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  1. #1
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    True reason backing trail "closures" in LCWP and Aliso?

    Okay, this is somewhat of a spin-off from my other post. Having started riding in SoCal and various areas of OC, I have to say most of the truly outstanding, fun technical trails in LCWP and Aliso have been closed. I won't mention any names so as not to create any compass whatsoever to suggest any trails, but you all know the names. There are many other closures apparently permanent, but I want to focus on these two places.

    Anyway, is the reason one of, or a combination of:
    liability,
    delicate slopes/ridges/plants/animal habitat
    conflicts with other users that may have occurred
    complaints by other users perhaps, i.e. homeowners in the areas
    other?

    And, 2nd part of the question if one of above, or other, what justification does the state/county/city of Laguna Beach? have to do this (or excuse anyway?).

    Most importantly, what is being proposed and done now and going forward, to get these trails opened up permanently to us by say SHARE or any other group?

    (I maintain my SHARE membership although I'm up in Boise - yes have to renew now)

    I really really want to mention 3 trail names in particular but will not. I'll just say two of them overlap El Moro and LCWP area, and one is completely inside LCWP itself. That shouldn't get anybody in a wad - just making mention without making mention!

    As an analogy, I'll use recreational enjoyment of the ocean, and surfing, I draw a parallel to a perfect day of summer surf, big perfect waves breaking way outside - (beyond where most swimmers and boogie boarders go anyway), yet the city or county "blackballing" the area for miles, so those waves going unridden and not enjoyed; although swimmers would be safe anyway - sort of a zero tolerance, all or nothing policy, whereas just the inside break could be blackballed. Not a perfect analogy since there ARE other users on said trails, or at least I've seen hikers on one of them, but the spirit of the idea comes through here.

    discuss please
    Last edited by mtnbkrdr98; 03-14-2008 at 11:32 AM.
    Sound of Tires on Dirt - Sole Music; shared with friends - Soul Music.

  2. #2
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    Actually quite a bit of movement has already taken place and the process is still in progress.

    Basically the County is in the process of formalizing the inventory of legal trails in the park and there have been several public meetings where the users had the opportunity to make their views heard.

    There's no need to hide the names of the trails you are concerned with since they are all known trails (including by the County), and most of them are shown by their most common names on the County's exhibits which are available on their website at www.ocparks.com under the Aliso-Woods Canyon RRMP page.

    Currently the general proposed maps show the potential for opening the following trails:
    Car Wreck
    Nestalls (aka Birthday)
    Corridor (for a connection to LCWP)
    and a connector trail from somewhere near the bottom of Cholla up to Five Oaks to make a legal loop instead of the current up and back.
    However, the plan also calls for their opening being contingent upon the successful closure and rehabilitation of the non-sanctioned trails that will not be part of the final park inventory.

    The reasons for the trail closures of any remaining non-sanctioned trails has to do with the habitat protection that the area is required to be managed under due to its signatory assignment under the NCCP (Natural Communities Conservation Plan), and an extensive biological review of the entire area...(ie... duplicity of trails, habitat fragmentation, erosion, and sensitive habitats and species).

    All the user groups have had the opportunity to get involved in the process and you can review the entire history and view all the trail and habitat exhibits on the website listed above.

    I hope this helps.

    Thanks!

  3. #3
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    Most of the trails have been closed to preserve plant/animal habitat. Both areas are designated "wilderness" parks which means habitat preservation takes priority over recreation.

    As someone who has been riding in OC for close to 20 years, I do miss the trails that have been closed at Aliso, but overall we have 100s of miles of trails within a very small area that are open. Go explore a little and you'll find plenty of dirt that is open.

  4. #4
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    JamR,

    I appreciate the detailed response and am taking a look at the county exhibits now. Going to read the exec. summary first then go further into it.
    But commenting right now, it's good that Car Wreck and Nestalls (Bday) has the potential for opening or reopening. Would certainly hope that 4 more classic trails would make the "potential" list.

    Will comment later

    thanks again!

