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  1. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by DieselvRR View Post
    Can't believe I just read every post on this thread, and still don't know what happened with the lady on the horse.
    If you like this thread... You've gotta check "The Shed of Doom" on by bcsportbikes.com

  2. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by DieselvRR View Post
    Can't believe I just read every post on this thread, and still don't know what happened with the lady on the horse.
    Things are currently waiting for court, so to preserve the case no details are being released right now.

    however, according to the pictures of the illegal signs popping up it sounds like her, or her friends are vandalizing the nature with illegal signs.....
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  3. #253
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    Re: the lady on the white horse (if you ran into her you know what im talking about)

    It was odd timing that I have been following this thread and the one about the lady with "bikes ruin trails" on her shirt - because my club has been flagging new trail and the other day we had our own crazy dog lady. Came up to us with a nice "oh, you're ones of those people" about the approval of us building trails there. Started complaining how our bikes scare the dogs and we are going to get bit... this was on the paved bike path which she mistakenly though was for the dog park and dog walkers. Her dog wasn't leashed either - against park rules. ignorant stupid people are annoying.
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  4. #254
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    Re: the lady on the white horse (if you ran into her you know what im talking about)

    Quote Originally Posted by duggus View Post
    It was odd timing that I have been following this thread and the one about the lady with "bikes ruin trails" on her shirt - because my club has been flagging new trail and the other day we had our own crazy dog lady. Came up to us with a nice "oh, you're ones of those people" about the approval of us building trails there. Started complaining how our bikes scare the dogs and we are going to get bit... this was on the paved bike path which she mistakenly though was for the dog park and dog walkers. Her dog wasn't leashed either - against park rules. ignorant stupid people are annoying.
    HA! It's the same crap all over. 2 weeks ago I was riding the trails while my wife hiked off on her own. She came across 2 others hikers, one of which was a woman that said "Hello fellow hiker who is NOT a biker." My wife just smiled and said "Actually, I ride bikes too." The woman's husband rolled his eyes and shook his head in embarrassment as they walked by.

    It's funny because the local MTB club has their name emblazoned on every damn thing in the park. Even the sign at the entrance says the park is taken care of by the MTB club. But people still get pissed about bicycles on trails built by cyclists for other cyclists to bicycle on. What gives?
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  5. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by dgw2jr View Post
    HA! It's the same crap all over. 2 weeks ago I was riding the trails while my wife hiked off on her own. She came across 2 others hikers, one of which was a woman that said "Hello fellow hiker who is NOT a biker." My wife just smiled and said "Actually, I ride bikes too." The woman's husband rolled his eyes and shook his head in embarrassment as they walked by.

    It's funny because the local MTB club has their name emblazoned on every damn thing in the park. Even the sign at the entrance says the park is taken care of by the MTB club. But people still get pissed about bicycles on trails built by cyclists for other cyclists to bicycle on. What gives?
    People gotta hate.

  6. #256
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    This is no suggestion towards any aggression, please be clear. But if any of you feel the threat of bodily harm from either:
    Riled up horses due to her actions
    Or
    Horses out of perceived control on their own, it is (likely) well within your rights to use bear spray against horse and/or rider in self defense.
    Just a random POV from someone who lives in bear country.
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  7. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    This is no suggestion towards any aggression, please be clear. But if any of you feel the threat of bodily harm from either:
    Riled up horses due to her actions
    Or
    Horses out of perceived control on their own, it is (likely) well within your rights to use bear spray against horse and/or rider in self defense.
    Just a random POV from someone who lives in bear country.
    If there was ever a time for g0 pr0 footage...


    I've read that using bear spray on a human is a big no no legally, if said human is trying to run you over with a 2000 pound horse thing may be different, but being cali I don't think you are allowed to defend yourself before the horse caves your skull in with its hoof.

    I'm so glad the horses around here are used to dirt bikes so they couldn't care less about mountain bikes.

  8. #258
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    It's true, I think, in 16 years of riding here (near) the Tetons, I have yet to have one truly negative horse-rider conflict...except one ride I was on in the very early days of Teton Pass/Ritalin, (2001?) and that encounter turned into the beginnings of Teton Freedom Riders.
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  9. #259
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackbombay View Post
    I've read that using bear spray on a human is a big no no legally, if said human is trying to run you over with a 2000 pound horse thing may be different, but being cali I don't think you are allowed to defend yourself before the horse caves your skull in with its hoof.
    It is also a no no to shoot someone with a gun, UNLESS you feel not protecting yourself will get you killed or terribly injured. Everyone has a right to self defense of some sort, and I know of very little a human on a bicycle can do to protect oneself from a charging horse.

