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  1. #1
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    The Brain vs. The Swinger

    The design of the brain rear shock seems to be a great idea. You are a much more effecient climber when the rear does not bob? How does the Manitou Swinger 3-Way Air try to achieve climbing effeciency? The way I understand it is you would need to increase the rear shock pressure. But doesn't that decrease the travel range? I want to purchase a Prophet 2000 but the idea of being able to have the rear locked out during climbs is a nice feature. Keep in mind I plan to use this bike for all-mountain not just downhill. How does the Prophet compare to the Stumpjumper or the Enduro?

  2. #2
    Are you talking to me?
    Reputation: damion's Avatar
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    Are you talking S-works?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marclan
    The design of the brain rear shock seems to be a great idea. You are a much more effecient climber when the rear does not bob? How does the Manitou Swinger 3-Way Air try to achieve climbing effeciency? The way I understand it is you would need to increase the rear shock pressure. But doesn't that decrease the travel range? I want to purchase a Prophet 2000 but the idea of being able to have the rear locked out during climbs is a nice feature. Keep in mind I plan to use this bike for all-mountain not just downhill. How does the Prophet compare to the Stumpjumper or the Enduro?

    The brain and the swingers use completely different valving systems to make the shock work.

    As far as the swinger goes, there are two air adjustments. One is the main air spring, (like a coil, only air) the other arir shamber controls the pedalling platform, or the point where the shock becomes fully active. The more air in the SPV valve, the harder of a force is needed do get the shock moving. This is independent of the sag, so the shock is still sitting at its proper sag point.

    The Brain uses a weight with a spring under it to stop the flow of oil, locking out the shock. It take a force from under the wheel to get the flow going.

    Two different means to address a similar issue.
    gfy

  3. #3
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
    Reputation: MendonCycleSmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marclan
    The design of the brain rear shock seems to be a great idea. You are a much more effecient climber when the rear does not bob? How does the Manitou Swinger 3-Way Air try to achieve climbing effeciency? The way I understand it is you would need to increase the rear shock pressure. But doesn't that decrease the travel range? I want to purchase a Prophet 2000 but the idea of being able to have the rear locked out during climbs is a nice feature. Keep in mind I plan to use this bike for all-mountain not just downhill. How does the Prophet compare to the Stumpjumper or the Enduro?
    As Damion said, they are just two different ways around the barn. The Brain has a harsher, more on/off feel to it. SPV is a bit more subtle feel to it, but it is still just as efficient. If you like a rigid hardtail feel, followed by a brief period of squish, then hardtail again, the brain is for you. If you want to think less about and be affected less by what you bike's suspension is doing, SPV is for you. The bigger issue I see in what you are comparing is, single pivot versus linkage. What do you, or have you ridden in the past? SP bikes have been maligned for a long time becase of the inherant bob that happened, particularly if you pedal in a stabby fashion. Linkage bikes have existed to cancel out a majority of that bob. Now with SPV, and other "platform" shocks such as the Progressive 5th Element, this bobbing is cancelled, without the lively feel being quashed by a linkage. If you are an FSR/Ellsworth style rider, the SP will take a little getting used to, as the axle path is curved, whereas a linkage bikes' is more or less,straight up and down. This makes the bike feel a bit odd, but that awareness of it will go away after your first ride. Probably the biggest benefit of SP is the ability to load the shock before launching over something, like a log. Think a snake trying to strike, it coils up, rears back, and preloads as much energy into itself as possible, can't be done on an FSR. I guess you could say I am fairly one sided in my bias, but I have been on SP bikes for over 10 years, owned a few Linkage bikes in that time too, and just never liked the way they rode. I now have a few friends who have gone away from their linkage support, and found true love= SPV has done incredible things for SP bikes, look for more of them in the future from other guys who "evolved away" from them a while ago. Go Prophet, or if you're adventurous and like to build your own, check out the various Super V threads, there are some folks in them doing stuff with longer, modern SPV shocks, getting up to 6" out of them, with no drawbacks. Ride fast!

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