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  1. #1
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    Tire/Rim questions

    I have two unrelated questions....

    1. The used bike I just got for my daughter (2004 Stumpjumper Womens) is set up tubeless. It has tubeless Specialized tires with Mavic 223 disk rims. That is about all the information I have and I am completely inexperienced with tubeless setups. How should I go about maintaining them or what special considerations are there over tubed tires? A good beginners guide would be awsome, there is a lot of information (some conflicting information) when using google.

    2. I was riding this weekend and went down hard due to my front tire rolling off my rim on a high speed banked corner. I was running a Kenda Kinetic Stick-e 2.6" tire with tube on a Mavic 223 Disk Rim. The rim was fine though the tube got a gash that I couldn't repair so I had to hump the bike back to the car with a cut on my ankle and some decent bruises. Spare tubes FTW I guess, live and learn. I had set my tire pressure at 35psi that morning and I know that the tube would deflate if left sitting for a week or more though it had held air just fine over a day. I'm 230lbs currently (down from 260!) and hadn't had an issue with this setup or pressure on a ride the previous weekend. I am looking for what could have contributed to the tire rolling off the rim so I can avoid it in the future? Too low of pressure, bad setup, bad riding, etc.?

    Thank you for your time.

  2. #2
    that guy
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    What terrain are you riding in with such a large tire? How aggressive was the corner, and how aggressive was your lean?

  3. #3
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    Ya, the tire is a bit much but its what I have currently. I'm trying to make it though this season with it seeing as how I spent my upgrade money on my daughter's bike. Well worth it though to get her riding with me. Though it is a 2.6 its casing is fairly small, more like a larger 2.3. The turn was banked, hard packed dirt with logs backing it. It was a more aggressive corner and I hit it with more speed than I had in the past (3rd time down this particular trail). I wasn't leaning to the point that I was uncomfortable or worried about coming out of the corner. It rolled maybe 3/4 of the way through the corner. If you are familiar with Japanese Gulch in Washington it was the last banked corner on the East side before getting to the sandy downhill near the bottom.

  4. #4
    nocturnal oblivion
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    Quick search and looks like the 223 rim is 23mm outside diameter. That 2.6 tire is way too big for the rim, should be pretty sketchy feeling to ride, like it's squirming over in the turns. A 2.6 inch tire needs a minimum 28mm rim. Go with a big volume 2.25/small volume 2.4 tire instead.
    "...like sex with the trail." - Boe

  5. #5
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    stumblemumble nailed your second question so I'll try and help your first.

    For a tubeless setup you mostly just need to refresh the sealant periodically. Here in the dry hot climate of Utah we need to do this every couple months but somewhere cooler and more moist you could probably go with needing to do it once or twice a season. To do this you just need to pop off a second of the bead and pour in some more sealant. Another way to do this is by injecting it through the valve stem with the core removed. You will probably need a compressor to pop the bead back on the rim, though occasionally it can be done with a bike pump. Don't pump your tires up much over 40 psi or you risk blowing the tire off the rim. And you need to carry a tube with you if you expect to fix a flat in a tubeless tire. You can't pump up a tubeless tire if it goes flat, you will need to put in a tube and fix the flat at home. If the tire has sealant in it, it has a good chance of plugging the hole while you ride. If in the process the tire looses air but still holds air (it isn't leaking any air) then you could pump it back up instead of deflating it and putting a tube in.

    You might be able to get a little better feel out of your big tire if you run it at a higher psi, but the correct answer is to run a narrower tire or a wider rim.
    Don't you hate it when a sentence doesn't end the way you think it octopus?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by stumblemumble View Post
    Quick search and looks like the 223 rim is 23mm outside diameter. That 2.6 tire is way too big for the rim, should be pretty sketchy feeling to ride, like it's squirming over in the turns. A 2.6 inch tire needs a minimum 28mm rim. Go with a big volume 2.25/small volume 2.4 tire instead.
    Thank you for this. The tires and rims are what I got with the bike when I bought it used. I assumed it would work and look where that got me. Well, looks like I am going to have to find a good deal on some Conti Trail Kings a little sooner than I thought.

    Quote Originally Posted by zebrahum View Post
    stumblemumble nailed your second question so I'll try and help your first.