    I think if a rider was to use a self defense spray of any kind on anther person or animal all they would need is a rightful fear for their own life to make a stand in court.
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  10. #260
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    Is this the same trail?

    Private Property Should Be Respected

  11. #261
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    Yup thats it.

  12. #262
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    Airhorn, no evidence.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  13. #263
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    Thanks for posting that link Elkootcho. So horseback riders have allegedly obtained a legally enforecable prescriptive easement just for horses...Wonderful. But it's no basis to try exclude other user groups just because they haven't litigated it. Never heard of a prescriptive easement being able to EXCLUDE certain users. And the whole comment about how the easement was "for horse riders, specifically not bikers" seems very fishy - who was riding mtb bikes down Horse trail in the 70s? Marty McFly & Doc?
    And who's to say a legally enforecable one for bikes couldn't be obtained in the same manner that the horse club got theirs? The trail has been in use by bikes for many years. Unfortunately if they put their gates up it will take a court case to force them to remove them, just like the horse club did.

  14. #264
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    The gate will be installed to make it impossible for bikers to get through.
    I'd love to see a gate that a horse can get through but a bike can't.


    Besides, bikes are light, just pass them over the fence.

  15. #265
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    "It is an expense and big inconvenience (getting on and off a horse to open and close the gate)"

    Oh my god can you imagine the horror of having to get on and off your horse all by yourself?! I agree the nonsense about the easement sounds legally dubious.
    buzzes like a fridge

  16. #266
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    5 bucks says someone builds a ramp or a jump over the gate

  17. #267
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    The hypocrisy of the woman Mark Langton quoted on the CORBA website is quite staggering. Based on her 'bad apple' logic, the entire Sullivan Canyon area should be closed to horses because of the behavior of the 'bad apple' Lady on the White Horse. I have a feeling though that she's exempted her horsey ilk from her special rules.

    And it's okay for horses to use the trail because they've been using it for a long time and it's easement. Mountain bikers are somehow different...how exactly?? Because they haven't gone to court to prove there's an easement for bikes/hikers as well as horses?
    Oh and I'd really like to see that judgement from the 1970s specifically banning mountain bikes from the trail.

    But the quote of day from the article on the CORBA website (apart from what a big effort it is to get off & on a horse) has to be "We are constantly sending workers there to straighten out the mess they make of the trail". So that's how the 1% does their trail work...send in the servants!

  18. #268
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    Interesting (and hypocritical) comment from Mrs. Nichols below. Taken from the NY Times article, printed September 4, 2005:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sara Nichols (2005)
    Even in picturesque Sullivan Canyon, where horse owners pay for regular corral cleanups, a neighbor took Ms. Nichols to lunch shortly after she and her husband bought their house to try to convince her to board her horse elsewhere.

    "She said, 'It's dusty, and it creates traffic, and the smell is awful, and horse feces get everywhere,' " Ms. Nichols recalled. "I said: 'You're fighting a losing battle. Why don't you move?' "
    Original article here: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/04/fa...ed=print&_r=1&
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  19. #269
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    HA! We horse riders win! and you mountain bikers lose!

    Enjoy being locked on the other side of the new gate! we are unbeatable!

    The only possible thing that could go wrong, would be if someone were to keep putting superglue in the locks of the new gate, as we would be stuck on our side of the gate then. But no mountain biker has the brains to think of this! so we win!

  20. #270
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    Lots of outrageous BS in that link that Elkootcho posted but the most egregious, I think, is the comment about "bikers" (that's a common way to conflate cyclists with outlaw motorcycle gangs like the H.A.) doing so much damage to the trail, and never offering to repair the massive damage they inflict upon it. That seems to suggest that bicycles render a trail unfit for horse traffic!

    Holy Crap!

  21. #271
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    I love this thead, comedy gold!. Never gets old, never dies.

    What is this CORBA? surely they could have rather made it use the letters COBRA

    Coz Our Bikes Run Awesome

    that's it, I am starting COBRA.

  22. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonjm View Post
    that's it, I am starting COBRA.
    Here, I just sketched up a logo for you,


  23. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonjm View Post
    What is this CORBA?
    Not . . . sure . . . if serious
    Alcohol may lead nowhere, but it sure is the scenic route!

  24. #274
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    Is Cobra aware of the lady on the white horse trying to kill/maim mountain bikers with her 2000lb beast?

