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  1. #1
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    San Diego, WAKE UP!

    There's a thread in this forum titled,"Sunday AM ride in Alpine?" The poster is from out of town.He states he has his big bike,truck,and can shuttle. 68 views as I type this, and no one has posted a thing about trail access at ATT.

    What's up. You all going to wait for him to post a picture of his truck up at the top and then proceed to call him a tool? Going to tell him after the fact about pissed off Indians and residents? Going to explain after the fact that he should of known about the situation regarding ATT?

    Here's what I think: Based on the deleted thread a few weeks ago, and this thread, not to many people really care about ATT, nor do they care if we mountain bikers lose access to a trail in San Diego County. Losing trail access due to disregarding trespassing laws probably doesn't help us in future trail access negotiations.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  2. #2
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    How about the one that is shuttling ATT needs to wake up! It is the riders responsibility to know what is legal, and what is not. Blaming the San Diego MTB community is not the right way.

    People themselves need to be responsible for their own actions, not society.

  3. #3
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    Oliver,

    I totally agree with you. Each individual is responsible for their actions. My point: The San Diego biking community, at least the ones that know of the trail access situation pertaining to ATT, do we not owe it to OURSELVES to inform individuals, local and non-local alike, when a situation is right in front of us? Is not education of local trail issues an important tool to help keep access to trails open to us?

    At least the OP posted his intentions. I pm'ed him, as well as others, and suggested other trails. By informing the OP of our situation, I believe he's now "woken up."

    As far as your last statement is concerned, I'm giving that one a pass.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  4. #4
    ocd
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    Overall the situation in SD looks a bit dark

    Personally I avoid ATT, no need for my ass to be out there adding to the problems.

    But the overall outlook on San Diego and bikes in general is not a good one.

    There are 1.5-2 million people in this county. There is a lot of revenue being created from bikes. Mountain bikes, road bikes, cruiser bikes, all different kinds of bikes.

    What events take place in SD county that are bike related? Very few. I am not talking about a brush clearing/trail maintenance every once in a while, I'm talking about events to promote bikes/trails/common use and the like.

    Considering the climate of San Diego and the population, we should be among the leading cities that are carrying out bike related events and activities. Mountain bike events, road bike events, commuting events and the list goes on.

    Quite simply though it doesn't happen. You read about cities that are improving bike infrastructure and trails, San Diego is nowhere to be found. Read about places grooming their open spaces for mountain bike access and to draw more people, San Diego is nowhere to be found.

    The issue is much larger than a single thread about ATT and someone shuttling while visiting.

    I'm babbling but honestly, I have been hearing a whole lot of what I would consider ******** from a whole lot of different organizations in San Diego county when it concerns bikes. Whether it is Mountain Bikes, Road Bikes or beach cruisers. On the trails, in the mountains, on the beaches and even on the college campuses. Bikes and their revenue to the surrounding communities are simply not a priority and the "higher ups" seem to have little interest in bringing light to the benefits.

    It is truly a shame for a city with such a perfect climate.

  5. #5
    shred
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    those rich bastards are the olny ones that are still going to be driving cars. gas is rising and its not going to fall. if u dont want to be poor id ride a bike eveywhere

  6. #6
    mechmann_mtb
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    Quote Originally Posted by ocd
    Personally I avoid ATT, no need for my ass to be out there adding to the problems.

    But the overall outlook on San Diego and bikes in general is not a good one.

    There are 1.5-2 million people in this county. There is a lot of revenue being created from bikes. Mountain bikes, road bikes, cruiser bikes, all different kinds of bikes.

    What events take place in SD county that are bike related? Very few. I am not talking about a brush clearing/trail maintenance every once in a while, I'm talking about events to promote bikes/trails/common use and the like.

    Considering the climate of San Diego and the population, we should be among the leading cities that are carrying out bike related events and activities. Mountain bike events, road bike events, commuting events and the list goes on.

    Quite simply though it doesn't happen. You read about cities that are improving bike infrastructure and trails, San Diego is nowhere to be found. Read about places grooming their open spaces for mountain bike access and to draw more people, San Diego is nowhere to be found.

    The issue is much larger than a single thread about ATT and someone shuttling while visiting.

    I'm babbling but honestly, I have been hearing a whole lot of what I would consider ******** from a whole lot of different organizations in San Diego county when it concerns bikes. Whether it is Mountain Bikes, Road Bikes or beach cruisers. On the trails, in the mountains, on the beaches and even on the college campuses. Bikes and their revenue to the surrounding communities are simply not a priority and the "higher ups" seem to have little interest in bringing light to the benefits.

    It is truly a shame for a city with such a perfect climate.

    i have to say, if this site had a "thanks" button, i would have pressed it!

    SD is not bike friendly, but it is horse friendly.

  7. #7
    shred
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    i know of a way. theres a town called rancho santa fe in sandiego, the richest place in the world at one point. there are a ton of super spoiled rich kids that could pour in money to some mtb organizations. if u could get some flyers and poster etc. around that town you are bound to get attention and $. i would know i lived there.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTN MAN
    i know of a way. theres a town called rancho santa fe in sandiego, the richest place in the world at one point. there are a ton of super spoiled rich kids that could pour in money to some mtb organizations. if u could get some flyers and poster etc. around that town you are bound to get attention and $. i would know i lived there.
    Well, what are you waiting for?

  9. #9
    Glad to Be Alive
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    what do we do about the uneducated riders who don't know the rules and those who choose to ignore it??
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  10. #10
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    Well for ATT, how about getting auth to install a kiosk with maps, some guidelines and etc on it, adjacent to the trail? Out of towners and other people that just don't know what the deal is out there would at least have a chance to encounter information they might otherwise only receive online (but without the berating sure to follow from an online inquiry).

    Hell, I'm going back to sleep now.

  11. #11
    Northern Aggressor
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    Quote Originally Posted by ocd
    Personally I avoid ATT, no need for my ass to be out there adding to the problems.

    But the overall outlook on San Diego and bikes in general is not a good one.

    There are 1.5-2 million people in this county. There is a lot of revenue being created from bikes. Mountain bikes, road bikes, cruiser bikes, all different kinds of bikes.

    What events take place in SD county that are bike related? Very few. I am not talking about a brush clearing/trail maintenance every once in a while, I'm talking about events to promote bikes/trails/common use and the like.

    Considering the climate of San Diego and the population, we should be among the leading cities that are carrying out bike related events and activities. Mountain bike events, road bike events, commuting events and the list goes on.

    Quite simply though it doesn't happen. You read about cities that are improving bike infrastructure and trails, San Diego is nowhere to be found. Read about places grooming their open spaces for mountain bike access and to draw more people, San Diego is nowhere to be found.

    The issue is much larger than a single thread about ATT and someone shuttling while visiting.

    I'm babbling but honestly, I have been hearing a whole lot of what I would consider ******** from a whole lot of different organizations in San Diego county when it concerns bikes. Whether it is Mountain Bikes, Road Bikes or beach cruisers. On the trails, in the mountains, on the beaches and even on the college campuses. Bikes and their revenue to the surrounding communities are simply not a priority and the "higher ups" seem to have little interest in bringing light to the benefits.

    It is truly a shame for a city with such a perfect climate.
    Just to give you some perspective, I moved back to Boston this Jaunary after 4 years in San Diego. As I'm sure you know, compared to San Diego the weather SUCKS here in New England.

    Much to my surprise though, the mountain bike scene is epically huge compared to San Diego. The New England Mountain Bike Assoc. is extremely active; they have at least seven chapters throughout the state, which is impressive considering the size of MA. There are numerous clubs organizing group rides, skills clinics, trails days have hundreds turn out, people make t-shirts, blah blah. The ski resorts within 2 hours of Boston are all building up there trails, I can go on and on.

