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  1. #151
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    Alright, I finally got the bike (19") and put it all together. It wasn't too difficult of a task, though I was really confused about putting the front disc brake on, until I figured out that you don't need the adapter plate that is already on it. The thing that sucks is my disc brake is oh so slightly bent, so I couldn't adjust the brakes the traditional way and it took me a little longer because of it. I'm not sure how big of an effect it will have on brake wear or if I should even be concerned about it. Also, my tire seems to be a little out of balance. When it spins freely (while the bike is on its back), you can see a little wobble, though I don't think that is that uncommon.

    Now all I need to do is get to the bike shop to grab a pump, and I'm sure a bunch of other things I don't necessarily need, and I'll be hittin' the trails.

    Any other adjustments I should make? I'll have to find Sheldon Browns website to figure out how to adjust the derailleurs, but that will be for later.

    Any things I should buy?

  2. #152
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    I need to call Forge, but thought I would ask here, as it's probably come up before.

    Why does Forge not sell directly?

    Why are these not sold in Target stores?

    Why does Target charge a sales tax? I admit, taxes just piss me off, and one of the nice things about ordering on-line for me is no taxes.

    I really like the price of $319, but add in the $30 for shipping and $30 for taxes, and I'm just getting peeved.

    Yes, I'm pretty thrifty. S'why I like the Forge Sawback so much. Seems like a fantastic bike at an incredible price, but the tax thing again, it just gets to me.

  3. #153
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    Use the 10% coupon code and that pretty much takes care of the shipping (or taxes, however you want to look at it) for you.

  4. #154
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    That 10% code does not work anymore. Site says it's expired. I searched all through google, and plugged in probably 20-25 codes, and none worked.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by thaar
    Also, my tire seems to be a little out of balance. When it spins freely (while the bike is on its back), you can see a little wobble, though I don't think that is that uncommon.
    Yeah! both tires do that on mine too! I was concerned and very angry for a bit.

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    That 10% code does not work anymore. Site says it's expired. I searched all through google, and plugged in probably 20-25 codes, and none worked.
    Hmm, I pulled it from slickdeals.net. Perhaps Target stopped allowing it.

    Edit: I just checked and others are having the same problem as well. Try using this with a Visa or Target card: TGTSTM47

    Here's the link I found it from: http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthr...ghlight=target

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    I need to call Forge, but thought I would ask here, as it's probably come up before.

    Why does Forge not sell directly?

    Why are these not sold in Target stores?

    Why does Target charge a sales tax? I admit, taxes just piss me off, and one of the nice things about ordering on-line for me is no taxes.

    I really like the price of $319, but add in the $30 for shipping and $30 for taxes, and I'm just getting peeved.

    Yes, I'm pretty thrifty. S'why I like the Forge Sawback so much. Seems like a fantastic bike at an incredible price, but the tax thing again, it just gets to me.
    1) Probably because they want a big company to handle all of their orders and shipping to end users. It keeps a lot of paperwork and a lot of taxes/other charges from even hitting Forge's end. In the end it's very smart. Think of it as selling your products on the Home Shopping Network. (They do all the legwork for you from advertising to the actual sale. It just makes financial sense.)

    2) Probably something to do with Target's choice on that one. They would probably sell more if they sold them in store as well. But then again it's more stuff to go wrong in the chain of the sale. This way, Forge knows who puts them together (the customer or a shop of Forge's choosing that's local to the customer at the customer's request) so there's less to go wrong.

    3) By law, if any company has a sales office or sales kiosk in a state that the customer orders from they are required to charge sales tax for any online orders even if they were not bought and shipped directly from the local branch. Since there's probably a Target store in your state... you get taxed.

    Hope that helps.

