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Why did they jack this trail up at El Morro?

7K views 43 replies 19 participants last post by  ETAV8R 
#1 ·
I went for a ride tonight at the Newport Coast top side of El Morro to the sweetest single track in the park and the trail nazis ruined it. If you knew where it was you won't believe the damage that has been done to it buy whoever cut brush down to cover the trail. The whole trail was hidden in trees not bothering anyone. Who does this? What kills me are the groups trying to control lay of the land by killing trails other than the weak fire roads that are left. If these groups are so worried about the land in this area where were they when they built the 2500 homes for the rich and famous starting ten years ago in Newport Coast? The amount of man hours, time and money used to kill this trail could have been used better maintaining and building new trails. Sorry for the rant but it really is too bad.
 
#3 ·
ambassadorhawg said:
I saw similar stuff done to trail offshoots in Chesebro this past weekend. It's probably the state doing this, closing sections that were "illegally built".
that was the biggest waste of time i've ever seen, on the way back to the parking lot after riding out to china flats, a bunch of their work had already been removed. I really don't understand what the state parks are thinking, it seems like they're just trying to exert their power?? How hard would it be to start working with groups like Corba to help maintain the trails instead of covering them up with branches?? :confused:
 
#4 ·
Maybe if people stopped talking about these trails on the internet, the "trail nazis" wouldn't be constantly spurred to take action. Idiots posting these trails on geoladders, etc - that's who you should be complaining about.

The trail you're referring to goes through an acheological site and crosses a blue line drainage. Doubtful that one will ever be brought into the legal trails inventory.
 
#5 · (Edited)
There was a nice status quo in El Moro for many years; the park tolerated some of the older illegal trails. But then illegal trails started popping up all over the place--including the ill-conceived Deliverance. The rangers weren't going to sit by and let the park get carved up by any kook with a shovel, so they started cracking down. NBTD has been posted as closed for years, but the signs kept getting ripped out, so they started getting a little more aggressive--including handing out tickets.

It's not the end of the world. There are still plenty of great trails around, and some parks are actually opening up new trails--like Car Wreck in Aliso and the new trails in Oaks.
 
#6 ·
The state park resource managment team is working to close that trail permanently.

In addition to the reasons already mentioned, last year a rider was injured while riding an illegal trail in El Moro. He is threatening to sue the state for not being more aggressive in closing illegal trails. So, you can also blame your litigious society for closing your favorite trails.
 
#7 ·
Thanks for replying Chopper.
Even though I don't know the exact trail being mentioned here, I can only imagine.
It really is tough educating everyone about trail systems in OC.

Chopper said:
The state park resource managment team is working to close that trail permanently.

In addition to the reasons already mentioned, last year a rider was injured while riding an illegal trail in El Moro. He is threatening to sue the state for not being more aggressive in closing illegal trails. So, you can also blame your litigious society for closing your favorite trails.
 
#8 ·
The threatening to sue aspect will never diminish because this is California. There will always be ambulance chasers ready to respond to incidents of self stupidity and those who refuse to take responsibility for their actions. Where did you get the information on the possible litigation?
 
#9 ·
I happened to be present during a coversation between hiim and the park managment.

I don't know what the outcome was or if he followed through but the point is, this is what they have to deal with.

I'm also not saying that's why the trail was closed because I can think of at least three other reasons why they would want to close it, some of which were already stated.
 
#10 ·
CMH22 said:
I went for a ride tonight at the Newport Coast top side of El Morro to the sweetest single track in the park and the trail nazis ruined it. If you knew where it was you won't believe the damage that has been done to it buy whoever cut brush down to cover the trail. The whole trail was hidden in trees not bothering anyone. Who does this? What kills me are the groups trying to control lay of the land by killing trails other than the weak fire roads that are left. If these groups are so worried about the land in this area where were they when they built the 2500 homes for the rich and famous starting ten years ago in Newport Coast? The amount of man hours, time and money used to kill this trail could have been used better maintaining and building new trails. Sorry for the rant but it really is too bad.
People doing NIGHT rides there is yet another reason that things are getting closed down. Don't get me wrong, I've ridden some of the trails being aluded to here... I would NEVER ride them at night though. You might as well be up there with one of those giant spotlights that they use at the oscars, or a store grand-opening. You can see a night rider from MILES away.

You wanna night ride, join the crowd over at Luge.
 
#12 ·
-bb- said:
People doing NIGHT rides there is yet another reason that things are getting closed down. Don't get me wrong, I've ridden some of the trails being aluded to here... I would NEVER ride them at night though. You might as well be up there with one of those giant spotlights that they use at the oscars, or a store grand-opening. You can see a night rider from MILES away.