    I like how they say people are tearing out signs, but fail to mention that those signs are not being installed legally and how they do not sight actual law code violations on them.

    I wonder how much actual trail maintenance the horse riding community does on those trails, it has been documented over and over that 2000lb animals do more damage to trail systems than a 30-40lb mountain bike with a 150-250lb rider do.

    I find this entire thing very interesting and am eager to hear how the lawsuit involving the attempted murder of a mountain biker will turn out.
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  25. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    I find this entire thing very interesting and am eager to hear how the lawsuit involving the attempted murder of a mountain biker will turn out.
    Nothing will happen to her, you can get away with all sorts of thing in Brentwood...

  26. #276
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    "If the Riding crop doesn't fit...you must Aquit!"
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  27. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonjm View Post
    I love this thead, comedy gold!. Never gets old, never dies.

    What is this CORBA? surely they could have rather made it use the letters COBRA

    Coz Our Bikes Run Awesome

    that's it, I am starting COBRA.
    CORBA goes way, way back as the local mountain bike enthusiasts organization. They go back to a time when "all mountain bikes are banned everywhere on public lands" threats/actions. That is probably before most of you were riding.

    As for the area, the residents have all the political connections and money to litigate pretty much anything in their neighborhood. For example, they will pretend the easement is whatever they want it to be and litigate as such. If they point their legal resources at CORBA, the legal costs alone would swamp CORBA.

    I know there are some much nicer folks up there, but we don't get a chance to celebrate them.

    I'd appreciate it if you and others would take this a bit more seriously as the residents have all the power and money to do as they please. If they get mad enough about mountain bikers, it would not be good.

  28. #278
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    so what's the latest????
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  29. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHIVER ME TIMBERS View Post
    so what's the latest????
    Saw her on the trails today for first time.

  30. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonjm View Post
    Saw her on the trails today for first time.
    how did she act towards you
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  31. #281
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    I was hiking so not really relevant

  32. #282
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    Does anyone have info on the lawsuit against the HOA, such as the case number? I'm thinking of engaging the HOA to force it to recognize an easement for the bikes.

    I've got a license to practice law and am not afraid to use it.

  33. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce in SoCal View Post
    Does anyone have info on the lawsuit against the HOA, such as the case number? I'm thinking of engaging the HOA to force it to recognize an easement for the bikes.

    I've got a license to practice law and am not afraid to use it.
    Do you know a good consumer rights attorney?

  34. #284
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    So what gives do you have the photos and video or what, 12 pages almost a year later? is the lady from the CORBA post the same lady on the white horse.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Salt View Post
    I'm pretty sure this thread will go "back on track" once the still pictures, the video, the police report, (and whatever I'm allowed to share from my meeting with the city attorney) and the final outcome is shared. Right now this is still an active case being investigated.

    rev106, I think you will realize that this issue was more than just some pissed runner / hiker / horse back rider, etc. once you are able to learn the full story.

    I promise all will be shared.

  35. #285
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    I doubt it, he is being stone walled and not willing to do anything about it. The fact this dangerous mentally disturbed woman is still roaming the trails is proof.

  36. #286
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    Perhaps we should assemble a search party?

  37. #287
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    Not stone walled exactly.

    There has been some completion* to the "case". It was suggested to me that I be very careful as to what I say and what I post because of the, shall we say, legal "condition" of the person known here as "the lady on the white horse". Her and her attorney did meet two times that I know of with the City Attorneys Office (I myself met one time in person, plus several phone conversations, as well as meeting with the LAPD detective assigned to the case).

    I was given the option to pursue the case, which would have lead to a hearing in front of a judge, but it was suggested to me, by the City Attorneys Office, that because of certain "conditions" of the "defendant", and the fact that I had become aware of these conditions (over-heard though no fault of my own), that this condition(s) would skew or change the way the legal system would or could pursue any case. It was suggested to me that I not in fact say anything (as I am here) at all. Though because I know others have still encountered this person, I feel compelled to advise anyone that has interaction with this person in any but the most friendly manor.

    * The case is not "closed" with the City Attorneys Office. So, the very best thing to do, if you were to encounter this person, AND have a negative encounter, is to document it (photo / video) and contact the LAPD / City Attorneys Office. If this person is "behaving" themselves in public then I (we?) have gotten what we want, but... if aggravated encounters continue the City Attorney wants to know about it.

    In the case I documented, thankfully no one was injured, though it was the most scary encounter I've ever had with another person.

