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  1. #1
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    Canfield's 27.5/26er is coming!

    Not sure when it's gonna happen, though a couple of comments made by Mr VT has pretty much confirmed that it's going to happen!

    At this stage of the game it looks a little like -

    - 27.5/26er compatible

    - Trail/AM category

    - Canfields Brothers work of art!

    Again from what I've read the frame is in the works, and that a prototype should pop up in the next few months.

    This IS exciting stuff, it's what I've been holding out for! Waiting for info to arrive is going to make for a looonngg few months. When the info does arrive I'll be like a seagull at a picnic.

  2. #2
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    How does the parallel link work as opposed to other suspension designs? Looks good for DH applications, I'm curious as to how it would work for a pedal f/s bike.
    My one says BRAP!

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    Quote Originally Posted by plume View Post
    How does the parallel link work as opposed to other suspension designs? Looks good for DH applications, I'm curious as to how it would work for a pedal f/s bike.
    Have you seen The One?

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    Quote Originally Posted by plume View Post
    How does the parallel link work as opposed to other suspension designs? Looks good for DH applications, I'm curious as to how it would work for a pedal f/s bike.
    My 2011 The One is setup an 8" mode, no other 8" bike can pedal like The One. Up,down and around the mountain all day long.

    Once/if the Parallel Link is the applied to the new 27.5/26er AM frame, I'm sure it'll be in an efficiency class of it's own.

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    ...Just imagine having the The One platform made into a shorter travel, lighter but just as hard hitting AM frame, full coil(Avalanche) WITH 650b's. You'd almost need a license to operate!

    I'm drooling at the thought, I can almost taste it....

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcrs View Post
    ...Just imagine having the The One platform made into a shorter travel, lighter but just as hard hitting AM frame, full coil(Avalanche) WITH 650b's. You'd almost need a license to operate!

    I'm drooling at the thought, I can almost taste it....
    I think Keeelington dropped that disinformation to direct us away from the pure joy that will be the Yelli-SQUISHY. **** I'll even name my next ex-girlfriend Yelli-SQUISHY if it comes out. I heard from a guy on Pinkbike that talked to a guy who was in Whistler last weekend that said that his bro saw a guy that looked like Sean looking at a 29er some girl was riding. The END IS NEAR folks!!! Pay no attention to this 650b nonsense! Stay to the TRUE PATH: YelliSQUISHY.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcrs View Post
    ...Just imagine having the The One platform made into a shorter travel, lighter but just as hard hitting AM frame, full coil(Avalanche) WITH 650b's. You'd almost need a license to operate!

    I'm drooling at the thought, I can almost taste it....

    I'll have my name on the list to get one of those next spring / early summer. Fired up!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    I think Keeelington dropped that disinformation to direct us away from the pure joy that will be the Yelli-SQUISHY. **** I'll even name my next ex-girlfriend Yelli-SQUISHY if it comes out. I heard from a guy on Pinkbike that talked to a guy who was in Whistler last weekend that said that his bro saw a guy that looked like Sean looking at a 29er some girl was riding. The END IS NEAR folks!!! Pay no attention to this 650b nonsense! Stay to the TRUE PATH: YelliSQUISHY.
    Hit this link and scroll down some....Its the only other indication I have that 650b/26er combo is in the works.

    Though your PROBABLY right, especially if you got that info from a guy off pinkbike that talked to a guy in Whistler.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcrs View Post
    Hit this link and scroll down some....Its the only other indication I have that 650b/26er combo is in the works.

    Though your PROBABLY right, especially if you got that info from a guy off pinkbike that talked to a guy in Whistler.
    We all know people on PB are usually right about everything.
    Last edited by Vertr; 05-22-2013 at 11:39 PM.

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    This thread got funny quick.

    My vote on the new 26/650b, after talking with Lance, is that we all agree to forego the front derailleur so we can get shorter stays. With all the 1x stuff and the Canfield hubs available, I don't see this as an issue and think it is a worthy sacrifice for shorter stays. Can I get an "amen"? They worried about alienating a big part of the market but I don't really think that will be an issue with all these awesome options out there.

