Results 1 to 97 of 97
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282

    Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?

    I haven't ridden there in a couple months due to all the rain, but Dirt Alpine has been my twice-a-week ride-from-home-to-dirt go-to for the past 3.5 years. Two years ago, heavy rains led to erosion of the "unauthorized" (but very fun) singletrack, and the single track got fenced off and closed down. Now the heavy rains of this December have led to a big washout about 2/3 of the way from the bottom of Dirt Alpine. There are new orange signs (posted into the ground) at the lower and upper trailheads that read "Road Closed - No public access", with folding signs/barricades next to the gates. And there is a big metal barricade at the washout, with ribbons. Are they going to shut this down permanently? They don't seem to be much for maintaining or repairing that trail, and who knows if there is money to do so. I am going to be so bummed if this closes. It would leave me with only Arastradero and Windy Hill within riding distance of my home.

  2. #2
    sftrydr
    Reputation: ssulljm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,085
    MROSD manages the section x Coal Creek OSP.
    Openspace.org - Your Preserves - Coal Creek

    SM Co supposedly manages the graveled section above the 1st bypass through Coal Creek OSP..

    Whose signs were posted(signs should be marked by agency that placed them), should be one of the previous agencies mentioned.
    Best recourse is to contact these entities directly+inquire as to what the plan(if any) is.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282

  4. #4
    VRC Illuminati
    Reputation: Rumpfy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    17,643
    I loved coming down that single track section. Definitely miss that loop. Hope they open it back up...including single track.
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  5. #5
    Wēk Sôs
    Reputation: IAmHolland's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    3,037
    That's a bummer. I only rode it once this past summer, with the reroute. It was fun, and would be nice to do it again.

  6. #6
    SOG
    SOG is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: SOG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    499
    I hope they reopen Alpine. It was a good way to connect to White Oak.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    I just spoke to a guy in the San Mateo County Roads department, and he said the plan is to eventually close down and barricade just the newly washed-out portion on Alpine Road, and have trail users bypass it via the the Cloud's Rest and Meadow trails. He said they will try to have this finished, weather permitting, in the next few weeks. Though there are signs posted at the top and bottom gates of Dirt Alpine right now that read "Road Closed - No public access", it sounds like they will be removed once the bypass routing is finished. Fairly good news!

  8. #8
    VRC Illuminati
    Reputation: Rumpfy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    17,643
    Could be worse. Thanks for the update!
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  9. #9
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    …have trail users bypass it via the the Cloud's Rest and Meadow trails…
    Hmmmm, if they are talking the full existing trails, that would not be a trivial bypass. And those stay pretty saturated in the Winter.

    Thanks much for all the information in this thread!
    ///Charlie
    Long live long rides

  10. #10
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    I wish the bypass is restored. It was fun, and it was not eroding - compared with the road itself.

    Singletrack all the way up would be very fine with me. Not a huge fan of climbing Cloud's rest while it is still wet.
    Last edited by Axe; 01-15-2013 at 10:59 PM.

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    Yeah, that is what it sounded like. Definitely not ideal, because you are right - that steep fire road (Cloud's Rest) stays wet for a long time in the winter. It would be great if they could actually create a new singletrack bypass for the new washout.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skyline35 View Post
    Hmmmm, if they are talking the full existing trails, that would not be a trivial bypass. And those stay pretty saturated in the Winter.

    Thanks much for all the information in this thread!
    ///Charlie

  12. #12
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    Yeah, that is what it sounded like. Definitely not ideal, because you are right - that steep fire road (Cloud's Rest) stays wet for a long time in the winter. It would be great if they could actually create a new singletrack bypass for the new washout.
    Would a small bridge there work? $$$ obviously. Hard to see that happen.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    145
    It would be much easier if they'd just allow us to build a ramp and a landing ...

  14. #14
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by erisch View Post
    It would be much easier if they'd just allow us to build a ramp and a landing ...
    Uphill? Damn... man.

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    145
    Yeah, seems like now we have a solution to make trails directional ...

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282

    Pictures from my ride today





    Last edited by Dopaminer_09; 01-16-2013 at 04:55 PM.

  17. #17
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post




    You need to use an actual image URL or upload it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?-photo4_zps057ce1ed.jpg  

    Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?-photo2_zps2c8b11b0.jpg  

    Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?-photo3_zps769947e7.jpg  


  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    You need to use an actual image URL or upload it.
    How do you upload directly from your computer hard drive to Mtbr?

  19. #19
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    How do you upload directly from your computer hard drive to Mtbr?
    There is a button "upload image" below the advanced editing box. You may choose an option of also adding it to your "gallery", or just linking in the post.

    I have uploaded your pictures from direct URLs in your photobucket, but you can do it from the local disk.

  20. #20
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    I went out there today too, and took the same photos as Dopaminer so no need for me to post mine.

    Looks more like a sink-hole than a wash-out.

    You can see that folks are simply going to the left of the hole:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post

    This is located midway between Meadow Trail & Alpine and Cloud's Rest fireroad & Alpine.

    ///Charlie
    Long live long rides

  21. #21
    VRC Illuminati
    Reputation: Rumpfy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    17,643
    How blocked off is the single track?
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: r3r3r's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    58
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    I just spoke to a guy in the San Mateo County Roads department, and he said the plan is to eventually close down and barricade just the newly washed-out portion on Alpine Road, and have trail users bypass it via the the Cloud's Rest and Meadow trails. He said they will try to have this finished, weather permitting, in the next few weeks. Though there are signs posted at the top and bottom gates of Dirt Alpine right now that read "Road Closed - No public access", it sounds like they will be removed once the bypass routing is finished. Fairly good news!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    Yeah, that is what it sounded like. Definitely not ideal, because you are right - that steep fire road (Cloud's Rest) stays wet for a long time in the winter. It would be great if they could actually create a new singletrack bypass for the new washout.
    I agree that this would not be ideal. Meadow to Cloud's Rest would be a steep and long detour to go around that sinkhole/slipout.

    The SM Co. roads vs. MROSD maintenance seems to result in no long term plan to keep this important bicycle route open. Re-routing people on an 1.3 mile detour with 300-400 feet of (steep) elevation gain does not seem like a good alternate route to me.

    At least Crazy Pete's is still open...

  23. #23
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    I just spoke to a guy in the San Mateo County Roads department, and he said the plan is to eventually close down and barricade just the newly washed-out portion on Alpine Road, and have trail users bypass it via the the Cloud's Rest and Meadow trails. He said they will try to have this finished, weather permitting, in the next few weeks.
    I rode down Dirt Alpine today and found this barricade across Alpine at the intersection with Meadow Trail:



    So I had to go up Meadow Trail and as expected, it was a muddy mess :-( That was enough for me, I didn't check the other end of Dirt Alpine.

    ///Charlie
    Long live long rides

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation: r3r3r's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    58
    I have contacted San Mateo County Roads asking if this is a temporary or a permanent closure (I sure hope it's temporary), and if they will work with MROSD to develop a single-track by-pass (similar to the one lower down on Alpine) that doesn't require such an extensive detour.

    I'm hoping for a positive response...

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation: r3r3r's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    58
    I heard back from the roads manager at SMCO and it sounds like this section will be closed at least until this summer. It also sounds like the county would repair the road section if emergency funding becomes available (that's a pretty big IF nowadays). Without funding, the county will likely perform minimal repairs to address drainage and erosion issues at the road failure location. It is unclear if the more limited repair will also make that section passable for bikers and hikers.

    For now it's closed, but I am hopeful that even the more limited repair will allow that section to be re-opened to bicycle/hiker traffic.

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    11
    The closure notices at the upper end (Page Mill Road) have disappeared. I hope this is good news for those of you who ride old Alpine. (I pass the point daily on my road bike...)

    Best wishes.

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    How much money would it take? Maybe we should get a donation fund going...


    Quote Originally Posted by r3r3r View Post
    I heard back from the roads manager at SMCO and it sounds like this section will be closed at least until this summer. It also sounds like the county would repair the road section if emergency funding becomes available (that's a pretty big IF nowadays). Without funding, the county will likely perform minimal repairs to address drainage and erosion issues at the road failure location. It is unclear if the more limited repair will also make that section passable for bikers and hikers.

    For now it's closed, but I am hopeful that even the more limited repair will allow that section to be re-opened to bicycle/hiker traffic.

  28. #28
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    This bubbled up on the ROMP list today:

    Long live long rides

  29. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    Great video! I just rode it today, with the detour, and was taking note again of how long it takes for that steep (and ugly) fire road to dry out.

    How do we let the San Mateo County Roads department know that we highly value dirt Alpine - call them, email them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skyline35 View Post
    This bubbled up on the ROMP list today:


  30. #30
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by Dopaminer_09 View Post
    How much money would it take? Maybe we should get a donation fund going...
    I rode past the fences and the sinkhole when I was late getting down. It is easy to ride by that hole, but that is one big frigging hole. Not sure if it is easy to repair - the ridable edge of the road will likely erode after a few more rains.

    A single track to replace the fireroad (maybe going along the edge of the forested area to meet Meadow trail midway?) would be great. But it will probably take 10 to 15 years to plan and approve.

  31. #31
    VRC Illuminati
    Reputation: Rumpfy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    17,643
    Can the single track they closed prior to the road wash out get you up still? If you're going to hop the barricade, might as well go all in.
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  32. #32
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by Rumpfy View Post
    Can the single track they closed prior to the road wash out get you up still? If you're going to hop the barricade, might as well go all in.
    Different area.

    We should restore that community maintained trail near the bottom. It was nice.

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5
    I was up on Dirt Alpine yesterday and bummed to discover the "road" closure at Clouds Rest intersection, mostly because I road bike dirt alpine (been doing so for ~25yrs; it's one of my favorite climbs to get up to skyline (beautiful, no cars, challenging, etc)). So anyway, I managed to climb parts of Clouds Rest, and walked the parts where I couldn't (probably could've ridden almost all with (much) lower gearing). The mud is drying out, but there's still some. Having the non-muddy surface being damp seemed to give road tires better traction than when it's totally dry and dusty -- less rear wheel slippage when out of the saddle.

    I /really/ hope we can keep dirt alpine open in at least the shape its been in the past 15 yrs. The present lower "single-track" bypass isn't too bad, there's only about four sections I have to walk. but having another steepish mtn-bike-gearing-required-to-ride-the-entire-thing bypass would be unfortunate, although not the end of the world.

    Dirt Alpine has really deteriorated since the mid-ninety's washout that necessitated using that present "lower" bypass. Before that it was much less overgrown throughout and seemed to be more-or-less maintained. It wasn't as much as a "trail" as it is now, it was more of a "dirt road". The rumor, back when I was first introduced to the route, was that it was maintained more-or-less as a fire road and/or escape route for the residents up at the top. Dunno about veracity of that rumor. A noticeable improvement though in the past decade or so has been the spreading of the coarse gravel -- i don't recall as much back in the "way old days" and it wasn't nearly as passable after rains.

  34. #34
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileuser View Post
    I was up on Dirt Alpine yesterday and bummed to discover the "road" closure at Clouds Rest intersection, mostly because I road bike dirt alpine (been doing so for ~25yrs; it's one of my favorite climbs to get up to skyline (beautiful, no cars, challenging, etc)).
    Was it you walking up the bypass? (I was coming down on a blue bike).

    I am doing this climb as a training ride for almost 20 years now, bummer it is deteriorating. Double bummer those idiot bureaucrats sabotaged a couple of community singletrack bypasses as well. They have no time or resources to maintain it, but enough to create barricades and destroy trails.

    But.. Too Crazy Pete up instead, and got to Borel hill through Ridge trail. Longer ride and I like it more, I think.

  35. #35
    SOG
    SOG is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: SOG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    499
    It is a bummer about this trail. I used to enjoy the lower single-track that has been covered up. I do still like Alpine as an after work ride and over to White Oak.

  36. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    733
    Quote Originally Posted by Rumpfy View Post
    How blocked off is the single track?
    It's really well blocked off. About 15 feet of branches and logs. Definitely not something you can get through easily.

  37. #37
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Was it you walking up the bypass?
    Nope, I didn't see anyone coming down as I was going up, until when I emerged on Skyline (as a result of the new detour) near the viewpoint just north of the intersection with Page.

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    282
    I am not sure if my memory is completely accurate, but I seem to remember that 5-6 years ago, that little trail was fenced off, and that at some point access was restored. It was quite a fun descent, and a great challenge to climb in one particularly steep part. I loved that trail, the way it was 3 years ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Different area.

    We should restore that community maintained trail near the bottom. It was nice.

  39. #39
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileuser View Post
    Nope, I didn't see anyone coming down as I was going up, until when I emerged on Skyline (as a result of the new detour) near the viewpoint just north of the intersection with Page.
    It looks like it is quite popular with road biking folks. I have met two guys (I guessed you could have been the polite gentleman on the bypass trail. ) on road/cross bikes going up.

    I hope roadies lobby for Alpine road as well, (given how dangerous it is to take the Page Mill uphill)

  40. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    2
    There is now a petition on Change.org(not mine) to get Alpine reopened. I'm not sure how effective it would be, but I'd urge everyone to sign it. (I'd post the link, but don't have enough posts to do so).

  41. #41
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by syount View Post
    There is now a petition on Change.org(not mine) to get Alpine reopened. I'm not sure how effective it would be, but I'd urge everyone to sign it. (I'd post the link, but don't have enough posts to do so).
    https://www.change.org/petitions/ple...-trail-segment

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    2
    Thanks for posting the link. Much appreciated.