    I too was perplexed and frustrated with the lack of activism and involvment in the San Diego MTB scene. I think the real problem in San Diego is just the explosive growth of the last decade and the somewhat transient nautre of the population. Here in New England, the people running NEMBA, Deisel Bikes, etc. have all grown into thier roles over the course of decades. The trail systems in each resepective chapter have been ridden and nurtured by the same people forever, where in SD many of the resident riders havn't been in town that long (and many East Coast shmucks like me leave after a few years, only to be replaced after the Rose Bowl ).

    In other words, San Diego is just like a kid straight out of school trying to find its idenity in the world. If people commited to the area continue to stay involved and start threads like this, things will turn around. It just takes time.

    Interesting item: a group of a freeride guys who thought NEMBA (re:SDMBA) was too sqaure for them, started thier own club called Deisel Bikes, and they're really taken off. Food for thought, IMO SD could use its own version of Diesel Bikes. Check 'em out:

    http://www.dieselbikes.com/

    PS I know you hate Boston, New England, the Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, John Adams, America, etc. Spare me! [not directed at the OP, just to all you hater's out there!]
    Last edited by Evil Chocula; 05-12-2008 at 10:02 AM.

  12. #12
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    I emailed SDMBA two weeks ago after the infamous deleted ATT thread asking why there is no signs, information, anything to inform riders of proper trail access at the top of ATT. I have not received an answer yet.

    Seems to me that priorities regarding what should be addressed regarding trail issues in San Diego County are a little distorted. The fact that there is a trail in the County with a history of access issues taking a backseat to improve a trail that isn't falling off the face of the earth makes no sense to me.

    It should not matter how many people use the trail, how fun the trail is to ride, what type of riders use the trail, etc. To lose the privilege to ride mountain bikes on any trail undermines our credibility for all future projects. To not take action,either short or long term, on an existing issue can easily be used against us in this argument:

    Why should a land manager allow any new trail system when we cannot deal with what issues we presently have?

    I'm looking forward to the SDMBA meeting on the 21st. I'm not some whining little b!tc#. I have concerns, ideas, and more important, answers and time to commit to SDMBA to help.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  13. #13
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    Where is the meeting on the 21st? My wife and I would really like to get involved. There are so many things that other big cities are doing to allow its residents to enjoy the outdoors. We live in one of the most beautiful outdoor areas in the countries yet I cant ride my bike anywhere or take my dog off her leash.

  14. #14
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    Impy deleted that thread... after about 50 phags got on there and started running there foul mouths. foul mouthed phags who have never even ridden ATT and started out with

    "I usually don't get in on these kinds of threads...." then ran their ass mouth

    and interjected at some point "... and I've never ridden there and probably never will..."

    yeah.. good support, yo!

    until there's signs saying it is flatly illegal, then get over it. it has access issues on BOTH ends of the trail.

    just makes me sick to see all these whiners cowtowing to an even bigger group of whining f*uckups. i mean, there's like billions of acres of un-touched chapparal east of San Diego but people are whining about 5 mile x 5 foot strip. OMG!!! YOU ARE ON MY LAND !!! MY NAME IS BEN CARTWRIGHT!! GTFO IT!!!

    was up in Kernville this weekend. road Coyote. was primo. but the POS National Forest Service still has locked gates to much of the access in the southern sierra nevada... again, phucking tree huggers sitting on their lazy welfare a$$es not doing chit. no reason to keep the gates closed.
    It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own.

    - Cicero

  15. #15
    Northern Aggressor
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    Quote Originally Posted by mild beast
    Impy deleted that thread... after about 50 phags got on there and started running there foul mouths. foul mouthed phags who have never even ridden ATT and started out with

    "I usually don't get in on these kinds of threads...." then ran their ass mouth

    and interjected at some point "... and I've never ridden there and probably never will..."

    yeah.. good support, yo!

    until there's signs saying it is flatly illegal, then get over it. it has access issues on BOTH ends of the trail.