  11. #11
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    oh, and I want 66-67 head angle with a 160mm fork (20mm thru axle fork a must), NO PRESS FIT BB!(shouldn't be an issue with these dudes), 73 degree seat angle, as sub 17 in stays as possible, and a straight 1.5 or I guess tapered head tube. Get the geo right and people showing interest and then later go to carbon once it is deemed ready.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    With all the 1x stuff and the Canfield hubs available, I don't see this as an issue and think it is a worthy sacrifice for shorter stays. Can I get an "amen"? They worried about alienating a big part of the market but I don't really think that will be an issue with all these awesome options out there.
    AMEN
    Just say "NO" to front derailleurs.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    This thread got funny quick.

    My vote on the new 26/650b, after talking with Lance, is that we all agree to forego the front derailleur so we can get shorter stays. With all the 1x stuff and the Canfield hubs available, I don't see this as an issue and think it is a worthy sacrifice for shorter stays. Can I get an "amen"? They worried about alienating a big part of the market but I don't really think that will be an issue with all these awesome options out there.
    I don't run a FD on my One (microdrive), but I don't see this happening until SRAM has 10 speed cassettes with more low-end range. 9/36 + 28 isn't quite enough low end for an AM bike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    I don't run a FD on my One (microdrive), but I don't see this happening until SRAM has 10 speed cassettes with more low-end range. 9/36 + 28 isn't quite enough low end for an AM bike.
    Your 28/36 low gear is almost the same ratio of the old standard 24/31 we (us old guys) grew up with and only 10% higher than the more recent 24/34 low end.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

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    Obviously terrain and steepness vary but I live in Boise and routinely do 3k foot climbs on my AM bike with a 34 front and an 11-36 rear cassette. I know that this is just me though and I could talk for pages about what gearing is necessary and it won't mean anything if the market won't buy a bike without front D. mounts. I don't want the Canfields to lose out on customers but for me, I prefer shorter chainstays at the sacrifice of front derailleurs.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by roxtar View Post
    Your 28/36 low gear is almost the same ratio of the old standard 24/31 we (us old guys) grew up with and only 10% higher than the more recent 24/34 low end.
    comparing it to the road bike gearing we used back in the stone age is disingenuous; there is a reason that stuff is gone now. I use the 22/34 on my one frequently - we don't have a lot of elevation around here, but 30%+ grades are common enough.

    I'll live without a FD mount when Sram has 11-speed cassettes with a 40 granny for under $200, or when they update hammerschmitt (not holding my breath on that).

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    This thread got funny quick.

    My vote on the new 26/650b, after talking with Lance, is that we all agree to forego the front derailleur so we can get shorter stays. With all the 1x stuff and the Canfield hubs available, I don't see this as an issue and think it is a worthy sacrifice for shorter stays. Can I get an "amen"? They worried about alienating a big part of the market but I don't really think that will be an issue with all these awesome options out there.
    I like the sound of shorter stays for sure. I haven't ran a FD on my AM rigs for the past five years. So that's an AMEN from me!

    As for alienating themselves, the Bro's seem to enjoy the pressure. For example, if anyone's wading into uncharted territory it's the Bro's. Take the Microdrive and the Yelli, two products that have blazed the path for the big names to follow. An follow they have.

    If ditching the FD to make way for a new breed of killer AM is whats to happen, it's because the Bros have seemingly laid the foundation for it to happen.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joules View Post
    comparing it to the road bike gearing we used back in the stone age is disingenuous; there is a reason that stuff is gone now. I use the 22/34 on my one frequently - we don't have a lot of elevation around here, but 30%+ grades are common enough.

    I'll live without a FD mount when Sram has 11-speed cassettes with a 40 granny for under $200, or when they update hammerschmitt (not holding my breath on that).
    Road bike gearing?

    I did Leadville two years ago with a 24/34 low gear and I'm a 52 year old flatlander.

