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  1. #1
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    Hope Spot Disc tab facing tool question?

    Just curious if anyone knows if the hope spot is set up to do 20mm bolt through forks like the Z1 FR qr20?

    I was thinking of renting the magura version, but the one place I found that does have one for rent won't do 20mm forks, so instead of paying $35 to rent and only being able to do the rear triangle, I was thinking if the Hope spot would do the whole bike and I can buy one for $110 or so and probably charge like $10 to do local bikes to recover the difference.

    Also just in general how do people like the hope spot tool that have used it?

    Todd

  2. #2
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    Idea! Don't assume that the Spot is not adequate for the job,...

    Quote Originally Posted by ToddM
    Just curious if anyone knows if the hope spot is set up to do 20mm bolt through forks like the Z1 FR qr20? I was thinking of renting the magura version, but the one place I found that does have one for rent won't do 20mm forks, so instead of paying $35 to rent and only being able to do the rear triangle, I was thinking if the Hope spot would do the whole bike and I can buy one for $110 or so and probably charge like $10 to do local bikes to recover the difference. Also just in general how do people like the hope spot tool that have used it? Todd
    ...the fact that many shops use the Gnanomat has probably more to do with their relationship with the manufacturer instead. Magura product/customer service is generally much easier to get than Hope, and the shops are probably getting a pretty good price on the Gnanomat if they do high volume in Magura.

    The main design difference between these tools however, is the adjustability that the Gnanomat has to align to the exact tab hole position. Hope takes a simpler, and IMO, better thought out approach to tab hole position by making the tool with preplaced holes in the exact "spot" the tab holes are supposed to be. This is not only quicker and easier for the user, it ensures that if your tab holes are slightly off, the tools cutter tip will reposition them to where they're supposed to be by reaming itself into place. Although this picture, and even Hopes current website picture does not show, the latest model of this tool comes with an adapter sleeve for use with 12mm through axle rear ends, and since the tool's axles are 20mm, it will work with 20mm through axle front ends too.
    [size=2]Hope Tech

    Hope SPOT disc brake mount facing tool
    [size=1](TL1600)
    [/size][size=2]$106.99 [/size][/size]


    (Alfre E. Bike price)


    Frankly, I don't see why more people aren't using this tool, esp shops that sell FR and DH frames. When you look at it's price, versatility, and the saved labor time, I would think shops in the know would prefer it.

    The Spot has always been 20mm compatible, the Gnanomat is just now becoming 20mm compatible, and still not 12mm compatible.
    Last edited by Gnarlygig; 02-24-2004 at 09:01 AM.

  3. #3
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    To me I think it should work pretty well, after talking with hope about it a little bit I decided to order one so I'll report back on how it does once it arrives and I have a chance to use it. I think I'll take a trial run on my old xfly fork, don't run discs on it anyway but it will serve as a nice practice run.

    I would think it would be pretty easy to make the way hope did it, I mean the bolt holes have to be spaced to a pretty close tolerence or the brakes would not bolt up.

    I do see what you are saying about warranty though, however I would think that most fork/frame companies would not refuse warranty if the failure was un-releated to the modification. Now if you cracked a disc tab or something and it was modified then sure, but if something internal goes wrong with your fork or your shock linkage breaks I don't think too many companies would say "Hey you faced your disc tab holes, no warranty". I've never heard of that happening with a headset or bb, and it's not uncommon to face those parts of the frame before install.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnarlygig
    ...the fact that many shops use the Gnanomat has probably more to do with their relationship with the manufacturer instead. Magura product/customer service is generally much easier to get than Hope, and the shops are probably getting a pretty good price on the Gnanomat if they do high volume in Magura.

    The main design difference between these tools however, is the adjustability that the Gnanomat has to align to the exact tab hole position. Hope takes a simpler, and IMO, better thought out approach to tab hole position by making the tool with preplaced holes in the exact "spot" the tab holes are supposed to be. This is not only quicker and easier for the user, it ensures that if your tab holes are slightly off, the tools cutter tip will reposition them to where they're supposed to be by reaming itself into place. Although this picture, and even Hopes current website picture does not show, the latest model of this tool comes with an adapter sleeve for use with 12mm through axle rear ends, and since the tool's axles are 20mm, it will work with 20mm through axle front ends too.
    [size=2]Hope Tech

    Hope SPOT disc brake mount facing tool
    [size=1](TL1600)
    [/size][size=2]$106.99 [/size][/size]


    (Alfre E. Bike price)


    Frankly, I don't see why more people aren't using this tool, esp shops that sell FR and DH frames. When you look at it's price, versatility, and the saved labor time, I would think shops in the know would prefer it.

