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  1. #1
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    Brake Weights???

    [SIZE=2]I may be seriously confused, but looking through sites to make an upgrade to my Shimano XT '04 disc brakes, I have noticed that there are not many lighter options out there?? Could this be correct?
    The XT's weigh 312gr (w/rotor), each.
    All other systems I found are in fact heavier:
    Avid Juicy 7's weigh 414gr. each;
    Avid Mechanical Ball Bearing 5's weigh 367gr. each;
    Hayes HFX Mag Plus weigh 368gr.;
    Magura Marta SL weigh 324gr.;
    Hope Mono Mini weigh 375gr.

    SO WHAT"S UP WITH THESE WEIGHTS? The only other system I'm not sure about is the XTR disc... What substantial advantages do the other systems give that would explain the weight increase?
    [/SIZE]

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by moose8500
    [SIZE=2]I may be seriously confused, but looking through sites to make an upgrade to my Shimano XT '04 disc brakes, I have noticed that there are not many lighter options out there?? Could this be correct?
    The XT's weigh 312gr (w/rotor), each.
    All other systems I found are in fact heavier:
    Avid Juicy 7's weigh 414gr. each;
    Avid Mechanical Ball Bearing 5's weigh 367gr. each;
    Hayes HFX Mag Plus weigh 368gr.;
    Magura Marta SL weigh 324gr.;
    Hope Mono Mini weigh 375gr.

    SO WHAT"S UP WITH THESE WEIGHTS? The only other system I'm not sure about is the XTR disc... What substantial advantages do the other systems give that would explain the weight increase?
    [/SIZE]
    Here are some weights (listed from lowest to highest) from my sets (all weighed by me on a digital scale and includes all hardware, full length lines, fully bled, rotors, etc....no BS!)

    Formula B4 SL = 631g/set
    Formula B4 SL+ = 697g/set
    Magura Marta SL = 706g/set
    Hope Mono Mini = 775g/set
    Shimano XTR/XT = 822g/set
    Hope Mini = 825g/set
    Ride Hard,
    Mike B. (MCM# 7.77)
    http://www.one-speed.com

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1speed_Mike
    Here are some weights (listed from lowest to highest) from my sets (all weighed by me on a digital scale and includes all hardware, full length lines, fully bled, rotors, etc....no BS!)

    Formula B4 SL = 631g/set
    Formula B4 SL+ = 697g/set
    Magura Marta SL = 706g/set
    Hope Mono Mini = 775g/set
    Shimano XTR/XT = 822g/set
    Hope Mini = 825g/set

    so the shimano stated weight of 312 each (624 total) is wrong?
    anywayz, which brakes do you recommend the most, not only for weight but for reliability and performance...

    also, do the formula people have a website????

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1speed_Mike
    Here are some weights (listed from lowest to highest) from my sets (all weighed by me on a digital scale and includes all hardware, full length lines, fully bled, rotors, etc....no BS!)

    Formula B4 SL = 631g/set
    Formula B4 SL+ = 697g/set
    Magura Marta SL = 706g/set
    Hope Mono Mini = 775g/set
    Shimano XTR/XT = 822g/set
    Hope Mini = 825g/set
    How would you rank those brakes in terms of overall performance?

  5. #5
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    XT/XTR 822g ?

    Levers :255 a Pair
    IS Caliper mount: 98g (front), 100g (rear)
    Rotor: 139g each
    That makes 731g , excluding houses.
    I dont know how much housing weights bur cant be 100 g ?
    or ar the weights specified on Jenson wrong ?
    thanks

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by moose8500
    so the shimano stated weight of 312 each (624 total) is wrong?
    anywayz, which brakes do you recommend the most, not only for weight but for reliability and performance...

    also, do the formula people have a website????
    Yes, I'm guessing the Shimano claimed weight of 312g/brake is wrong.

    Of all those brakes listed (which I've personally raced on), my current fav is the Marta SL closely followed by the B4 SL (and B4 SL+). I've been using the Martas for ~4 months and they are incredible! Excellent power and modulation, quiet, reliable, light, etc. Plus, I just love the aesthetics of them...carbon lever, wavy rotors...really nice.

    The Formula B4 SLs (and SL+s) are a very, very nice brake, too. In fact, they've got the upper-hand on the Marta SL in terms of modulation, but are slightly less powerful.

    I've had issues with the Shimano XTR/XTs....sticky pistons. Too bad, really nice brakes.