    A carbon crankarm, titanium geared Hammershmidt would definitely be the ****, though.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by roxtar View Post
    Road bike gearing?
    24/34 isn't want I meant by roadie gearing; you mentioned back in the day when 24/30 was the lowest gear you could get. That was because mountain bike components at the time were slightly modified touring bike components.
    my first mountain bike came with a 28/38/48 crank and a 13-30 7-speed cassette. I'll have strong words with anyone that claims that was even remotely appropriate gearing for riding offroad.

  20. #20
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    So as it stands, and in the interest of healthy e-speculation, the frame sounds like -

    - 27.5/26er combo
    - A sharp AM slayer
    - Sort stays

    Going off the latter, I'd bet my left nut that it'll be in the 150-160mm range, ~67-66d HA and a medium weighing in at ~7lbs. A shock i-2-i length of 8.5.

    I'd like to see stealth post routing.....

  21. #21
    Cleavage Of The Tetons
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    The Swifty-Fifty!!!
    Or Drifty-50!
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    The Swifty-Fifty!!!
    Or Drifty-50!
    Drifty-50! Drifty-50!

  23. #23
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    drifty-50!
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  24. #24
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    Know going into the build that the bike doesn't work with a FD is all that is needed really. Engineers in all companies are preparing for the departure of the FD. Shimano needs to catch up quickly and offer suitable competition. If shorter stays are what makes a bike handle the way we'd like - kill the FD option. I'd even rock a 1X10 now on that Yelli if I *had* to...

    I can't wait to see what gaining all that clearance in the rear triangles do to the next generation of super bikes.
    My one says BRAP!

  25. #25
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    honestly, we are about 30 years overdue for ditching the rear derailleur!
    It's time for an internal that is light and works.
    with all of our technology...it's unfathomable.
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by plume View Post
    I can't wait to see what gaining all that clearance in the rear triangles do to the next generation of super bikes.
    I was just looking at the riders pic's from the Enduro's in Italy and Oregon. Not too many riders are running front derailleurs, change is on the horizon fore sure.

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    I just got back from the Oregon Enduro in Hood River and didn't see one front d personally all weekend. Change is more than on the horizon, it is on yesterdays horizon and just a few people out there who are holding out. Some of them for valid reasons don't get me wrong but as far as the market goes, I would feel pretty safe designing around no front D any more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    I just got back from the Oregon Enduro in Hood River and didn't see one front d personally all weekend. Change is more than on the horizon, it is on yesterdays horizon and just a few people out there who are holding out. Some of them for valid reasons don't get me wrong but as far as the market goes, I would feel pretty safe designing around no front D any more.
    I contacted Chris Canfield via Ouija board last week and it was very clearly indicated to me that road bikes are the future. I mean look at how fast those things are, they just need to translate that to the mountain somehow.

    I bet they'll release the "Nimble Cross" without a FD mount and that will be the beginning of the end.


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    Its an older vid but according to Vertr and his black magic tricks, still relevant:


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    But back on topic, I think the fact that the Canfields have their micro drive as well makes them the perfect manufacturer to start looking at bikes with no front derailleur. They already have a product that accommodates those needing that more flexible gearing range.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    But back on topic, I think the fact that the Canfields have their micro drive as well makes them the perfect manufacturer to start looking at bikes with no front derailleur. They already have a product that accommodates those needing that more flexible gearing range.
    So if this bike actually happens, would you run 650b or 26?

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    Did you see PBs feature on what the Enduro pros are all riding?
    Not a lot of 26ers in there.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by roxtar View Post
    Did you see PBs feature on what the Enduro pros are all riding?
    Not a lot of 26ers in there.
    Just because it's trendy doesn't meant it's faster or jumps better.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    Just because it's trendy doesn't meant it's faster or jumps better.
    These guys aren't riding them because they're trendy. They're riding what works best for them. Most (Specialized, Cannondale, and Trek riders, for instance) have several models, avail in different wheel sizes to choose from. They seem to be choosing the bigger wheel sizes.

    Ahm jus sayin...
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    So if this bike actually happens, would you run 650b or 26?
    I don't have any time on 650b bikes so can't make an assessment but as of right now, I really enjoy riding 26 inch wheels. They are more fun to me for sure than 29 though I think that for a lot of trails I ride a 29 would be faster according to a clock. A buddy just built up a 650b and I will borrow for a couple rides to get an impression. I like the idea of the Canfield having the option to go either in case I do want to jump on the bandwagon.

