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  1. #1
    fc
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    Lights, Ayup and the midpen ticket

    Lights Shootout update. Almost all the LED lights are here except for Dinotte. Lupine has not responded. Does anyone own a new Lupine LED lightset that I can borrow?

    An interesting light that just arrived is the Ayup. It's $380 for the 'regular' set. And man it's got a lot of stuff. 2 dual lights, 3 lipo batteries, car charger, neoprene case. I ride with a bud who's been using this and it's hecka bright. I haven't used this light yet. It's a little ghetto since there's no light switch, no manual! Also, the mounting is a bit funky with zipties. It's aussie, oi, oi, oi.
    http://www.ayup.com.au/kits-regular.php

    My night riding ticket is here. It was for 7pm at Fremont Older, which is right by my house. Do not ride there! The ranger is nice but he is diligent. It's $307. I'm fighting it. Midpen is going down. If I do the crime, I should do the time, right? But night riding is not a crime. $307 is a crime. They should go to jail. Who ordered the code red? They can't handle the truth!

    After I do my night test, I'll loan all these lights out. If you're in the market, you can try them out. And don't make me pay your ticket, kapeesh?

    fc
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    Last edited by fc; 11-29-2007 at 01:27 PM.
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  2. #2
    aka baycat
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    I can provide an excellent TESTING ground in the Marin Headlands and San Francisco Urban night ride and bar tour!

    Ouch about the ticket FC. Maybe you can do community service to pay it off! Don the orange vest and pick up trash off the freeway

  3. #3
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    Where's Fasy Eddy with his homebrew light?

  4. #4
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by baycat
    I can provide an excellent TESTING ground in the Marin Headlands and San Francisco Urban night ride and bar tour!

    Ouch about the ticket FC. Maybe you can do community service to pay it off! Don the orange vest and pick up trash off the freeway
    Oh this is bull. I have to go to Traffic Court on Ruff Drive. That place is so tweaker with all the DUI peoples. I spent some time there during my speedster 20's. Maybe I'll give the judge some comic relief.

    I'll be wearing my Blanco Basura t-shirt http://www.blancobasura.com/. <-- check the site to hear the song 67 Impala.


    fc
    Last edited by fc; 11-29-2007 at 11:21 AM.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    My night riding ticket is here...
    I Googled that Violation Code (MP-805.4-1). Doesn't exist. Case dismissed.

  6. #6
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian
    I Googled that Violation Code (MP-805.4-1). Doesn't exist. Case dismissed.
    You're hired as my lawyer. I like your avatar!

    My other lawyer is Caffey


    fc
    Last edited by fc; 11-29-2007 at 11:32 AM.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    Oh this is bull. I have to go to Traffic Court on Ruff Drive. That place is so tweaker with all the DUI peoples. I spent some time there during my speedster 20's. Maybe I'll give the judge some comic relief.

    I'll be wearing my Blanco Basura t-shirt http://www.blancobasura.com/. <-- check the site to hear the song 67 Impala.


    fc
    It's been a while since I've had to go to traffic court. But my experience is that going in and being polite and professional for something relatively harmless like this (as opposed to DUI or reckless driving) can be a light spot in the judge's day. If nothing else, they might knock the fine down for a first offense.

    Be sure to take your photo of the ranger with all the lights on his truck. You might not get to show it, but then again you might.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryCallahan
    Be sure to take your photo of the ranger with all the lights on his truck. You might not get to show it, but then again you might.
    Not at the arraignment.

    This is the part where you simply utter "Guilty" or "Not Guilty." If you plead "Guilty," you might be able to get in a "...but with comment." Otherwise, if it's "Not Guilty," and you start assembling your whiteboard, evidence chart and proceed to say, "For my first witness, I'd like to bring in," you'll get laughed out of the courtroom!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    You're hired as my lawyer. I like your avatar!

    fc


    You should never violate the MROSD Bermuda Triangle (Fremont Older, St. Joseph's, Rancho San Antonio) on weekday afternoons or weekends. That's where MROSD makes 89% of their operating budget writing tickets!

  10. #10
    wg
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian
    I Googled that Violation Code (MP-805.4-1). Doesn't exist. Case dismissed.
    Unfortunately its a violation code specific to the MidPen Open Space District. Its a biatch to find via Google but this search gave it top billing:
    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...n+code+vehicle

    Go here:
    http://www.openspace.org/activities/...egulations.asp

    Get the "REGULATIONS FOR USE OF MIDPENINSULA REGIONAL OPEN SPACE DISTRICT LANDS" PDF link on the right.

    "805.4 Bicycle Operation After Hours. No person shall possess or operate a bicycle, unicycle, or similar device on District lands after Official Hours."

    Can't even ride a unicycle!

    Still sucks though. That fine is outrageous.
    Don't harsh my mello

  11. #11
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    Francois - were you ticketed for having your car in that tiny parking lot off of Prospect after the ranger wanted to close the gate or for actually riding at night? I went for a quick ride there the other day(evening) and noticed a bunch of guys riding the road up and I thought to myself 'Why don't those dudes just drive up and park?'. Then when I got to the parking lot I saw the gate and realized why! I talked to a hiker who looked like she knew the area well and she said that they won't lock your car in but they WILL wait there and give you a ticket. Then I HAULED ASS down 7 springs and back up and out - never did it faster! I was the last car in that lot and it was just about dark but didn't see a ranger.

  12. #12
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    That ticket is more expensive than the speeding ticket I got on HWY 17!

