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  1. #1
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    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! ever seen a mountain lion at calavera?

    On my ride at calavera on friday around 4pm i spotted something running through the field that appeared to be a moutain lion. but anybody who knows calavera, knows that would be hard to believe. maybe it was a bobcat? this thing was all yellow though. from pictures i've seen, bobcats have some black markings. whatever it was, as it ran away from me, it kept stopping to turn around and look at me. i waited till it was in the bushes and rode very fast the other way. although with all the fires, i'd think the possibility of it being a mountain lion could be likely?

  2. #2
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    I wouldn't be surprised.
    I spotted a mountain lion off Palomar Airport Road, and El Fuerte in Carlsbad recently
    "Hesitation is the Mother of Failure!"

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mudd
    I wouldn't be surprised.
    I spotted a mountain lion off Palomar Airport Road, and El Fuerte in Carlsbad recently
    really? when?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbchik25
    really? when?
    Go here: Roadkill cougar
    Post 17
    "Hesitation is the Mother of Failure!"

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  5. #5
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    ..where at Calaveras did you see it?

  6. #6
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    deer

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Dolor
    If there's deer in Calavera, it could have been one. If no deer, then probably not.
    i've never seen deer at calavera, but there are lots of coyotes, rabbits. do they make yummy kitty snacks?

  7. #7
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    you know where that paved road is near the dam?

    Quote Originally Posted by REIGN 2
    ..where at Calaveras did you see it?
    i went down that, then turn left and pass through the gate. went up the hill and kept going straight then there's an open field. that's where he was, to the left about 30 yards away. he definately saw me first, i didn't even notice until i saw him running off through the field.

  8. #8
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    Bobcats are frequently mistaken for mtn lions, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear of one there. Long tail is a better ID factor, more so than color. A guy told me a year ago or so early one morning he had just seen one. Lions can cover huge amounts of ground and have big territories. Yes, the fire makes it more likely. You're lucky to get to see one, but it does make one less comfortable doing solo rides at dawn or dusk!

  9. #9
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    ...it had to be a bobcat...just ask DJ....
    ...every day sends future to past...

  10. #10
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    I dont understand how someone can mistake a bobcat for a mountain lion.....

    One is dark and has a short tail, the other is quite a bit lighter and has a long tail...

    I know they are out and around, Ive been seeing a lot more deer lately up in the Temecula area.

  11. #11
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    Have you seen any tracks? I was just out there yesterday, saw a lot of horse tracks...grrrrr, they really tear it up. Plenty of hiker tracks through the mud. Not as manybike tracks throught the mud as I expected to see. I haven't seen a mt lion since 2001 up in Cuyamaca.
    No, it wouldn't suprise me either, as the fires do tend to drive wildlife into areas abundant in wildlife, and we all know that there are a lot of critters at Calavara, it truely is an amazing..be it small ecosystem.
    How big was it? Kind of creepy since I ride solo there a lot...in fact I ride solo just about everywhere since my wifes injury.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbchik25
    On my ride at calavera on friday around 4pm i spotted something running through the field that appeared to be a moutain lion. but anybody who knows calavera, knows that would be hard to believe. maybe it was a bobcat? this thing was all yellow though. from pictures i've seen, bobcats have some black markings. whatever it was, as it ran away from me, it kept stopping to turn around and look at me. i waited till it was in the bushes and rode very fast the other way. although with all the fires, i'd think the possibility of it being a mountain lion could be likely?

    I doubt it was any type of mt lion or bobcat. I have ridden out there for the longest time and have seen coyotes. I was bombing down one of the trails one day and had a coyote run across my trail. After he crossed I took off even fast just in case I scared or pissed him off by my flyby. So more than likely it was a coyote. Although rarely seen that is the only animal I have seen out there on quite a few occasions. For the most part they tend to stay away and on thier own path.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by skate
    I doubt it was any type of mt lion or bobcat.
    I've been riding in Southern California since 1989 and have never seen a cougar. I've seen two bobcats. Why couldn't it be a cat? It's more likely to be a bobcat but where there's food, there's kitty's.

    Cougars have a fairly large range of travel so for one to end up in Calvera it'd have to have a pretty good access path that's pretty secluded. I don't know the area well enough to know if it would have that or not.

    Before the Cedar fire, Cuyamaca park had the largest concentration of cougar's in the state. not sure how it ranks now though.

    YR

  14. #14
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    Mountain lion and bobcat pixs....
    (Quite a difference!)
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    "Hesitation is the Mother of Failure!"