    just makes me sick to see all these whiners cowtowing to an even bigger group of whining f*uckups. i mean, there's like billions of acres of un-touched chapparal east of San Diego but people are whining about 5 mile x 5 foot strip. OMG!!! YOU ARE ON MY LAND !!! MY NAME IS BEN CARTWRIGHT!! GTFO IT!!!

    was up in Kernville this weekend. road Coyote. was primo. but the POS National Forest Service still has locked gates to much of the access in the southern sierra nevada... again, phucking tree huggers sitting on their lazy welfare a$$es not doing chit. no reason to keep the gates closed.
    Then again... maybe SD won't get it's sh!t together.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boulder Pilot
    I'm looking forward to the SDMBA meeting on the 21st. I'm not some whining little b!tc#. I have concerns, ideas, and more important, answers and time to commit to SDMBA to help.
    I predict they'll be stoked to see you and open to ideas you're willing to devote horsepower to.

  17. #17
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    EBasil,

    Are you being sarcastic? Are you giving me a heads up to bring protection?
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  18. #18
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    No, I meant it. When I've attended their meetings, I've seen them to be receptive to ideas and especially those from people willing to work on them. If you haven't met their "ATT Liason", you'll be impressed when you do (if he bathed recently) and if it's possible to place signeage, they'll know whom to ask.

    In terms of signeage, I'll proffer this for the backend of a project: if you get approval for either signs or a kiosk, I volunteer my time to chuck up a board or two under my router templates to carve out some names for you. Stuff like the Noble Canyon sign we've all seen pics of...ie 3" letters.

    Don't worry about being a DH guy at their meeting, either. SDMBA slaughtered all their goaters and have renounced short travel bikes entirely. Okay, that part is sarcastic...

  19. #19
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    I think I may still bring protection. EBasil, you mention,"If it's possible to place signage." Bro, dust off those templates.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  20. #20
    MTP
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    Amen, mild beast. The uproar over some dirt is comical.

    BTW, the biggest problem I have is with idiot dog owners who don't use a leash on public trails. Signs at the trailheads prohibiting unleashed dogs make no difference to these folks. I pass the signs everytime I ride.

    The next mutt that snarls at me gets a shot of pepper spray to the nose and eyes. The owners too, when they inevitably become unglued at my action.

  21. #21
    shred
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    i live in a damned place called florida at the time

  22. #22
    Self Appointed Judge&Jury
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Chocula
    Then again... maybe SD won't get it's sh!t together.
    Yeah really, if we all had his attitude the very few trails we do have would be shut down with in five years.
    Front Range, Colorado.

  23. #23
    shred
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    Wink

    hahah i wouldnt do taht over there ud get sued by some rich nutjob

  24. #24
    ocd
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    I made it as far as "moved back to Boston"

    And had to stop reading there.

    First thing into my head was "thank god, why didn't the rest of the m*******s go with him"



    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Chocula
    Just to give you some perspective, I moved back to Boston this Jaunary after 4 years in San Diego. As I'm sure you know, compared to San Diego the weather SUCKS here in New England.

    Much to my surprise though, the mountain bike scene is epically huge compared to San Diego. The New England Mountain Bike Assoc. is extremely active; they have at least seven chapters throughout the state, which is impressive considering the size of MA. There are numerous clubs organizing group rides, skills clinics, trails days have hundreds turn out, people make t-shirts, blah blah. The ski resorts within 2 hours of Boston are all building up there trails, I can go on and on.

    I too was perplexed and frustrated with the lack of activism and involvment in the San Diego MTB scene. I think the real problem in San Diego is just the explosive growth of the last decade and the somewhat transient nautre of the population. Here in New England, the people running NEMBA, Deisel Bikes, etc. have all grown into thier roles over the course of decades. The trail systems in each resepective chapter have been ridden and nurtured by the same people forever, where in SD many of the resident riders havn't been in town that long (and many East Coast shmucks like me leave after a few years, only to be replaced after the Rose Bowl ).

    In other words, San Diego is just like a kid straight out of school trying to find its idenity in the world. If people commited to the area continue to stay involved and start threads like this, things will turn around. It just takes time.