    If you really want to night ride FO you need to be a bit more discrete than having the equivalent of a car headlight on your bike.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCTreeHugger
    If you really want to night ride FO you need to be a bit more discrete than having the equivalent of a car headlight on your bike.
    Can someone confirm if MROSD rangers can ticket you in a SC County Park? I think they might do this in the SCC parks that are adjacent to MROSD preserves.

    The only place I've ever seen a SCC ranger actively enforce no bikes is on the Table Mountain Trail (no bikes section). Otherwise, SCC rangers actually engage in activities that are more ranger-like, not peace officer-like.

    If you were in ranger school, wouldn't the nature aspect of it entice you more than "Oooh, I get to bust mountain bikers for speeding" aspect?

  14. #14
    Let's ride
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian
    If you were in ranger school, wouldn't the nature aspect of it entice you more than "Oooh, I get to bust mountain bikers for speeding" aspect?
    As with all things, once you measure it, it will get better.

    Team, how much and how many tickets did we issue last month, last year? What are we using those $$$ for?

    The budgets are limited again. Where can we get more money?

    How much money are we getting from tickets this quarter? Can we count on that?

    If we just get another x% more this quarter we can do this...




    Just imagine what would happen at MidPen or any county if the ticket revenue were cut in half, decline, went away, etc. It wouldn't be, "cool, people are finally getting the message, and we get to patrol less."

  15. #15
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by campisi
    Francois - were you ticketed for having your car in that tiny parking lot off of Prospect after the ranger wanted to close the gate or for actually riding at night? I went for a quick ride there the other day(evening) and noticed a bunch of guys riding the road up and I thought to myself 'Why don't those dudes just drive up and park?'. Then when I got to the parking lot I saw the gate and realized why! I talked to a hiker who looked like she knew the area well and she said that they won't lock your car in but they WILL wait there and give you a ticket. Then I HAULED ASS down 7 springs and back up and out - never did it faster! I was the last car in that lot and it was just about dark but didn't see a ranger.
    I rode from my house. I did a Seven Springs loop and when I popped out into the three way intersection out in the open, the ranger truck came barelling down with lights a flashin. So the ticket is for riding more than 30 minutes past sunset.

    He said I was his third ticket that week. He said DO NOT run cause there's no escape, he'll get backup and everybody will be all grumpy all night.

    If your car is in the parking lot, it's a dead giveaway for them and they can just wait for you. Of course they won't get you for a $20 parking ticket when they can have your $307.

    The ranger was very, very nice and so are the others that I've met. But they are pawns of the mid-pen board of directors empire.

    So do not night ride in the normal day riding venues! Just night ride on the asphalt or somewhere else.

    fc
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by rensho
    As with all things, once you measure it, it will get better.

    Team, how much and how many tickets did we issue last month, last year? What are we using those $$$ for?

    The budgets are limited again. Where can we get more money?

    How much money are we getting from tickets this quarter? Can we count on that?

    If we just get another x% more this quarter we can do this...

    Just imagine what would happen at MidPen or any county if the ticket revenue were cut in half, decline, went away, etc. It wouldn't be, "cool, people are finally getting the message, and we get to patrol less."
    What's the genesis of their arbitrary 15MPH speed limit, btw? (I know this has probably been massacred in the forum archives, but search never works well for me on forums.)

    15MPH for me is 60MPH for Steve Peat.

    In effect, I can bang a 14 MPH wheelie in front of a ranger without penalty and pose much more of a danger to others than if I happened to hit 19 MPH on Canyon Trail with both wheels on the ground.

    To quote a libertarian, "If the government can make you put on your seat belt, what else can they make you do?"

  17. #17
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    The real crime is you were not able to evade this guy at night
    Go get that KOM "You Deserve" - http://www.digitalepo.com/index.php

  18. #18
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    I am in the market for a new light.

    My old nightsun will only hold about an hour charge.

    Set me up, I pay my own tickets too!!

    Aaron

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    Oh this is bull. I have to go to Traffic Court on Ruff Drive. That place is so tweaker with all the DUI peoples. I spent some time there during my speedster 20's. Maybe I'll give the judge some comic relief.
    ahh, ruff drive

    say hi to judge madden and get a hot dog from the cart guy outside



  20. #20
    Medium?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian
    Where's Fasy Eddy with his homebrew light?
    It's at the bottom of a parts bucket somewhere. I've been running a NiteRider HID/LED for a very long time (3 years?) now.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    So do not night ride in the normal day riding venues! Just night ride on the asphalt or somewhere else.
    Skyline to the sea trail? Yosemite? PCT? That nobody-is-allowed-to-ride-there-but-everyone-does-anyway spot in SC?

  22. #22
    Ebo
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    You might get the ticket reduced by showing up. Depends on past history and the judges mood at the time. Often it's "just pay the clerk please". Good luck.

  23. #23
    mmm
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    Quote Originally Posted by wg

    Get the "REGULATIONS FOR USE OF MIDPENINSULA REGIONAL OPEN SPACE DISTRICT LANDS" PDF link on the right.

    "805.4 Bicycle Operation After Hours. No person shall possess or operate a bicycle, unicycle, or similar device on District lands after Official Hours."
    Wait, so this regulation is specifically for bikers? What's the fine for hikers and equestrians after dark?
    ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A Select Start

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fast Eddy
    It's at the bottom of a parts bucket somewhere. I've been running a NiteRider HID/LED for a very long time (3 years?) now.
    Well, last time I saw it in action was Coe for the Biking Viking ride, so yea, about that long. I remember that light taking a pounding on Cattle Duster when your tire popped off the bead, yet your tube remained inflated!

    It took that lickin' and kept on shinin'...