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  15. #15
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    I just got an email from my almamatter.....(or however you spell that)

    Cal State San Marcos.......

    "The mountain lion has once again been seen on the campus grounds in the evenings and
    early morning hours. Please use extra caution when walking on campus at night. Do
    not walk alone. If you see the mountain lion, contact University Police
    immediately. For the fastest possible police response, program 750-4567 into your
    cell phones.

    Traps have been set to capture the animal, but until it is caught, walk in groups
    when outside at night. Do not approach the animal. If you are confronted by the
    mountain lion, DO NOT RUN, as this will stimulate the its instinct to chase. Make
    yourself appear as large as possible, keep intense eye contact, wave your arms, and
    make noise."

    Thought it might interest some of you......

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by skate
    I doubt it was any type of mt lion or bobcat. I have ridden out there for the longest time and have seen coyotes. I was bombing down one of the trails one day and had a coyote run across my trail. After he crossed I took off even fast just in case I scared or pissed him off by my flyby. So more than likely it was a coyote. Although rarely seen that is the only animal I have seen out there on quite a few occasions. For the most part they tend to stay away and on thier own path.
    it wasn't a coyote

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattsteve
    I just got an email from my almamatter.....(or however you spell that)

    Cal State San Marcos.......

    "The mountain lion has once again been seen on the campus grounds in the evenings and
    early morning hours. Please use extra caution when walking on campus at night. Do
    not walk alone. If you see the mountain lion, contact University Police
    immediately. For the fastest possible police response, program 750-4567 into your
    cell phones.
    .
    the "cougar" obviously feels right at home.

    masthead-logo-csusm-140w.gif

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mudd
    Mountain lion and bobcat pixs....
    (Quite a difference!)
    ...every day sends future to past...

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    Speaking generalities here... cats don't usually frequent being out in the open like in a field or a meadow. They like ground cover, being skulky, sneaky, and having something very close or nearby to hide behind, be it rocks, bushes, cover, etc. They like to hunt by getting close and ambushing their prey at close range. Given a choice, they like to be a minimum of 5 steps from being able to hide behind something to keep you from viewing them.

    Sooo, seeing a cat in a wide open field with no cover near by is not too common. A coyote will run and stop, looking back, once he feels the distance between you two is safe.. A cat, once he decides to leave, and has lost curiosity and interest, won't bother, they just keep on walking or trotting, never looking back. A cat, spooked at close range, will run and hide behind something, truly believing in it's camoflage , that it is invisible to you if it remains motionless.

    Hunting a coyote, knowing they stop and look back, ends up in the crosshairs. You just wait for the opportunity. If it was stopping and looking back, I have my doubts it was a cat, unless it was late January or February during the mating season. All horny animals do stupid stuff during the mating season.
    Last edited by Boyonabyke; 12-19-2007 at 10:43 AM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandyBoy
    Speaking generalities here... cats don't usually frequent being out in the open like in a field or a meadow. They like ground cover, being skulky, sneaky, and having something very close or nearby to hide behind, be it rocks, bushes, cover, etc. They like to hunt by getting close and ambushing their prey at close range. Given a choice, they like to be a minimum of 5 steps from being able to hide behind something to keep you from viewing them.

    Sooo, seeing a cat in a wide open field with no cover near by is not too common. A coyote will run and stop, looking back, once he feels the distance between you two is safe.. A cat, once he decides to leave, and has lost curiosity and interest, won't bother, they just keep on walking or trotting, never looking back. A cat, spooked at close range, will run and hide behind something, truly believing in it's camoflage , that it is invisible to you if it remains motionless.

    Hunting a coyote, knowing they stop and look back, ends up in the crosshairs. You just wait for the opportunity. If it was stopping and looking back, I have my doubts it was a cat, unless it was late January or February during the mating season. All horny animals do stupid stuff during the mating season.
    it wasn't a coyote

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbchik25
    it wasn't a coyote
    ...got yer back. Nevermind what all the 'authorities' around here say...YOU know what you saw.
    There are no absolutes when it comes to the natural world...
    ...every day sends future to past...

  22. #22
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    [QUOTE=xjbebop]...YOU know what you saw.QUOTE]
    Actually he doesn't. one can only assume what type of animal it was based on the location and terrain of Calaveras. For all we know it could have been a yellow dog or something.

  23. #23
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    I've been riding at Calaveras for thirty-five years...and it doesn't surprise me mtbchik saw a mtn lion where and when she said... running across the open area to get to the thick brush on the other side.

  24. #24
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    A few years ago...when Flightline used to exist...my former co-worker and I saw one in the eastern end of Flightline during a post-work evening ride. No mistaking it...long tail with the sleek body. Our boss saw one out there not long before that. They are out there!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbchik25
    it wasn't a coyote
    I don't know what it was... but the probability of you seeing a mountain lion in your mountain bike travels before a bobcat or a coyote is not that likely.

    Secondly, if I saw a mountain lion, on Friday at Calavera, I would have posted about it on Friday night, when I got home, to warn other riders of the hazard in the area before they went out on their weekend rides. Did you notify anyone else about what your saw before going home?

    You took your time posting about it Monday morning, so whatever it was you saw, you didn't think it was that important or worth warning your fellow mountain bikers on the board here about.

    So, what was it you saw? Your actions (or lack of urgency thereof) and behavior speak volumes about the perceived threat to you, and to others.

    Maybe it would be a good idea if you packed a digital camera on every ride, so you could take pictures, and remove all doubt. Photo opportunities like that are golden. Even cell phone photo's are better than nothing.



    *****


    Last edited by Boyonabyke; 12-20-2007 at 12:09 AM.

  26. #26
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    Dang, stop giving the girl a hard time Randy. Just because you yourself didn't see it, doesn't mean she didn't. If I asked if anybody ever saw deer at Discovery Hills and got a bunch of nay sayers, I would just laugh at you. I do happen to believe the fact that a large cat was at Calavara. Did I see it there? No, Did she? Yes. Those of you who judge the validity of her statement as if she doesn't know the difference need to lighten up, back off.
    I'll tell ya what, why don't we go out there and ride around a bit. I'll meet you there and we can then observe the terrain features and abundance of wildlife capable of attracting and sustaining such an animal. Maybe we'll discover some tracks or other evidence of its presence. I can be there this saturday, around noon, anyone want to take me up on this? Maybe you do Randy, lets see you put condescending tone into energy, we can get in a good ride, you can burn off whatever frustration it is your trying to vent, and maybe we can run across some evidence that will enable you to say..."ya know what, I was a jerk, I owe mtbchick an apology."

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by downhilljill
    A few years ago...when Flightline used to exist...my former co-worker and I saw one in the eastern end of Flightline during a post-work evening ride. No mistaking it...long tail with the sleek body. Our boss saw one out there not long before that. They are out there!
    I'm with you on this one Jill. Due to the fact that I spotted one at Bressi Ranch in October.
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mudd
    I'm with you on this one Jill. Due to the fact that I spotted one at Bressi Ranch in October.
    It always amazes me when people try to discount that a mountain could possibly be here or there. It is an apex predator that has a huge roaming range. The corridor is there. East County, San Pasquel Valley, Hodges, Elfin, La Costa.. Hello Kitty!... Welcome to Carlsbad.

    A big cat is going to come into PQ, Mission Trails, etc... It is not an if, but a when. Sooner or Later this equation will always get solved.

    Deer + Corridor + Time = Kittys

    People want to disbelief that the big critters that can kill you are not around. They are, but you are still more likely to get struck by lighting.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da-Sloth
    Dang, stop giving the girl a hard time Randy. Just because you yourself didn't see it, doesn't mean she didn't. If I asked if anybody ever saw deer at Discovery Hills and got a bunch of nay sayers, I would just laugh at you. I do happen to believe the fact that a large cat was at Calavara. Did I see it there? No, Did she? Yes. Those of you who judge the validity of her statement as if she doesn't know the difference need to lighten up, back off.
    I'll tell ya what, why don't we go out there and ride around a bit. I'll meet you there and we can then observe the terrain features and abundance of wildlife capable of attracting and sustaining such an animal. Maybe we'll discover some tracks or other evidence of its presence. I can be there this saturday, around noon, anyone want to take me up on this? Maybe you do Randy, lets see you put condescending tone into energy, we can get in a good ride, you can burn off whatever frustration it is your trying to vent, and maybe we can run across some evidence that will enable you to say..."ya know what, I was a jerk, I owe mtbchick an apology."

    Sloth, I deal in facts. A week ago, riding East Canyon, not only did I see deer tracks, but I saw mountain lion tracks in the mud, on the north damp side, on top of the deer tracks. They were 5 days old at least, another club member had seen them on a ride the previous Saturday. I've seen more coyotes and bobcats, at 12x, through a scope, coming and going than you.



    I have plenty of experience in both coyote and bobcat behavior, along with their interactions with humans in the field. Enough to have made money at it doing it as a profession in the late 70's through the late 80's hunting and trapping for pelts. When your paycheck depends on being good at what you do, you either get good at it or starve.

    An apology is due from the lady, not me, for her timeliness, or lack thereof in posting on the risk of "seeing something yellow that might have been a mountain lion" being seen in the area, especially before the weekend, when everyone rides there. That is flat out irresponsible. How would she feel if some other mountain biker got hurt, killed, or mauled by a Mountain Lion at Caladera last weekend, and she said nothing about it until Monday morning at work?

    We need to work together on this, not be devisive. Show some common sense about risk management. Report what you see in a timely manner, if it's a risk to all mountain bikers or hikers in the area. A look at other posters here that have seen mountain lions and what they have said and done to other bikers and hikers in the area to warn or advise them of the immediate risk, is the right thing to do.

    All I can say is this: if I saw a mountain lion on Friday afternoon on a bike ride before the weekend. I'd notify the proper authorities, in addition to putting up some dated cardboard signs stating that mountain lions are in the area currently and using it as their hunting grounds or territory, and to be careful and alert, as well as weighing the risks.

    I think that is just good common sense. Talking about it Monday morning is too little, too late.

    I will leave at this: mtbchik saw something yellow Friday afternoon on her ride at Calavera. It was running away from her through a field, and it stopped several times to look back at her before walking off into the bushes. It was near the dam She reported here on MTBR what she saw on Monday morning, once she got back to work, 65 hours later, after the sighting.

    One could say the same thing about Ted Kennedy and the incident at Chappaquiddick, based on the facts.

    If you care about the club and your fellow riders, post up immediately about the risks. We do so with fire closures, with rain and snow and trail damage, and most of us do it with mountain lion sightings. Seems like just good common sense to me. What good is news, if it's not timely?

    I don't want to see someone get injured from this particular mountain lion, and I particularly don't want to see the mountain lion having to be destroyed for attacking a human, if a little common sense can avoid that whole scenario.
    Last edited by Boyonabyke; 12-20-2007 at 10:05 AM.

  30. #30
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    Hey RandyBoy ... little grumpy today huh....I've been riding Calaveras for years and it seems entirely possible that a Lion could venture into that area. Maybe mtbchik was mulling it over to post it because of guys like you that like to ridicule mountain lion sightings...

  31. #31
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    Cougars rule.

    Quote Originally Posted by tacos&beer
    the "cougar" obviously feels right at home.

    masthead-logo-csusm-140w.gif
    There should be enough fit young mountain bikers for one to satisfactorily feed there.
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandyBoy
    .......

    If you care about the club and your fellow riders, post up immediately about the risks. We do so with fire closures, with rain and snow and trail damage, and most of us do it with mountain lion sightings. Seems like just good common sense to me. What good is news, if it's not timely?

    ....
    So there is no risk if you do not see them?

    Let's get some of the risk out in the open ahead of time in the name of common sense.

    If you ride anywhere in the dirt in San Diego County where Deer are known to be, there is a distinct possibility that a mountain lion may pass through. Riding a mountain bike, hiking, or doing anything in the great outdoors could result in you being eaten by a mountain lion.

    You could be eaten by a Great White Shark if you swim in the ocean.

    You could be hit by a car walking down the street.

    You could be struck by lighting.

    You could be killed by a ravenous herd of rabid chinchilas that escaped from a top-secret goverment test facility buried deep underground in the Laguna Mountains.

    You could break out into silly laughter after ripping down a great downhill singletrack out in the middle of nowhere, while a mountain lion watched from a distance.

    Don't say you were not warned!

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbbill
    So there is no risk if you do not see them?

    Let's get some of the risk out in the open ahead of time in the name of common sense.

    If you ride anywhere in the dirt in San Diego County where Deer are known to be, there is a distinct possibility that a mountain lion may pass through. Riding a mountain bike, hiking, or doing anything in the great outdoors could result in you being eaten by a mountain lion.

    You could be eaten by a Great White Shark if you swim in the ocean.

    You could be hit by a car walking down the street.

    You could be struck by lighting.

    You could be killed by a ravenous herd of rabid chinchilas that escaped from a top-secret goverment test facility buried deep underground in the Laguna Mountains.

    You could break out into silly laughter after ripping down a great downhill singletrack out in the middle of nowhere, while a mountain lion watched from a distance.

    Don't say you were not warned!
    Exactly!! Thank you, Bill.
    According to these ...people, I guess I should run home and post a warning the next time I see a new rock in the trail before someone else gets hurt!

    *sheesh...I'm embarrassed to post in the same thread as some of these clowns...
    ...every day sends future to past...

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandyBoy
    Sloth, I deal in facts. A week ago, riding East Canyon, not only did I see deer tracks, but I saw mountain lion tracks in the mud, on the north damp side, on top of the deer tracks. They were 5 days old at least, another club member had seen them on a ride the previous Saturday. I've seen more coyotes and bobcats, at 12x, through a scope, coming and going than you.

    :
    Just because I currently live in socal doesn't mean my life experiences haven't allowed me to hunt and track game for 20 years. I grew up in that lifestyle, heck, it's all I knew. So if you indeed want to follow the facts, come out with me and ride Calavara, maybe we can find some facts to quell your attitude.

    *Edited for your fragile mind*
    Last edited by Da-Sloth; 12-21-2007 at 02:04 PM.

  35. #35
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    Good grief!
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    "Hesitation is the Mother of Failure!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Da-Sloth
    Boy Randy, I think you need to stop being an A$$-Hat. Just because I currently live in socal doesn't mean my life experiences haven't allowed me to hunt and track game for 20 years. I grew up in that lifestyle, heck, it's all I knew. So if you indeed want to follow the facts, come out with me and ride Calavara, maybe we can find some facts to quell your attitude.
    You lost the debate when you started the name calling. Facts trump emotions, every time. What kind of person calls you names like A$$-Hat, then in the same paragraph, invites you to go riding with them? WTF?

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mudd
    Good grief!

    I would never argue with a Mountain Loin... Unless it was fixed!

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandyBoy
    I would never argue with a Mountain Loin... Unless it was fixed!
    Pork loin?
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  39. #39
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    Rode solo at Calaveras today about 4PM. Did not see a mtn lion, although I believe Mtbchik did per her original post. I did see three coyotes right where she saw the lion. They trotted from the field across the doubletrack right in front of me into the heavy brush by one of my favorite singletrack entrances. Good lookin' coyotes in their winter coats -- very dark. The third coyote stopped and watched me ride right by him...so I skipped that singletrack this time.

    http://www.co.san-diego.ca.us/awm/do...oteattacks.pdf

  40. #40
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    Been out hiking and riding in Calavera for 8 years, never seen a mountain lion, nor sign, but its entirely possible, especially with the recent fire and loss of habitat out east.
    There's a pretty good herd of deer just a couple bumps over by Denk, and mountain cats are known to have a couple hundred mile range in territory. Plenty of coyote, racoon, dogs and cats in the neighborhood, which they will eat if no deer are available.

    Here is a picture of a bobcat from over in Elfin Forest. http://gallery.mtbr.com/showphoto.ph...160213/cat/515
    Saw one like this awhile back out in a gully on west side of Calavera:
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    - William Arthur Ward

  41. #41
    Self Appointed Judge&Jury
    Reputation: DIRTJUNKIE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xjbebop
    ...it had to be a bobcat...just ask DJ....
    So your telling me that your avitar is a Bobcat, right?
    Front Range, Colorado.

  42. #42
    Skeej
    Guest

    Carlsbad Oaks Trail work this weekend...keep an eye out for cats

    REMINDER - HERE IS A WAY FOR MTB TO DO GOOD IN CARLSBAD -

    near Flightline.

    my two cents: See pic of bob cat attached from a CNLM webcam in Elfin three years ago. About 18 inches tall, short tail and tufted ears is the giveaway-

    you'd be very lucky to see one anytime, as they are extremely shy - most likely at dusk if at all during daytime.

    Doesnt surprise me to hear of a cougar in Calavera. Its actually not that far at all from most recent repeated sightings in Discovery Hills, especially with the open space connectors we have to Calavera via San Marcos in the Flightline area. Lots of dogs and cats for food in suburbs...

    Probably see more if we get fire or smoke pushing them west again...check the overhanging branches and rock ledges ahead at 8-10 feet high as they are ambush hunters and typically drop for a paralyzing neck-bite on deer passing by, then rip out the guts and feed while alive. They also especially like the open end of storm drain culverts on a hot day...

    Skeej
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    Last edited by Skeej; 02-06-2009 at 12:54 AM.

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