    For a tubeless setup you mostly just need to refresh the sealant periodically. Here in the dry hot climate of Utah we need to do this every couple months but somewhere cooler and more moist you could probably go with needing to do it once or twice a season. To do this you just need to pop off a second of the bead and pour in some more sealant. Another way to do this is by injecting it through the valve stem with the core removed. You will probably need a compressor to pop the bead back on the rim, though occasionally it can be done with a bike pump. Don't pump your tires up much over 40 psi or you risk blowing the tire off the rim. And you need to carry a tube with you if you expect to fix a flat in a tubeless tire. You can't pump up a tubeless tire if it goes flat, you will need to put in a tube and fix the flat at home. If the tire has sealant in it, it has a good chance of plugging the hole while you ride. If in the process the tire looses air but still holds air (it isn't leaking any air) then you could pump it back up instead of deflating it and putting a tube in.
    Thank you. I do have a small compressor so that seems to be a bonus in maintaining these. They are on my daughter's bike and she is 10 years old and maybe 70 lbs so I am not too concerned with her being too rough on these just yet. Good tip on the 40psi max though. I have them at 50psi right now because I have only gotten her to do pavement riding so far. I'll back it off to 40. I usually (not this last weekend) have a tube with me just in case so I shouldn't have an issue there. I'll plan on grabbing some Stan's sealant when I buy my tires. After doing a some reading I was thinking of mixing up some Wade's special blend but I don't need nearly that much for one bike. Maybe I'll go tubeless on my bike next year and make some up. For now I'll have my daughter throw in some glitter, she'll love that her tires have glitter in them.

    Quote Originally Posted by zebrahum View Post
    You might be able to get a little better feel out of your big tire if you run it at a higher psi, but the correct answer is to run a narrower tire or a wider rim.
    The other thing I found is that the gauge on my floor pump is no longer reliable. It reads a little higher than what the actual pressure. So when I thought I had the tire at 35-40 psi the other day it could have been as low as 30 psi. I can't afford new rims at the moment so I think I will refrain from using these larger tires and get a proper tire for my rim. I do like the feel of larger tires though (I'm a clyde) so I will probably go with a 2.3. I'll be back at Japanese Gulch this weekend so I'll have to run some Panaracer Fire XC Pro 2.1s I have until I can figure out new tires.

    Thank you again for your help.

  7. #7
    that guy
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    Worth every penny:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001OMQK6Q/

    Use it before every ride. And, you should consider going much lower than 40psi once your daughter hits dirt.

    As for tires, you may be able to get away with an Ardent 2.4 in the front...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by paleh0rse View Post
    Worth every penny:
    SKS Airchecker Digital Airgauge:Amazon:Sports & Outdoors

    Use it before every ride. And, you should consider going much lower than 40psi once your daughter hits dirt.
    So true, I had found the gauge on my floor pump to be accurate until recently. It hooks directly to Presta which was nice. The only other good gauge I have is Schrader so I have to fiddle with an adapter. I think I'll be picking one of these up ASAP.

    Quote Originally Posted by paleh0rse View Post
    As for tires, you may be able to get away with an Ardent 2.4 in the front...
    In another thread I was recommended quite a few different tires for the areas that I ride. Mostly packed dirt singletrack with roots and a little loose dirt or gravel thrown in. One of the tires I am really considering is the Trail King (Rubber Queen). On Conti's website the Trail King is listed as having an over sized casing and comes in 2.2 or 2.4. I wanted to run a 2.2 in the rear and a 2.4 in the front both in black chili compound. Now I am thinking that the 2.4 would be too large or right on the edge of it. Would a 2.4 TK give me issues?

    Other tires/combos I am considering: (front/rear)
    Maxxis Minion 2.35/ Highroller 2.35
    Nevegal 2.35 Stick-e / 2.35 DCT (maybe a 2.1 DCT in the rear)

    Someone did mention that the Minion 2.5 Exo 3C ran small and was more like a 2.35 tire. I am intrigued as to whether it would fit.

    The Nevegals are the least expensive but the Maxxis pair isn't too far behind.

    I always overthink stuff like this and end up causing myself grief.

  9. #9
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    I picked up a set of Trail King 2.2, folding, Black Chili tires today. Amazon has them for $38.22 with free shipping but I was skeptical as to weather they would actually be BC compound once they got here. I had to order some other stuff so I had JensonUSA price match them. So I got a set for $77 shipped (would have been $106 normally). Almost the same price as the Nevegals and a fair bit less expensive than the Maxxis combo I was looking at. I picked up a Topeak D2 gauge as well so I should be set. Thank you.

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