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Thread: Hayes or Hope ?

  1. #1
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    New question here. Hayes or Hope ?

    I'm looking to get a new brakeset for my '03 Heckler w/Firefly. I can't decide if I should get hayes mags (I've always run hayes with minimal problems), or go with something different and get the new hope mono M4 's. Will I feel much of a difference between them? Is it worth the few extra bucks fot the hope? I'm not a lightweight, 190 lbs, and I enjoy freeride and aggressive xc. I'm also not sure on rotor sizes, hope comes in 6,7,8 inch rotors, hayes comes in 6,8 inch. Any recomendations on the setup ?

    Cheers

    Greg

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    i actually had the same problem ... hayes mags 8" or hope mono m4s .
    however, i chose to go with the mono m4's (200mm fr/180mm re) because
    - they are a piece of cnc-art, and if you are a litttle enthusiastic about gear like me you owe it to yourself.
    - everyone rides hayes, because they come stock on retail bikes. if possible, i choose to go with more exotic parts.
    - hope customer service is supposed to be very good (although i did not need it)
    - the m4 shares pads with the old xtr and the grimeca's, no other brake gives you as much flexibility in the choice of pads.
    - performance is awesome, check the review section (some reviews are in the section of the older m4's)
    - they are really easy to bleed
    - you get them at mtnhighcyclery.com for ~400$, which is not that much more expensive than the hayes brakes.

    but in the end you have to choose

  3. #3
    Daniel the Dog
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    I think you answered your own question...

    Quote Originally Posted by rumor
    I'm looking to get a new brakeset for my '03 Heckler w/Firefly. I can't decide if I should get hayes mags (I've always run hayes with minimal problems), or go with something different and get the new hope mono M4 's. Will I feel much of a difference between them? Is it worth the few extra bucks fot the hope? I'm not a lightweight, 190 lbs, and I enjoy freeride and aggressive xc. I'm also not sure on rotor sizes, hope comes in 6,7,8 inch rotors, hayes comes in 6,8 inch. Any recomendations on the setup ?

    Cheers

    Greg
    Why mess with success. If you like the Hayes' brakes. I saw the Hayes Mag at Universal Cycles for like $109 or something cheap. I ride Hayes and think they are the cat's meow. I've ridden XT and like them a lot also. It is pretty hard now to buy a bad disc brakes. I have heared the new Hopes are great, but they have that shim system, which, I don't like. I prefer the Haye's adapter system.

    Jaybo

  4. #4
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    I'd say

    the M4's. Having used the Hayes comp (same as mag except lever body) 6" rotors on an XC bike, and '03 M4's on my Bullit, there's no comparison IMHO. Hopes modulate better, it's that simple, and for me, that means way better control. Lots of Hayes owners like their brakes, I'm not one of them. Sure they work, but so does a Chevy...basic transport. The Hopes hand you the tools to do a bit more, IMO. They are on an '03 Bullit, I ride old guy aggressive FR, with some XC.

    We are similar weight at 190# plus gear, the larger front rotor I recommend too, 6" won't do it. Check to make sure the Firefly can take a bigger rotor and stresses.

    Good luck, Jim
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  5. #5
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    Thanks for replies

    I'm leaning toward the hopes because #1 --the modulation and #2 --to be a bit different . I just hope I'm not trading off reliability for this. I was thinking 8" rotor up front ( I have the firefly w/ thru axle) and 7" in the back. And yes, they do look like a piece of art !

    What about noise (squealing) from the hopes, I' ve been told that they are noisey. Is this just with the old ones, or the new ones too?

    Thanks

    Greg

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    the hopes are not noisy if they are set up properly. at least mine are not (noisy, that is. properly set up they are!)
    also, reliability is not an issue, with the larger rotors you won't have much of an overheating and fading problem, the pad wear is low (4-piston brakes-> larger brake pad) and as far as long-time durability goes i just expect them to live up to hope's reputation.

    since the hopes and the hayes are pretty much on par weightwise, imho the only thing speaking for the hayes is the lower price. however, if you want to go with the current model hayes g2-caliper i do not think you will be able to find the set of hayes mag hd for under 260$, and hence i got the hopes.
    also, i do not like to take chances when it comes to brakes, and i feel kinda secure about having these on my bike.

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    plus i think the hope lever feels more ergonomic for a guy with big hands like me.
    although, on the plus side for the hayes, the mag levers are a flip-flop design, which i think is a pretty good idea.

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    My M4's

    made a slight low howl at 1st but it went away after a few rides, and after I tightened it all up. I used the Magura Gnannomat to face the tabs on the Bullit (way out) and the Super T (way out) and that has helped a lot. I recommend you do that if your shop has a Hope Spot tool or Gnannomat.

    I've got... and have had, many brands, when they get wet, especially in cool or cold, expect noise, they ALL do that. Once you burn the water off with some FR stopping, back to peace and quiet.

    Wish I'd waited 1 year to get those snazzy new M4's. that said, the performance of the '03's is nothing short of perfect.

    I should tell you that the Magura Gustav's rate right up there with the Hopes; and the service for them is excellent for parts and advice.

    Good luck, Jim MCM #11

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    Thanks

    Thanks for the help !

    I've made the call and ordered myself a set of hopes , getting the 8" up front, and the 7" in the back. Should be enough to stop my slightly overweight self ! Can't wait till they get here ! I'll install them myself first ( do they come with spacers, or do I have to pick em up from a hardware store ? ) If I have a problem with them making noise , I'll bring them in to a shop that has the proper tools , and/or get the tabs faced . Thanks again !

    Cheers,

    Greg

  10. #10
    Jm.
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    My hope DH4s were dead reliable. I sold them with my bike, but I probably should have kept them. 4 years and perfect the entire time. They seemed to cut through mud and muck a lot better than my hayes.

    That said, I really like the latest hayes, they never "sucked", but their current mag brakes are ultra-refined and very nice all around. I just bought a pair a few days back in fact. My buddy has the mag+ and I like those as well. If I had the $$$ I would get the hope minis, but the mags are significantly cheaper for me, and they work good enough for this application. My DH bike also has hayes currently, but for that bike if I didn't have hayes on there and needed new brakes, I would in fact save up until I had enough $$$ for hopes.
    I know in my heart that Ellsworth bikes are more durable by as much as double. AND they are all lighter...Tony Ellsworth

  11. #11
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    Well, I would say if you've got the money, go for the Hopes! If not, the Hayes will work fine. However, stay far away from the HFX-9 levers. Those things blow chunks!! Stupid little bleeder cap will come out/off at at the most inoportune time.

    Now, with all that said, I just ordered set of the MAG levers to replace the HFX-9's. The G2 calipers and 8" rotors still have a ton of life left, so the jump to Hope MonoM4's was tough to justify. ($150 vs $450+)

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    Geez, I'm still waiting on my Hopes ! They say that they had to special order the front because it is a Manitou fork, and uses a different combination of caliper and rotor with the manitou IS adapter. It's only been a couple weeks, but it seems like forever !

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