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    103
    Signed

  44. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation: erginguney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    987
    Quote Originally Posted by fourgasm View Post
    Signed
    Ditto...
    Looking for local rides? You'll find plenty on my website: Bay Area Mountain Bike Rides.

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    Done

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    947
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    A single track to replace the fireroad (maybe going along the edge of the forested area to meet Meadow trail midway?) would be great. But it will probably take 10 to 15 years to plan and approve.
    A citizen built singletrack could be built on a weekend afternoon with one person and some hand tools. Too bad the bureaucratic tools override common sense and hand tools.
    "It's just that nobody likes Cornfish." francois

  47. #47
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Quote Originally Posted by cornfish View Post
    A citizen built singletrack could be built on a weekend afternoon with one person and some hand tools. Too bad the bureaucratic tools override common sense and hand tools.
    But what about brown legged spotted butterfly snakes? Ten bikes a day could disturb them.

    ..if that citizen clears up the old one, it would be much appreciated.

  48. #48
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    A friend forwarded this update to me:

    Quote:

    Progress on Dirt Alpine Repairs?

    Last week we received the following words from Joe LoCoco, the County's man in charge of Alpine Road's trail segment, above and to the south of Portola Valley:

    "The Mid Peninsula Open Space District has been authorized to excavate around the failed pipe in an effort to reestablish drainage underneath the road. We anticipate this work to occur in the coming weeks and that we will have a better sense, during this effort, of whether reestablishing the drainage is in fact viable.

    Any additional strategies for the site will be largely be dependent on the findings and success of this effort, as having a workable drainage system is a critical component of any plan, since without a functioning drainage system, the remainder of the road will wash out."

    Many thanks to MidPen for this work and thanks also to anyone that wrote a letter encouraging a resolution to this trail closure.

    Charlie Krenz
    COPAR PV | Concerned Outdoorspeople for the Preservation of Alpine Road ? Portola Valley
    Long live long rides

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    517
    Alpine Road: Repaired!

    On Friday a deft Midpeninsula Regional Opens Space District crew completed work on repairs to the damaged section of “Dirt Alpine”. The road has not as yet reopened, but it seems as if this should happen shortly.

    Big thanks to San Mateo County and MidPen for banging out this project in few days of work: This put a stop to a severe erosion problem, stabilized the roadbed and prevented a need to “wait out the winter” to affect repairs next summer. Bravo, well done!

    Charlie Krenz
    COPAR PV | Concerned Outdoorspeople for the Preservation of Alpine Road ? Portola Valley

  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation: erginguney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    987
    Wow. That was a much quicker resolution than I expected.

    Kudos!
    Looking for local rides? You'll find plenty on my website: Bay Area Mountain Bike Rides.

  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    I thanked the MROSD for the action taken. So appreciative. I intend to have a look at the trail tomorrow and take some photos. If I manage to, I will post here.

    On yesterday's ride I noticed that the log-over is gone, cut-up, near the creek ford in Upper Stevens Creek Canyon (Santa Clara County land, but the MROSD shares corridor management).

    Also saw much heavy work in advance of winter in Fremont Older going on yesterday on my ride over to the Stevens Creek Canyon.

    Funds being spent!

  52. #52
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Today's update from the Concerned Outdoorspeople for the Preservation of Alpine Road – Portola Valley :

    Alpine: Good news and bad

    First the good: The barricades are down and the route is open.

    The Bad: San Mateo County has now described the fix as “temporary” and they say they “anticipate the need to again close the trail when large and/or regularly occurring storms occur since the road will not be considered stable under typical mid-winter conditions.”

    I’m bummed. I thought we were done. Apologies for the premature optimism.

    MidPen reports the remaining “good part” of the drainage pipe that had partially collapsed causing the problem was far deeper than anticipated. This greatly increased the cost and complexity of a robust conventional repair approach. Instead large boulders were used to back fill the excavation pit. It's hoped that flow through this “gigantic french drain” will be adequate this winter. We won’t know until the storms hit.

    The County remains hopeful that a substantial amount of funding will be released by the state department of emergency services for a full repair next summer.
    Long live long rides

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5
    Hi, and now it's Fall 2014 and we know the above-described further repairs did not get done, unless they've been done since the last time I was up there on Sun 17-Aug-2014.

    Anyone have any more info?