    Interesting item: a group of a freeride guys who thought NEMBA (re:SDMBA) was too sqaure for them, started thier own club called Deisel Bikes, and they're really taken off. Food for thought, IMO SD could use its own version of Diesel Bikes. Check 'em out:

    http://www.dieselbikes.com/

    PS I know you hate Boston, New England, the Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, John Adams, America, etc. Spare me! [not directed at the OP, just to all you hater's out there!]

  25. #25
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    I have a question: Are most of you people posting in this thread members of SDMBA?
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTP
    Amen, mild beast. The uproar over some dirt is comical.

    BTW, the biggest problem I have is with idiot dog owners who don't use a leash on public trails. Signs at the trailheads prohibiting unleashed dogs make no difference to these folks. I pass the signs everytime I ride.

    The next mutt that snarls at me gets a shot of pepper spray to the nose and eyes. The owners too, when they inevitably become unglued at my action.
    This is the attitude that is part of the problem. We all need to be aware of the others point of view. You dont think that hikers get annoyed with us when we shoot by at 20mph?
    Not that a mean dog is ok. It should be punished, and there are laws against agressive animals.
    Its more illistrative of the point. Don't you get mad when you see a gorgeous area that there is closed to bikes? Well I get mad when I cant let my well behaved dog off her leash.
    There are good dogs and bad dogs, there are good mountain bikers and bad mountain bikers, but its just dumb to ban an entire group due to the exeptions.

  27. #27
    Working Man's Toilet
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    Just move to East County- heard ther was trouble in the past at Anderson, but that there was no problem now-

    anybody got a link so I can read about the past problem? what is the status now, as I must have heard wrong?

  28. #28
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    Im kinda interested too. I just stopped riding ATT all together when they stopped allowing people to ride WC. (if it ever was legal)

    Anyone know for a fact if the Mike King section in the first New World Disorder video was at WC? There are two jumps I would swear are the upper end. and a flowy section that looks to be the traditional sections of anderson truck trail.

  29. #29
    Liaison
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    Quote Originally Posted by socalenduro
    Where is the meeting on the 21st? My wife and I would really like to get involved. There are so many things that other big cities are doing to allow its residents to enjoy the outdoors. We live in one of the most beautiful outdoor areas in the countries yet I cant ride my bike anywhere or take my dog off her leash.
    SDMBA meetings are held the third Wednesday of the month at Mission Trails Regional Park Visitor Center. 7:00 p.m.

    Check out our org at SDMBA.com for more info.

    We welcome concerned mountain bikers and really welcome people who are willing to get involved. We can help you find the people to talk to about your favorite ride.
    SDMBA Liaison, Sycamore Canyon/Goodan Ranch Open Space Preserves

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by D3DO
    Just move to East County- heard ther was trouble in the past at Anderson, but that there was no problem now-

    anybody got a link so I can read about the past problem? what is the status now, as I must have heard wrong?
    http://www.socalmtb.com/socal/trails...m?list=reviews start at the bottom of the thread and work up

  31. #31
    MTP
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    "Well I get mad when I cant let my well behaved dog off her leash.
    There are good dogs and bad dogs, there are good mountain bikers and bad mountain bikers, but its just dumb to ban an entire group due to the exeptions."


    Are you serious? Don't you realize that the last thing I ALWAYS hear from the non-leashing owner is "Don't worry, he won't hurt you" or "Don't worry, he's friendly." This of course is while the mutt is snarling and/or chasing me down. I stop, use my bike as a barrier, and then the owner of the "nice dog" comes running (sometimes), but always with a surprised look. Further, these dog owners don't know how their unleashed mutt is going to react, or be reacted up, by other unleashed mutts in the "no leash" zones.

    Bottom line: dog owners who don't leash their dogs on public trails where leashes are strictly required are BAD owners. Period.

    Forgive me if your claim of a nice dog falls on deaf ears. I am so tired of that line I could spit. Now, where'w my pepper spray?