    And saying big wheels is trendy is sort of ignorant. The pros are riding the bike that will get them down the fastest. They could ride any from their sponsored manufacturer and the results are what matter. They are going to ride the fastest bike for that course to get those results.

    Personally, I think I will stick with 26 for the fun and flickable factor but if I were only a racer I doubt my outlook would be the same.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    And saying big wheels is trendy is sort of ignorant. The pros are riding the bike that will get them down the fastest.
    Thinking that the pro's are motivated only by speed is much more ignorant. 650 is a trend. Calling it trendy isn't out of line or inaccurate. This business runs by offering a new novelty ever year or two to keep the new bikes selling. Whether you believe the hot new thing will make your riding more enjoyable is up to you, but speculating about what is objectively faster based on arbitrary bike selections by pros in an enduro race in Oregon is ridiculous.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    650 is a trend.
    Why would you say that? Particularly after what happened with 29ers.
    People will use what works best, especially at pro level racing.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by roxtar View Post
    Why would you say that? Particularly after what happened with 29ers.
    People will use what works best, especially at pro level racing.
    Let me help you.

    trend (trnd)
    n.
    1. The general direction in which something tends to move.
    2. A general tendency or inclination. See Synonyms at tendency.
    3. Current style; vogue: the latest trend in fashion.

  39. #39
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    A common use of the word "trendy" is to mean a fad that will die out quickly. If that was not your intentioned use of the word then I misunderstood you.
    My apologies.
    Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    Liberty is a well armed sheep, contesting the vote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by roxtar View Post
    A common use of the word "trendy" is to mean a fad that will die out quickly. If that was not your intentioned use of the word then I misunderstood you.
    My apologies.
    I don't think anything I've said indicates that I think it's a fad or soon to die. The argument both of you have made is that since a lot of pros are using it, that it is faster. I'm not really for or against 650 either way, I'm just noting that it *is* a bandwagon and whether Joe blow pro is riding it doesn't really mean a lot at this point. Whether it sticks or not will be up to the market.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    Thinking that the pro's are motivated only by speed is much more ignorant. 650 is a trend. Calling it trendy isn't out of line or inaccurate. This business runs by offering a new novelty ever year or two to keep the new bikes selling. Whether you believe the hot new thing will make your riding more enjoyable is up to you, but speculating about what is objectively faster based on arbitrary bike selections by pros in an enduro race in Oregon is ridiculous.
    So are you a jerk in real life too or do you just play one on the internet? You have no idea what is going on with the race scene as evidenced by your ignorant comments. The clock does not lie, speed is quantifiable unlike your opinion. You can argue it all you want but by doing so you lose all credibility.

    I like 26 inch wheels. I find them more fun for my style of riding but to say they are trendy only is flat blind to reality. Enjoy your stay in ignorantville, I will not be joining you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    So are you a jerk in real life too or do you just play one on the internet? You have no idea what is going on with the race scene as evidenced by your ignorant comments. The clock does not lie, speed is quantifiable unlike your opinion. You can argue it all you want but by doing so you lose all credibility.

    I like 26 inch wheels. I find them more fun for my style of riding but to say they are trendy only is flat blind to reality. Enjoy your stay in ignorantville, I will not be joining you.
    Hey I was having a fun time until you called me ignorant. Perhaps you should stop calling names, because that was way out of line. If you have to resort to abuse I'd bet your argument isn't as strong as you think it is.

    The clock can determine a winner, but it doesn't tell you that the key element that made them win was the wheel size. Hopefully your reasoning really isn't that poor. I know quite a lot about the race scene, not agreeing with your personal assessment of it doesn't mean I'm ignorant, it just means we disagree.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    Hey I was having a fun time until you called me ignorant. Perhaps you should stop calling names, because that was way out of line.

