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  1. #1
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    Full Metal Jacket Question

    I got a set of Avid Full Metal Jacket cables/tubing for my BB7s. I'm looking at the directions and the parts and having trouble seeing how it all goes together. I'm a visual learner, so does anyone have pics of the tubing runs/caliper connections or any tips for putting it all together?

  2. #2
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    My tip would be to get rid of them. They are a pain to fit to some bikes, and you'll still need some standard housing anyways. Just go full housing runs, use one of the nice housings or generic, and don't look back. I have tried the full metal jackets and just found them not worth it at all...YMMV.
    "...the people get the government they deserve..."
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  3. #3
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    The FMJ is perfect if your frame is suitable for a non-complicated cable run. The performance cannot be topped by another cable system. Here is a link to some pictures:
    Is it just me? Avid BB7's not too impressive.

  4. #4
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    here's a couple...maybe hard to see tho
    i just colored it red

    routing in general


    trelgne - i couldn't see your pics
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    trelgne - i couldn't see your pics
    Sorry. It seems that only registered members of the mtb-news-forum can see the pictures behind the links.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  6. #6
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    I had the Full Metal Jacket when I first got my BB7's on my old hardtail. I never really saw the advantage and eventually just went to Flak Jacket cables and housing, which worked just as well and aesthetically were much nicer.

    Just my $0.02

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    @ trelgne - cool you got the pics up - a little bit easier to see than mine. But you're right...pretty much exactly the same routing (not like there's another way to do it )

    @ mtnbiker72 - was your FMJ's damaged? I mean why did you swap it out?
    what I'm gettin at is SpartaSpartan (OP) shouldn't go with full length housing if he's already got the FMJ's. No?
    Why shell out even more dough.
    I honestly cannot say if the FMJ performs better as I have nothing to base that on. I thought they would be better (could be wrong) but it was only $30 on an already ~$1000 ticket ,so... yeah.
    I will say that I do like the looks better - especially since I colored mine red (matches my other bits) and it looks tech.

    SpartaSpartan - they are more complicated obviously than full length, but I would only switch to full housing if:
    - you can get your $$ back for FMJ
    - you get a housing like mtnbiker72 said - Flak Jackets or something non-compressing.
    - someone else can confirm that they(FMJ) offer no benefits above Flak Jackets or similar
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  8. #8
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    I never said to go full length housing in my post. I said I used Flak Jacket. I used the standard cable stops because Flak Jacket uses a liner that seals the cable.

    The Full Metal Jacket is only good for strait tubing. This means you can only use short sections because you need housing to bend in many places. Imagine hydro housing if it couldn't be bent around the curves of a bike...it would be useless. The FMJ is the same way, your only using small sections connected by other pieces of housing...it looks cobbled and junky.

    I replaced it mainly because its ugly and IMO provides no advantage over quality housing like Flak Jacket. So my advice is to take the FMJ back and get a quality set of cables and housing such as Flak Jacket.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker72
    I never said to go full length housing in my post...
    oops, I apologize. sorry man
    My rig doesn't have cable stops for brakes, so that's where I Inferred (and wrongly so)
    as for 'cobbled and junkie', that's your opinion and I respect that. But telling someone to do something different just because how you think it should look or whatever is fukked. Like people tellin' me bar-ends are lame b/c they think it's not fashionable. psssh
    So, as far as I can tell, the FMJ would go where it was a straight run anyways If I did have cable stops. 6 in one...
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  10. #10
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    Whatever

    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    oops, I apologize. sorry man
    My rig doesn't have cable stops for brakes, so that's where I Inferred (and wrongly so)
    as for 'cobbled and junkie', that's your opinion and I respect that. But telling someone to do something different just because how you think it should look or whatever is fukked.
    Why is it fukked to express my opinion...isn't that YOUR opinion

    Kind of the tea kettle calling the pot black...don't you think

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker72
    ...
    Kind of the tea kettle calling the pot black...don't you think
    I don't think I've told anybody here to do something based on looks - other than the occasional good-natured ribbing. So, no, I don't think that the pot/tea kettle thing figures in here.
    speaking of pot or tea, maybe you should have some... you seem a little agitated.
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    I don't think I've told anybody here to do something based on looks - other than the occasional good-natured ribbing. So, no, I don't think that the pot/tea kettle thing figures in here.
    speaking of pot or tea, maybe you should have some... you seem a little agitated.
    So you missed the part where I said I felt it offered no advantages over Flak Jacket then

    Agitated...only at your reading comprehension

  13. #13
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    I ran Avid mechs for a long time, and always ended up with better results in looks and in brake feel/performance in the long run with full housing runs of a good quality housing with some nice stainless cables. Tried the FMJ thing a few times, but it never really worked as well. It didn't stay as sealed, made more nose, and was far more of a pain to set up.