    Edit: ok I very quickly briefed the contents after reading the exec. summary.

    and see no mention of 4 more tails I am thinking of. Not sure what side of the tradeoff they are going to be included in. Maybe I have not read far enuf into it. Again, two of these trails are within El Morro AND LCWP; one is fully in LCWP (parallels the toll road as well), and one is completely within El MOrro (not bday trail)

    by the way, the reason I wasn't aware of the RMP and mtb community involvement in this is that I haven't lived in Cal for over 6 years, but look forward to returning, permanently within 1.5 years, and this is my favorite riding area and in my opinion a really special resource (LCWP), the trails, woodlands, coastal scrub, cacti, etc. very special place!

    will get back as I read and study the entire plan/update.
    Last edited by mtnbkrdr98; 03-14-2008 at 08:12 PM.
    Sound of Tires on Dirt - Sole Music; shared with friends - Soul Music.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrdr98
    JamR,

    I appreciate the detailed response and am taking a look at the county exhibits now. Going to read the exec. summary first then go further into it.
    But commenting right now, it's good that Car Wreck and Nestalls (Bday) has the potential for opening or reopening. Would certainly hope that 4 more classic trails would make the "potential" list.

    Will comment later

    thanks again!

    Edit: ok I very quickly briefed the contents after reading the exec. summary.

    and see no mention of 4 more tails I am thinking of. Not sure what side of the tradeoff they are going to be included in. Maybe I have not read far enuf into it. Again, two of these trails are within El Morro AND LCWP; one is fully in LCWP (parallels the toll road as well), and one is completely within El MOrro (not bday trail)

    by the way, the reason I wasn't aware of the RMP and mtb community involvement in this is that I haven't lived in Cal for over 6 years, but look forward to returning, permanently within 1.5 years, and this is my favorite riding area and in my opinion a really special resource (LCWP), the trails, woodlands, coastal scrub, cacti, etc. very special place!

    will get back as I read and study the entire plan/update.
    I'm not sure about the trails status in EM or LCWP as far as additional trails to the inventory of trails since both of those parks have pretty much been through either a Recreation and Resource Management Plan (RRMP), General Design Plan (GDP), or similar plan that has taken place. So I believe that the trails have already been planned and implemented with the exception of Lizards which has had a unique status in the past, although it is currently not authorized.

    Marie's is off the bubble from my understanding for several reasons which includes its location through a restoration area and other jurisdictions besides the county (including Caltrans).

    What I typically recommend to everyone who is interested in these types of trail issues is to contact the source by talking to the rangers or land managers of the particular area. They should be able to answer any questions and give you the straight scoop.

    All in all though, the entire area has seen some great additions over the years of trails that were once not authorized.............Stairsteps, Emerald Falls (BVD), Laguna Ridge (T&A), the new Stagecoach South Trail from the Nix Nature Center, Rabbit Run (Rock Problem or Poachers), Cattle Crest (Cowabunghole), Fox Run (Rock Bridge), Ridge Route (Irvine ST), and Shady Oaks (Turtle Island).

    So the land managers have definitely seen the need and desire for good single-track and nature trails and have responded in-kind with these trails. while there are certainly others out there that we would have liked to see included in the inventory; for the most part I believe that some really good compromises were reached.

    And if the additional trails are approved and included in the Aliso-Woods RRMP, it will be even better in the future.

    Overall, I think the whole South Coast Wilderness Area with more than 100 miles of trails and fire roads is a pretty impressive trail system for everyone. There will definitely be some lost favorite trails but overall we still have plenty of fun and technical trails to ride.

    Thanks......and see ya on the trails!

  6. #6
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    JamR,

    very good to hear it! Pretty busy with studying this weekend, slammed, and will be lucky to get a solid road ride in this weekend for fitness, betwen rainshowers up here, but when get a chance will look at map to see where some of those additions are, as I haven't even heard of or ridden some of them. Happy about those additions! As for Maries, I was hoping it would have been taken into consideration and kept open. Was also hoping for three more I'll PM you on. I will say these three did/do make riding El Moro itself much more interesting and varied, but with Bday opening that doese same.

    Thanks again!!!

    Sound of Tires on Dirt - Sole Music; shared with friends - Soul Music.

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