  25. #25
    ol'guy who says hi &waves
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    I bet I can gather a few TROGS and an Ogre to test them lights on some very steep and rocky LEGAL single track.

    Let me know.
    .

    I may not have the best of everything, but I have the best everything that matters.

  26. #26
    Totally, and to the max.
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    I've gotten two riding tickets in the past. The first time I went to court and the judge reduced the fine 50%. This was in 1995 and I ended up paying $88. The second ticket was two years ago on Christmas morning. Quicksilver, a day after it rained. I had to pay the court because I rode my bike when the ground was wet. Reduckilous. That ticket was $150-ish. Didn't fight that one, just paid it. Too much of a pain at the time.

    Gotta say though, I've gotten out of more tickets than I've received. Who says "you can run but you can't hide?"

  27. #27
    It's carbon dontcha know.
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    The Ay-Up's are a great package. I've done a couple of rides with mine, pleased with them so far.

  28. #28
    fc
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    Listen!

    Quote Originally Posted by One_Speed
    I am in the market for a new light.

    My old nightsun will only hold about an hour charge.

    Set me up, I pay my own tickets too!!

    Aaron
    Nightsun... that shows our age man. That's cool you skipped HID entirely. You can jump into these new breed of LEDs. It's the new frontier.

    I've had about 5 night rides with 6 or more riders. Everybody's got two lights, bar and helmet, mostly LED, some HID. With a big night group you always expect one or two light failures and some folks ride home in the dark and need assistance. So far, zero failures!! The lights, no-wires, the batteries and chargers are better. So cool!

    I'll set you up with my favorites after my testing.

    fc
    Last edited by fc; 11-30-2007 at 09:14 AM.
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  29. #29
    jrm
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    "Midpen is going down"

    perry "francois" masons in the house..Good luck..take some video that would rock..

    That sounds a cool lightning package for the money.

  30. #30
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrm
    perry "francois" masons in the house..Good luck..take some video that would rock..

    That sounds a cool lightning package for the money.
    Yeah, what's the name of that San Jose Mercury news reporter that rode with us at Turkey ride last year? Also, Teresa Estacio at Kron is a the cyclist I hear.

    We might have an angle here with midpen charging $307 for going over 15mph and the same night riding. And of course the La Honda trail access issue is a travesty.

    Google is giving bikes to every single employee. We should get an in there and get them behind us.

    fc
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  31. #31
    Capricious youth...
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    I'm still sold on my Exposure light.

    I've ridden with buddies with Topeaks, Nite Riders, Cateyes, and so many others, and as far as I'm concerned, Exposure is THE WIN.

    I'm taggin my Exposure Enduro MaXx to a helmet mounted Nite Hawk AL 400 Lumen LED. It's really a narrow light pattern, but because it's really bright and light weigt, it'll work perfectly for things like seeing around corners and stuff.
    Meh.

  32. #32
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    No Kidding?

    Quote Originally Posted by francois
    ...
    Google is giving bikes to every single employee. We should get an in there and get them behind us.

    fc
    That's huge. What if along with the bikes, they gave every employee a membership to ROMP or the SVBC? The clubs would benefit hugely, and nothing like being able to add a few thousand members to the roster when talking with elected officials!

  33. #33
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarryCallahan
    That's huge. What if along with the bikes, they gave every employee a membership to ROMP or the SVBC? The clubs would benefit hugely, and nothing like being able to add a few thousand members to the roster when talking with elected officials!
    Maybe just 2000 euro employees. That's all I found in the news
    http://blogoscoped.com/archive/2007-03-27-n56.html

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  34. #34
    Coors, the american beer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by baycat
    Ouch about the ticket FC. Maybe you can do community service to pay it off! Don the orange vest and pick up trash off the freeway
    my buddy did this to pay off a ticket for driving in the carpool lane

    Quote Originally Posted by SCTreeHugger
    That ticket is more expensive than the speeding ticket I got on HWY 17!
    x2 ... most expensive speeding ticket i ever got was $259 for doing 75 in a 55 on hwy 101 north of willits.

    In Chico we are lucky, for bidwell park the only night restriction is that you cannot be in the park between 12am and 5am unless passing through to another destination. Im guessing this is because the section from hwy 99 to bruce ave is about 4 miles long and it would be unreasonable for them to expect people to go all the way around.

    However, ride your bike or skateboard on Chico State Campus and its a $158 fine, one of my homies got one last semester.
    AZ has the best mountain bike gathering ever

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melt
    However, ride your bike or skateboard on Chico State Campus and its a $158 fine, one of my homies got one last semester.
    I attended SJSU in the mid 90s and always used to outbike the campus police, as we weren't supposed to bike in the section that was once San Carlos St. between 4th and 10th. My buddy got caught once and they impounded his bike.

    I think it's legal now. Either that, or they've given up enforcement.

  36. #36
    fc
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    I'm just slaving away here, testing runtimes.

    I just realized something. Some of these lights are so fancy I can't test runtimes easily. At low battery levels, they step down, and then step down again to give extra runtime. So it's a 3 hour battery and it might last for 10 hours. Hmmm.

    It's heating up the room. Hope ze house don't burn down.

    fc
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  37. #37
    Curse you Coe!
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    What's that unit with the Perfect Circle light beam? 2nd from the right in FC's photo? I could use something like that for a helmet mount light.

  38. #38
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    wddung -

    That looks like the Stella from Light & Motion to me. Nice light.

    - I'm blind as a bat at night so 2 ARC's is the call for me..... Portable sun.

  39. #39
    Let's ride
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    That's the Stella 180L. Too much of a hotspot as the pattern. Not enough spill. Nice packaged light though.

