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  1. #1
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    Avid Minus the CPS system?

    I've been fighting the dreaded turkey warble for a couple of years on my Juicy 5's. I'm really wanting other brakes but it's hard to justify with our budget right now. I really think that part of the problem is the CPS system making the system less rigid. So today I removed the top pair of CPS washers and replaced them with a normal flat washer and tightened them down. I left the lower pair to keep the spacing correct but the flat washer kept the caliper from rotating and it also had the bolt head almost directly on the caliper with an effectively shorter bolt. It seemed to help a good bit on today's ride with less warble and resonance., I'll see how it goes in the future. I also found it interesting that for the first time ever, I held the lever, tightened the bolt and they were perfectly centered. That never happened with the CPS washers. Has anyone else tried something similar. Will any other adapters allow direct mounting of the caliper without any washers?
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  2. #2
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    VaughnA, Perfect timing 'cos right at the moment I am doing the same thing but I have cut my own spacers from a sheet of aluinium that is exactly the same thickness as the bottom two silly washers. When they are done I paint them black.

    I done the rear a week ago( I only done the one incase it didn't work ) and it works a lot better than with the wobbly washer system and as you have found a lot easier to setup.

    I have never had the turkey thing and don't know how that sounds but mine squeel so loud in the wet that I just don't want to ride. The rear is a lot quieter now so I hope I have the same result with the front.

    I should have the front finished in an hour(ish)

    EDIT: Forgot to add that I glue the spacers to the bracket with strong epoxy before painting it that way it is "as one"

    Have some pics.....
    Last edited by yetibetty; 03-23-2009 at 10:24 AM.

  3. #3
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    All done, I'll let you know if it works after a ride.
    Last edited by yetibetty; 03-23-2009 at 10:23 AM.

  4. #4
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    We are thinking on the same plane. I'm interested in seeing how well that works. I was considering doing the same thing if this plan worked. But it may all be for naught. My wife has approved money for new brakes so I'm considering the idea as well. If the juicies still work I may stick with them but at least now I have the option.

    Now if I go with new ones I need to decide what I want on my 575. Magura, Hope or Formula? Weight or power, and don't forget the bling factor. And no, I can't afford the ones.
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  5. #5
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    Well that was a waste of a few hours........... still squeal like crazy in the rain, and I live in the UK so rain is a bit hard to avoid.

    Can't really afford new brakes right now but after 2 years of trying to shut these things up I have had enough.

    VaughnA, let us know what brakes you get and how they turn out.

    I have owned Magura in the past and never had any trouble if that helps.

  6. #6
    Meh.
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    If it's only squealing in the rain, try a different pad compound.

  7. #7
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    yetibetty - you using organic pads ? In the wet they squeel like a biatch.

    Try sintered if so.

  8. #8
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    Yes they only make a mad crazy squeal in the wet but otherwise they are silent.
    I did use the original Avid gold coloured pads that came with the brakes for a while but they just made the rotor go blue and had no power whatsoever. I am currently using the medium compound version of these http://www.discobrakes.com/?s=0&t=0&c=2&p=85& could you recommend a good all year round pad that I could maybe try. Thanks.

  9. #9
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    In to see if anyone else has tried this. I attempted to do this a few days ago with random washers laying around in my toolbox, but the OD can only be so big before interfering with the rotors. I just might have to make some spacers as well. I tried several ways to align the calipers, including Avid's method, but once the bolts are nearly torqued, everything seems to move around. Jamming anything between the pads and rotor ends up deflecting the rotor instead of shifting the caliper, the rotors just flex too easily.

    edit: Has anyone ever compared Avid rotors to another brand's rotor? I'm wondering if they are more rigid and resist deflection a little better.

  10. #10
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    iaintdumb2
    It was woth doing after all, everything is a lot easier to set up and is a lot less flexy, you can even feel it at the lever.

    I can now push on the caliper with my hand and it feels solid where as before I could see it flex.

    There is now a lot less vibration through the frame but you must have straight frame tabs as you won't have the wobbly washers to compensate (if they ever did).

    I think you will only get good results with solid blocks though.

    Oh and Avid rotors are the thinest out of the three brake systems I own the others being Shimano and Magura, don't know about any others.