    Also, when I went up that day, there was a sign in the road down near the lower windy hill trailhead (off of that long driveway) that stated that the "road" would be closed from 19-Aug to ?-Oct-2014 (I forget the date). Some folks I know were up there a few weeks ago and said dirt alpine was open to the top but that sign was still there.

    any further news?

    thanks.

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    360
    It's the paved part of the road that's closed. The dirt part of it remains open. I was there last Thursday, and the paved road was closed from Willowbrook to Joaquin. The closure specifically mentioned cyclists as well as motorists. Since it was a weekday and I didn't want to go halfway up and be turned back, I turned around and went to the bottom of the dirt part via Los Trancos Road and Joaquin, a nasty little warmup. The dirt part of Alpine was the same as usual.

  55. #55
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    132
    Yup, just the lower paved part. I've done it twice this month, coming down from the top at Page Mill, where this sign is. 8AM to 5PM weekdays thru Oct 31. The Joaquin go-around is insanely steep. Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?-img_1755.jpg

  56. #56
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    360
    The paved detour is insanely steep in either direction.

  57. #57
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5
    > MidPen reports the remaining “good part” of the drainage pipe that had
    > partially collapsed causing the problem was far deeper than anticipated.
    > This greatly increased the cost and complexity of a robust conventional
    > repair approach. Instead large boulders were used to back fill the excavation
    > pit. It's hoped that flow through this “gigantic french drain” will be adequate
    > this winter. We won’t know until the storms hit.

    Looks like it mostly held thru the Nov-Dec 2014 storms -- the trail is fine but it looks like there was some serious water action down in the pit.

    I note the big barriers were totally removed but don't understand why they placed wimpy standard-issue folding barricade units where the big barriers were.

    anyway, I hope the county indeed secures funds for a better fix.

  58. #58
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5
    > I note the big barriers were totally removed but don't understand why they
    > placed wimpy standard-issue folding barricade units where the big barriers were.

    the folding barricade units are apparently there to mark the vertical pipes that were being used to anchor the previous big barricades.

  59. #59
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Passing along this update...

    "…Public works has recently surveyed the site and has a design for the repairs to the drainage system. An environmental assessment of the work area is the last major piece to be put in place as funding for construction has been secured. Public works is relatively confident that the work will be complete by next summer…"
    Long live long rides

  60. #60
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Well it's February 2017 and still no more work has been done on Dirt Alpine. Happily the two existing washouts haven't got worse this winter but now there is a new washout:





    That is 100 yards down from the Meadow Trail intersection.

    As you can see, it is no problem to ride past it. In fact Dirt Alpine was all open and ride-able today except a dismount was required to get under this tree:



    ///Charlie
    Last edited by Skyline35; 02-03-2017 at 10:03 AM. Reason: grammer
    Long live long rides

  61. #61
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    49
    Alpine is open now get out and ride.
    Just watch out for the rangers their ticket happy right now. parking tickets,poaching tickets, raffle tickets.

  62. #62
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    1,038
    And its gone! It is a huge wash out. It took out the rest of where it started a few years ago. Its a huge canyon now.

    I was running down it today and was staring into the abyss. I found a way across but I don't recommend it. The water was narrow, maybe 3-4 feet across. I was getting sucked into he mud so I decided to jump into the water to prevent loosing a shoe in the mud. I figured it was going to be about shin deep. BAD idea. That water was 5 feet deep.

    I got up laughed and kept on running, but it took a while to warm up. The other trails are still passable to get around it, but I don't think they will be fixing this one. After the rainy season Im sure where I snuck through a trail will get blazed.

  63. #63
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Bummer.

    You know what did not have any washouts? The single track they destroyed in the name of erosion control.

  64. #64
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by heythorp View Post
    And its gone! It is a huge wash out....
    It was captured on film:




    The accompany text...

    While making my way up “Dirt Alpine” yesterday afternoon I passed the “Alpine Sink Hole” as some hikers and cyclists refer to it. It's about 2/3’s of the way up the unpaved section. The hole has been slowly expanding over the past few years as the drainage system under the road bed slowly crumbled. Long story shortened, this drain got clogged with the heavy rains and the water level rose above the “dam” i.e. the road bed. From there water flow quickly eroded a "V" shaped gorge across my favorite trail.
    San Mateo County had been planning to repair the drainage system this coming summer. Not sure how this will effect things, but they will have less soil excavation to do wink emoticon;-)
    Long live long rides

  65. #65
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    733
    Where did this happen - before or after Meadow Trail?

  66. #66
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by ForbiddenBeat View Post
    Where did this happen - before or after Meadow Trail?
    Descending, the landmarks are...