  40. #40
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    Francois, I can loan you my new MiNewt X2 Dual for a bit if you want.

    **The TriNewt's a freaking CHP floodlight!!!!

    For the level it is, I am actually really impressed w/ the improvements made to this year's kit.

    PM me ahead of time, and I can throw it in the rig to take to work w/ me, and you can pick it up there.

  41. #41
    Yet
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    Maybe we should all wear our helmets AND turn on our helmet night lights at Tuesday's la honda meeting.
    Virtue is its own punishment

  42. #42
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    You need Betty. Too bad I am using mine every night. It is awsome, but $$$$$$$$$

  43. #43
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    I'm running the Lupine Nightmare. They're a couple of years old, but, man, what a light pattern is spits out.

    I'm sorry, but Lupine makes the best lights. I've gone through two Nite Riders and one L&M in the entire time I've had my Lupine.

    It's German is all that needs to be said.

  44. #44
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by poff
    You need Betty. Too bad I am using mine every night. It is awsome, but $$$$$$$$$
    I'll get the Wilma and Betty. It's just a question of timing now. Also I'm getting Lights On http://lightonlights.com/product/

    fc
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  45. #45
    Flyin Canine
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    Hey Francios Use This

    Hey Francios, use this data in your court appearance:

    http://www.sunrisesunset.com/calenda...pe=0&use_dst=1

    It shows that the official sunset for San Francisco, ca on OCT 29th 2007 was 6:15pm. So the ranger wrote you a $307 dollar ticket for being in the preserve 15min too long? Just 7 days earlier and you would have been in the clear at 7pm. Just go in to court and tell the judge that you thought you were riding legally but did not know the exact time that the preserve closed. They do not post the closing time on the sign on the way in and you didn't know the exact time that the sun set that day.

    This whole rule is absolutely insane. We need to fight midpen and make them change the closing time to 9pm EVERY day of the year. It's total crap that they are wasting my tax payer dollars paying a ranger to be out there giving you a ticket. The money for the ticket doesn't even go to their budget either. What the Hell are they thinking?

  46. #46
    fc
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    In late November, I got a night riding ticket for going to Fremont Older and riding at 6:30pm. The ticket was $307.

    Yesterday, I closed the book on this saga and just wanted to share some notes.

    Night riding in Midpen parks should absolutely be legal. Right now it is not. The fine of $307 is a crime I believe.

    I got the ticket, and I requested a court date and mailed in the form. It turns out that I need to send in $307 (to be refunded later) with the form.

    Palo Alto traffic Court did not process my incomplete form and mailed me a warrant in February. I dropped by the traffic court and they gave me a court appearance for March 27.

    I showed up in court along with 40 other traffic offenders and went before the judge. There were only three options: guilty, not guilty, traffic school. Not Guilty was my choice but I would have to set another court date to fight my case.

    I waited for an hour until my laughable offense was stated publicly. Most of the other cases there are severe traffic offenses. I had to cut my time losses so I stated 'guilty'. Every guilty plea gets about a 50% fine reduction.

    So my fine, $157. I pay and say goodbye.

    So there you have it. This applies to all your speeding and illegal trail, night riding, Midpen ticket.

    I wish I could have fought it and won or get it lowered to about $30. It wasn't quite worth my time. But I was learning the process and it was worth it not to give greedy midpen $307. Their fines are really unfair and the no night riding law is a crime to us who want to live an active and healthy lifestyle.

    Live and learn.

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    Just got a MROSD 805.3 (bicycle operation after hours) ticket tonight. I read through this thread and agree it is a crime to give these kind of tickets for something that harms no one and shouldn't be illegal in the first place! I'm shocked the fine is so high! Has anyone done anything to get the rules changed? With the amazing light technology we have now, why the heck can't we ride at night? What can we do to get this ridiculous rule changed?

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    Just got a MROSD 805.3 (bicycle operation after hours) ticket tonight. I read through this thread and agree it is a crime to give these kind of tickets for something that harms no one and shouldn't be illegal in the first place! I'm shocked the fine is so high! Has anyone done anything to get the rules changed? With the amazing light technology we have now, why the heck can't we ride at night? What can we do to get this ridiculous rule changed?
    Bummer you got a ticket....but I gotta ask...What park were you in, what area of that park were you in, and what time of night was it?

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    Just got a MROSD 805.3 (bicycle operation after hours) ticket tonight. I read through this thread and agree it is a crime to give these kind of tickets for something that harms no one and shouldn't be illegal in the first place! I'm shocked the fine is so high! Has anyone done anything to get the rules changed? With the amazing light technology we have now, why the heck can't we ride at night? What can we do to get this ridiculous rule changed?
    I'll probably get some red Chiclets for this but this MidPen (and I'm no fan of MidPen) rule/regulation makes sense given what MROSD is all about.

    It's mostly about resource protection; most wildlife move around at night---so banning access at night is primarily about protecting wildlife. Partially about not disturbing them and in the case of small critters not running over them.

    Secondarily; banning night access is also about law enforcement RE "real" criminals like pot farmers and poachers (as in with firearms). Hint: they also move around at night.

    The safety issue is probably third; MidPen would rather not have to do a SAR at 3:00 AM when somebody is reported missing and their car is found near a MidPen trailhead.

    FYI several areas that can be legally ridden at night; Henry Coe SP (at least for the time being; see "wild, wild west"); Fort Ord seasonal guided rides courtesy an agreement between MORCA and BLM; occasionally SCC OSA if a special event is organized.
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  50. #50
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    I am doing trial by declaration for my speeding ticket now. Here are some pointers for you:

    - start discovery early. Legally, the respondents have 15 calendar days to respond. However, when you schedule your TBD, the clerks will give you a due date that is just 20 days out. For example, I dropped off my TBD request with bail yesterday, on the 24th, and my due date is Nov 13. That's just barely enough to get any information back in the mail and prepare your defense.