    As for the chain interference or noise issues some of you are having, you have two choices. You can either call Forge and they will solve the issues from there via various routes of your choosing or you can simply take it to a shop and pay anywhere from $15-$65 for an adjustment of the derailers or a complete tuneup. While I like to live in my own little perfect imaginary world and think the setup should be perfect out of the box it's also obvious that this is probably not going to be the case. These bikes just like all bikes are mass produced, slight adjustment mistakes will be made. Not only that, but for anyone that argues that "I bought my bike from an LBS and it was perfect", listen to what you just said. You bought it from an LBS where "unbeknowst" to most the shop guys have already built and adjusted EVERYTHING on the bike before you even pick it up. They don't come in boxes when you buy a bike from an LBS for a reason.

    Anyhoo, we can and all like to be a little cheap sometimes, but a $600 quality range bike for half the price is really nothing to sneeze at. Remember that as Forge grows more then likely the route they take to get their bikes to market will change... who knows, maybe you'll even start seeing the bikes being carried by LBSs. You never know what the future might bring... we just have to support them by buying the products.

    In closing, if you have issues, call Forge Support... you WILL get a call back. Remember that if all else fails and you absolutely don't like the bike or are unhappy Target does give you the option of returning it. I don't think heard of anyone returning a Sawback yet.

  8. #158
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    Or.. you could go here
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
    http://www.parktool.com/repair/byreg...ageField2.y=15
    Takes longest to read it, and maybe a few minutes to get it right..

    for free..

  9. #159
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    Or.. you could go here
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
    http://www.parktool.com/repair/byreg...ageField2.y=15
    Takes longest to read it, and maybe a few minutes to get it right..

    for free..

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by taikuodo
    Or.. you could go here
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
    http://www.parktool.com/repair/byreg...ageField2.y=15
    Takes longest to read it, and maybe a few minutes to get it right..

    for free..
    I have one other link as well.
    http://www.utahmountainbiking.com/fix/index.htm

  11. #161
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    Price/Weight/Comp Version 3

    Well I have finished the chart, and was rather shocked/pleased with the results. While this chart isn’t 100% it's a descent start. I’m missing some tools to take the chain and crankset off, but the listed weight should be close. If anything I have found them to be conservative.

    I will be turning it into a web page so the links are clickable and also prove the Excel file so others can edit it or use if for their own bike. Any blue link is to a product page to buy the item. These are the lowest costs I could find; I tried to be accurate on the prices as “cheating” on this sheet doesn’t do anyone any good.
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  12. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by taikuodo
    Or.. you could go here
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
    http://www.parktool.com/repair/byreg...ageField2.y=15
    Takes longest to read it, and maybe a few minutes to get it right..

    for free..
    OK, stop posting. I've read all of those on parktool. My issues are that the derailer is up too high on the frame tube. Honestly, I just don't feel like messing with it to that extent. And even so, by the time it ends up at the shop it'll be time for that first checkover anyway after break-in, so it just makes sense to me.

  13. #163
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    I think the frame weight should be 4 pounds or something, 3.5 is extremely light and comparable to some XC race bikes.

    PS. If your front derailler is too high, try unscrewing it and moving it lower.

  14. #164
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    whyamidoublepostingalot?

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by taikuodo
    I think the frame weight should be 4 pounds or something, 3.5 is extremely light and comparable to some XC race bikes.
    3.5 lbs (1590g or so) seems to be about an average frame weight for a 18" or 19" frame according to weight weenies.

    The frame weight is a result of the original bike weight of 31.5 pounds minus all components added together. If the bike weighs 32 lbs... Well then you have your 4 lbs frame.

    Again it does NO good if the value is a "fake". Anything in RED on the chart I weighed myself with a digital scale. I would LOVE for someone else to provide weight info or provide a source for weights I had to go to the manufacturer (or 3rd party site) for (weights in black). Again it's about being accurate. I'm sure I've made a mistake or two. That's why I have been posting versions so if someone sees an error, I can correct it.

    The cable weight is a flat out guess. The bottom bracket is an estimate based of off other bottom bracket weights. This is not a "fact" sheet (Unless the value is in red).

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by taikuodo
    If your front derailler is too high, try unscrewing it and moving it lower.
    Yeah, but then the cable length is off so the shifting will be messed up. I'd have to adjust that as well.

  17. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by subxeon
    Yeah! both tires do that on mine too! I was concerned and very angry for a bit.
    machine built wheels are NEVER 100% true. anything you see coming out of your LBS has been hand trued by someone at the shop. humans are still better at some things than machines.....

  18. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRSCCivic98
    Yeah, but then the cable length is off so the shifting will be messed up. I'd have to adjust that as well.
    lower the derailluer, line it up right, properly adjust the limit screws, shift down all the way, tighten the cable, make minor tweaks to cable tension if needed w/barrel adjuster. putting a new front derailluer on from scratch takes about 10 minutes if you arent very good at it, adjusting one thats already on should take you less than 15. very much worth the money you save and the knowledge you gain. not only that, but once its dialed in right you will never need to spend more than 2 or 3 minutes adjusting it in the future unless you smash the crap out of it on a rock or something.

  19. #169
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    OK, so I broke down and did the adjustment myself today. Took a while since I hadn't done one before and didn't know you have to have some slack on the cable when you mount it to the derailer. Anyway, I moved the derailer down to where it should be and readjusted it. Moral of the story. I can crosschain this thing all day long and it does not interfear anymore in any gear. I knew the "You can't crosschain without interference" was a BS line. While I understand that it shouldn't be done I knew you should be able to use all gear combinations. Anyway, the only negative... the misplaced derailer left some marks on the frame as they normaly do.... oh well, big deal right? The bike shifts even better now. It's amazing how much of a difference a proper adjustment will make. Anyway, I'm a happy camper again.

    BTW, here's the best part. Apperently I missed a call while I was in the garage. It was Mike from Forge wondering if I had time to take the bike into a shop yet to get it adjusted. Needless to say, I was surprised he'd actually follow up on something I never gave him a timeline on. Long story short, Mike is the man! I think it really shows that he cares about Forge customers when he takes the time to call someone at 5pm on a Friday to check up on them. If this continues, I have no doubt that Forge will be in business for a long time.

    Also, everyone and I mean EVERYONE that's bought one of these bikes and has positive feedback needs to get back on Target's site and add in a positive review for the bike you bought. Do it!

  20. #170
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    I went ahead and bought a Forge 5xx 17", although I am only 5'5". It was just too tempting to pass up without trying the fit. If it just does not work for me, I can at least take it back to Target.
    Should be here Monday, according to UPS.

    I wonder though, if only selling through Target hurts their sales. There's quite a stigma attached to department store bikes, and lots of people that "know better" won't even consider something like Forge because you have to order through Target.
    Seems like they could make a bigger impact selling direct.

  21. #171
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    I was reading an article in Bicycling magazine that said cross-chainging is no longer an issue with today's chains.
    I always stay in the middle chainring anyway, so it's not an issue for me, but I thought it was interesting.

  22. #172
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    Yeah, you can cross chain all day long but it will wear out your components faster and if you didnt know before, chainrings are like ratios.

    So you can get the same ratio with different gears, so there is not point using that specific gear, get it?
    =)

    nice job on the derailler fix, now you won't have to spend 20 bucks every time something goes wrong.

  23. #173
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    My replacement arrived yesterday. No damage like the last one. Drop out area is not painted, and the headset cap is plain black unlike my previous bike. On this bike, the rear brake cable was wrapped around the RD shifter cable on the top tube in between the two guides. I removed the break cable and popped off one of the little black guides to fix it. Though all screws went in nice and smoothly unlike the last bike.

    I put everything together (100% stock) and weighed it; 32lbs. If the bike weighed 31.6 and I weight 120.2, that would account for the difference (.5 lbs increments).

    I went on a ride this morning and the bike felt GREAT! I opted for a set of flat bars on an order to Nashbar just to see how they felt (This is what my last bike had). I think I prefer them, but I need a few more rides to really know. I adjusted the FD right off the bat as well and it did seem a lot smoother.
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  24. #174
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    Shame those decals are so low quality.. well you can't complain looking at the specs you get, and customer service.

    A brand new bike! Dang..

  25. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    I wonder though, if only selling through Target hurts their sales. There's quite a stigma attached to department store bikes, and lots of people that "know better" won't even consider something like Forge because you have to order through Target.
    Seems like they could make a bigger impact selling direct.
    Maybe, maybe not... at the moment anyway. What you need to do is if you like the bike, write a positive review on Target.com for this bike informing people that this bike is nothing like the Schwins pictured right next to it... it's way better. In all reality, I was shopping for a Mongoose when I stumbled across the Forge on Target's site. I looked up info on it, stumbled across the website, saw the component list, checked prices for other bikes with the same stuff on them, did some research on here about past experiences... etc. Long story shot, I bought one and I'm happy I did. A department store bike doesn't even have a candle, let alone hold one to this bike.


    Quote Originally Posted by jleecong
    My replacement arrived yesterday. No damage like the last one. Drop out area is not painted, and the headset cap is plain black unlike my previous bike. On this bike, the rear brake cable was wrapped around the RD shifter cable on the top tube in between the two guides. I removed the break cable and popped off one of the little black guides to fix it. Though all screws went in nice and smoothly unlike the last bike.

    I put everything together (100% stock) and weighed it; 32lbs. If the bike weighed 31.6 and I weight 120.2, that would account for the difference (.5 lbs increments).

    I went on a ride this morning and the bike felt GREAT! I opted for a set of flat bars on an order to Nashbar just to see how they felt (This is what my last bike had). I think I prefer them, but I need a few more rides to really know. I adjusted the FD right off the bat as well and it did seem a lot smoother.
    That's how my bike looks. My stemcap is also all black. Glad you're happy with the replacement.

  26. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRSCCivic98
    That's how my bike looks. My stemcap is also all black. Glad you're happy with the replacement.
    Old vs New
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  27. #177
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    Got my 19" yesterday,its blue and I am very happy with the bike so far went about 10 miles and everything felt great

  28. #178
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    we are working on the issues with the decals as i type this. trust me, as the guy who designs the graphics for the bike i was not pleased with them one bit...

  29. #179
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    Honestly, I'd rather have properly installed components (front derailer, because it's obviously off on everyone's bikes so far) then "perfect" decals. Besides, from the looks of the graphics issues you can only see them when you're really up close. I agree that it should be something to fix and not let it slide, but functionality is much more important as it deals with the reliability of the hardware sold. Besides, if you're concerned about looks, who wants to deal with chipped clearcoat because of an improperly installed FD?

  30. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRSCCivic98
    Honestly, I'd rather have properly installed components (front derailer, because it's obviously off on everyone's bikes so far) then "perfect" decals. Besides, from the looks of the graphics issues you can only see them when you're really up close. I agree that it should be something to fix and not let it slide, but functionality is much more important as it deals with the reliability of the hardware sold. Besides, if you're concerned about looks, who wants to deal with chipped clearcoat because of an improperly installed FD?
    well again, I DON'T ACTUALLY WORK FOR FORGE and i have no say over anything but the looks. i was replying to the comment about the decals. its all quality control issues that need to be ironed out, but that is outside of my range of influence besides saying "hey i've seen a few people have issues with this..."

    as for "it's obviously off on everyone's bikes" you should be careful about throwing around generalizations based on anecdotal evidence from 3 or 4 people. the devon cm that my girlfriend ordered for her mom for mothers day had the front d positioned correctly, it just needed the limit screws to be tweaked a little (as does every other bike shipped anywhere to anyone) and i and the guys at forge have heard from quite a few people that the bikes were set up just right when the got them (other than the minor tweaking along the lines of the above). the point being that in order to address a qc issue hard numbers are needed, not "well this guy and this and this guy said" and that IS being dealt with. neither i , nor the guys at forge, nor the factory can magically fix anything that has already shipped (as in every bike in the warehouse) but we CAN record the issues and fix things on future runs of the product.

  31. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    I was reading an article in Bicycling magazine that said cross-chainging is no longer an issue with today's chains.
    riiiight.... put it in the big ring up front and big ring in the back and tell me that sounds healthy for a chain...
    who ever mentioned that is a friggin twit.. probably a chain salesman

  32. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdburch
    well again, I DON'T ACTUALLY WORK FOR FORGE and i have no say over anything but the looks. i was replying to the comment about the decals. its all quality control issues that need to be ironed out, but that is outside of my range of influence besides saying "hey i've seen a few people have issues with this..."

    as for "it's obviously off on everyone's bikes" you should be careful about throwing around generalizations based on anecdotal evidence from 3 or 4 people. the devon cm that my girlfriend ordered for her mom for mothers day had the front d positioned correctly, it just needed the limit screws to be tweaked a little (as does every other bike shipped anywhere to anyone) and i and the guys at forge have heard from quite a few people that the bikes were set up just right when the got them (other than the minor tweaking along the lines of the above). the point being that in order to address a qc issue hard numbers are needed, not "well this guy and this and this guy said" and that IS being dealt with. neither i , nor the guys at forge, nor the factory can magically fix anything that has already shipped (as in every bike in the warehouse) but we CAN record the issues and fix things on future runs of the product.
    I think JRSCCivic98 was referring to the bikes we have seen on here (Sawback 5xx). I would hope common since says that JR hasn't seen EVERY Forge bike therefore his statement is based off available information in this thread, which is "Everyone has had issues with the FD".

    I don't think this was meant as an attack just an observation and his concern is for the company. "Is it in the company’s best interest to fix the looks or functionality". To JR it's about functionality. Because of your position it's about looks. I think BOTH should be correct/addressed.

    I had the SAME conversation with Mike. If you are buying this bike you are more than likely a newB or returning to biking. With that said most of our comments/opinions should be taken with a grain of salt as we are not experts. While I have an opinion and so do others similar to mine that doesn't make it fact.

    Enough with my opinions...

  33. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by jleecong
    I think JRSCCivic98 was referring to the bikes we have seen on here (Sawback 5xx). I would hope common since says that JR hasn't seen EVERY Forge bike therefore his statement is based off available information in this thread, which is "Everyone has had issues with the FD".

    I don't think this was meant as an attack just an observation and his concern is for the company. "Is it in the company’s best interest to fix the looks or functionality". To JR it's about functionality. Because of your position it's about looks. I think BOTH should be correct/addressed.

    I had the SAME conversation with Mike. If you are buying this bike you are more than likely a newB or returning to biking. With that said most of our comments/opinions should be taken with a grain of salt as we are not experts. While I have an opinion and so do others similar to mine that doesn't make it fact.

    Enough with my opinions...
    no, no i agree that both should be fixed, but telling me to fix something other than the looks wont help anything. the best thing you can do is call or email forge about the issue, wether you corrected it yourself or need their help isn't important. what's important is that they track all the issues they hear about from customers. that database has the hard numbers they need when talking to the folks at the plant.

    with functionality all i can do is add one more voice to the "hey i've heard thee is an issue with x" list, granted my voice might have more weight with forge, but it's still not the hard numbers they nedd. however i have a lot more control over the looks and therefor it makes more sense for me to focus on what i can change while making sure someone pays attention to the things i can't control.

    in the end consumer opinion is EVERYTHING. high-end mongooses come off the same line as low end to mid level treks and have better specs. but people would rather own a low end to mid level trek because they have the opinion that trek is good and mongoose sucks. we are trying to change people's opinions of value-priced bikes, but we also have to overcome industry ideas that the details don't matter as much on value-priced offerings. its going to take some time but those guys are committed to making the best possible bike you can buy on a budget and i am committed to making sure they don't look like *mart bikes. we WILL get there and its going to be a great ride (pun only semi-intended)

  34. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdburch
    no, no i agree that both should be fixed, but telling me to fix something other than the looks wont help anything. the best thing you can do is call or email forge about the issue, wether you corrected it yourself or need their help isn't important. what's important is that they track all the issues they hear about from customers. that database has the hard numbers they need when talking to the folks at the plant.

    with functionality all i can do is add one more voice to the "hey i've heard thee is an issue with x" list, granted my voice might have more weight with forge, but it's still not the hard numbers they nedd. however i have a lot more control over the looks and therefor it makes more sense for me to focus on what i can change while making sure someone pays attention to the things i can't control.

    in the end consumer opinion is EVERYTHING. high-end mongooses come off the same line as low end to mid level treks and have better specs. but people would rather own a low end to mid level trek because they have the opinion that trek is good and mongoose sucks. we are trying to change people's opinions of value-priced bikes, but we also have to overcome industry ideas that the details don't matter as much on value-priced offerings. its going to take some time but those guys are committed to making the best possible bike you can buy on a budget and i am committed to making sure they don't look like *mart bikes. we WILL get there and its going to be a great ride (pun only semi-intended)
    I myself have done my fair share of freelance work and know firsthand exactly where you are coming from. Please don’t think we are holding you responsible (at least I’m not).

    I myself told Mike of the issues I had or had heard here on the forums (I also suggested he check out this thread). I think JR did the same. This is a good thread if you ask me. While it shows some of the flaws/problems with the bike, it also shows just how good Forge support/help has been. As far as I can tell any real problem (non cosmetic) Forge has offered advice to fix or even offered to pay a shop to fix it. While the cosmetic issues are an “annoyance” for me, they are not very noticeable as JR pointed out and probably won’t be noticed by as many people as something not properly aligned. (I think this was JRs point)

  35. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by jleecong
    I myself have done my fair share of freelance work and know firsthand exactly where you are coming from. Please don’t think we are holding you responsible (at least I’m not).

    I myself told Mike of the issues I had or had heard here on the forums (I also suggested he check out this thread). I think JR did the same. This is a good thread if you ask me. While it shows some of the flaws/problems with the bike, it also shows just how good Forge support/help has been. As far as I can tell any real problem (non cosmetic) Forge has offered advice to fix or even offered to pay a shop to fix it. While the cosmetic issues are an “annoyance” for me, they are not very noticeable as JR pointed out and probably won’t be noticed by as many people as something not properly aligned. (I think this was JRs point)
    i'm not complaining about this thread. the feedback has been very helpful to both myself and forge. my thinking is that the missalignment and things like the cutouts and gaps in the decals and mistakes in paint are all symptomatic of the industry wide belief that attention to detail isn't important on the cheaper bikes. i think it is, and so does forge.

    its kind of like target vs walmart. both sell goods at about the same price point, but target's attention to detail is stunning while walmart's is virtually non-existent. target has shown that even people without a ton of money to spend want well made and well designed products that reflect some sort of actual pride in the work and not just a "lets just crank out as much **** as we can and sell it as fast as possible" attitude on the part of the retailer. i think target vs walmart is an excellent metaphor for forge vs *mart bikes (ie any brand owned by pacific)

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    cdburch, you need to get off your high horse for a sec and reread what I wrote. Nowhere in my post does it say for YOU to take care of the FD issue rather then the decal issue YOU apperently have a problem with. Settle down a bit man, geebus Mary Mother of Joseph and take a breath. I was not generalizing about everything just I hope you're not generalizing about EVERY Sawback having decal issues like you're seeing here. I don't have any issues with my decals and I basically stated that even if therer were they are really so small that it's hard to see anyway. It's not like they are upside down or anthing.

    Anyway, settle down with these attacks (either that or we're all misreading what we're typing because we keep getting defensive). Anyway, let me set it streight once and for all. I have already spoken with Mike about the FD issues. I corrected it myself. He also know of other things (small things) that they are working on improving and customers are welcome to comment and help with the development of these "improvements". It's not the end of the world here people, we're all looking at what we get and state comments on how to improve the item, that's all. I look more at the hardware aspect of things. This is probably the main reason why I'm not in line wanting to trade my bike in for another because my dropouts aren't black. I don't care too much about that. My mention above was simply a "generalization" that "I" myself would rather have a drivetrain properly tuned then to care about a little "decal flake" that got trapped under the clearcoat. That's my opinion and certainly not something that should deter you from trying to fix the decal issues if you really think there is one. I personally don't think there's a paint or decal issue myself aside from the dropout problem, but that's only with the first few ** number of bikes and HAS already been resolved.

    Anyway, stop attacking me because I'm not attacking the product or you. I think we're all just misreading or misunderstanding these simple little posts. They are all intended to HELP THE PRODUCT LINE ALONG. If we don't mention them then it won't help Mike, just like it wouldn't have helped you to find there was a paint or decal issue if no one had posted pics up. It's all constructive my man... so chill.

  37. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRSCCivic98
    cdburch, you need to get off your high horse for a sec and reread what I wrote. Nowhere in my post does it say for YOU to take care of the FD issue rather then the decal issue YOU apperently have a problem with. Settle down a bit man, geebus Mary Mother of Joseph and take a breath. I was not generalizing about everything just I hope you're not generalizing about EVERY Sawback having decal issues like you're seeing here. I don't have any issues with my decals and I basically stated that even if therer were they are really so small that it's hard to see anyway. It's not like they are upside down or anthing.

    Anyway, settle down with these attacks (either that or we're all misreading what we're typing because we keep getting defensive). Anyway, let me set it streight once and for all. I have already spoken with Mike about the FD issues. I corrected it myself. He also know of other things (small things) that they are working on improving and customers are welcome to comment and help with the development of these "improvements". It's not the end of the world here people, we're all looking at what we get and state comments on how to improve the item, that's all. I look more at the hardware aspect of things. This is probably the main reason why I'm not in line wanting to trade my bike in for another because my dropouts aren't black. I don't care too much about that. My mention above was simply a "generalization" that "I" myself would rather have a drivetrain properly tuned then to care about a little "decal flake" that got trapped under the clearcoat. That's my opinion and certainly not something that should deter you from trying to fix the decal issues if you really think there is one. I personally don't think there's a paint or decal issue myself aside from the dropout problem, but that's only with the first few ** number of bikes and HAS already been resolved.

    Anyway, stop attacking me because I'm not attacking the product or you. I think we're all just misreading or misunderstanding these simple little posts. They are all intended to HELP THE PRODUCT LINE ALONG. If we don't mention them then it won't help Mike, just like it wouldn't have helped you to find there was a paint or decal issue if no one had posted pics up. It's all constructive my man... so chill.
    dude you need to relax. no one attacked you. someone else complained about the decals. i replied that we were working on it and you jumped in to tell me to fix something else. my response was that i cant do anything about it and that me telling the guys at forge "hey people are complaining about X" wont help nearly as much as their having a bunch of calls and emails relating to X logged into the issue tracking system. they need to be able to say "we have had 57 calls regarding X" not "we have heard that people are having issues with X" in order for the plant to spend more money on qc they are going to want hard numbers.

    i have repeatedly thanked you guys for your feedback good and bad about the bikes, but you in particular sometimes tend to be a bit overly demanding in your responses to me. i am simply trying to remind you that my ability to correct things is pretty much limited to the graphics as i have no power over anything else other than being pretty close to the guys in charge. i am doing what i can to make these bikes as good as they can be, but i have rather limited power over this. i just want to make sure the people who do have the authority are given the tools they need (ie logged feedback issues) to correct this.

    i do happen to know for a fact that EVERY bike has issues with the decals because i designed the things. its not a quality control issue (a few flakes or crooked stickers that may or may not be isolated) its a universal process issue (they didn't paint the bikes according to the artwork that they were given). one of these days i will post my concept art for the new line of bikes (with forge's permission of course) if you happened to talk to the reps for forge at interbike last year you would have seen them, but otherwise no one outside the organization has ever gotten a look.

  38. #188
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    any update on that 10% off code? I cant seem to find any that work

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    My Sawback 5xx 17" came in today, and it's great.

    Took me about 30 min. to put it together, all told. I lost my presta valve adapter, but luckily my CO2 inflator will do presta. Aired up the tires and took it out for a test ride, and it's great.
    Almost seems a bit small for a 17" frame. I was worried that being on 5'5" that the bike would be too big for me.

    I still need to dial in the front & rear derailleurs and position the brake levers and shifters, but other than that it's good to go.

    Love those disc brakes, they are very nice.

  40. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdburch
    dude you need to relax. no one attacked you. someone else complained about the decals. i replied that we were working on it and you jumped in to tell me to fix something else. my response was that i cant do anything about it.
    And that's where you got it wrong. I would have directed the post towards you instead of simply stating my viewpoing on the matter(s) at hand for everyone to read. Did I mention your name in the post? Just because my post was after yours does not mean it was directed at you. Anyway, let's just let it go.

  41. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    My Sawback 5xx 17" came in today, and it's great.

    Took me about 30 min. to put it together, all told. I lost my presta valve adapter, but luckily my CO2 inflator will do presta. Aired up the tires and took it out for a test ride, and it's great.
    Almost seems a bit small for a 17" frame. I was worried that being on 5'5" that the bike would be too big for me.

    I still need to dial in the front & rear derailleurs and position the brake levers and shifters, but other than that it's good to go.

    Love those disc brakes, they are very nice.
    Glad everything worked out and you are happy. Enjoy the bike bike and keep us updated!

  42. #192
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    There is an error in the description for the 5xx. In the Extras it says it has two water bottle mounts, but the 5xx only has one mount.
    Not a big deal, but it is an error.

    Everything else on mine was fine. Decals are great, wheels are true, etc,etc.

  43. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemck
    There is an error in the description for the 5xx. In the Extras it says it has two water bottle mounts, but the 5xx only has one mount.
    Not a big deal, but it is an error.

    Everything else on mine was fine. Decals are great, wheels are true, etc,etc.
    The 17" only has 1. The 19" has 2.

    cdburch I think this is you.

  44. #194
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    the site is now correct. sorry everyone, copy/paste from spec sheets isn't as reliable as it should be sometimes...

    thanks for catching that!

  45. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by 83jeep
    any update on that 10% off code? I cant seem to find any that work
    I emailed Target and they applied the 10% code to my bike after I received it,seemed ass backwards but thats what I was advised to do.
    I qouted the code in this thread a few pages back to the CSR on the phone and bingo 10% off,hope this helps,Carl.

  46. #196
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    I gotta get in on that.

    Can you please tell me what number you called, and if possible, which CSR you talked to?
    Oh, and which code did you quote to them?


    Thanks.

  47. #197
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    Well I went for my second ride on the new bike yesterday (both rides easy and onroad) and when I got back I was wiping off the bike I felt something....

    What, How, I just don't understand!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  48. #198
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    what did you hit?!?! i've managed to chip paint here and there on rocks or missing a grind, but that had to be something gnarly to do that to the tubing...

  49. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdburch
    what did you hit?!?! i've managed to chip paint here and there on rocks or missing a grind, but that had to be something gnarly to do that to the tubing...
    I haven't hit ANYTHING... Thats the point! The bike has NEVER left payment, not jumped, nothing. It was setup on a stand. It has 6 miles on it. This is NOT something I did.

  50. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by jleecong
    I haven't hit ANYTHING... Thats the point! The bike has NEVER left payment, not jumped, nothing. It was setup on a stand. It has 6 miles on it. This is NOT something I did.
    wow. yeah if you had hit somethign hard enough to do that you would have known it. do you have any photos of this area from when the bike arrived? i'm guessing that whatever ups did that screwed up your wheel damaged the frame too. it looks like someone spiked the box with a forklift. you need to try REAL hard to put a slice like that in a tube....

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