You wanna night ride, join the crowd over at Luge.
thank you. i worked the halloween ride in el moro and we saw lots of other "unofficial" lights bobbing off in the distance. then there's the local club that does night ride poaches with 30 people. ****ing brilliant...

get used to trails/parks getting closed.
 
#15 ·
-bb- said:
2w4s?

Is that the reincarnation of W4S? I thought you were up in LA now. did you move back down?
No, still living in Santa Monica, and i was discussing the stupid trail stuff they did at Cheseboro this weekend, completely different situation compared to El Moro. I agree with Dirtvert about El Moro, if the trail is closed, don't f'in ride it! I had to quit riding all the fun trails at the Oaks when they arbitrarily closed them, now they are marked trails! I still ride the OC all the time though. :thumbsup:
 
#17 · (Edited)
CalEpic said:
Keyboard courage. I wonder why he didn't say anything to them when crossing paths last night? :lol:
troll/stalk much?

there aren't any mods here, so i guess you can be as "disrespectful" as you want...as for internet courage, wikipedia credits you as the inspiration for the phrase. :lol:

seriously, you're an awesome ambassador for str--and the rads. but please stay on topic.

btw- thanks for the suggestion. if you really want to make an issue of it, i'll put in a call to the rangers/sheriff the next time i see the thundering herd poaching on their weekly ride. and, if you insist on harassing me on every mtb site, i also know about new trails that the rads have in aliso and another oc park. it would be too bad if they had to find another place to play...have fun at the pit.

and maybe--just maybe--you could ignore my posts like i do yours. cuz if you insist on continuing the pissing contest, we'll both end up smelling like a urinal.

"Don't do the crime if you can't pay the fine." : $$$ :
 
#18 ·
Sounds like some guys that need to put their skills to test. I dont like crying to rangers about trail enjoyment or discrimination. It might be best if the term White is removed from your tag of the rads. If someone were to describe other groups of a color with the same tone all hell
would break loose.
 
#21 ·
Dirtvert, you're a complete moron and don't know what you're talking about. I think you're just pissy cuz you got picked on in high school. I've been riding with the RADS for 15 years and we haven't done a night ride since before Y2K. Not to mention that a great majority of local trails were built by the RADS years ago and the county adopted them into their system under different names. Even Adam and his cronies have claimed to 'build' trails in the Irvine Ranch property when those were 27 year old RADS trails. Who do you think built the Stagecoach trail from the ranger station? 2 RADS, that's who... and the rangers asked them to make it. Telonics, Car Wreck, Rockit, Lynx, Stairsteps, Cholla, T&A, BVD, LIzard, Pacman... all RADS-built trails and the list goes on.
 
#22 · (Edited)
^^ radrider, you forgot Deliverance, just one of their newer creations that helped bring local mtbers under the current scrutiny of land managers. the trails they're building now are illegal (some are ridiculously unsustainable like the ones in aliso), every rads ride involves mass poaching--including in irvine south which helped get the park closed to ALL cyclists for months. and putting on a highly publicized illegal race is a great feather in their cap. if the rads were so proud of their "accomplishments" they wouldn't have to live in the shadows...

as for Stagecoach--thanks, Chopper! i did trailwork on it last year with 40 people all morning, and we could only fix about 1/2 the trail; it was very poorly designed.

rationalize it any way you want, call me as many names as you want, but you can't argue the facts. the rads are a dinosaur fraternity that runs on a sense of entitlement and hurts everybody else who rides on the same trails. i'm sure it's great if you're in the club, but it sucks for the rest of us who have to deal with the consequences. and is there anybody in the club that ISN'T a white male? seriously, that's just weird.

we've probably hijacked this thread enough. you can start your own "rads are rad" thread if you want. i'm over it...

Edit- arguing with ad hominem attacks speaks volumes about you--and the rads.
 
#23 ·
All those trails I mentioned above were "consequences". You and the mtb community have benefited from the clubs efforts for many years now. Dinosaur fraternity?.. we're going stronger than ever and new riders are always eager to join us. You're right only about one thing; the RADS aren't for everybody. But if you like to ride difficult terrain, challenge yourself against better riders than yourself, get one helluva workout, and make a great circle of friends in the process, then it's for you. You've got to be able to leave your ego at the door to get along with this group and based on your attitude it's no wonder you didn't fit. Luckily everybody knows that you only knock down others to make you feel good about yourself. Get a life, grow up, go ride your bike. I've said enough, you're not worth the energy.
 