    - Attorney General no longer handles discovery for cases handled by the traffic court where defendant represents himself. You have to send your requests directly to the agency that issued your citation. Of course, nobody will tell you that until you get a punt letter in the mail back from AG, and you will have just days left before your due date.

  51. #51
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    And don't forget, Demo is closed on weekends, according to Google. And it also moved!
    Lights, Ayup and the midpen ticket-demo.jpg

  52. #52
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    Off topic...

    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian View Post
    And don't forget, Demo is closed on weekends, according to Google. And it also moved!
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Has this thread gone OT or what!?!?

    No, Demo's office is still in the same place and correctly located by Google:


    Can you pick out drewp from the crowd? He's there so this must be Demo!
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  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by beaverbiker View Post
    Bummer you got a ticket....but I gotta ask...What park were you in, what area of that park were you in, and what time of night was it?
    Last week around 7:30pm in Fremont Older there was a Ranger truck on one of the fire roads with lights aimed along the Toyons. I was climbing by moonlight and saw them before they noticed me, so was able to get out of there without incident.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    Has this thread gone OT or what!?!?
    No it hasn't. I was obliquely responding to what you wrote: "FYI several areas that can be legally ridden at night; Henry Coe SP (at least for the time being; see "wild, wild west"); Fort Ord seasonal guided rides courtesy an agreement between MORCA and BLM; occasionally SCC OSA if a special event is organized."

    I've ridden Demo at night, and thought I'd look up what its riding hours were. Hence, my post.

    Sorry for the humor. I'll PM you with my post before posting, to make sure it doesn't stray.

  55. #55
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    We need a private forum setup for us to report all ranger activity (ticketing and radar locations). This is crucial info for Midpen riders that needs to be readily available with real time updates that only members can view. Anyone with that ability ready to step up and make it happen. I'm just a mechanical engineer so can't really help on that front but I can help with getting people signed up and verified.

    Let's do it!

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by beaverbiker View Post
    We need a private forum setup for us to report all ranger activity (ticketing and radar locations). This is crucial info for Midpen riders that needs to be readily available with real time updates that only members can view. Anyone with that ability ready to step up and make it happen. I'm just a mechanical engineer so can't really help on that front but I can help with getting people signed up and verified.

    Let's do it!
    easy.

    start a private google group and invite who you want.

    set it so anytime someone posts you are notified by email.

    keep your email notifications to 'push' on smartphone and you will be notified immediately if you have cel service.



    Or there are Apps that update Radar traps in real time with the same type of notification features.
    Click Here for Forum Rules

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHUM View Post
    easy.

    start a private google group and invite who you want.

    set it so anytime someone posts you are notified by email.

    keep your email notifications to 'push' on smartphone and you will be notified immediately if you have cel service.



    Or there are Apps that update Radar traps in real time with the same type of notification features.
    Ah, google groups, didn't even think of it. Thanks for the tip. Don't have a smartphone so the Apps thing is useless to me. I don't really need that up to date info since I could check the computer before heading out on a ride.

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    Stop the Madness

    I was riding Kennedy and he was waiting at the trailhead. I had problems with my brakes as the spring got caught up in the rotor so it took me a long time to fix it. Ranger couldn't care less about my reason and had an attitude about it. Official closure (30 min after sunset) was 6:50pm. I was caught at 7:50pm.

    $300+ ticket for being in a park after closing is insane! Has anything been done to fight Midpen in the last 6 years? What can we do?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    I'll probably get some red Chiclets for this but this MidPen (and I'm no fan of MidPen) rule/regulation makes sense given what MROSD is all about.

    It's mostly about resource protection; most wildlife move around at night---so banning access at night is primarily about protecting wildlife. Partially about not disturbing them and in the case of small critters not running over them.

    Secondarily; banning night access is also about law enforcement RE "real" criminals like pot farmers and poachers (as in with firearms). Hint: they also move around at night.

    The safety issue is probably third; MidPen would rather not have to do a SAR at 3:00 AM when somebody is reported missing and their car is found near a MidPen trailhead.

    FYI several areas that can be legally ridden at night; Henry Coe SP (at least for the time being; see "wild, wild west"); Fort Ord seasonal guided rides courtesy an agreement between MORCA and BLM; occasionally SCC OSA if a special event is organized.
    Sorry but I'm not buying that wildlife is a primary concern. Exactly what wildlife will be inconvenienced by riding at night and what critters are we concerned about? I've done hundreds of night rides in my life and haven't had an impact on any animals except I may have run over a few ants.

    To ban recreational access because someone might grow pot is also nuts. If someone wants to grow pot, there are lots of much easier and safer places to do it than in a public park. Besides, it's basically legal in California now anyway.

    Finally, to address the Search And Rescue concern, I'm sure they would be happy to do a search and rescue if we had to pay for it as is the case in most areas. Besides, we don't need the parks open all night. How about we at least keep them open until 9pm so we can get a ride in after work in the winter?

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    Sorry but I'm not buying that wildlife is a primary concern. Exactly what wildlife will be inconvenienced by riding at night and what critters are we concerned about? I've done hundreds of night rides in my life and haven't had an impact on any animals except I may have run over a few ants.
    You need to talk to a park resources person; they'll give you rather long list of critters disturbed at night. On the bright side; I did see a resources study that said that bikes with lights are no worse than hikers with lights.

