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  1. #1
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    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....

    Remember when I said once the cdale bikes are made overseas you'll probably see exact copies made in the same factories????Well, there you go guys, just buy one of these, slap a cannondale logo on it and save a lotta money....way to go cannondale!
    I bet nobody in the Bedford factory stayed after hours and produced frames to be sold without brandname logo.....:nono
    LaMere Cycles Full Suspension 29er Frame
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    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....

    Well that didn't take long now did it

  3. #3
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    I'm not really clued up on Scalpel 29ER's, but a quick picture comparison between these LaMere Cycles frames and Scalpel shows that they are far from being the same, in fact i can't see a any of the tubes being identical. So surely with them being carbon they are using completely different moulds?

    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-701589d1338838647-best-looking-29er-frame-scalpel-29er.jpg

  4. #4
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    This has been out for a while. There is a thread in the 29er forum. It's a very close replica of the Scott.

  5. #5
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    Definitly not a Scalpel, if you think they're the same, you're missing out a lot of details. Tubes are not shaped the same, it has pivots at the dropouts, no thru-axle style pivot at the swing link, geometry isn't the same....

    It's like wine, to some, they all taste the same and these people can't understand why some cost 7$ and others hundreds...

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  6. #6
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    Dunno, looks just like a buncha other overseas plastic crap if you ask me.

    Bring back the funk Cannondale, we want the funk. This all looks the same stuff is getting old......

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    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by nathanbal View Post
    This has been out for a while. There is a thread in the 29er forum. It's a very close replica of the Scott.
    That makes sense...wasn't it the same Scott designer who works for cannondale now?
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous View Post
    Definitly not a Scalpel, if you think they're the same, you're missing out a lot of details. Tubes are not shaped the same, it has pivots at the dropouts, no thru-axle style pivot at the swing link, geometry isn't the same....

    It's like wine, to some, they all taste the same and these people can't understand why some cost 7$ and others hundreds...
    Well, yeah...maybe I went a bit far when I said "exact" copy... lol but that's what the Chinese counterfeiters do all the time....they take an existing design and modify it a little bit to throw the person who doesn't know a whole lot about it off....being in the military we had issues with counterfeit Holosights made by EoTech and even Bodyarmor and Helmets....you can buy them on eBay, even when reported they don't do ****, seller says why pay $750.- for a weapon sight if you can get the same one for less than $100.-?
    Devil is in the Detail bro, devil is in the detail unfortunately your average Joe doesn't know.....
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous View Post
    It's like wine, to some, they all taste the same
    Yeah, all of it yucky. You certainly hit that one right on the money.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdalemaniac View Post
    That makes sense...wasn't it the same Scott designer who works for cannondale now?
    Nope, Denk had already left Scott before their 29er full-suss was released.

  11. #11
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    Anyway, the point is that it is not a Cannondale factory rip off at all. It is a Scott factory rip off.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by chick0 View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	701589d1338838647-best-looking-29er-frame-scalpel-29er.jpg 
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    Using this as a jumping off point, Here's my point.

    How about we try, even just a little bit, to look like we put some manner of thought, creativity, hell, even soul, into the design we choose to put out there.

    I'm not making any sort of endorsement as far as how these bikes ride. At least they have someones fingerprint, ya know?

    Just cause it's carbon, doesn't mean it needs to be a copy.

    Ugh.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-bikegtltscarbon.jpg  

    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-kestrel_rubicon_sml.jpg  

    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-raven3.jpg  

    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-s-works-c3-1.jpg  

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  13. #13
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    CDaleManiac, I guess you're not right ALL the time....