  32. #32
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    if this thread is gonna devolve into a ~"dog's with $hitty owners" thread, i got a few thousand stories i'd like to toss in here.
    It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own.

    - Cicero

  33. #33
    Working Man's Toilet
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratt
    http://www.socalmtb.com/socal/trails...m?list=reviews start at the bottom of the thread and work up
    Great info- but a little dated- so is it technicaly "closed" but people ride it anyway or what?

  34. #34
    shred
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    are you telling me you can take down a dog? manhandle the little beast, their not that strong

  35. #35
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    Here's the deal:
    You park under the overpass on Peutz Valley Road. Although the locals have been known to break your vehicle windows. You pedal up about 3/4 mile, on pavement, trailhead on your left. Climb up to where it levels out, then go back the way you came.

    PS. Take the dog problems elsewhere.We don't need people thinking, on top of all the REAL issues with ATT, that dogs are running off leash attacking hikers and bikers on ATT.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  36. #36
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    yawn

  37. #37
    Eric at ITSA Bike Shop
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    My Emotional Response

    This thread brings up one of the biggest issues that us mountain bikers and cyclists face every time we're out or not out there on the trails. It's definitely one of those "sensitive" political issues that not enough of us cyclists (i say cyclists in general, because I believe trail closures affect us all) get active about. Cyclists are definitely a funny breed of people. Mountain bikers are so eager to cut a new trail, and even more eager to ride it. Road cyclists, bmx'ers, & urban cyclists in general just grab their bike and go for the ride everyday with little concern of the legal issues they may or may not be following. Simply put, us cyclists love cycling because it helps us get away from ordinary life, it's stresses, and definitely away from the political battles that we SHOULD be facing.

    The simple fact is that San Diego is horse friendly, because the equestrians are a more powerful group politically, because it "means more" to them. Granted of course, trail access means just as much to us cyclists as it does to them, but politically speaking, they are a much more active group than us bikers. The fact is that we need to fight for our trail rights. Equestrians see their trail rights as a part of their life , lifestyle, and livelihood. It is no different for us cyclists, but even with such a larger population of cyclists to equestrians, we are a weaker group, because we don't fight for our rights as if it was a very part of our soul and who we are. The equestrians really do. Sure we bicker and moan about horse-riders, but they are a prime example of how we should fight for our rights to the trails. With the larger population of trail users it should be a no-brainer on that one.

    The San Diego Mountain Bike Association (SDMBA) is one small way we can make a big impact on trail-access. Helping them helps us. Being a part of the SDMBA or just going to those trail-access meetings held locally, at the state, or even federally and voicing your opinion really does make a difference. Your voice is your greatest strength for us cyclists. For you roadies out there it's the San Diego County Bicycle Coalition (SDCBC) that helps with bicycle advocacy on those treacherous roads.

    I know we all know someone that's been hit by a car. We all know some trail that we've lost access to. The fact is that we do need to go through the red-tape and cut it. Be angry about laws that don't do anything for us, but be active in trying to promote change legally for us cyclists as a whole. One person can't do this alone. We do need to do it as a group.

    I'm sure I've ranted more than enough for everybody, but this issue is something that all of us cyclists should be really passionate about, whether you're a cross-country rider, downhiller, bmx'er, roadie, etc. This is definitely something that affects us all, because when one of the group gets weaker, the fact is that we all do. People who complain about mountain bikers or roadies don't complain about "those mountain bikers" or "those roadies" or even "those bmx'ers." They complain about "those cyclists" or "those bikers." Well, it's our trail and our streets, too.

    Eric

  38. #38
    Rollin' on dub-6's
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    It appears I'm seriously behind the curve on this...Anderson is completely illegal? I mean, I've encountered the big road block that the dude put up to protect his house, but that's the only "get out" vibe I've gotten there.
    We park underneath the bridge off the 8 (Harbison Canyon exit?) and shuttle to the top of World Cup. Ride down World Cup and connect to the trail that traces El Cap lake to the left, then hop on the paved road (past "the dude's driveway) right on down to the cars.
    What's wrong with this route??