    You can view this person (not my video) beginning at 6:17 in this video: Jedi Plunge - Squirrel Cage Video - Pinkbike
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  38. #288
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    ^ So, what you're saying is: SHE'S COMPLETELY INSANE MAN!!

  39. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    ^ So, what you're saying is: SHE'S COMPLETELY INSANE MAN!!
    You have got to be kidding me, she is taking the "I am too mentally distraught to be held liable for my actions" stance?

    People are shameful.
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  40. #290
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    That's what I got out of it. Although, I could be wrong. It makes sense, if you consider her actions, doesn't mean I agree with it though.

  41. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    That's what I got out of it. Although, I could be wrong. It makes sense, if you consider her actions, doesn't mean I agree with it though.
    It is totally what her attorney is advising her to do(Speculation of course). No one ever takes responsibility for their own actions, it is always someone or something else's fault.

    I don't care if she has PTSD, there is no excuse for acting like that towards another human being, yet people get away with attempted murder all the time with these kind of lame excuses. If she really does have some sort of mental disability, then she needs to be locked up in a Hospital to protect herself and others. There is no way she should ever be allowed back on any public trail where she has the ability to hurt someone.
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  42. #292
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    A defense of insanity is very hard to prove. Like I said a long time ago, she'll plead a lesser charge and it will be over with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    A defense of insanity is very hard to prove. Like I said a long time ago, she'll plead a lesser charge and it will be over with.
    I'd think that insanity defense or no, it would be a fairly simple matter for the guy threatened, having audio and video evidence, to obtain a restraining order against her. Specifically pertaining to when she is on a horse. It would also take care of any firearm threat she may pose to him, as any and all firearms in her house would typically be confiscated for the duration of the order.

  44. #294
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    If she really is a nut she is not allowed to have any kind of
    firearm.

  45. #295
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    She's probably just got political connections. That's how I read it at least. There's no way anyone in a formal capacity is going to allude that the lady is retarded and that's a reason for dropping it.

    If that were the case (mentally handicapped) there's probably good reason for her NOT to be riding a horse by herself around strangers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by probiscus View Post
    She's probably just got political connections. That's how I read it at least. There's no way anyone in a formal capacity is going to allude that the lady is retarded and that's a reason for dropping it.

    If that were the case (mentally handicapped) there's probably good reason for her NOT to be riding a horse by herself around strangers.
    A horse can be just as dangerous as a firearm, so I'd tend to agree. Another factor here may be the automatic tendency of police to give cyclists, on road or off, short shrift when it comes to the protection of the laws.

    My friend, who owns a bike shop here, has gotten hit twice in the last week, just riding along legally on the street. In both cases, motorists making sharp right turns in front of him, while he was riding in a designated "Bike Lane", caused him to crash. In the second instance, somebody called 911 because he couldn't get up right away (he broke a rib). Paramedics arrived, then cops. Cops stated that they could not see 'sufficient evidence' to cite the driver for negligence. Both times he was not running a stop sign, was riding in a designated bike lane, and was not riding at or faster than the speed limit.

    Here in San Diego, if you want to get away with a random act of homicide, just run down a bicyclist. The cops will understand.

  47. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Ray View Post
    I'd think that insanity defense or no, it would be a fairly simple matter for the guy threatened, having audio and video evidence, to obtain a restraining order against her. Specifically pertaining to when she is on a horse. It would also take care of any firearm threat she may pose to him, as any and all firearms in her house would typically be confiscated for the duration of the order.
    I don't think there's a problem with her running into and harassing the same person or her seeking out specific individuals. So, a restraining order is pretty much useless.

  48. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    I don't think there's a problem with her running into and harassing the same person or her seeking out specific individuals. So, a restraining order is pretty much useless.
    That's exactly when a restraining order would go into effect. She would be required, by court order, to keep X distance from the individual(s) being protected. She'd have to turn around and go the other direction, or violate the order.

  49. #299
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Ray View Post
    That's exactly when a restraining order would go into effect. She would be required, by court order, to keep X distance from the individual(s) being protected. She'd have to turn around and go the other direction, or violate the order.
    No, you don't understand, everyone needs to be protected from her. How is everyone going to get a restraining order?

  50. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    No, you don't understand, everyone needs to be protected from her. How is everyone going to get a restraining order?
    Maybe it would be a good idea if you guys made a deal with her in an effort to avoid/respect each others space....

    Start a new thread here and have her participate. When she is gonna go out and ride, she can post it up as a warning. When you guys are gonna go out and ride, you can post it up as a warning. Seems fair to me.

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