    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    To ban recreational access because someone might grow pot is also nuts. If someone wants to grow pot, there are lots of much easier and safer places to do it than in a public park. Besides, it's basically legal in California now anyway.
    Yeah legal for personal use sort of. Still big money in it. Well; pot growers are nuts. Don't make me post my Sierra Azul photos. I've had some scary moments in El Sereno also. Under Ranger's orders there are some places in Coe that I can't go because "I know too much". Read John Nores Jr's "War in the Woods" for an education. Seriously...

    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    Finally, to address the Search And Rescue concern, I'm sure they would be happy to do a search and rescue if we had to pay for it as is the case in most areas. Besides, we don't need the parks open all night. How about we at least keep them open until 9pm so we can get a ride in after work in the winter?
    That's a great idea, come to the meeting and submit your comment.
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  61. #61
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    How about 10PM and cite all the EBRPD parks as a precedent. They may not be conducive to letting bikes on narrow trails there, but they do stay open the same hours year round, light or dark.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by somanygoodbikes View Post
    How about 10PM and cite all the EBRPD parks as a precedent. They may not be conducive to letting bikes on narrow trails there, but they do stay open the same hours year round, light or dark.
    That's a great idea, come to the meeting and submit your comment.
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  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by garne2t View Post
    I was riding Kennedy and he was waiting at the trailhead. I had problems with my brakes as the spring got caught up in the rotor so it took me a long time to fix it. Ranger couldn't care less about my reason and had an attitude about it. Official closure (30 min after sunset) was 6:50pm. I was caught at 7:50pm.

    $300+ ticket for being in a park after closing is insane! Has anything been done to fight Midpen in the last 6 years? What can we do?
    I've got you beat...got popped coming out of woods trail at hicks road only 20min after the legal time. Luckily the judge thought it was bogus and reduced it to $110.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian View Post
    several areas that can be legally ridden at night; Henry Coe SP (at least for the time being; see "wild, wild west")
    I searched for any reference to what you're talking about and found none. ???

    Edit: found it (2013 Henry Coe Park Map thread) It doesn't say anything about closing the park at night.

    Quote Originally Posted by somanygoodbikes View Post
    How about 10PM and cite all the EBRPD parks as a precedent.
    Marin Headlands too.

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    So you didn't get caught...

    Quote Originally Posted by Biking Brazilian View Post
    I've ridden Demo at night, and thought I'd look up what its riding hours were. Hence, my post.

    Sorry for the humor.
    I guess the humor is lost in the translation.

    Here's what CalFire's ca dot gov site has to say about Demo's hours of use:

    "Visitors enjoy hiking, bicycling, picnicking and horseback riding. There are no restrooms and no developed water sources in the forest so please bring your own drinking water. Hours for use are dawn to dusk; day use only. Horses and mountain bikes need to stay on trails or roads. Pets are welcome but must be on a leash. No smoking or fires of any kind are allowed in the forest. No firearms or motorized vehicles are allowed in the forest."

    Funny; this is what what popped up when I did a Google search, you must be doing something wrong
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  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fast Eddy View Post
    I searched for any reference to what you're talking about and found none. ???

    Edit: found it (2013 Henry Coe Park Map thread) It doesn't say anything about closing the park at night.
    The "wild wild west" is a continuing conversation, not necessarily on MTBR (or more like especially not on MTBR); Coe's immense size and resultant low user density affords us liberties that don't occur at other State Parks.

    The context is that if Coe was popularized to draw enough visitors to come close to "breaking even"; the rules would likely stiffen up.

    I see the "wild wild west" aspect of Coe mostly being a good thing.
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  67. #67
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    The fall into winter cycling season always finds us, here in the metropolitian areas, in the enforcement cross-hairs, of what I consider ludicrous prohibitions. I wish that we could at least ride until 10pm without having to resort to infantile games of hide and seek.

    I might have have been sporadically mountain bike night riding in the Cupertino area since 1986 and I might not have been caught yet. Yes, I have had a speeding ticket once in Freakmont Odor.

    Eating carrots, dressing in camouflage (with bike paint schemes to match), slowly and quietly riding by ambient light with eyes peeled and ears open, provides a rare excitement. The suspense of the hunt, when one is the prey, is one of keen and exqisite alertness and intense experience. This is adumbrated by the relative invisibility of the trail and the obstacles therein, as well as the drop-offs out there.

    Rides may be carefully planned to elude detection. Observe park staff behavior carefully and make note. Wild animals will share these trails at night. Ride slow. Enjoy the silence. If you don't, who will?

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcerer View Post
    Ride slow. Enjoy the silence. If you don't, who will?
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  69. #69
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    Zorg, exactly what I was thinking of when I wrote that. The less you say, the more you mean.

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    Agreed with all the posts to keep MROSD parks open until 10pm year around! Now how can we come together to make it happen? One guy showing up to a meeting won't do much. Anyone have experience on how we might get things changed?

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    How about we get a bunch of people to the next meeting and we all bring our bright mountain bike lights so we can shine them in their face until they give in? But seriously, it would help for them to see how many of us are interested in night riding along with the technology that makes it very safe to accomplish.

    Other points in favor of keeping parks open until 10pm:

    1) Promote healthy exercise year around.
    2) Safer for bikers to ride on trails rather than night riding on roads.
    3) Current fines are absurd. Penalty doesn't fit the "crime."
    4) If night rescue is a concern, permit charging those who need rescue just as I believe most parks do.

  72. #72
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    How about flash mob critical mass night rides?! If....

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by beaverbiker View Post
    I've got you beat...got popped coming out of woods trail at hicks road only 20min after the legal time. Luckily the judge thought it was bogus and reduced it to $110.
    that's such bullsh|t....

  74. #74
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    That's expensive. I'm glad I decided against doing an extra loop in Fremont Older today and did Rolling Hills and Parker Ranch instead.
    Also known as Menso's dad.

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    Francois, you might try exercising your 8th amendment right to be free from excessive fines? I know it's a long shot, this being post America, but still worth a try.

    Good luck.

  76. #76
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    Sort of off-topic.

    I was talking to someone last night about their recently run-in with MidPen rangers. They've been jumping onto trails in front of bikers in order to spook them. I recall that happened to me in the past while dropping down Ridge at the Gap. Of course, I immediately braked so I wouldn't run into them. Then they say that I was "out of control" because I slowed down quickly.

  77. #77
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    This post is old btw. The new fine by Midpen is $400 for riding 30 minutes after sunset.

    My view hasn't changed on this issue. They are downright criminals for charging excessive fines and discrimination against cyclists.

    I make sure to tell every ranger I see what they are doing and the cost of the tickets they're writing up.

    If you get caught hiking at night... you fine is around $40 but really, they won't cite you.

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  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    This post is old btw. The new fine by Midpen is $400 for riding 30 minutes after sunset.

    My view hasn't changed on this issue. They are downright criminals for charging excessive fines and discrimination against cyclists.

    I make sure to tell every ranger I see what they are doing and the cost of the tickets they're writing up.

    If you get caught hiking at night... you fine is around $40 but really, they won't cite you.

    fc
    Haha, so much truth to that. I remember getting caught in midpen areas at night with my buddies and a backpack full of...never got cited and they even offered us a ride home. We declined and emptied the backpack on the walk home. And every time I've been ticketed by Midpen and I ask why they have these dumb night riding rules they say it's for safety bla bla bla, and to keep kids from partying in the parks. Laughable.

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    I got my "courtesy notice" today for my MROSD 805.3 (bicycle operation after hours) ticket. Fine is $234. Better than the $400+ cited above but still ludicrous!

    I was riding Kennedy and was caught at the trail exit 1 hour after park closing. I have a valid defense as I had brake problems with the spring getting caught up in the brakes and it took me a long time to fix it.

    Is there any way to fight it by mail so I don't have to make a trip to the court? I just found the answer to my question. Yes.

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  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    You need to talk to a park resources person; they'll give you rather long list of critters disturbed at night.
    Quack science. And "disturbed" does not mean negatively affected to any appreciable degree.

    In any case - another reason to hate this stupid winter time shift. Keep summer time all the year.

  81. #81
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    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Lights, Ayup and the midpen ticket-1450680_10151968584383213_1397933112_n.jpg  

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  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    Holy cow. Does it come with a vision insurance plan?

  83. #83
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    Does it have a 60 lumen ranger danger mode? That light looks like a ranger magnet.

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    Does the battery pack require a trailer???
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  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Holy cow. Does it come with a vision insurance plan?
    Last night after I installed it, I looked in the mirror at an angle and turned it on. I guess I wasn't angled enough cause the light hit my eyes. I had to go to sleep early since my eyes hurt. 5 years of light testing and I've never been retina burned like that. My eyeballs still hurt.

    Ranger danger mode, yes. It will last 7 days on the battery. At 600 lumens, it lasts 36 hours.

    System weight is 820 grams so it's like the old Niterider Trinewts.

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  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by beaverbiker View Post
    I've got you beat...got popped coming out of woods trail at hicks road only 20min after the legal time. Luckily the judge thought it was bogus and reduced it to $110.
    Price of doing business.

    Although, I can kinda see where they are coming from. From their perspective, if you crash and break your hip or your back, it becomes a major rescue operation to extract your dumb ass after the local rangers/cops/sheriff/support staff have gone home for the evening. Budget cuts, yo. It's not as if they can leave you do die because they are off the clock. They are just trying to discourage that sorta thing so you don't make a crapload of expensive work for them... plus, they are concerned for your safety and don't fully get what we do or even why we do it.

    It wouldn't surprise me if they backcharged you for search and rescue operations if the issue came up. That ain't cheap, either.

  87. #87
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    What MidPen sez about night riding...

    ...is this (via a local mountain biking group, from a rider who asked nicely for permission and WYSIWYG'):

    "Dear Xx. Xxxxxxxxx,

    As Xxxxxxxxxx Xxxxxxx for the District, I received your request and subsequent communication with District staff regarding your interest in having regularly reoccurring permitted Docent led night time bicycle rides on District lands. The District has very strict rules regarding afterhours use of its Preserves. It is true, that on rare occasions our Docents have led night time hikes for special activities like star gazing or wildlife observation. However, it is rare and requires a lot of preplanning for one to occur. After hours bicycle riding is not an activity the District has an interest in allowing because of concern for wildlife safety (many small animals can be found on the trail at night) and for rider safety. Nighttime activities require ranger monitoring in the event emergency medical response is required as it becomes much more difficult for responding emergency services to locate and transport individuals after dark in the event they are injured or become sick. In addition, the District already experiences a lot of illegal nighttime bicycle riding that we strictly enforce against and those individuals could see sanctioned night rides as a way to legitimize and increase the activity.

