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  1. #1
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    Has anyone had problems with shock bushings/reducers

    Has anyone had the problem with the bushing and reducers developing play. My slayer has this affliction that about after every sixth or seventh ride my reducers and bushings on the back end of my shock need replacement, (it's a 03 1/2 Slayer) The LBS and myself are mystified.

    The rear triangle was replaced by Rocky to solve the problem, but it's still happening any ideas?

  2. #2
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    Check the alignment of your frame

    Remove the front mounting bolt of your shock, and cycle the rear end through its travel, to see if the shock is aligned properly with the mount on the top tube.

    I have the bushings on the rear (3D-Link) mount die after about 6 months. Once the teflon ring in the shock eyelet is worn slightly, the wear of the alloy reducers increases to an alarming rate. Mind you, 6 months is still better than 6 rides.

    Alsio, this might sound silly, but remove the reducers from the front of the shock and check to see if both pairs have the same dimensions.

    I eventually solved the problem by fitting a shock with spherical eyelets, a DT Swiss SSD.

  3. #3
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    I get like 20 rides before I have to change it.. At least it's more than 6-7, but still a pain in the ass :-/

    It's all alligned and nothing seems to be wrong with the bike/shock setup whatsoever..

    I was told by a fox service person that's it's supposed to be a little soft to be able to absorb shocks/sideways force (or something like that) insted of the shock itself.

    There's 3'rd party parts that can replace the "normal" stuff, but what from what I have understood that might cause harm to the shock or frame when it's put under pressure. Anything that don't wear out is probably way to stiff/hard to work the way fox wants it to.

  4. #4
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    Wow that's fast.

    I've had a fox shock on my bike for over a year without problem. But my Giant AC with a Swinger actually ended up developing play after about 250 miles. Enough to make a clunking noice. I just swapped the entire shock for a Fox since I wasn't hot about the swinger anyway.

    I didn't realize the bushings needed replacing that frequently. I just thought the Manitou was typical Mani-poo.

    REEK

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Intrepidity
    I get like 20 rides before I have to change it.. At least it's more than 6-7, but still a pain in the ass :-/

    It's all alligned and nothing seems to be wrong with the bike/shock setup whatsoever..

    I was told by a fox service person that's it's supposed to be a little soft to be able to absorb shocks/sideways force (or something like that) insted of the shock itself.

    There's 3'rd party parts that can replace the "normal" stuff, but what from what I have understood that might cause harm to the shock or frame when it's put under pressure. Anything that don't wear out is probably way to stiff/hard to work the way fox wants it to.

    Are you on a slayer as well?

  6. #6
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    Yep, 2004 Slayer 50

    I've double checked everything that can in any way develop play.. Everything is tightened at the correct torque and I use locktite to make sure the bolts are not moving.

  7. #7
    1946:2006:2066
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    the best shock upgrade ever...

    a touch of british engineering...

    http://www.betd.co.uk/acatalog/BETD_...d_Tool_25.html

    Don't believe what Fox says...those alu reducers are garbage. You apply torque to soft
    aluminium and it will flow, causing further binding inside the eyelet, causing increased wear.

    I just received these from BETD...expensive, but damn, what a difference. The shock is
    free to move and consequently do what it is supposed to do. Rebound and Compression
    now work properly and predictably.

    michael
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    "Be not afraid of going slowly but only of standing still." - Chinese Proverb

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by canadian-clydesdale
    Has anyone had the problem with the bushing and reducers developing play. My slayer has this affliction that about after every sixth or seventh ride my reducers and bushings on the back end of my shock need replacement, (it's a 03 1/2 Slayer) The LBS and myself are mystified.

    The rear triangle was replaced by Rocky to solve the problem, but it's still happening any ideas?
    That's strange. I ride an 03 Slayer and haven't had to change them once. I ride hard and include 4-6 ft. drops. It's been two solid seasons of riding. Though before this season starts I plan on changing everything

  9. #9
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    I'm giving my Fox to a friend this weekend...

    He's had wear issues with his Swinger, and apparently has found some kind of composite which does a much better job than the aluminium reducers. I suspect it's either POM or Delrin. Either way, he's offered to machine me a new reducer set to try.

    As soon as I get the shock back I'll mount my Fox again and report back in a couple of months.

  10. #10
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    It seems that either the things wear fast or not much at all, I know a 1/2 dozen other slayer riders of varing sizes and skill levels (i'm not the biggest or burliest rider of the bunch) and I'm the only one with bushing grief.

    Time to get the yellow paint, this suckers a lemon

  11. #11
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    before you get out the yellow paint...

    the problem may be the shock. The eyelet's inside diameter seems to be notoriously
    lacking in consistency from one shock to another and from one end to the other on
    the same shock. If the overly tight end is the moving shock pivot you will have excessive
    wear. The standard DU bushing and alu reducers contribute to the problem. Particularly
    the reducers since they are split into two parts that can move independently as wear
    increases, causing further problems.

    If you can, try reversing the shock, next time you replace the bushings and reducers.