    • Upper gate (Page Mill Rd.)
    • Meadow Trail intersection
    • Sinkhole/washout causing the closure
    • Cloud's Rest intersection
    • Crazy Pete's intersection
    • Single-track "by-pass" section
    • Lower gate
    Long live long rides

  67. #67
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    733
    Quote Originally Posted by Skyline35 View Post
    Descending, the landmarks are...

    • Upper gate (Page Mill Rd.)
    • Meadow Trail intersection
    • Sinkhole/washout causing the closure
    • Cloud's Rest intersection
    • Crazy Pete's intersection
    • Single-track "by-pass" section
    • Lower gate
    Thanks for the info. My typical ride was going up from Alpine Road (parking at Windy Hill parking lot) all the way to Meadow Trail, then over into Russian Ridge. Sounds like I'll be taking Cloud's rest instead for a while.

    Unless...can you pedal really fast and jump the gap?

  68. #68
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    59
    June 10 trail work day on Dirt Alpine:

    https://www.facebook.com/svmtb/posts/628906723967286

  69. #69
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    I'm in.

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  70. #70
    mtbr member
    Reputation: griffsterb's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    730
    Quote Originally Posted by agtuck View Post
    June 10 trail work day on Dirt Alpine:

    https://www.facebook.com/svmtb/posts/628906723967286
    Cool. I'll see if I can make it. Hope it turns out like the old bypass trail, that one is fun.

  71. #71
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    59
    Based on the stakes that were out last weekend it'll be a lot shorter than that - but should be rideable rather than the steep hike-a-bike that's there now.

    The section lower down between the bypass and Crazy Pete's needs work too (it's kind of a rutted out mess and not nearly as fun as before IMO), but at least it's rideable.

  72. #72
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    I am probably going to arrive by dropping in from the top off Page Mill Road.

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  73. #73
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    Here's 80 feet of new trail.

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  74. #74
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742

    Thank You to the trailworkers !!!

    Long live long rides

  75. #75
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    While volunteers did trail work on the morning June 10 many riders and a few hikers went by going up the social trail to get across the slide. It was difficult for some people.



    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  76. #76
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    The other side is steep as well. No work was done to this part of the trail. There exists a way to reduce the grade of this and make it less prone to erosion with a reroute. This section approaches 34% gradient. Most people can ride up this.

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  77. #77
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    Looking across the gap in the road, you can see the gulch which must be crossed and get an idea of the amount of fill that went down the hill when the flood occurred. In the bottom of the gulch there is a buried 4' corrugated steel culvert structure which by account was clogged and unmaintained during the preceding drought. Due to meager rainfall, nothing bad happened, until the mega storm showered down. That culvert, further down from its surface exposure is buried under 20' of silt and gravel.

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  78. #78
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    As the reroute began to take shape and become usable, the crew closed the old social rope climb ramp. The knob of dirt that the rope route was on supported a few mature trees and is filled with roots. Hopefully the trees can continue to flourish and also maintain stability of the hillside here.

    (An alternative reroute was considered to cross this slope, but it was not selected. That's good because these trees would have suffered more for it.)

    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  79. #79
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Jack Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,672
    The final results are nice and usable for now. I am not confident in the long term integrity of it though.

    It is going to receive some improvement in the near future, and it should be rebuilt in sections from the bottom up, using anchored crib cells. Also the grade can be slightly reduced at the bottom, which will help some riders.

    The section is 77' long, with an average grade of 22.5%, and an average width of 4.9'. It is 29" at it's narrowest point. This achievement is phenomenal to me.


    Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

  80. #80
    VRC Illuminati
    Reputation: Rumpfy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    17,643
    Awesome! Thanks for the photos and report Jack!
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  81. #81
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742

    Dirt Alpine's future goes to the MidPen Board of Directors next Wednesday Mar 14 2018

    Dirt Alpine's future goes to the MidPen Board of Directors next Wednesday March 14, 2018. Full agenda item here:

    https://www.openspace.org/sites/defa...OD_R-18-19.pdf


    High level recap of the 3 alternatives to be presented:

    The following (3) repair options were evaluated ; each option affects the scale and cost of the repair, and future level of access.

    Repair Options and Preliminary Cost Estimates

    1 Repair full length of Alpine Road Trail to road width (12 feet) $2,600,000+
    2 Repair full length of Alpine Road Trail to trail width (6 feet) $1,430,000+
    3 Repair Alpine Road Trail to Clouds Rest Trail to road width (12 feet) and from Clouds Rest to Portola Valley to trail width (6 feet) $2,000,000+

    *Costs for engineering, construction inspections, permitting, and escalation are assumed to be 30% of the estimated construction cost.

