
  3. Problem installing M770 crank in new BB90 bearing
    By JezV in forum Drivetrain - shifters, derailleurs, cranks
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 12-31-2011, 05:48 AM
  4. Installing new Hope Tech's: 3 Questions
    By 007 in forum Brake Time
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-24-2011, 05:54 PM
  5. Installing XT crank question
    By jrrider in forum Drivetrain - shifters, derailleurs, cranks
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 01-10-2011, 08:15 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •