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  1. #1
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    203mm front and rear. :)

    You guys that seem to love the smallest disks that can be fitted to a bike will love this one.

    I just upgraded my 185mm cleansweep G2 on the rear to a 203mm G2. 203mm all around FTW!

    I got bored so I test fitted my old 203mm roundagon on the rear without the caliper mounted. I rode the bike and emphasized side to side motion to flex the frame. No rubbing so I ordered the 203mm G2 for it.

    I noticed that after getting the bike out on the trail, I used the rear brake much more than the front. Never had any problems with overheating but I wanted to try the larger brake. I also went snowboarding recently at Big Bear and was informed that the lifts are used for mountain bikers once the snow is gone. Can't wait for this! Should be some fun DH action.

    So to the results, modulation is about the same, definately no worse than the 185mm, maybe a little better. It's not touchy at all, no problems with premature lockup. I'm also up to 230lbs without gear so I figure there's no such thing as too much brake.

    I think it's a safe assumption I'm one of the few running 203mm front and rear. Anyone else on here doing the same?
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  2. #2
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    I did for a long time. Many (most) DHers run 203mm front and rear.

  3. #3
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    you have 203mm rotors all around.. on a hardrock?

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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot
    you have 203mm rotors all around.. on a hardrock?
    Have you noticed all the confused bikes on mtbr lately, from people turning xc-am bikes into DH bikes using dual crowns, department store bikes being loaded with expensive parts, overforking, overbraking, you name it.

    I actually knew a guy that had like a Trek 4300 and put Juicy 203's on it, front and back. It looked ridiculous for the flatlands he was riding in, and on top of that, he had like a Dart fork, or something.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    Have you noticed all the confused bikes on mtbr lately, from people turning xc-am bikes into DH bikes using dual crowns, department store bikes being loaded with expensive parts, overforking, overbraking, you name it.

    I actually knew a guy that had like a Trek 4300 and put Juicy 203's on it, front and back. It looked ridiculous for the flatlands he was riding in, and on top of that, he had like a Dart fork, or something.
    yeah, ridiculous!

    imagine someone customizing a bike to have it the way they want it! it's like they don't bother conforming to the market segmentation of mountainbiking or something! the trek advertising department must up in arms over that one!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoot2boot
    yeah, ridiculous!

    imagine someone customizing a bike to have it the way they want it! it's like they don't bother conforming to the market segmentation of mountainbiking or something! the trek advertising department must up in arms over that one!
    The fork was a qr model that was clearly marked to not use 203 rotors on for safety reasons. You know, safety and design parameters. When people are freeriding and doing big mountain runs using 183's on big rigs, and someone is using a 4300, an entry level bike, weighing under 180 pounds, then someone is using their bike outside of the design parameters, or overbraking it. Since I knew the guy personally, I know he was overbraking it, a little stupid, and also thought he rode harder than he did. Oh yeah, he had a $200+ Ti seatpost on it. It was worth more than the bike.

  7. #7
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    So long as you can keep your hand pressure in check I find the bigger rotors a blessing. If you grab a handful at the wrong time there is more of a penalty though. To each their own...
    Quote Originally Posted by saturnine
    that's the stupidest idea this side of pinkbike.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    You guys that seem to love the smallest disks that can be fitted to a bike will love this one.

    I just upgraded my 185mm cleansweep G2 on the rear to a 203mm G2. 203mm all around FTW!

    I got bored so I test fitted my old 203mm roundagon on the rear without the caliper mounted. I rode the bike and emphasized side to side motion to flex the frame. No rubbing so I ordered the 203mm G2 for it.

    I noticed that after getting the bike out on the trail, I used the rear brake much more than the front. Never had any problems with overheating but I wanted to try the larger brake. I also went snowboarding recently at Big Bear and was informed that the lifts are used for mountain bikers once the snow is gone. Can't wait for this! Should be some fun DH action.

    So to the results, modulation is about the same, definately no worse than the 185mm, maybe a little better. It's not touchy at all, no problems with premature lockup. I'm also up to 230lbs without gear so I figure there's no such thing as too much brake.

    I think it's a safe assumption I'm one of the few running 203mm front and rear. Anyone else on here doing the same?
    Yeah, but on my "big" bike, an old Kona Coiler. It uses a 20mm thru axle and the fork is rated for an 8" rotor. My other bike, a 29'er rigid, uses a 185 mm front rotor.
    I don't know if I'd want to run an 8" front rotor on a QR fork.... The bigger rotor is more likely to rip the wheel out of the dropouts, potentially destroying the fork, the brakes, the wheel, and your face.
    Do yourself a favor, If you decide try downhilling at your local resort, and your primary ride is a hardrock, get a rental for the day. It's not that expensive, and you'll have a much better time.

  9. #9
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    I know a guy who runs 559mm rotors front and rear.

    he's damn good lookin too
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrampBredo
    Yeah, but on my "big" bike, an old Kona Coiler. It uses a 20mm thru axle and the fork is rated for an 8" rotor. My other bike, a 29'er rigid, uses a 185 mm front rotor.
    I don't know if I'd want to run an 8" front rotor on a QR fork.... The bigger rotor is more likely to rip the wheel out of the dropouts, potentially destroying the fork, the brakes, the wheel, and your face.
    Do yourself a favor, If you decide try downhilling at your local resort, and your primary ride is a hardrock, get a rental for the day. It's not that expensive, and you'll have a much better time.
    It's got a Rockshox Revelation fork rated for 203mm so no problems there.

    I'm running the Hardrock on the downhill. It's not a race, just going to have some fun and get out of town. Besides, the frame is literally the only stock piece on the bike. It's my first try at mountain biking and the modding process has been fun.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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    '14 Trance SX -

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    Have you noticed all the confused bikes on mtbr lately, from people turning xc-am bikes into DH bikes using dual crowns, department store bikes being loaded with expensive parts, overforking, overbraking, you name it.

    I actually knew a guy that had like a Trek 4300 and put Juicy 203's on it, front and back. It looked ridiculous for the flatlands he was riding in, and on top of that, he had like a Dart fork, or something.
    You're an elitest idiot on so many levels. Now would be a good time to off yourself.

    I have 13" 4 piston brakes on my '06 TL. I have a 602rwhp street car. I don't use the brakes to their potential often and I rarely ever put my foot down in the 600hp car but it's there when I need/want it. If this is too hard of a concept to understand, I feel sorry for you.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
    '09 Epic Comp
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot
    you have 203mm rotors all around.. on a hardrock?
    Yep. And the fork alone is worth more than the whole bike, so are the shifters/deraileurs, lights, and the rims/crank/cassette/carbon handlebar/ti seatpost/clipless pedals/WTB Laser seat are at least half the cost of the bike each. I don't see what the big deal is. I like to mod things. I'll end up buying a nice FS bike this summer but this was my first experience in mountain biking and it's been a fun 2 years trying new stuff out. Now I have a good idea of what I want when looking at a new bike.

    I've taken up weightligting again and I'm up to 230lbs without gear. After getting a lot of seat time I've realized I use the rear brake much more than the front. Obviously there was plenty of power with the 185mm but the 203 requires just a little less finger effort and the modulation actually seems better. Fade was never an issue but I saw 650F brake temps. Not too high but that's without any serious DH.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  13. #13
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    Seeing as the cheapest HR is 390 bucks, if you're paying half of that for a WTB Laser (even the SLT model), you're getting ripped off.

    But since you've got an HRXC... that goes for what? Just shy of 500?

    250 bucks for a pair of rims (or pedals or bar or cassette) is being marked up something nasty...

    Dean and USE seatposts are under 200. Moots posts are more expensive... but are actually heavier than Thomson Elite posts of the same diameter and length. In fact, most Ti seatposts won't be significantly lighter or stronger than Thomson Elite posts.

    x0 and XTR derailleurs sell for around 150 bucks. Shifters are about the same. m970 cassettes are also about the same.

    Post a spec list and pics.

  14. #14
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    Do whatever you want its your bike. but what I really what to know is:

    1. How much boost you running on that GN
    2. Single or Twin Turbo
    3. 3.8?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdgang
    Do whatever you want its your bike. but what I really what to know is:

    1. How much boost you running on that GN
    2. Single or Twin Turbo
    3. 3.8?
    LOL. I like this subject better.

    1. 28psi, 27 degrees of timing for the dyno run. 19psi on the street because any more will just blow the tires away at any legal speed.
    2. Single Garrett GT 6776 DBB turbo.
    3. .035 over 4.1 block (4" bore) for 256" or just a hair over 4.2L.

    The build is pretty boring. Small 212-212 flat tappet cam. JE 8.5:1 pistons. Home ported Champion heads, home ported intake manifold, 60lb injectors with a large shot of methanol up top at full boost. Sounds and drives like a stocker.

    Stock 3.42 gears, Eaton posi, tons of suspension work, and most of the money is in the 200-4R and convertor to make it live.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by XSL_WiLL
    Seeing as the cheapest HR is 390 bucks, if you're paying half of that for a WTB Laser (even the SLT model), you're getting ripped off.

    But since you've got an HRXC... that goes for what? Just shy of 500?

    250 bucks for a pair of rims (or pedals or bar or cassette) is being marked up something nasty...

    Dean and USE seatposts are under 200. Moots posts are more expensive... but are actually heavier than Thomson Elite posts of the same diameter and length. In fact, most Ti seatposts won't be significantly lighter or stronger than Thomson Elite posts.

    x0 and XTR derailleurs sell for around 150 bucks. Shifters are about the same. m970 cassettes are also about the same.

    Post a spec list and pics.
    What exactly are you getting at? Lots of rambling and opinions about prices I didn't ask for. Why do you need a bike spec sheet in a thread about rear brake size? I think this is about the time where you mis-quote me and I have to go back and defend myself and remind you of what I actually said. Since it's so important to you, my mod list and pictures are buried somewhere in this thread. I think the only thing missing at the last entry was the Ti seatpost. Your Entry Level MTB (Pics and Upgrades)

    So I know where this is going, people have a bad habit around here of trying to belittle others. I said those other mods cost ABOUT half of what the bike cost. I also said the shifters AND deraileurs cost about half of the bike so don't bother going there. And one more time, this is a thread about brakes, I don't give a **** about anyone's opinion of how I spend my money.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  17. #17
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    Actually you said...

    are at least half the cost of the bike each
    And you never said shifters AND derailleurs, you said shifters/derailleurs, so if we're to follow that / = and, then rims/crank/cassette/carbon handlebar/ti seatpost/clipless pedals/WTB Laser seat, means that all of that adds up to half.

    And the way it's phrased, the implication is that the shifter/derailleur cost more than the bike.
    And the fork alone is worth more than the whole bike, so are the shifters/deraileurs
    But I suppose it can be read as
    the shifters/deraileurs, lights, and the rims/crank/cassette/carbon handlebar/ti seatpost/clipless pedals/WTB Laser seat are at least half the cost of the bike each.
    No misquoting... taken directly from your post. Just as I did not misquote last time either.
    Last edited by XSL_WiLL; 03-30-2010 at 10:09 PM.

  18. #18
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    Firex cranks are under 100 bucks, that's nowhere even close to "about half."

    Deore shifters sell for about 30 bucks. XT derailleurs maybe around 80 or 90. That is not about half either.

    Your Shimano pedals aren't that expensive either.

    Crossride WHEELS are about half, the rims are not.

    You're the one trying to make it seem like you've got the fancy bike.

    No belittling, just calling BS on your claims.

  19. #19
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    Did we see a vid of this thing in action at some point a while back?
    Oldest daughter doesn't ride.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrampBredo
    Yeah, but on my "big" bike, an old Kona Coiler. It uses a 20mm thru axle and the fork is rated for an 8" rotor. My other bike, a 29'er rigid, uses a 185 mm front rotor.
    I don't know if I'd want to run an 8" front rotor on a QR fork.... The bigger rotor is more likely to rip the wheel out of the dropouts, potentially destroying the fork, the brakes, the wheel, and your face.
    Do yourself a favor, If you decide try downhilling at your local resort, and your primary ride is a hardrock, get a rental for the day. It's not that expensive, and you'll have a much better time.
    Great advice for sure. You can snap the dropouts or tug the qr clean out with that much force. I used to run a qr Fox RLC100 with an oversized rotor and a friend suggested I call Fox to check. I did and they cautioned heavily that there would be an eventual mishap, injury, frustration that they would take no part in. I changed the fork to a Marz SL2 with a 20mm TA and have zero worries running 8" front/6" back. As for the rider customizing his bike with top end parts and 'bike jewellery', etc., if he likes it, who cares. We've all done this to an extent at some point I'm sure. That's what the sport is all about! Find out what and why you like to ride and keep at it. That said, heavy DH runs on an XC bike with short travel qr forks will prove be a harrowing combination of frustration and danger I would imagine.

    A.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    You're an elitest idiot on so many levels. Now would be a good time to off yourself.

    I have 13" 4 piston brakes on my '06 TL. I have a 602rwhp street car. I don't use the brakes to their potential often and I rarely ever put my foot down in the 600hp car but it's there when I need/want it. If this is too hard of a concept to understand, I feel sorry for you.
    What kind of DH do you do?

    I feel sorry for you because you seem to think that everything from the automotive world applies directly to the mountain biking world. But that's cool. Meatheads still rule. Especially the ones with anger issues.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    I used the rear brake much more than the front. Never had any problems with overheating
    so you're incorrectly braking, not overheating them anyway.. so you installed brakes so big they're not approved for your bike?

    this is just dumb. you're risking breaking you bike, for absolutely nothing. its not a style thing, or a subjective thing, you're putting parts that arent supposed to be used on your bike.

    the front brake gets your bike stopped. ive ran a 203 up front too, but i HAVE smoked the hell out of 160's. im back on 185's now and they've been pushed too hard on occasion.. and theres still a 160 in the back.

  23. #23
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    Your Entry Level MTB (Pics and Upgrades)

    There are some pics of the bike. Just another typical mtbr confused bike. What I've noticed is there seems to be a hierarchy amongst the beginners. Some are quite cool and look to take in as much info as possible, but then there are others that think if they register on an internet forum for mountain bikers, they are mountain bikers. They spend a short time hanging around, then they start giving (bad) advice to other noobs, and the newer n00bs don't know any better than to listen, then they turn around and do the same thing ashort time later. Some get aggressive and start dishing it out to people with more experience then them. It's quite interesting. They don't know how clueless they are, and lend themselves to our entertainment.

  24. #24
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    I'm running Hayes Stroker Ace's with 203mm front & rear on my Cannondale Rize 4. Along with Mavic 819disc wheels. I've already gotten a few funny looks & WTF's from some other bikers but I don't give a rats ass what they think Normally I'm the guy flying past most people on trail on a set up weighing much more, costing half as much, & having just as much if not more fun. Why do so many people think their has to be a certain way to ride a bike? Just like all the crazy clothing? May sound a bit crazy but a pair of board shorts a T shirt & a pair of shoes do it for me. I get **** for that all the time to, but I'm out to enjoy myself not impress anyone else or live to their standard of how they think I should ride.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by XSL_WiLL
    Firex cranks are under 100 bucks, that's nowhere even close to "about half."

    Deore shifters sell for about 30 bucks. XT derailleurs maybe around 80 or 90. That is not about half either.

    Your Shimano pedals aren't that expensive either.

    Crossride WHEELS are about half, the rims are not.

    You're the one trying to make it seem like you've got the fancy bike.

    No belittling, just calling BS on your claims.
    LOL. Whatever makes you feel good about yourself. This is comedy.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
    '09 Epic Comp
    '14 Trance SX -

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    What kind of DH do you do?

    I feel sorry for you because you seem to think that everything from the automotive world applies directly to the mountain biking world. But that's cool. Meatheads still rule. Especially the ones with anger issues.
    Aww, you're so sweet. You little guys are amusing.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot
    so you're incorrectly braking, not overheating them anyway.. so you installed brakes so big they're not approved for your bike?

    this is just dumb. you're risking breaking you bike, for absolutely nothing. its not a style thing, or a subjective thing, you're putting parts that arent supposed to be used on your bike.

    the front brake gets your bike stopped. ive ran a 203 up front too, but i HAVE smoked the hell out of 160's. im back on 185's now and they've been pushed too hard on occasion.. and theres still a 160 in the back.
    Nothing is going to break.

    No such thing as having too much brake.

    Overkill is good.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeST765
    I'm running Hayes Stroker Ace's with 203mm front & rear on my Cannondale Rize 4. Along with Mavic 819disc wheels. I've already gotten a few funny looks & WTF's from some other bikers but I don't give a rats ass what they think Normally I'm the guy flying past most people on trail on a set up weighing much more, costing half as much, & having just as much if not more fun. Why do so many people think their has to be a certain way to ride a bike? Just like all the crazy clothing? May sound a bit crazy but a pair of board shorts a T shirt & a pair of shoes do it for me. I get **** for that all the time to, but I'm out to enjoy myself not impress anyone else or live to their standard of how they think I should ride.
    Yup. Just out there having a good time.

    I love modifying things and this has been a blast so far. Now I'm trying to get better at riding to determine if I should step up to a more expensive bike but this one is so much fun already.

    I don't let these guys bother me. There are many out there who have nothing better to do than try and make themselves feel better by putting others down. I have a life outside of this board and outside of mountain biking so the comments are pretty funny most of the time.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    Your Entry Level MTB (Pics and Upgrades)

    There are some pics of the bike. Just another typical mtbr confused bike. What I've noticed is there seems to be a hierarchy amongst the beginners. Some are quite cool and look to take in as much info as possible, but then there are others that think if they register on an internet forum for mountain bikers, they are mountain bikers. They spend a short time hanging around, then they start giving (bad) advice to other noobs, and the newer n00bs don't know any better than to listen, then they turn around and do the same thing ashort time later. Some get aggressive and start dishing it out to people with more experience then them. It's quite interesting. They don't know how clueless they are, and lend themselves to our entertainment.
    I am the greatest! You could learn a thing or two from me newb.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  30. #30
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    Teach us a few things you know about bikes.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    Teach us a few things you know about bikes.
    There's just so much I don't know where to start!
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    There's just so much I don't know where to start!
    how about fork bridges?
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    how about fork bridges?
    Way too easy.
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  34. #34
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    Then what are they?
    This is silly.

  35. #35
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    well i dont know anything about head clearence and turbos and all that but i do know a little about physics. you are right about never having too much brake. however YOU have-ing too much brake and your BRIDGE being too plastic are entirely different. i do hope you enjoy your ride as that is the ultimate point of cycling. please dont forget that sometimes an upgrade is not always adding parts you can see but also strenghtening areas that matter to the laws of physics not just your cool factor. lastly... please wear your helmet if your going to do any down hill. take care and enjoy the ride bro.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by mhmacw
    ... YOU have-ing too much brake and your BRIDGE being too plastic are entirely different.
    AMEN brotha!
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    I know a guy who runs 559mm rotors front and rear.

    he's damn good lookin too
    So which bike is it you are running rim brakes on highdell?
    Look, whatever happens, don't fight the mountain.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by savagemann
    So which bike is it you are running rim brakes on highdell?
    hehe - finally someone got it
    my '87 'Hopper (SSer) and the DB DJ (response)
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  39. #39
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    Word!!!!
    Look, whatever happens, don't fight the mountain.

  40. #40
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    All joking aside, I'm really liking the 203mm rear with some seat time. Modulation is better hands down. Same caliper, type of pad, and rotor. Maybe it's my 230lbs, I don't know but I wish I would've gone with the larger rotor a long time ago. It just feels better.

    Now hurry up and take this post out of context and tell me how dumb I am and how I think I have the baddest most expensive bike ever.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
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  41. #41
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    Considering I'm new here, I have a feeling I'm gonna get flamed for what I'm going to say. However, like someone mentioned above, cycling is about having fun and enjoying what you're doing. BuickGN, dude I have the exact same idea as you, I've yet to buy a Hardrock, but once I do I plan to learn all about the parts and work on upgrades. Just like you I've decided to make it my project bike and yes definitely install 203's on them, as soon as the money comes in ...oh well the experience will help me learn more stuff before I buy a bike in the thousands $

  42. #42
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    I've been riding 203's for 6years I guess without a issue, I had the front brake fail on a ride recently ( Girls pad failed so gave her mine as I can handle being a brake down better than her, not my brakes fault ) and even with 203's on the rear had it seriously over heating ( I was riding flat out down stuff LOL ) anything smaller would of let me down for sure.

    The weight saving going smaller is minimal and brakes are to me, not a place to save weight, actually I can't find anywhere on my bike to save weight strength all the way for me.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCdriver8
    Considering I'm new here, I have a feeling I'm gonna get flamed for what I'm going to say. However, like someone mentioned above, cycling is about having fun and enjoying what you're doing. BuickGN, dude I have the exact same idea as you, I've yet to buy a Hardrock, but once I do I plan to learn all about the parts and work on upgrades. Just like you I've decided to make it my project bike and yes definitely install 203's on them, as soon as the money comes in ...oh well the experience will help me learn more stuff before I buy a bike in the thousands $
    I agree. I bought a bunch of components. Some were a mistake, some were very good. Now I feel better about dropping a couple thousand for a bike. It's been very fun, so much that I'm in no hurry to buy a new bike. The other reason I started out small is I hadn't been on a bike in over 10 years 2 years ago. I figured if I didn't like it, I would still have a decent exercise bike but I wouldn't have a $3,000 bike sitting around unused.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
    '09 Epic Comp
    '14 Trance SX -

  44. #44
    ~Disc~Golf~
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    All joking aside,...
    I don't think some of us were joking in reference to the 203mm on a 'weaker' fork
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  45. #45
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    I used 203's on a fork rated for 160's for awhile and nothing failed!!

    Worst case a fail causes a crash and well I crash frequently anyway so no big deal on the reason why.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turveyd
    I used 203's on a fork rated for 160's for awhile and nothing failed!!

    Worst case a fail causes a crash and well I crash frequently anyway so no big deal on the reason why.

    So it must work for everyone! Lets put a 203 on a 28mm stantioned fork guys! Then take it to whistler! lulz at the bigger must be better even if it breaks my frame attitude make sure to post pictures of the QR drop outs post failure. The laws of physics are not to be ignored.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turveyd
    I used 203's on a fork rated for 160's for awhile and nothing failed!!

    Worst case a fail causes a crash and well I crash frequently anyway so no big deal on the reason why.
    Just because it didn't fail for you doesn't mean it won't for someone else.

    Hey, I drive a Toyota, and i've never gotten the accelerator stuck, so all those other people must be faking it.

    If it does fail, then you've just destroyed some expensive bike parts and taken an unnecessary fall.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    I don't think some of us were joking in reference to the 203mm on a 'weaker' fork
    My Revelation is rated for a 203. I don't understand what the deal is.

    I ran the 203 on the stock fork with no issues too.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
    '09 Epic Comp
    '14 Trance SX -

  49. #49
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    To some other posters in this thread, it would be more comfortable if you removed that stick from your ass.
    '08 Hardrock HRXC
    '09 Epic Comp
    '14 Trance SX -

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuickGN
    To some other posters in this thread, it would be more comfortable if you removed that stick from your ass.
    You'll probably be removing one from yours when the great brake experiment fails you.

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