    Note: these are preliminary, based on concept drawings and not on detailed construction drawings.

    Option 1: Restores Alpine Road Trail to road width and includes constructing a new road through the Central Section to replace the “Bypass Trail.” Completion of this project would allow vehicular passage from Portola Valley (Windy Hill Preserve and Hawthorn Property) to Page Mill Road and Skyline Boulevard, a route that improves response times for patrol and emergency access for the District and other emergency services.

    Option 2: Repairs the road failures to a six-foot wide trail standard and constructs a new, six-foot wide trail through the Central Section to replace the “Bypass Trail.” This option provides a narrower trail experience and is less costly to maintain. However, emergency vehicle access would be limited or restricted.

    Option 3: Repairs the road failures to road width allowing vehicle access to Clouds Rest Trail and constructs a new, six-foot wide trail through the Central Section to replace the “Bypass Trail.”Construction of this option provides a patrol vehicle route through the Preserve and retains the option to reopen the entire length of the Alpine Road Trail for patrol vehicle access at a later date.

    All repair options require permits from various regulatory agencies, including California Department of Fish and Wildlife, Regional Water Quality Control Board, US Army Corps of Engineers, and San Mateo County, as well as compliance with the California Environmental Quality Act. Additional permitting requirements related to sensitive resources may surface, which could extend the project schedule.

    Option 3 provides the most benefits to the District and leaves the option of reopening the rest of the road for patrol, maintenance, and emergency vehicles. For these reasons, the Acting General Manager recommends proceeding with Option 3. If approved by the Board, the Acting General Manager will direct District staff to apply for a permit-to-enter with the County to prepare design plans and conduct CEQA review. Staff would return to the Board for final approval of the repair along with the environmental review findings prior to commencing the permitting and bidding process.
    It appears the feral nature of Dirt Alpine is doomed.

    ///Charlie
    Long live long rides

  82. #82
    Axe
    Axe is online now
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: Axe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,397
    Indeed. If they can't drive a truck midway, how would they setup radar speed traps?

    But its bikes that cause erosion. That terrible single track section they had to close.

  83. #83
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: 5k bike 50cent legs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    2,480
    If this impacts my Palo Alto to Dirt Alpine down White Oak up to Black Mtn fitness ride, I'm going to be pissed!

  84. #84
    Formerly dvo
    Reputation: mtbrdan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    1,561
    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    If this impacts my Palo Alto to Dirt Alpine down White Oak up to Black Mtn fitness ride, I'm going to be pissed!
    Likely scenario is that the bypass section gets redone to fit to the MidPen standard, the hidden loss is that dirt Alpine would fall as the last legal night trail ride spot on the Peninsula. Oh well, the writing has been on the wall for years, the only constant is change. Smoke em if you got em.
    I'm the problem....

  85. #85
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: 5k bike 50cent legs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    2,480
    Quote Originally Posted by mtbrdan View Post
    Likely scenario is that the bypass section gets redone to fit to the MidPen standard, the hidden loss is that dirt Alpine would fall as the last legal night trail ride spot on the Peninsula. Oh well, the writing has been on the wall for years, the only constant is change. Smoke em if you got em.
    Yeah, out with the old in with the new!


  86. #86
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Political pressure at hand (from the MidPen pdf):

    The Regional Water Quality Control Board lists the San Francisquito Creek watershed as impaired due to sediment and siltation. The Watershed Analysis and Sediment Reduction plan prepared by the San Francisquito Creek Joint Powers Authority identifies Alpine Road as a chronic contributor of sediment and prioritizes it as a treatment site. Completing the recommended repairs will reduce future sediment delivery to the watershed and help further the goals of improving water quality in the watershed.


    The run-off from Dirt Alpine goes into Corte Madera Creek and on to the cluster-bleep that is the San Francisquito watershed:



    If they genuinely wanted to limit siltation into the creek, then option 2, a full-lengh 6' wide golf cart path (likely topped with crushed granite) would be best.



    If you're interested...more on the San Francisquito watershed:

    Save Stanford Steelhead (It's stated here that Searsville Reservoir is 90% filled in with sediment.)

    https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/...e-lagunita-dam
    Long live long rides

  87. #87
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    658
    6' wide is more sediment than 4' wide and less than 12'. Generally speaking.

    But really the key issue is design. Is the sedimentation from the steep 'bypass' or the various total failures. Like the one you video'd last year, but surely all the previous ones continue to fail slowly.

    Surely they have a report from, say, the hydrologist they usually use? The PDF has a color coded and number keyed map, which shows that the 'bypass' is low priority from a sedimentation point of view. What do the keyed numbers mean?