    The Spot has always been 20mm compatible, the Gnanomat is just now becoming 20mm compatible, and still not 12mm compatible.

    Have had the oppertunity to use the Spot tool on several frames and forks and can not argure that it is a must have for anyone serious about working with disc brakes. I'm just a little slow when it comes to the little metal bits pictured below.

  5. #5
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    No, you're not so much "slow" as the parts are hard to figure. Even the guy at Hope I talked to said he wasn't sure how they're used, as he hadn't had a chance to use the tool. He seemed to be sure they were for using the tool with a Boxxer fork, but thought them to seem redundant. I myself thought they might be used in conjunction with the front axle (100mm), whereby the little holes would be secured at the axle ends, between the axle shoulder and fixing bolt, with the larger hole sliding over the axle in the dropout, so as to extend the reach to face adapters, rather than tabs. This, if it were the application, would only work with standard rears and 20mm through axle fronts.

  6. #6
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    Sorry, you must have read my post before I edited it. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by ToddM
    To me I think it should work pretty well, after talking with hope about it a little bit I decided to order one so I'll report back on how it does once it arrives and I have a chance to use it. I think I'll take a trial run on my old xfly fork, don't run discs on it anyway but it will serve as a nice practice run.

    I would think it would be pretty easy to make the way hope did it, I mean the bolt holes have to be spaced to a pretty close tolerence or the brakes would not bolt up.

    I do see what you are saying about warranty though, however I would think that most fork/frame companies would not refuse warranty if the failure was un-releated to the modification. Now if you cracked a disc tab or something and it was modified then sure, but if something internal goes wrong with your fork or your shock linkage breaks I don't think too many companies would say "Hey you faced your disc tab holes, no warranty". I've never heard of that happening with a headset or bb, and it's not uncommon to face those parts of the frame before install.
    After talking to Hope, I agreed with what was said, that if the tab holes were so out of position that this tool either would not work or need considerable repositioning of the tab holes, the fork would pretty much be considered too off ISO or whatever bolt pattern, to be capable of properly mounting the calipers.

  7. #7
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    Well after using it on two forks and a frame now I have to say I'm pretty impressed. I did two marzocchi forks where there really wasen't rotor rub but you could see by the light gaps that they were not quite strait with the rotor, after facing them they sat perfect. Then on my 04' Z1 FR QR20, I set up some louise FR's that rubbed a little and without doing some pretty good rotor tweaking it would not have been right, again it was easy to see by the light gap that they were not quite strait with the rotor, after facing, it took about 5 minutes to get the right spacers in there and boom, no rub, no mess no fuss, no need to bend the rotor.

    Another thing I noticed is that even without rubbing the rotor before the tabs were faced you could see the rotor being pushed to one side or the other when the brakes were applied, almost twisted when clamped, after facing, no movement of the rotor when brakes are applied.

    The tool probably isn't needed, but I think for the price if you have a few bikes it's certainly worth it. The magura unit might be a little nicer in that it allows you to use any position, where the hope has slots for common ones. However on the 3 setups I used it on, I never had a problem with it fitting once the first one was set, it fit right in the second slot without any need to do any cutting on the actual bolt hole itself. It looks to me like they build in a little oversize into that hole to allow for a little movement, because a caliper mount bolt has some play in any direction.

    The instructions say to slide it in so the tool is flush, set the bottom out kurled knob and then go ream the second hole the same as the first. I modified this by reaming the first hole enough to remove the paint and smooth it out so it was even, then setting the bottom out knurled knob and moving to the second hole. It probably takes off a tiny bit more material but it makes more sense to me to get rid of any paint thickness differences on both tabs.

    However as to those two little figure 8 with different sized holes, they came with it but the instructions don't even mention or show them. No idea what they are for.

  8. #8
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    Good report Todd, and very thorough. I was reminded in the middle of reading it though, how some (including Hope), have complained of poor dropout alignment on some of the '03 Zokes. I'm not sure how one of these tools (or any facing tool) would work if that were the case.

  9. #9
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    I own the Hope tool and have dealt with poor alignment on my fox fork with the tool. I finally figured out how to correct some of it. You need to loosly insert the axle into the dropouts, then align the facing tool in the caliper mount, then you tighten the ends of the axle. This will allow you to face the mounts correctly. I was having trouble outerwise, but only on my Fox Vanilla R. I also had a little trouble with my Vulture 29'er frame, but I was able to make that work better, by completely lossening the axle ends and getting the tool in place. I think that tightening the axle in the frame/fork deflects just enough that the tool wont go in correctly.
    SB

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