    Sincerely,
    Xxxxx Xxxxxxxxxxx
    Xxxxxxxxxx Xxxxxx"
    Last edited by Moe Ped; 11-21-2013 at 12:50 PM. Reason: Tutorial about editing
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  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    ...is this (a local biking group asked nicely for permission and WYSIWYG):

    "Dear Mr. Xxxxxxxxx,

    As Operations Manager for the District, I received your request and subsequent communication with District staff regarding your interest in having regularly reoccurring permitted Docent led night time bicycle rides on District lands. The District has very strict rules regarding afterhours use of its Preserves. It is true, that on rare occasions our Docents have led night time hikes for special activities like star gazing or wildlife observation. However, it is rare and requires a lot of preplanning for one to occur. After hours bicycle riding is not an activity the District has an interest in allowing because of concern for wildlife safety (many small animals can be found on the trail at night) and for rider safety. Nighttime activities require ranger monitoring in the event emergency medical response is required as it becomes much more difficult for responding emergency services to locate and transport individuals after dark in the event they are injured or become sick. In addition, the District already experiences a lot of illegal nighttime bicycle riding that we strictly enforce against and those individuals could see sanctioned night rides as a way to legitimize and increase the activity.

    Sincerely,
    Xxxxx Xxxxxxxxxxx
    Operations Manager"
    Makes my blood boil. They are a nazi regime living in their own bubble. They make up sooooo many rules and feel they have to enforce them all at night.

    In the South Bay (Coe, Morca), it's not an issue.

    In the East Bay, it's not an issue.

    In the rest of California, not an issue.

    In the rest of the US and the rest of the world, night riding is as normal as walking at night.

    We Midpen mountain bikers are the laughing stock of the world.

    fc
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  89. #89
    Dirty by Nature
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    ^^ I'll just add that night riding in the OC is also an issue. Almost all the parks close at dusk, although the rangers rarely monitor/ticket. The only legal riding is in the Santa Ana Mtns (national forest), and there were never any issues there with rescues, mountain lions, creatures of the night, etc. If anything, riders are slower and more careful at night.

    The no night-riding rule just fits the general pattern of Midpenis schmuckiness.

    (see what I did there!)
    Last edited by dirtvert; 11-20-2013 at 07:37 PM.
    Friends don't let friends ride e-"bikes" on dirt.

    Nature is not a sidewalk (I'm looking at you, MidPen).

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    I would be interested in what brand of sorcery is attached to your helmet, posthaste good chap!
    To love me is to rep me, world domination is eminent/imminent/immanent.

  91. #91
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    Lights, Ayup and the midpen ticket

    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Makes my blood boil.
    Could be that lighthouse bulb you have strapped to your head.

    There is a local agency that sucks worse than Midpen. San Mateo parks.

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    I think if you put a magnifying glass in front of you, those ants on the trail will be toasted.........(think when you were 7 yrs old)
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  93. #93
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    You WERE interested in my tiara. And then you saw the price.

    Halo - Trail Led

    fc
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  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    You WERE interested in my tiara. And then you saw the price.

    Halo - Trail Led

    fc
    NA, I'll just wait for a few years, you'll prob throw it in the NorCal free or trade thread.
    Last edited by Buzkil; 11-20-2013 at 02:27 PM. Reason: cause my brain went faster than my fingers
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  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    Here's the matching bar light
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Lights, Ayup and the midpen ticket-300486_10150344508988213_898888752_n.jpg  

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  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    You WERE interested in my tiara. And then you saw the price.

    Halo - Trail Led

    fc
    Wow...for $1,200 you'd at least expect them to throw in a nomex hoodie and fire-extinguisher.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    ...is this (a local biking group asked nicely for permission and WYSIWYG):

    "Dear Mr. Xxxxxxxxx,

    As Operations Manager for the District, I received your request and subsequent communication with District staff regarding your interest in having regularly reoccurring permitted Docent led night time bicycle rides on District lands. The District has very strict rules regarding afterhours use of its Preserves. It is true, that on rare occasions our Docents have led night time hikes for special activities like star gazing or wildlife observation. However, it is rare and requires a lot of preplanning for one to occur. After hours bicycle riding is not an activity the District has an interest in allowing because of concern for wildlife safety (many small animals can be found on the trail at night) and for rider safety. Nighttime activities require ranger monitoring in the event emergency medical response is required as it becomes much more difficult for responding emergency services to locate and transport individuals after dark in the event they are injured or become sick. In addition, the District already experiences a lot of illegal nighttime bicycle riding that we strictly enforce against and those individuals could see sanctioned night rides as a way to legitimize and increase the activity.

    Sincerely,
    Xxxxx Xxxxxxxxxxx
    Operations Manager"
    What a load of crap. They can simply charge anyone who needs to be rescued as they do in many parts of the country. Rescue cost is not an issue.

    I've done lots of night riding and have yet to see all these small animals they are concerned about. Bogus.

    In addition, the rangers are already patrolling at night so they can write us tickets. Save money by leaving the rangers at home at night and simply charge for any required rescues. With the bevy of very bright lights we have now, a night time rescue would be very easy. Just as night time riding is easy and safe.

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Oh it's on ranger biatches. 6000 lumens.
    Bring that light to the next MROSD meeting. Let's all bring our lights and show up in force! Put them in the spotlight to clue them in to how safe night riding is with the lights we have now.

    Next meeting is Jan 29th at 6pm:

    Openspace.org - Plans and Projects - Imagine the Future of Open Space - CAC Meeting Schedule

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    That might not work too well if they are more worried about complaints (or even lawsuits?) from rich NIMBYs who live next to preserves...

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by locoyokel View Post
    That might not work too well if they are more worried about complaints (or even lawsuits?) from rich NIMBYs who live next to preserves...
    I'm not aware of any homes next to trails that I have ridden in MROSD so I wouldn't think that would be a concern. Kennedy, El Sereno, Steven's Canyon, Fremont Older.

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