    YMMV.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by scrublover
    I ran Avid mechs for a long time, and always ended up with better results in looks and in brake feel/performance in the long run with full housing runs of a good quality housing with some nice stainless cables. Tried the FMJ thing a few times, but it never really worked as well. It didn't stay as sealed, made more nose, and was far more of a pain to set up.

    YMMV.
    Do you use 5mm brake housing, or can one get by with 4.5mm universal housing?

  15. #15

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by trelgne
    It seems that people have very different experiences with the FMJ. ...
    hahaha...that's funny.
    the ONE guy who rated the FMJ the lowest on MTBR complained that, "Comes with shrink tubing and doesnt indicate you need a heat gun anywhere on the directions."
    wheew...i had a good actual LOL on that.
    whaaa ...shrink tubing??? how do I...ummm...why won't these tubes shrink?...hrrrumph... they're in place.....what the?....psssch ....with the force I command you to shrink!....shrink!!...SHRIIINK!!!... damn man, what the hell?... that's it - these FMJ's are bogus!
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  17. #17
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    Thanks for the tips and insights. I was fiddling around with the FMJ rods last night and I'm not sure they're going to work on the top tube because they don't fit in the cable guides, and the top tube is long so I'd need to use a few shorter pieces for the full run.

    I'll play around with it some more, but might just have to call it a learning experience and pop for some good cables and housings.

  18. #18
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    I use a high quality teflon coated cable and housing such as Dia-Compe BRS or Delta Aztec. The FMJ has very little advantage over full housing with these cables because they have almost no friction in the straight sections. The FMJ has the disadvantages of being more expensive, much harder to install, and more likely to fail over time.

  19. #19
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    And even less friction with no housing at all in a straight section! I still prefer a full housing run, though. FWIW I had no idea what the FMJs actually were when I ordered them, had no idea the name was literal, just thought it was some hokey military sounding name so many companies are fond of, thought I was getting Flak Jackets when ordering...
    "...the people get the government they deserve..."
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  20. #20
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    Someone should make a test procedure. Same bike, same cable routing. One with the FMJ, then with a good compressionless housing, and one with cheap and interrupted housing. And then note the differences for friction and performance with a given finger force at the lever. After one year in use the same procedure again towards a long-term assessment.

    Where are the volunteers?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by trelgne
    Someone should make a test procedure. Same bike, same cable routing. One with the FMJ, then with a good compressionless housing, and one with cheap and interrupted housing. And then note the differences for friction and performance with a given finger force at the lever. After one year in use the same procedure again towards a long-term assessment.

    Where are the volunteers?
    I'll volunteer!!
    when can I expect to receive the bikes?
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  22. #22
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    I just bought a FMJ to install with some BB7s. When I purchased it I didnt realize that it was actual metal housing. Anyway, I took it to the shop to install and we didnt see any good way to use it so we (they) just ran the full housing that came with FMJ. There was enough housing to make full runs. The only good space I could have seen to run it was on the top tube but then it looked like it would rattle.

  23. #23
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    Some FMJ pics

    Just installed a Full Metal Jacket housing for my hardtail's rear-brake. To keep life simple, I just ran stainless-steel housing along the Top-Tube.

    Avid's instructions were OK, so installation was about as smooth and simple as assembling kit-furniture from the Ikea store! Here's some pics...







    And with any luck, I'll hopefully get around to installing FMJ for the front BB7 fairly soon.
    Brisbane, AU

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by hootsmon
    ...And with any luck, I'll hopefully get around to installing FMJ for the front BB7 fairly soon.
    Just remember to use 'gentle' curves.



















    But, seriously...Isn't "FMJ" all about the gentlest of curves?
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  25. #25
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    Hee hee! I just like curves I suppose Maybe I should have said 'avoid sharp bends' instead?

    You're absolutely right of course! FMJ only works dead straight cable-runs, which limits its applications quite a bit. For example, I did consider running FMJ down the Paragonad's seatstay, but after allowing for bends there was barely 160mm of straight cable-run. So I just kept it simple, by running Flak Jacket there instead.

    Sure my new FMJ/FlakJacket housing is light, looks nice, and has much better brake feel than the worn housing it replaces. But to be honest, I can't be sure if FMJ's really all that dramatically better than (say) a good-quality Alligator compressionless housing? Whatever the case, I'll press on and install some more FMJ on the front BB7 soon.
    Brisbane, AU

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