    Better still, replace both with the BETD polymer Hula Hoop bushing and stainless shaft.
    The solid steel shaft completely eliminates the problems with a two part shaft and the
    polymer bushings are naturally stiction free. On my ETSX with a Vanilla RC I have had
    to revise my compression and rebound settings due to the lack of stiction in the bushings.
    That, and I think I may now have to go up to a 600# spring from a 550# spring since the
    lack of stiction makes me feel undersprung.

    This may sound like heresy but I believe those damn DU bushings and alu reducers have
    caused more problems than Fox is willing to admit, all the way to breaking bike frames,
    since the shock moving pivot can actually be almost seized causing stress in the frame
    before the leverage ratio has a chance to overcome the severe stiction and if the frame
    doesn't break you will have excessive wear in the bushing/reducer interface.

    My $0.02's (CAD) worth!

    michael
    "Be not afraid of going slowly but only of standing still." - Chinese Proverb

  12. #12
    LBS Manager
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    I'll take a set

    Quote Originally Posted by mrdy
    the problem may be the shock. The eyelet's inside diameter seems to be notoriously
    lacking in consistency from one shock to another and from one end to the other on
    the same shock. If the overly tight end is the moving shock pivot you will have excessive
    wear. The standard DU bushing and alu reducers contribute to the problem. Particularly
    the reducers since they are split into two parts that can move independently as wear
    increases, causing further problems.

    If you can, try reversing the shock, next time you replace the bushings and reducers.

    Better still, replace both with the BETD polymer Hula Hoop bushing and stainless shaft.
    The solid steel shaft completely eliminates the problems with a two part shaft and the
    polymer bushings are naturally stiction free. On my ETSX with a Vanilla RC I have had
    to revise my compression and rebound settings due to the lack of stiction in the bushings.
    That, and I think I may now have to go up to a 600# spring from a 550# spring since the
    lack of stiction makes me feel undersprung.

    This may sound like heresy but I believe those damn DU bushings and alu reducers have
    caused more problems than Fox is willing to admit, all the way to breaking bike frames,
    since the shock moving pivot can actually be almost seized causing stress in the frame
    before the leverage ratio has a chance to overcome the severe stiction and if the frame
    doesn't break you will have excessive wear in the bushing/reducer interface.

    My $0.02's (CAD) worth!

    michael


    I Ride an 05 ETSX do you know of some place in the Toronto area where I can some of those.

  13. #13
    1946:2006:2066
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    unfortunately, no...

    I ordered direct from BETD, UK. See my post higher up. I decided to bite the bullet and
    accept the horrendous exchange rate and bought exactly what I needed to convert my
    shock to the polymer bushing and stainless steel shaft. The shafts and insertion/removal
    tool were what drove the cost up. But the shafts shouldn't wear at all and additional
    bushing are only $10.00 each. The tool makes replacement a 5 minute job and will never
    wear out.

    What drove me to this conversion was, with the original Float RL, rebound seemed to be
    very inconsistent. So I investigated if the shock was free to move ie: no bushing stiction.
    Not only was there stiction, I needed vise-grips and a lot of elbow-grease to get the damn
    reducers out. I then bolted the reducers together and, with one end of the bolt in a drill
    emeried the bearing surface of the reducers. This required multiple passes until I had
    reducers that were a gentle press fit into the DU bushing. Remounted the shock and
    suddenly sag and rebound were easy to set and adjust respectively. The only problem
    is that this procedure has to be repeated frequently. This was the end of 2002 into
    2003. At the end of 2003 I converted to the Vanilla RC and followed this procedure before
    mounting the shock. Again, lasted for about a month or three.

    2004 was not a good year. I was off the bikes for about 6 months due to an accident.
    When I was finally ready to try riding again during late November I took theVanilla off to
    check for stiction, to my horror, the upper eyelet was completely siezed and the reducers
    were actually moving against the frame. Imagine the stresses of that. I followed my procedure
    knowing it would get me through the winter. I've known about BETD for some time and
    decided after xmas to get the necessary parts. Still not riding much, f'n snow, but I won't
    have to worry about those DU bushings and reducers anymore.

    As a foot note my ETSX is a 2002.5. I wonder if my attention to the shock has anything
    to do with it not breaking. I don't ride as hard as most guys but with binding shock pivots
    the initial stresses on the seat tube must be pretty high. With the BETD conversion and
    the reinforced seat tube a 2005 should be as rugged as a tank.

    This is what I ordered to do both shocks.

    Shopping Cart (Prices in British Pounds)
    DESCRIPTION QUANTITY PRICE COST
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Hulahoop Eyelet Bush 4 £4.00 £16.00
    Fox, Stratos, 5th Element Shocks

    Bush Extraction/Fitting Tool 1 £30.00 £30.00
    Fox, Stratos, 5th Element Shocks

    New STRONG Shock Bushes 2 £15.00 £30.00
    length required: 22mm/6.1mm bore
    ================================================== ====================
    Subtotal: £76.00
    Shipping (Royal Mail Air Mail Recorded): £20.00
    Total: £96.00


    With an exchange rate of 2.31 the total was $222 CAD.