#25 · (Edited)
RadsRider said:
Dirtvert, you're a complete moron and don't know what you're talking about. I think you're just pissy cuz you got picked on in high school. I've been riding with the RADS for 15 years and we haven't done a night ride since before Y2K. Not to mention that a great majority of local trails were built by the RADS years ago and the county adopted them into their system under different names. Even Adam and his cronies have claimed to 'build' trails in the Irvine Ranch property when those were 27 year old RADS trails. Who do you think built the Stagecoach trail from the ranger station? 2 RADS, that's who... and the rangers asked them to make it. Telonics, Car Wreck, Rockit, Lynx, Stairsteps, Cholla, T&A, BVD, LIzard, Pacman... all RADS-built trails and the list goes on.
Hi RadsRider,

Not sure if we ever met, but I'm pretty much a bug about being factual.

We don't claim to have built those trails, and people who attend the rides out there can attest that we pretty much state how they came to be. We even let people know the original names of the trails (at least as we understood them to be prior to the new names in the RMP).

Talk to Joe or some of the other Rads members I have communicated with in the past, and they will confirm that we acknowledge the history of those trails.

Even in the RMP we listed them as "Existing Trails" which was how we were able to get them adopted into the system.

You can track my posts back to 2007 regarding these trails: From March 2007
I don't take credit for the trails themselves since most of them were built by the Rads, but I do take partial credit for working through the system and getting the number of single track doubled from the original plan.

Again....we did not build them from scratch and have never claimed as such.

We surveyed them, had them reviewed biologically, had them listed as "existing unauthorized trails", worked to get them legally adopted, and did some minor alignment adjustments to tie them in to the existing configuration with the closure of the canyon ranch road (including the bridges). We also closed a couple of duplicate lines that existed on the trails.

We were able to get five out of six trails adopted, and only had to close one trail. However it was definitely a chore to get them adopted.

Originally the only thing on the RMP near those trails was Serrano Ridge, the canyon fire road, Fox Run and Rabbit Run (which were both scheduled to be hiking only trails). On the other side of the area, East Fork and West Fork were the only trails shown.

After our first survey of the area, and being tasked with the goal of developing a diverse trail system for the City of Irvine Open Space Preserve South; we thought it would be a better system to have more single track (multi-use), So we made the modified recommendation to the agencies to eliminate the canyon fire road and add Cattle Crest, Shady Oaks single Track, and Ridge Route as additions to the already listed Fox Run and Rabbit Run. And to have them designated as multi-use.

We also listed two new trails in the Bommer area (which we flagged this past week).

So the final result of our meetings with the agencies was the trail system you see today. Legally adopted.

That's the key word....legally adopted.

My point being....if you are going to post, just post factually.

As far as building new unauthorized trails....this is a bad concept and since the inclusion of these areas into the NCCP, these can have far reaching negative impacts for access locally. The days of building new trails without permission, then having them adopted are long gone.

Stagecoach South also was definitely a Rads built trail. The only difference being, that this one was built with permission as part of the park plan.

Working through the system may be slow, but it is the only way to get things done that will last.

It's true that most of the single track trails in those areas are adopted Rads trails; but where we split differences is that I have come to accept that the areas have been signed and listed into a protection document, and the trails that are to be adopted have been listed on the various GDP's and RMP's. And that the continued use of the trails that have been listed for closures; and the building of new trails; will only continue to hurt our sport.

The NCCP and the Resource Management Plans are realities that we have to deal with locally.

Anyway, everyone knows how to get ahold of me; so catch me for a ride some day and I can let you know what some of the final plans are for the various areas.

You obviously know me. Next time you see me on the trails, do me a courtesy......and just come out of anonymity, say hi and introduce yourself. I don't bite!

Thanks!

Adam
 
#26 ·
RadsRider said:
All those trails I mentioned above were "consequences". You and the mtb community have benefited from the clubs efforts for many years now. Dinosaur fraternity?.. we're going stronger than ever and new riders are always eager to join us. You're right only about one thing; the RADS aren't for everybody. But if you like to ride difficult terrain, challenge yourself against better riders than yourself, get one helluva workout, and make a great circle of friends in the process, then it's for you. You've got to be able to leave your ego at the door to get along with this group and based on your attitude it's no wonder you didn't fit. Luckily everybody knows that you only knock down others to make you feel good about yourself. Get a life, grow up, go ride your bike. I've said enough, you're not worth the energy.
This post is so filled with awesome^

Don't worry yourself with faux-"advocates". They want everything to be lowered to the lowest denominator, or to what they might feel is "extreeem". Hooray for a-technical! Most of those fools could never hang with the Fruita University Cycling Team either. Not to say they'd be invited in the first place...
 
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