  11. #11
    ride hard take risks
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    This has been done and suggested if you read the Avid Turkey Whine post..
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by dogonfr
    This has been done and suggested if you read the Avid Turkey Whine post..
    I figured that it may have been but I was busy reading 'War and Peace' and didn't want to read two long novels at once.

    I've got a set of "The Ones" on the way. I've had enough of the avids. They are headed to eBay.
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  13. #13
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    VaughnA
    Good luck with the new brakes please give an update after you have used them for a while.

    I Can't wait for the day when I can jump up and down on my Avids and then set fire to them

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnA
    I figured that it may have been but I was busy reading 'War and Peace' and didn't want to read two long novels at once.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetibetty
    I Can't wait for the day when I can jump up and down on my Avids and then set fire to them
    I'm witcha on that one!

    Wanna buy a nice used set of juicies?
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetibetty
    VaughnA
    Good luck with the new brakes please give an update after you have used them for a while.

    I Can't wait for the day when I can jump up and down on my Avids and then set fire to them

    I received the brakes today. Awesome looking and easy to install. Centered up in 2 minutes and we're ready to go. I can hear and FEEL a difference even on the workstand. Then while installing I notice a big crack in my stem. So the test will have to wait until I can borrow or replace the stem faceplate.
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnA
    Then while installing I notice a big crack in my stem. So the test will have to wait until I can borrow or replace the stem faceplate.
    And how did the crack get there???
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dogonfr
    And how did the crack get there???
    Considering it is a Thomson I'm sure it will be fixed under warranty. I guess I'm a little rougher on my equipment than I thought. Maybe heavy duty brakes on my trailbike might be the right decision if I'm as rough on my brakes as I am on my stem.
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by VaughnA
    Considering it is a Thomson I'm sure it will be fixed under warranty. I guess I'm a little rougher on my equipment than I thought. Maybe heavy duty brakes on my trailbike might be the right decision if I'm as rough on my brakes as I am on my stem.
    Bar clamps dont crack from braking they crack from over tightening.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetibetty
    Yes they only make a mad crazy squeal in the wet but otherwise they are silent.
    I did use the original Avid gold coloured pads that came with the brakes for a while but they just made the rotor go blue and had no power whatsoever. I am currently using the medium compound version of these http://www.discobrakes.com/?s=0&t=0&c=2&p=85& could you recommend a good all year round pad that I could maybe try. Thanks.
    Wow. I guess brake pads are very subjective. The OEM metallic pads are a little too noisy for me, although they stop nicely. The OEM organic pads are nice and quiet, except when hot or wet. The stopping power is not as good as metallic, but I really like the silence.

    I tried some Disco pads because they were cheap. The first ride was mellow and they only seemed to make a little more noise than the OEM organics. The second ride I pushed them HARD. They faded so badly that squeezing as hard as I could on the lever would only provide minimal braking. I immediately yanked those pads and installed some used Avids.

    Now I have two pair of Disco pads with two rides on them, and two pair that are new and in the original packaging. I'll NEVER buy any of their products again. But If there's anyone who LOVES discos near La Habra in SoCal, I'll trade 'em for a box of Sierra Nevada.

    If you're looking for an "all around pad," I don't think you can go wrong with the Avid organics.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dogonfr
    Bar clamps dont crack from braking they crack from over tightening.
    I was trying to justify the ones on a trailbike

    The faceplate was tightened with a torque wrench to the correct torque. After a google search it seems I'm not the first to crack a thomson faceplate in the same place. I'm going to get it replaced if possible since I've already invested the bucks for a thomson. But I'm thinking I'll go with a forged stem next time.
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetibetty
    VaughnA
    Good luck with the new brakes please give an update after you have used them for a while.

    I Can't wait for the day when I can jump up and down on my Avids and then set fire to them
    Had my first ride on "The ones" today. Unbelievable difference. Silence as well as a smooth buttery feel in the levers as opposed to the metal-on-metal feel I had with the juicys. On the first steep downhill switchback I new I'd made the right decision. Where I had to brake-release-brake-release through with the Avids, I could just get smooth modulation from the ones. No more shuddery, grabby braking, and silence to boot. And true one finger braking on steep fast downhills. Worth the price, I got a great deal on a used set for 350, and they were basically like new.

    Get out the torch and burn the avids. Even if you have to get a second mortgage on the kids it would be worth it to me. Of course I don't have kids..
    What do I want to be when I grow up.....Dead!

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