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Thread: Banshee Viento

  1. #1
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    Banshee Viento

    An interesting new bike is the all-mountain hardtail from Banshee, the Viento. It's seems to be very lightweight and geometry is suitable for a long-travel fork like the Pike or Minute. Any info or pics. of this bike? Perhaps someone already tried it out and care to share some riding impressions?

    Thanks for the help!

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    I noticed the Viento while on the Banshee website. I would like to hear from some folks who have tried out the new frames from Banshee. I am pretty interested in the Pyre. It looks like a nice trail rig. I would like to know if you can run other shocks like the DHX coil or air on it besides the air shocks it is advertised with. Inquiring minds want to know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pewe
    An interesting new bike is the all-mountain hardtail from Banshee, the Viento. It's seems to be very lightweight and geometry is suitable for a long-travel fork like the Pike or Minute. Any info or pics. of this bike? Perhaps someone already tried it out and care to share some riding impressions?

    Thanks for the help!
    Pewe,

    Like you, I also find the Viento one of the most interesting frames this year - at least for me as a hardtail rider with epic mountain rides on top of every list. This is actually the first frame I've seen that combines true «All Mountain»-geometry with true lightweight numbers. As a writer at Scandinavia's largest mountain bike magazine - www.terrengsykkel.no - I made a news story on the Viento in november, along with an email interview with the designer Pippin Osborne himself. Check out his take on the Viento design below, as quoted in our forum (follow the link in the news story to see the discussion - in norwegian only, sorry about that).

    The news story and a few pics can be found here:
    http://terrengsykkel.no/?1436

    The frame designers view follows in this slightly edited summary from the email interview (only moved some topics together for easier reading, no quotes are altered). Massive props to Pippin Osborne who took the time to explain the details in such a honest and dedicated way. I mostly questioned the «morphing geometry» concept, and wondered how one frame can ride well with such a variety of fork travel settings. Here is what I got:


    «Hey Geir Anders!

    The Viento is a fairly lightweight all-mountain bike that is suitable for forks up to 130mm travel. It is built out of micrograin enhanced 7005 aluminum. The main tubes are triple butted to save weight and hydroformed to enhance strength and stiffness. The seat and chain stays are internally ribbed to increase lateral stiffness without sacrificing vertical compliance. (see attached tubing photo)

    Like you, I live for those long all day epic rides. I can't decide if I like the 6 hour climbs or 2 hour descents the best. This is what the Viento was primarily designed for. Note the seat stays; they have a fairly tight radius bend in them, near the bottom, to give the rear triangle a bit of vertical compliance. This shock damping will make the ride a lot less fatiguing during a long day in the saddle.

    All of the frame components have been custom designed to reduce weight. The BB shell is double butted, the dropouts are only 12g each yet incredibly strong. The asymmetrical hourglass head tube is lighter than a standard head tube but resists ovalization much better.

    The frame weighs 3.5lb in a medium size.

    I have been working on this "Morphing Geometry" concept for 5 years now. I think it makes a bike much more versatile if the designer takes into account all the riding styles and fork types that the intended rider might use. Of course you are right, most frames designed for a 3 or 4" fork will not be very balanced with a 6" fork, and vice versa. When I’m designing a frame to «morph», I look first at the intended use. In the case of the Viento, this is all mountain riding.

    The tubing materials and thicknesses are chosen for the correct weight and strength for this intended use. Then, I design custom tubes to optimize the strength and stiffness and to minimize the weight. ªNext, the ideal geometry is selected for the intended use. This includes: fork length, head angle, top tube length, seat angle, bb height, and chain stay length.

    Of course there are many conflicting ideas in regard to what the «perfect» geometry for a certain type of bike is. Over 25 years riding, racing and designing high performance bikes I have developed some certain formulae for frame geometries.

    Instead of saying that I want a certain head angle, I look at the steering trail because this more accurately describes how a bike will react to steering input.

    I then choose a head angle that achieves this trail with the length of fork I wish to use. Top tube length and seat tube angle work together to influence rider comfort, confidence and the rider’s ability to generate power. Therefore different riding disciplines will require different top tube lengths and seat tube angles. Instead of using BB height in my design, I try to make the «drop» of the frame match the fork travel and ground clearance requirements.

    Chain stay length affects the natural turning radius of the bike and works in conjunction with the trail. Chain stay length is kind of like choosing skis. Shorter slalom type skis and shorter chain stays are best for quick turns and nimble handling. Longer giant slalom type skis and longer chain stays are better for higher speeds and longer carving turns.

    Once I have these geometric criteria determined, I draw the bike in its ideal form with its intended fork. The base design of the Viento is with a 5" fork and adjusted from there. The base design had a 69 degree head angle. After adjustment, to allow the frame to morph, the actual head angle is 68.45 degrees. This is a very slight 0.55 degree change.This is the base design. I then redraw the frame with different wheel sizes and fork lengths in the range that I desire. Different wheel sizes and fork lengths suggest different riding styles and different terrain conditions so I check the geometry of each variation against the ideal requirements. Some minor adjustments of the base design are undertaken to adjust the geometry to work in the various configurations, but it is always very slight.