    Quote Originally Posted by cdalemaniac View Post
    Remember when I said once the cdale bikes are made overseas you'll probably see exact copies made in the same factories????Well, there you go guys, just buy one of these, slap a cannondale logo on it and save a lotta money....way to go cannondale!
    I bet nobody in the Bedford factory stayed after hours and produced frames to be sold without brandname logo.....:nono
    LaMere Cycles Full Suspension 29er Frame
    Hey this is JP LaMere, owner of LaMere Cycles, and also a big Cannondale Scalpel fan and owner of 2 of them, well actually 3 because my 2011 frame had a mfg defect in the rear triangle and they gave me a new one. Anyway, the LaMere full susp we do get directly from Asia is not even close to a Cannondale Scalpel, its is much closer to a Scott Spark SL 900, but without the ability to raise and lower the BB and also change the angle of the headtube, or whatever the crazy stuff those Germans have designed in there. The Scalpel lacks a rear pivot point, so the carbon frame itself flexes, cool design that saves a lot of weight. I like my current Scalpel except that its a 26er, and its always creaking, I fix one creak another one pops up. I was just looking online tonight, the new 2013 Cannondale Scalpel Ultimate weighs 21.6 lbs and costs $11,000, our bike weighs 21.8 lbs and costs about $6000 and has a full set of easily serviceable pivot points. Anyway I think we can all agree the Lefty is the best front suspension on the planet. I think we could get ours down to 21.6 lbs with Ashima rotors, some stupid tires, and a carbon wheelset instead of the Stan's.
    JP LaMere
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  14. #14
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    Here's the full build with Sram XX1 and carbon Lefty weighing 21.8 lbs

    Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-jp.full.susp.good-shot.jpg
    JP LaMere
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  15. #15
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    I don't care how light it is....buying bulk frames from China and simply have them put your brandname on it doesn't make for much innovation whether or not it spec'd top notch.
    I was wrong when I said "exact copy"....got it....it's still -in my eyes- a cheap pos China made bulk frame that in this case is a Scott, not a cannondale knock off then.....
    "Common sense isn't always that common!"
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  16. #16
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    Cdalemaniac, question for you, where are Cannondale and Scott frames manufactured?
    JP LaMere
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jplamere1 View Post
    Hey this is JP LaMere, owner of LaMere Cycles, and also a big Cannondale Scalpel fan and owner of 2 of them, well actually 3 because my 2011 frame had a mfg defect in the rear triangle and they gave me a new one. Anyway, the LaMere full susp we do get directly from Asia is not even close to a Cannondale Scalpel, its is much closer to a Scott Spark SL 900, but without the ability to raise and lower the BB and also change the angle of the headtube, or whatever the crazy stuff those Germans have designed in there. The Scalpel lacks a rear pivot point, so the carbon frame itself flexes, cool design that saves a lot of weight. I like my current Scalpel except that its a 26er, and its always creaking, I fix one creak another one pops up. I was just looking online tonight, the new 2013 Cannondale Scalpel Ultimate weighs 21.6 lbs and costs $11,000, our bike weighs 21.8 lbs and costs about $6000 and has a full set of easily serviceable pivot points. Anyway I think we can all agree the Lefty is the best front suspension on the planet. I think we could get ours down to 21.6 lbs with Ashima rotors, some stupid tires, and a carbon wheelset instead of the Stan's.
    I think im right in thinking that all Scalpel 29er's have a pivot points, not a flexing chainstay like the 26".

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]http://cdn.media.cyclingnews.com/2011/04/18/2/cannondale_scalpel29_frame_600.jpg[/ATTACH]
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-cannondale_scalpel29_frame_600.jpg  


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    Oh, ooops, you're right, I forgot they do the 29ers different...CDaleManiac is gonna bust my balls for this mistake!
    JP LaMere
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by jplamere1 View Post
    Cdalemaniac, question for you, where are Cannondale and Scott frames manufactured?
    In Asia. Why do you think I keep riding my made in the USA frames?
    That still doesn't change the fact that the frames you market can be found in Asia wholesale places with whatever name you like to put on them....simply buying bulk, is not innovation. If I would to sell the exact same frame with cdalemaniac logo on it....how would that differ from yours? (Except for the different name)....Even a Huffy with XX1 components will still be a Huffy and that's all I have to say about this topic.
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  20. #20
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    So you're a Cannondale Maniac but you don't ride a Cannondale?

    Yeah we love the open mould frames from Asia, we feel its a rip-off to spend $3000 on a frame to support all the big executive salaries at big bike companies, we'd rather buy direct. The frames we get are the same ones you see all over the Internet, they are great, would love to have you demo one and you would agree. Have you ridden an open mould frame or you just assume they are crap? I have a Scalpel, and just sold top of the line Epic, both good bikes but I love my open mould LaMere way more and I don't feel like a sucker with the price I paid. Our model at LaMere Cycles is to customize bikes for people that know the bike biz and know the frames have become a commodity and they do not possess magic powers like the bike companies claim, in order to get you to spend $3000 on their frames. Our customers are bike junkies who are specific about they want and know they don't need to spend $10K on a bike to get the good stuff.