    Hope this helps.

    michael

    edit:
    they shipped Jan 12, I received Jan 20...faster than from the states
    and since it was via mail brokerage was only $5.00 + PST + GST
    Last edited by mrdy; 02-01-2005 at 09:59 AM.
    "Be not afraid of going slowly but only of standing still." - Chinese Proverb

  14. #14
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    $222 for bushings and reducers seems a bit steep, and If it dosen't fix it.... Present set just developed play, 4 rides with snow so not so much rock? WTF is with this POS....I doubt I'll ever buy another Rocky If this is how their "all mountain" frame goes I'm think I'm gonna need to get a different frame
    it tied the room together man!

  15. #15
    1946:2006:2066
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    yes...but...

    I was after the hula hoop eyelet bushing as well and they only work with their eyelet shaft.
    Plus I bought the the insertion/extraction tool as well. It's the exchange rate that kills you.
    Now at 2.38. Measure you reducer's for overall width and bolt diameter and buy a set
    of Progressive coil shock mounting kits. They use a steel shaft with spacers. Stop
    blaming Rocky. Most of the problem is with Fox. Have you tried a different shock. Get
    you LBS to loan you one.

    michael
    "Be not afraid of going slowly but only of standing still." - Chinese Proverb

  16. #16
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    I'll bring it to the shop tommorrow and see what they can do in regards to different reducers and bushings, last set got a brand new bolt (same as original but new).

    I'm thinking the wear is a problem of both Rocky and Fox, fox for the weak bushing/reducer/ shock, and Rocky for not building a frame that handles the load with the speced shock.

    The LBS has been in contact with Fox, and they are of the opininon, that perhaps a coil over will solve the problem,

    MRDY what do you think? Is the shock itself the problem (Fox Float RL)?
    it tied the room together man!

  17. #17
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    Here is another solution

    I was in Canadian Bearing supply today and they said they can make a brass hoop bushing and brass reducers for my shock. They told me that they would last 10 times as long as the stock ones. Without looking it up ecactly he told me somewhere around $50 for the set. They would be a little heavier but worth it I think.

  18. #18
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    Johnny Hair: Are you having the same design as the aluminum reducers and bush made or just the reducers and using the stock bushing?
    it tied the room together man!

  19. #19
    1946:2006:2066
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    Progressive Coil Rear Shock Mounting Kits

    Speedgoat Bicycles carries these kits and are a better option than Fox's reducers. Fox
    and Progressive use the same diameter DU bushing. They make a variety of M6 and M8
    mounting kits. They are a full width steel tube with spacers for centering the shock. The
    sites indicates they are only compatible with Progressive. But it's worth a try at only $19.00
    US per eyelet.

    http://www.speedgoat.com/product.asp...=250&brand=196

    As for a coil-over shock resolving the problem, don't know. It might since the pre-loaded
    spring stiffens the shock laterally. But it's even more money than BETD kits and then
    find out you still have the problem. If you were to consider a different shock, go with
    the Progressive 5th Element Air. The eyelets are spherical bearings and use a similar
    mounting kit.

    http://www.speedgoat.com/product.asp...=250&brand=196

    I still believe if you could find some affordable alternate mounting kit that is a full width
    steel tube with spacers for centering the shock, your problems would disappear.

    Goodluck

    michael
    "Be not afraid of going slowly but only of standing still." - Chinese Proverb

  20. #20
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    Both

    Quote Originally Posted by canadian-clydesdale
    Johnny Hair: Are you having the same design as the aluminum reducers and bush made or just the reducers and using the stock bushing?
    I haven't yet decided if I will get them made or not I will wait to see if my new frame has any issues with the stock ones first

  21. #21
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    another suggestion

    hey guys sorry to drag up this old post, hopefully u might've sorted out ur bushings problems - it sux, i know i've had them with my 03 stumpjumper fsr. just to add my experiences, i wore the du bushing and because i was stupid and didn't replace it soon enough not only did i totally screw the alloy reducers but i also ovalised the shock eyelet! this meant that a new bushing lasted all of a few rides before slop developed in the suspension. anyway, just thought i'd mention this in case this may have happened to u guys too - my lbs said that when replacing the DU bushing and alloy reducers with new ones, the reducers should be a very snug fit (read push them in using a bench vice). if they're not then its cause the eyelet is ovalised and its back to fox for a new shaft - and in australia thats an expensive trip, it cost me bout AU$270 which i think is about the same amount in canadian $.
    cheers
    stevo

  22. #22
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    The problem has been solved, a bush and a stainless steel t-sleeve in lieu of the alloy reducers and I'm off and away. I actually thought the eye in the shock was ovalised but new bushings have been the usual pain to get in, sooo....... I guess the aluminum reducers wern't up the pounding by a clydesdale with a taste for rocky trails
    it tied the room together man!

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