  88. #88
    mtbr member
    Reputation: griffsterb's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    730
    lol. what a joke

  89. #89
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by mbmtb View Post
    6' wide is more sediment than 4' wide and less than 12'. Generally speaking.

    But really the key issue is design. Is the sedimentation from the steep 'bypass' or the various total failures. Like the one you video'd last year, but surely all the previous ones continue to fail slowly.

    Surely they have a report from, say, the hydrologist they usually use? The PDF has a color coded and number keyed map, which shows that the 'bypass' is low priority from a sedimentation point of view. What do the keyed numbers mean?
    Good points!



    Quote Originally Posted by mbmtb View Post
    But really the key issue is design. Is the sedimentation from the steep 'bypass' or the various total failures. Like the one you video'd last year, but surely all the previous ones continue to fail slowly.
    Yeah, there are more places where the erosion is creeping up to the edge of the road. btw, that was a different Charlie who made the videos.



    Quote Originally Posted by mbmtb View Post
    Surely they have a report from, say, the hydrologist they usually use? The PDF has a color coded and number keyed map, which shows that the 'bypass' is low priority from a sedimentation point of view. What do the keyed numbers mean?
    Certainly there is more to the report. It appears we only got that one page in the meeting package (I couldn't find the full thing on the MidPen web site). I have his recent report on ECdM and it's very detailed.

    ///Charlie
    Long live long rides

  90. #90
    he who goes without food
    Reputation: diskus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    544
    After some discussion and a narrow vote, board of directors voted to go forward with the narrower option. 6 feet for all repairs. Lobbying of locals and svmtb seemed effective. 3-5 years out for any construction

  91. #91
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: 5k bike 50cent legs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    2,480
    Quote Originally Posted by diskus View Post
    After some discussion and a narrow vote, board of directors voted to go forward with the narrower option. 6 feet for all repairs. Lobbying of locals and svmtb seemed effective. 3-5 years out for any construction
    Great update. So that means 10 more years before any construction and 5 more votes??

  92. #92
    SOG
    SOG is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: SOG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    499
    Did my last ride on Alpine tonight. The bypass has been ruined with an extremely flaccid reroute and the old path has been fenced up. It's a shame since I've been riding there over 30 years but all good things come to an end. It's not like it was challenging but a good after work spot since it's close to the house.

    Guess I'll ride less and take it to SC since the peninsula is so soft.

  93. #93
    mtbr member
    Reputation: griffsterb's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    730
    Quote Originally Posted by SOG View Post
    Did my last ride on Alpine tonight. The bypass has been ruined with an extremely flaccid reroute and the old path has been fenced up. It's a shame since I've been riding there over 30 years but all good things come to an end. It's not like it was challenging but a good after work spot since it's close to the house.

    Guess I'll ride less and take it to SC since the peninsula is so soft.
    Wait the single track bypass is closed and rerouted? Ugh

  94. #94
    SOG
    SOG is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: SOG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    499
    Quote Originally Posted by griffsterb View Post
    Wait the single track bypass is closed and rerouted? Ugh
    The bottom part of the bypass is closed - fenced off at the top of the steeper last section and fenced off where you normally exited. There is a lame reroute with no flow now.

  95. #95
    mtbr member
    Reputation: griffsterb's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    730
    Quote Originally Posted by SOG View Post
    The bottom part of the bypass is closed - fenced off at the top of the steeper last section and fenced off where you normally exited. There is a lame reroute with no flow now.
    That is such complete shit. Looks like I moved out of the area at just the right time.

  96. #96
    mtbr member
    Reputation: griffsterb's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    730

    Are we going to lose Dirt Alpine?

    I’m slightly confused though. When did MidPen get jurisdiction over alpine?
    Last edited by griffsterb; 05-01-2018 at 11:36 AM.

  97. #97
    More pie please
    Reputation: Skyline35's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,742
    Quote Originally Posted by SOG View Post
    Did my last ride on Alpine tonight. The bypass has been ruined with an extremely flaccid reroute and the old path has been fenced up. It's a shame since I've been riding there over 30 years but all good things come to an end. It's not like it was challenging but a good after work spot since it's close to the house.

    Guess I'll ride less and take it to SC since the peninsula is so soft.
    That was done on an SVMTB trailwork day, April 21, 2018:





    A picture of the new bit I took when I rode it on April 25:

    Long live long rides

Members who have read this thread: 155

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

mtbr.com and the ConsumerReview Network are business units of Invenda Corporation

(C) Copyright 1996-2018. All Rights Reserved.