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Hope M4's vs Avid Juicy 7 which to buy?

2K views 18 replies 12 participants last post by  misctwo 
#1 ·
Hey folks, I need some quick advice. I have a buyer for my Avid Mechnical discs on my Turner XCE. I have a 185mm front and 160mm rear. I'm a Clyde hence the 185mm front.

So I'm thinking of taking the expensive plunge for hydraulic disc.

just which one.

1. Avid Juicy 7
2. Hope M4

I like the Avid Mechanical CPS and how easy it is to setup. I also know that the Hopes can be troublesome to install/setup; but once in they are reportedly some of the best out there.
 
#3 ·
Don't know much about Hopes since I'm a Magura and Hayes guy, but I have crossed the Juicy 7 off my list. Read the reviews. Too many issues, above and beyond the issues every product has. Heck, if Performance is knocking 30% off you know something is wrong. Kidding.

And even though I hate my Hayes Mag 160mm discs, I may try the El Camino.... if people would start posting real-world reports! ;)
 
#4 ·
BlackOut said:
Hey folks, I need some quick advice. I have a buyer for my Avid Mechnical discs on my Turner XCE. I have a 185mm front and 160mm rear. I'm a Clyde hence the 185mm front.

So I'm thinking of taking the expensive plunge for hydraulic disc.

just which one.

1. Avid Juicy 7
2. Hope M4

I like the Avid Mechanical CPS and how easy it is to setup. I also know that the Hopes can be troublesome to install/setup; but once in they are reportedly some of the best out there.
especially in light of the lighter weight of the new M4s and the not so great reviews of the Juicy 7s in many regards, no question, the Hope M4s are the brake right now.
 
#6 ·
BlackOut said:
Hey folks, I need some quick advice. I have a buyer for my Avid Mechnical discs on my Turner XCE. I have a 185mm front and 160mm rear. I'm a Clyde hence the 185mm front.

So I'm thinking of taking the expensive plunge for hydraulic disc.

just which one.

1. Avid Juicy 7
2. Hope M4

I like the Avid Mechanical CPS and how easy it is to setup. I also know that the Hopes can be troublesome to install/setup; but once in they are reportedly some of the best out there.
I recently replaced a set of Hayes HFX-9 with a set of Hope Mone M4s including the newer two piece rotors (200mm front and 160mm rear. They look great, have great modulation and unbelievable stopping power. I'm very happy with the performance of these brakes and they were not as hard to set up as I thought they would be. A little patience is all it takes.

Hope this helps
 
#7 ·
It sounds like the Hope's are it

Thanks for all the feedback folks. I think that the M4's are the way to go then.

I will look forward to the difference in modulation. I didn't feel that the Avid Mechs had that great of a modulation to them; thought that my Avid SD2.5's v-brakes on my RMB Vertex were a little better.
 
#9 · (Edited)
rensho said:
How do magura Louise compare with these mono M4?
The Mono4 is a 4 piston brake (like the heavier Magura Gustav) Quad piston caliper brakes have several inherent advantages over dual piston calipers; a narrower brake track (for a given pad area), toe in pressure on the pads, and more even pressure on the pad. However given that it is a more expensive brake than the Louise, that it performs better is no surprise. (the Gustav would have an advantage (over the Mono4) power and fade wise but are not in this weight class and really should be compared to the Mono6ti)

Just for information you can run the 160 and 180mm Mono Mini rotors with the Mono4's (they are considerably lighter) However this is a XC only trick, although the power and modulation would be the same the heat dissipation of the Mono4 rotors is better.
 
#10 ·
snowstick said:
I recently replaced a set of Hayes HFX-9 with a set of Hope Mone M4s including the newer two piece rotors (200mm front and 160mm rear. They look great, have great modulation and unbelievable stopping power. I'm very happy with the performance of these brakes and they were not as hard to set up as I thought they would be. A little patience is all it takes.

Hope this helps
i found that hope's take quite a long time to bed in 100%. have you had the same experience? i just got a set of mono mini's with 180mm F/R and they're getting stronger every day, but it's been about a week of riding every day at least 1 hr, and they still don't seem at full power. my monoM4's are 100%, took a long time to bed in also, but they are mucho powerful; they do squeal and reverb a lot when wet--facing the mounts is something i need to do soon.
 
#11 ·
I think that all Hope brakes now come with sintered metal pads which do take longer to break in (but they also wear longer.) Two thoughts on the squeal, other than a misaligned caliper (misfaced mounts) One, pads that have not full seated on the rotors have limited ability to squeegee water off the braking surface under hard braking (so it may be better after break in) Second if the discs are getting drenched in just clean water (rare unless you are riding in wet snow) nearly all discs will squeal (a little mud goes a long way to quiet brakes) Lots of clean water (like riding in melting snow) is particularly bad for sintered pads (noise wise) because it washes the graphite off the surface of the pad (sintered pads are virtually all metal (bronze) but they have a tiny bit of graphite mixed in to quiet them) If they are just getting drenched with clean water a couple long downhill sections (moderate, not hard, pressure) should quiet them.
Hope this helps
 
#12 ·
Mono's or M4's

I was wondering what the big diff was with the mono vs the Mono4's. I'm only a singletrack XC rider so would you bother with with M4's or just to with the Mini's?

