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  1. #1
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    False advertisement from BikesDirect...

    I was looking at Motocbecane Fantom Elite DS from Bikes Direct for a while and decided to pull the trigger. This decision was based soley on the components at this price level. I figured I could always recycle the crap frame and transfer the components to a better one latter. Looking at the specs, the bike came with a RS monarch 3.3 and Avid Elixer Cr brakes. Much to my dismay, the shock that came on the bike was a bottom level RS Ario 2.2. A complete downgrade in my opinion. The brakes that came on the bike were Avid Elixer 5's which are entry level Elixers instead of the CR's as advertised. I am feeling dupped right now. Sure, the bike didn't cost much, but I was expecting what was advertised..

    I emailed BD a couple times and have not heard a response. I guess you get what you pay for? If it sounds to good to be true.....then it is

    If you are looking at a new bike, take everyone's advise on here and don't buy from them...I have now learned my lesson......end of rant

  2. #2
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    Bummer. Hopefully the BD guy will be along shortly to address it. If he still hangs out in here.

  3. #3
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    I say this is an April 1st troll on BD. In poor taste. This is a solid company, solid bikes, solid reviews all over the world, and despite growing, they are not shorting people on service, just cutting out the middleman.

  4. #4
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    Wouldn't put it past the people who put the bikes together. My Road bike came with different cranks than they list on there site.
    Big Foot Blue KHS XC704r

  5. #5
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    I would call bd, and talk to their customer service. If they are unwilling to fix the problem, I would call my credit card company and file a complaint with them. I would tell BD that I was going to do that as well. You may have to ship the bike back, at your expense, but I would not keep the bike if I wasn't satisfied.

    I have mail ordered something in the past with my debit card, and received something less than advertised, and my bank gave me the money back and chased after the company when I couldn't get the company to do the right thing.
    Since I don't like writing, I don't have a blog to pimp. This space for rent.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    I say this is an April 1st troll on BD. In poor taste.
    I considered that, but looking at his posting history I doubt it.

    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    This is a solid company, solid bikes, solid reviews all over the world, and despite growing, they are not shorting people on service, just cutting out the middleman.
    Frankly you sound more like a BD shill than he does a troll.

  7. #7
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    I call BS on you, must be an April fool's joke. Sometimes BD swaps different parts on their bikes, but they always list that possibility. And for the parts they swap out, they are equivalent or even better in some cases.

    Here is how they list it when bikes may come with alternate parts:
    "NOTE: Wheels are Vuelta XRP PRO or Vuelta ZeroLite (No Choice)"

    On the off chance this is not a joke, call them up and give them hell. They'll ship you the correct parts free of charge.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    I call BS on you, must be an April fool's joke. Sometimes BD swaps different parts on their bikes, but they always list that possibility. And for the parts they swap out, they are equivalent or even better in some cases.

    Here is how they list it when bikes may come with alternate parts:
    "NOTE: Wheels are Vuelta XRP PRO or Vuelta ZeroLite (No Choice)"
    Didn't list that for my road bike. There listing says RPM Crank By FSA, not FSA Tempo Cranks which is what came on my Windsor Wellington 3.0. I am happy with my bike though. The Tempo are probably better cranks.
    Big Foot Blue KHS XC704r

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    I call BS on you, must be an April fool's joke. Sometimes BD swaps different parts on their bikes, but they always list that possibility. And for the parts they swap out, they are equivalent or even better in some cases.

    Here is how they list it when bikes may come with alternate parts:
    "NOTE: Wheels are Vuelta XRP PRO or Vuelta ZeroLite (No Choice)"

    On the off chance this is not a joke, call them up and give them hell. They'll ship you the correct parts free of charge.
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...elite_ds09.htm

    Says the bike comes with Avid Elixir CR's. He should get that or they should reimburse him.
    Since I don't like writing, I don't have a blog to pimp. This space for rent.