    As far as innovation, we are not frame engineers or designers, our only innovation is to bring a customizable bike model to the market using open mould frames or frames and components people already own, and getting people on sweet bikes for half the price by selling direct over the phone and email.
    JP LaMere
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jplamere1 View Post
    So you're a Cannondale Maniac but you don't ride a Cannondale?

    Yeah we love the open mould frames from Asia, we feel its a rip-off to spend $3000 on a frame to support all the big executive salaries at big bike companies, we'd rather buy direct. The frames we get are the same ones you see all over the Internet, they are great, would love to have you demo one and you would agree. Have you ridden an open mould frame or you just assume they are crap? I have a Scalpel, and just sold top of the line Epic, both good bikes but I love my open mould LaMere way more and I don't feel like a sucker with the price I paid. Our model at LaMere Cycles is to customize bikes for people that know the bike biz and know the frames have become a commodity and they do not possess magic powers like the bike companies claim, in order to get you to spend $3000 on their frames. Our customers are bike junkies who are specific about they want and know they don't need to spend $10K on a bike to get the good stuff.

    As far as innovation, we are not frame engineers or designers, our only innovation is to bring a customizable bike model to the market using open mould frames or frames and components people already own, and getting people on sweet bikes for half the price by selling direct over the phone and email.
    I like it.
    What kinda warranty comes w/ the frames?
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    Stumpjumpy, lifetime warranty, if its a mfg defect we send you a new frame right away and don't make you send in the old one, if you crash or drive the bike into your garage we sell you a new one at cost plus shipping, and our cost is between $400 and $700 depending on the frame.
    JP LaMere
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jplamere1 View Post
    So you're a Cannondale Maniac but you don't ride a Cannondale?
    ???????Maybe you should start reading the entire posts, including the signature....If you know about bikes you should know that cannondale used to be made here before the Dorel takeover.
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    OK, well I've had 2 Cannondale frames break on me, a Raven and also my 2011 Scalpel, so probably they got smart now and are having their carbon frames made in Asia where all the best frame manufacturing technology is and where 99% of the world's high end carbon frames are currently manufactured.
    JP LaMere
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by jplamere1 View Post
    Stumpjumpy, lifetime warranty, if its a mfg defect we send you a new frame right away and don't make you send in the old one, if you crash or drive the bike into your garage we sell you a new one at cost plus shipping, and our cost is between $400 and $700 depending on the frame.
    So what you are saying is you buy your frames directly from the Asian factories for between $400 and $700? What's stops me from missing out the middleman (you), and buying a frame (or a whole crate of them) direct from the makers?

    I would also be interested in knowing who would be accountable if a rider's death was a direct result of a LaMere frame failure, would it be you or the fame builder? And do the frames meet regional testing standards (for Europe for example) ?

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by chick0 View Post
    So what you are saying is you buy your frames directly from the Asian factories for between $400 and $700? What's stops me from missing out the middleman (you), and buying a frame (or a whole crate of them) direct from the makers?

    I would also be interested in knowing who would be accountable if a rider's death was a direct result of a LaMere frame failure, would it be you or the fame builder? And do the frames meet regional testing standards (for Europe for example) ?
    Carbon Frame Mtb 29er,Tr-fm256cf - Buy Carbon Frame Mtb 29er,Carbon Bike Frames,Carbon Bicycle Frame Product on Alibaba.com

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    It says it passed the EN standard test, the question is....which one? ;-)
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    Read this entire thread and really don't understand why people are getting so upset over a US based startup reselling frames manufactured in Asia at a much lower cost then the big name brands. It may not be innovation, but its capitalism plain and simple... As a consumer, this opens up new possibilities for those that don't have 10k to drop on a bike. It also offers the customer the ability to chose between tradeoffs: limited warranty vs life-time warranty (c-dale for example), risk of a startup going out of business and having no customer support vs customer support from a big bike company.