I'm using a 185 rotor on the front now; but I'm not adverse to trying the smaller 160mm version.

Anyone else switch between Mechs and Hopes? Did you "feel" that much different?

I like the Avid Mechs over the Hayes Mechs, the feel was a little better; but not a lot.
 
#13 ·
BlackOut said:
I was wondering what the big diff was with the mono vs the Mono4's. I'm only a singletrack XC rider so would you bother with with M4's or just to with the Mini's?

I'm using a 185 rotor on the front now; but I'm not adverse to trying the smaller 160mm version.

Anyone else switch between Mechs and Hopes? Did you "feel" that much different?

I like the Avid Mechs over the Hayes Mechs, the feel was a little better; but not a lot.
As a dumb blond, the way I see it is that the only tangible benefit of the Mini's vs the M4s is the cost savings. That aside, especially in light of the M4s now being lighter, I see almost no reason to not get them, period. I would recommend to almost everyone (except racers who literally count grams and to freeriders and DHers who need larger), to run a 180mm front and 160mm rear....it is well worth it.

cheers
 
#15 ·
Grumpy said:
I think that all Hope brakes now come with sintered metal pads which do take longer to break in (but they also wear longer.) Two thoughts on the squeal, other than a misaligned caliper (misfaced mounts) One, pads that have not full seated on the rotors have limited ability to squeegee water off the braking surface under hard braking (so it may be better after break in) Second if the discs are getting drenched in just clean water (rare unless you are riding in wet snow) nearly all discs will squeal (a little mud goes a long way to quiet brakes) Lots of clean water (like riding in melting snow) is particularly bad for sintered pads (noise wise) because it washes the graphite off the surface of the pad (sintered pads are virtually all metal (bronze) but they have a tiny bit of graphite mixed in to quiet them) If they are just getting drenched with clean water a couple long downhill sections (moderate, not hard, pressure) should quiet them.
Hope this helps
yeah i did notice that the monoM4's are making less noise now, but i heard that going with koolstop pads will keep them more silent? also as MBA states, "weight weenies will rejoice when they hear that the koolstops are 7 grams lighter than the stock pads."
:)
 
#16 ·
misctwo said:
yeah i did notice that the monoM4's are making less noise now, but i heard that going with koolstop pads will keep them more silent? also as MBA states, "weight weenies will rejoice when they hear that the koolstops are 7 grams lighter than the stock pads."
:)
The M4 calipers can keep even metal pads(when they are fully broken in) fairly quiet (one of the benefits of a quad piston brake) The Koolstops are semimetallic pads (mostly resin with a little metal sprinkled in) and don't have quite the performance or life-span of the sintered pads (particularly in the mud) but they are a little quieter. They are great for downhill however, because they don't conduct the brake heat back to the calipers nearly as much as the metal pads do. (I keep a set for DH) If you have heat fade problems with the stock pads Koolstops are defiantly a good alternative. For general XC / all-mountain use I always go back to the sintered pads.
 
#17 ·
Hopes for sure

I have a set of M4's and they are, in my personal opinion, the best 'feeling' brakes out there. Great modulation and power. I'm running the 180mm fr/rr on my XC/all mtn. bike and I can't notice any weight difference from my older 160mm hayes. I'd use it on my DH bike also but apparently Hopes are not compatible with a Dorado, oh well. Shell out the cash now and you won't regret it down the line.
 
#18 ·
don't know Juicy. Hope Mono M4 200mm's awesome

don't know Juicy, but i know that my superbly modulating Hope Mono M4 200mm brake is really strong, esp on long and fast twisty descends. I had noticed that my old Mini Mono 160mm had a bit of fade when the rotors got really hot...so i gave it away and got the Mono M4 with the largest rotor i can fit, 200mm.
 
#19 ·
TrailNut said:
don't know Juicy, but i know that my superbly modulating Hope Mono M4 200mm brake is really strong, esp on long and fast twisty descends. I had noticed that my old Mini Mono 160mm had a bit of fade when the rotors got really hot...so i gave it away and got the Mono M4 with the largest rotor i can fit, 200mm.
i have a hope 220mm rotor(newer spider design) that was going to be for my Fox DH40 that i never ended up getting. it's sitting lame in my closet... but right now my 180 F/R's work great. might go back to 200/180 though....
 
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