    ªFor example, a Viento is a bit heavy for x/c racing but for a big, strong and heavy guy it would be perfect. With a 3" fork, the Viento has a 71 degree head angle, perfect for x/c racing. The bb height is fairly low, reflecting the smooth terrain and benefits of a low center of gravity in x/c riding. The same frame with a 5" fork has a 68 degree head angle which is ideal for the wide ranges of terrain associated with all mountain riding. The BB is almost an inch higher to provide added ground clearance for rougher terrain. If a fork or wheel size does not work properly, we do not recommend it or include it in our geometry charts.

    ªI hope this gives you a bit of insight into my design process. Full suspension bikes are more complex by an order of magnitude. ªWhat separates Banshee hardtails with Morphing Geometry from other hardtails is that I actually take different fork and wheel configurations into consideration in the design. I do not consider the Viento to be a «long travel» hardtail. Our Scirocco or Morphine would be our best bikes for this.


    All the best,

    Pip»

    - - -


    Sounds good to me.
    I'll get a complete Viento for test riding as soon as the snow goes away :-D




    *geiranders

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    Hei Geir Anders,

    thanks for your reply! Oh yes, make no mistake about it...Of course I've already read the exellent article in terrengsykkel. I' m from Sweden so norwegian is no problem for me. I also contacted Somar in Norway and they have at the moment two complete bike in the shop. I e-mailed Börre and he was willing to sell borh frames to me (one for my riding buddy aswell).

    Been researching for a long time about the new bikes we are getting and I've made a list on different candidates: Cove Stiffee (to heavy?), Cove Hummer (great, but to expensive), Cotic Soul (also good and happy owners), Nicolai Argon FR (wonderful but also expensive, 1200 Euro) and a few others, both titanium, steel and alu.

    And so comes the Viento....On paper it looks very good but I'm not sure what to expect really. I really think I will like the low weight and Pip sure seems to know what he is talking about. Not so sure about this "morphing" qualities really but I'm happy if it's a great bike in one setting. I don't think I will change much once I've built up the bike. The reason why I feel a bit uncertain is that even though I consider myself as an experienced rider both on and off-road I must admit that I've never tried many different bikes. Haven't got around to it simply put. So I don't have much to compare with.

    But I do know that I need a much "bigger" bike with more travel up front, bigger brakes and slightly relaxed geometry. My current bike is a Cannondale F2000 wich as you know a xc-bike. The new bike is going to be used 70 % in the swedish forests with technical singletrack but a couple of times a year I'm going to the Italian Dolomites (Lake Garda) where the terrain is much steeper and demanding. So the bike have to be really versatile.

    I probably make my mind up this week. Buying a bike untried/unseen is not really how I usually get my bikes but in this case I might do an exception.

    Looking forward to hear from you!

    Regards
    Patrik from Sweden

  5. #5
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    looks like a santacruz chameleon

    Quote Originally Posted by pewe
    An interesting new bike is the all-mountain hardtail from Banshee, the Viento. It's seems to be very lightweight and geometry is suitable for a long-travel fork like the Pike or Minute. Any info or pics. of this bike? Perhaps someone already tried it out and care to share some riding impressions?

    Thanks for the help!
    i own one and i love it

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    Can you please post some pictures of the Viento? I've only seen one "real" pic. on an russian(!) site and that was a frame only shot. SO if you have the oppertunity to post some pics I would be grateful!

    Regards

    Patrik

  7. #7
    nav
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    I've been searching for a frame for my next not-super-lightweight XC build (XC geometry but a frame that's a little tougher than normal between 3.5 and 4.0 pounds) because I'm going to mutate my Komodo build a bit and had been investigating the Banshee Viento. All the other hardtail options I considered were either too light weight (Ellsworth Enlightenment), super expensive (Nicolai, Whyte, Ventana; I'm not going to even mention the titanium frames I looked at), had horizontal dropouts (Santa Cruz), very heavy (Cove Stiffee and Scirocco), non-replacable derailleur hangers (Cove Handjob and Rocky Mountain Blizzard and Vertex and most custom steel frames in my price range), or otherwise let me down (Yeti ARC).

    The more I learn about the frame the more it seems right for me. Hopefully within a few months I'll own one . This is the first thread I've seen anywhere discussing it yet so any reviews or pictures would interest me.

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    nav: You and I are in the same situation, know exactly what you are talking about.

    The Viento is the only bike that I've found that meets my criteria, except the Cove Hummer wich is very expensive. Lightweight, long travel with good standover isn't easy to find.

    Personally I think Bansheeis on to something here, and I think many manufacturers will follow.

    I'm 99% sure that I'm ordering 2 Vientos (one for my buddy aswell) this week. Can't wait!

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