  39. #39
    Eric at ITSA Bike Shop
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    Ya, honestly, I don't know the legalities of riding Anderson. As I understand it, the portion of the trail with the "road block" is actually public land, that one of the locals has claimed as his own because it's close to his land (that guy's been up to no good for many a year now, and has actually gone so far as making the trail really actually dangerous for us riders). If someone could elaborate if Anderson is public or not that would be great. If I remember correctly it weaves through public and private land through different portions of it.

  40. #40
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    Ya, honestly, I don't know the legalities of riding Anderson. As I understand it, the portion of the trail with the "road block" is actually public land, that one of the locals has claimed as his own because it's close to his land (that guy's been up to no good for many a year now, and has actually gone so far as making the trail really actually dangerous for us riders). If someone could elaborate if Anderson is public or not that would be great. If I remember correctly it weaves through public and private land through different portions of it.
    How about the one that is shuttling ATT needs to wake up! It is the riders responsibility to know what is legal, and what is not. Blaming the San Diego MTB community is not the right way.

    People themselves need to be responsible for their own actions, not society.
    Oliver, work your logic right here.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  41. #41
    Eric at ITSA Bike Shop
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    Ya, that's a big "d'oh" on my part.... no more computer super late at night : )

  42. #42
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    Eric,
    Check your PM.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  43. #43
    Equal opportunity meanie
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    Holy fvck.....I didn't even ride Anderson. I completely forgot about that thing until I saw this. I rode Noble with a bunch of chill local guys that day. And FYI, you're the only one who sent me a nasty PM or responded in any way to that thread to attempt and dissuade me from riding it. I think that nobody gives a damn. If I were into making judgements through online personas, I'd have to guess you're the same guy who will go out of his way to butt into any conversation that bikers are having to give them futile lectures on their stomping grounds. Also almost all of the local riders around there ride the trail pretty often and do shuttle it, and that is no small number of riders. Out-of-town'ers aren't your problem jackass....

    Gonna make sure I never mention riding in San Diego again on here, sheesh...
    805

  44. #44
    MTP
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    No worries. So you're not the "dork' in the picture, but do you own a dog?

  45. #45
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    That's getting changed soon. I don't own a dog but perhaps I should rent a horse to take on walks on drop 40lb piles of feces in everyones way.
    805

  46. #46
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    Here's the ATT scoop:

    I have got parcell numbers and land information on ALL of Anderson, including World Cup, Eco Challenge, No Name, Sidewinder, the Great Wall of Bofus, all the way down to Peutz (that's pronounced Pitts) Valley Road.

    At Puetz Valley Road, there are 4 private land owner's land that ATT crosses including Bofus' (I know his real name but I'm not posting it). ATT crosses about 20 yards of his land and he knows it, hence the wall 5 years ago. The other land owners are absentee and have differing views on crossing their land. (I've talked to a few.) The lower part of ATT crosses San Diego City land by the reservoir (right after the creek crossing just as ATT heads up). The middle is US Forest Cleveland National Forest, and all of the upper with the exception of the road (which is an easement) is the Viejas tribe land including WC and Eco Challenge.

    That being said, pretty much all of ATT, with the exception of the US Forest land is consdidered trespassing. The FS land is smack in the middle so you can't get there unless you trespass.

    There is no recognized easement through the private land as it stands now. To get an easement (therefore legal to ride through private land) requires an attorney to assert that and get the ball rolling. There are a few avenues to do this, but it will take time and money so the attorney has to love mt. biking and have a lot of time on his/her hands AND be willing to work for free so probably needs to be independently wealthy and/or sponsored by some organization that has a lot of money. Good Luck with that.

    As to the climate currently? It's OK. Not a lot of apparent opposition to riding ATT at the moment. Much better than it was 5 years ago when the sheriff was giving tickets, Forest Ranger Michelle was giving tickets, and Bofus was digging ditches.