    The clock can determine a winner, but it doesn't tell you that the key element that made them win was the wheel size. Hopefully your reasoning really isn't that poor. I know quite a lot about the race scene, not agreeing with your personal assessment of it doesn't mean I'm ignorant, it just means we disagree.
    I guess some of us are more interested in a factual, serious discussion here than just having fun and inciting arguments, which you have been doing since you ouija board comment. And pro racers want results and will ride the bike their sponsor provides that gives them the best results. If you truly believe otherwise then you are ignorant of the mindset of a true, competitive, racer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aenema View Post
    I guess some of us are more interested in a factual, serious discussion here than just having fun and inciting arguments, which you have been doing since you ouija board comment. And pro racers want results and will ride the bike their sponsor provides that gives them the best results. If you truly believe otherwise then you are ignorant of the mindset of a true, competitive, racer.
    So far you haven't provided a single factual serious technical reason why 650b is faster. Mostly you are just insulting me and using that for the basis of assuming that pros are the ultimate metric for understanding mountain bike technology. Clearly I am interested in factual discussion, I'm just telling you that your metric is piss poor.

    Continuing to call me ignorant without any backup whatsoever is showing a lot more about your character than mine.

    Also, it seems that you too do not understand the meaning of the word "trendy."

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    So far you haven't provided a single factual serious technical reason why 650b is faster. Mostly you are just insulting me and using that for the basis of assuming that pros are the ultimate metric for understanding mountain bike technology.

    Continuing to call me ignorant without any backup whatsoever is showing a lot more about your character than mine.
    Whatever man, you were the one who started spewing your opinions about trends and whatnot and now say the burden of proof is on me. You are just upset you got called out and have no real response. Calling upon my character is the last act of a desperate forum troll trying to regain credibility. Just slink away already.

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    Like I just added to my above comment, you don't seem to know what a trend is. It's not a negative thing. Calling 650b a trend is not an argument. That is a fact. The burden of proof *is* on you because you made the argument. I really haven't made any argument except to point out that what you did say is factually weak.

    I mentioned your character because you've been calling names like a five year old. Don't even start me on credibility son.

    I'm not looking for a fight, I am looking for a rational discussion, and that really isn't occurring. SO, if you can actually come up with a reasonable argument I'd be down to continue this in a civil manner.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    Like I just added to my above comment, you don't seem to know what a trend is. It's not a negative thing. Calling 650b a trend is not an argument. That is a fact. The burden of proof *is* on you because you made the argument. I really haven't made any argument except to point out that what you did say is factually weak.

    I mentioned your character because you've been calling names like a five year old. Don't even start me on credibility son.

    I'm not looking for a fight, I am looking for a rational discussion, and that really isn't occurring.
    I thought I told you to slink away already. This thread was better off before you joined in so do it a favor...

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    It's okay aenema, we can still be friends. Just hit the dictionary a little harder before you fly off the handle about the word "trend" next time.

    And seriously, Canfield cyclocross '14.

    Canfield's 27.5/26er is coming!-zdenekstybarjump.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertr View Post
    It's okay aenema, we can still be friends. Just hit the dictionary a little harder before you fly off the handle about the word "trend" next time.
    Ok, maybe I was a little harsh and I wasn't the one who remotely cared about the word "trend". What I am saying is that big wheeled bikes simply are faster on a lot of trail rides. Enduro races simply are trail rides with a clock running. If you disagree, go do a strava run of a normal trail ride, then get comfortable on a bigger wheeled bike and do it again and you may be in for a surprise. The clock does not lie. Strava, for all its hate-able attributes, is the easiest tool for quantifying these results.

    And pros are only pros because they have the talent, the work ethic, and the competitive drive to get them to that top level. To say that one would ignore the bike that would be faster on that trail to ride the one that is "trendy" really is ignorant. They are out there for results, they have put in countless training miles in and have a competitive side to them that only other top athletes can understand. They are not going to ride the slower bike in a big name race. And before you go there, the Oregon Enduro Series are all big name races. If they are going to fly halfway around the world to a race a week after doing a pro enduro in Italy, they are going to fly there to win, not to show off the latest trend in wheel sizes.

  50. #50
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    And that latest cyclecross pic is pretty rad to be honest.

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