    Chick0, you could source the frame yourself and build it up - it's really easy. But I like this option as well for those that want the convenience of someone to build up a bike using this frame or simple be the middle person in the buying a frame overseas experience. But you do ask some interesting questions! Unless JP responds to them, I would assume that no one will be held accountable, and that no one would guarantee the frames are tested to meet certain standards, though theoretically they should meet since they are the same frames big bike companies source.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by vtsteevo View Post
    It may not be innovation, but its capitalism plain and simple... .
    I respect that and wish your business well.
    Those bikes/frames are just not my cup of tea and I just do not like so-called "Clones" period.
    I wouldn't even pay $11,000.- for a name brand bike, but that's just me....
    The only reason business is booming for anything that is a Clone or even a Counterfeit item is because the majority of people are so superficial nowadays and simply look for ways to "Keep up with the Jones' " instead of buying something they really like, need or might be of better quality....
    "Common sense isn't always that common!"
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    chick0, yeah go for it, I can direct you to the main agents that sell the frames for the factories including HongFu, DengFu, Carbonal, Yishun, and more.... see we don't make money on the frames, we make money on building up the frames however you want. We have a dealer account with QBP, Security, Stan's, and many other suppliers so basically we try to make $500 on each high end custom bike we produce...and we're not in it to make money although we do like the tax write-off for our lives which revolve around biking and riding the best singletrack in the USA as often as we can.

    If someone dies or gets injured on one of our frames we are responsible, and that's why we pay so much for insurance.
    JP LaMere
    Phone USA: (612) 326-4183
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    Email: lamerecycles@gmail.com

  30. #30
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    That is an interesting frame jp. Glad that you are there to show people that you intend to fully back the production with a warranty.

    What I think they fail to see is that, sure you can purchase the frame for yourself through an outside source... But you will not be given a warranty (primarily defects only), and if you do receive a warranty, it is up to you to send it back to China before you receive a replacement frame. Which would put you out approx 3 months between shipping to you, back to them, and for the port to clear and them to ship out the replacement product.

    Whereas there is you as the builder which is within the US and can handle the service quicker and warranty the product or answer questions should there be a need.

    Kudos to you and GL.

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    Thanks Skene, thanks for pointing this out, yeah we order 35 frames at a time which is a big commitment on our part but that's the difference in buying from us vs. buying one direct from Asia... that and we can build up your entire bike however you want it. My goal for the company is to become the US distributor for the open mould frames, got a trip to China and Taiwan planned for soon and will be trying to talk them into that.
    JP LaMere
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  32. #32
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    Hope

    I bought my 29er frame from Lamere in the 2014 season and i love it.. With it I achieved (3) 1st place finishes and a 4th plus did pretty decent with it in CX races and 6th place at a Marathon MTB Events.

    JP's cell is available and quick to respond on FB. He has helped many riders get a high end frame at a good price. Usually high end purchases meant having to work a bike shop for discount, stalk eBay or donate plasma to support our bike fix(jk).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Gosh, I hate to be right all the time.....-10516606_10152557725028607_2241097385199855901_n.jpg  


  33. #33
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    Big brands like to sell you an image. They overcharge a lot on that basis. I would be ok with that if they built their bikes in their own factories and tested them vigorously instead of just outsourcing thir design to facotries that build many other frames for a lot of different brands.

    For instance, F29 frames are relatively speaking outdated concerming technologies used (no TA, external routing, seatstay disc mount, old style geometry), yet they cost a lot.

    Whereas you can get modern frameset or a complete bike from direct sale brand for half or third price which will ride great and won't break more often.

    Everyone builds good bikes nowadays, it's not like 10-20 years ago. Market and technology has matured, it's not like bikes are complex systems that require massive engineering and expertise as cars, ships and planes.

    I don't buy those scare tactics that say inexpensive frames or components are going to break and get you killed, a lot of racers got hurt due to expensive brand name gear braking on them.

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    Jplamere, do you have store here in Philippines? I want to be a distributor...

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    We do a Lifetime Warranty on all our frames....oh and for the open mould super popular 29er frames known as HMO36 and many other names we just had a Boost 148mm rear end made for these frames.
    JP LaMere
    Phone USA: (612) 326-4183
    Web: LaMereCycles.com or Facebook.com/LaMereCycles
    Email: lamerecycles@gmail.com

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