    Bottom Line: Ride ATT at your own risk. If you do ride, be respectful of the community and the land. Keep a low profile and say "Hi" to everyone you see. Let's play nice.

  47. #47
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    Re: Where?

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Boulder Pilot
    Where do you plan on riding?


    Anderson, but if there is something else around Alpine worth checking out I am open to suggestions. Give me a call back when you get this - I'm on dial up so I probably will only check back here once later tonight.

    Gordon

    Re: Not Cool

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Boulder Pilot
    Hey bro,

    We have some SERIOUS trail access problems with ATT. The only LEGAL way to ride ATT is to park at the bottem of Peutz Valley Road, PEDAL up to the trailhead, ride up to the top, then come back down the way you came up.

    If you shuttle, you will be trespassing on tribal land. The tribe has threatened total closure of the top. Residents are petitioning to have access closed to us mountain bikers.

    We are in the process of trying to come to some kind of agreement with the tribe and residents. Any and all violation to what is presently the legal access to ATT will severely hamper any chance to get more access to ATT in the future.

    I politely relay this information to you off the boards so that you don't have to be subjected to the pissing war that was in an ATT thread 2 weeks ago that was deleted due to name calling, ETC.

    I ask you as a fellow mountain biker to PLEASE respect our fragile access situation pertaining to ATT. Check my threads. I just returned from a vacation. Before I left, I posted to find out any information about trail access issues in the areas I planned on visiting.

    May I suggest Noble Canyon. You can shuttle there. It's one of the best trails in Southern California.

    Thank you,

    Jason L. Showalter
    IMBA Trail Advocate
    SDMBA member


    No brakes on the little bike at the moment and I don't have all day to be devoting to shuttling. How long does the climb up take with a 38t and a road cassette?

    Shuttle Noble

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I have no idea what kind of physical condition you are in, but I wouldn't want to ride up ATT on your rig. Park a car at the Pine Creek Road parking lot, shuttle up Sunrise Highway and access Noble Canyon from there. You will have a blast. If I did not have a prior commitment, I'd ride with you.

    Have fun and thank you for being responsible. There may be a day when ATT will be open to shuttle, but presently ATT is not.

    Jason L. Showalter
    __________________
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

    DHidiot, the San Diego mountain biking community, at least the faction that cares about trail access for ALL types of mountain bikers, thanks you for not shuttling ATT. I know you chose not to shuttle ATT for reasons of your own, which makes no difference to me. What matters to me is the end result, that being, one less chance of a negative confrontation.

    As far as this new thread is concerned, I was covering your back. The reason I PM'd you, as stated, was to spare you the type of uncalled for e-thug berating that goes on in these forums, which you are obviously well versed with.
    Last edited by Boulder Pilot; 05-15-2008 at 12:01 PM.
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  48. #48
    i can't type the letter s
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boulder Pilot
    The only LEGAL way to ride ATT is to park at the bottem of Peutz Valley Road, PEDAL up to the trailhead, ride up to the top, then come back down the way you came up.
    As posted in my previous post, this statement isn't exactly true. There is NO unequivocal (i.e. supported by the state) legal access to ATT with the exception of the fireroad at the top to private homes.

  49. #49
    Single(Pivot)and Happy
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    Mouse Jockey, thank you for the information. I have one more question: Mouse Jockey, are you a member of SDMBA and/or IMBA?
    The suspension of your bike sucks if it's different than mine. Really. It sucks. Big time.

  50. #50
    i can't type the letter s
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boulder Pilot
    Mouse Jockey, thank you for the information. I have one more question: Mouse Jockey, are you a member of SDMBA and/or IMBA?
    Yea, I was on the board of directors for SDMBA when ATT hit the fan 5 years ago. I am no longer on the board but I am still the San Diego County Liaison and keep in touch with County Supervisor Diane Jacob's office and others when needed. (speaking of that I need to call to find out when the DJ's next trail meeting is, thanks for reminding me. )

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