    The Minis and Mono Minis are both nice breaks, the Monos being the nicer of the two due to the new single-piece mono caliper. Plus, they are beautifully CNC'd. But, they just don't have the same *feel* as the Magura Marta SL and Formula B4 SL. It's hard to put my finger-on, but I just find the Hopes dead compared to the Martas and B4s. Plus, they squealed like pigs...wet or dry, it didn't matter.
    Ride Hard,
    Mike B. (MCM# 7.77)
    http://www.one-speed.com

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DH_WP
    Levers :255 a Pair
    IS Caliper mount: 98g (front), 100g (rear)
    Rotor: 139g each
    That makes 731g , excluding houses.
    I dont know how much housing weights bur cant be 100 g ?
    or ar the weights specified on Jenson wrong ?
    thanks
    Here's the break-down from my set:

    - Front and rear XT levers (BL-M756) = 248g
    - XT 160mm rotor with bolts = 140g
    - Front XTR caliper with bolts and pads = 103g
    - Rear XTR caliper with bolts and pads = 105g
    - Front line (900mm) with bolts, olive, uncut, no fluid = 32g
    - Rear line (1700mm) with bolts, olive, uncut, no fluid = 45g
    Total = 813g/set (no fluid)

    Now, with the lines cut and the system fully bled, the weights are:

    - Front lever, line, fluid, caliper, bolts = 263g
    - Front rotor with bolts = 140g
    Total = 403g

    - Rear lever, line, fluid, caliper, bolts = 279g
    - Rear rotor with bolts = 140g
    Total = 419g

    Total = 822g
    Ride Hard,
    Mike B. (MCM# 7.77)
    http://www.one-speed.com

  8. #8
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    Ok thanks , If it not..

    For the Stiky syndrome , how would you rate the XTR brakes and XT levers ? as they are selling 5.5's with XTR brakes.
    Spoke to my LBS and they said they have found away to elimitate the SS.
    Worth considering , if should I just cut the risk and go str8 to the Marta'sl

    One last question , can you run a larger than 160mm rotor on the XTR ?
    thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by 1speed_Mike
    Here's the break-down from my set:

    - Front and rear XT levers (BL-M756) = 248g
    - XT 160mm rotor with bolts = 140g
    - Front XTR caliper with bolts and pads = 103g
    - Rear XTR caliper with bolts and pads = 105g
    - Front line (900mm) with bolts, olive, uncut, no fluid = 32g
    - Rear line (1700mm) with bolts, olive, uncut, no fluid = 45g
    Total = 813g/set (no fluid)

    Now, with the lines cut and the system fully bled, the weights are:

    - Front lever, line, fluid, caliper, bolts = 263g
    - Front rotor with bolts = 140g
    Total = 403g

    - Rear lever, line, fluid, caliper, bolts = 279g
    - Rear rotor with bolts = 140g
    Total = 419g

    Total = 822g

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by DH_WP
    For the Stiky syndrome , how would you rate the XTR brakes and XT levers ? as they are selling 5.5's with XTR brakes.
    Spoke to my LBS and they said they have found away to elimitate the SS.
    Worth considering , if should I just cut the risk and go str8 to the Marta'sl

    One last question , can you run a larger than 160mm rotor on the XTR ?
    thanks
    If not for the SPS (sticky piston syndrome), the XTR/XTs would rank pretty high, but would still be seated after the Magura Marta SLs and Formula B4 SLs. Don't get me wrong, the XTR/XTs are really nice (excellent power and modulation), but the Martas and Formulas are just a tad better. When you add in the SPS, it's a no-brainer (for me, anyway).

    Ya, I'd like to hear what your LBS does to eliminate the SPS. I've tried everything. I called and spoke with Shimano USA and Shimano Canada and tried all of their suggestions...nothing worked. Ultimately, I sent the brakes back for warranty. The replacements are better, but are showing signs of SPS.

    At the TransRockies, I spoke with a knowledgeable shop mech who knew all about the SPS. He indicated that Shimano addressed the issue with slight mods to their caliper design...in particular, in the fluid chamber that connects the right/left caliper halves. He indicated that on the first generation caliper, the hole was made too small and didn't allow the fluid to move freely enough between the two halves. The second design saw an increased hole diameter. You can visibily see this in the new caliper where the bridge area is much wider.
    Ride Hard,
    Mike B. (MCM# 7.77)
    http://www.one-speed.com

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