  10. #10
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    A little googling led me to this
    Moto Fantom Elite DS 2007 on clearance -
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...fantom_eds.htm
    Front: RockShox Reba SL Air + Uturn Travel Adjustment (80-120mm) + PopLoc
    SPECIAL FREE FACTORY UPGRADE TO
    REVELATION 409 ROCKSHOX FORK + UTURN AND LOCKOUT!!
    100-130MM ADJUSTABLE TRAVEL +
    QTYS EXTREMELY LIMITED (MSRP $600)
    Rear: RockShox Ario 2.2 Adjust W/ LOCKOUT + Bar Mount PopLoc Adjust - 3"/4"/5" Travel Adjustable Air

    Avid BB5 Mechanical Disc
    Moto Fantom Elite DS 2010 -
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...elite_ds09.htm
    RockShox Recon 351 WITH UTURN ADJUSTABLE TRAVEL (85-130MM) TurnKey LOCKOUT /Rockshox Monarch 3.3 Air with 3 Position Motion Control Platform Damping and Rebound

    Avid Elixir CR Hydraulic Disc front and rear, 160mm rotor

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dremer03
    Didn't list that for my road bike. There listing says RPM Crank By FSA, not FSA Tempo Cranks which is what came on my Windsor Wellington 3.0. I am happy with my bike though. The Tempo are probably better cranks.
    So did you tell them or just let it slide?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    So did you tell them or just let it slide?
    Why is anyone going to complain on an upgrade :S



    EDIT - I call BS on the OP. At worst, he confused models.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    So did you tell them or just let it slide?
    Slide, because I honestly dont care. I just wanted to ride, not wait another week for a new bike to come just because the cranks that are listed are not the ones I got. Bike has treated me well the month or so I have had it.
    Big Foot Blue KHS XC704r

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalker
    A little googling led me to this
    Moto Fantom Elite DS 2007 on clearance -
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...fantom_eds.htm


    Moto Fantom Elite DS 2010 -
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...elite_ds09.htm

    Stalker, I bet you're right, they do that quite often with last year's closeouts. They either sent the wrong bike, or the wrong bike was ordered.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalker
    Why is anyone going to complain on an upgrade :S



    EDIT - I call BS on the OP. At worst, he confused models.
    Pretty sure they are a upgrade. Actual FSA cranks instead of Cranks labeled as RPM, but made by FSA.

    The 2007 model of the bike he bought does come with the Ario shock, but BB5 brakes.
    Big Foot Blue KHS XC704r

  16. #16
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    PM Mike from BD on here. He'll be able to help you out. hopefully.
    2000 something DB Sorrento
    2010 Motobecane 29Pro SL

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dremer03
    Slide, because I honestly dont care. I just wanted to ride, not wait another week for a new bike to come just because the cranks that are listed are not the ones I got. Bike has treated me well the month or so I have had it.
    I'd still let them know so they can correct the problem, even if you're going to keep the crankset. I used to work in customer service and would always tell people that they can't get angry with me for not fixing something, when they never told me about the problem in the first place. They can't make it right unless you tell them they screwed up.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    I'd still let them know so they can correct the problem, even if you're going to keep the crankset. I used to work in customer service and would always tell people that they can't get angry with me for not fixing something, when they never told me about the problem in the first place. They can't make it right unless you tell them they screwed up.
    I am sure he will read this at some point.
    Big Foot Blue KHS XC704r

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrayBeard Pirate
    I would call bd, and talk to their customer service. If they are unwilling to fix the problem, I would call my credit card company and file a complaint with them. I would tell BD that I was going to do that as well. You may have to ship the bike back, at your expense, but I would not keep the bike if I wasn't satisfied.

    I have mail ordered something in the past with my debit card, and received something less than advertised, and my bank gave me the money back and chased after the company when I couldn't get the company to do the right thing.
    Assuming it's not a troll, I'm with Pirate on this one. Your credit card company is evil, but they'll be evil on your behalf if you think you've been defrauded. Try to work it out through customer service first, of course. It sounds like a pretty significant difference in dollar value.

    There's a note on almost all spec sheets that components are subject to change without notice, but that should really only cover exchanges for roughly equivalent parts.
    "Don't buy upgrades; ride up grades." -Eddy Merckx

  20. #20
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    I have read every post on this thread and though it is a coincidence that today is April 1st, this is not a joke. I have emailed customer service(after the purchase email) twice with my concern and have had no response. The only #'s I can fine on the website is a fax number and a credit card processing #. When I purchased the bike, there was no "closeout option" with different spec's and I paid the "full" price for it. I also understand that there may be mid-run component changes, and am fine with most of the ones stated in the specs sheet, but the components that were swapped out seem disproportionate to what was spec'd. It's almost like purchasing an Audi and the salesman handing you the keys to a Volkswagen. Both are good in their own right, but not in the same league.....I will give it another try to contact them and then off to the CC company to dispute. Other than this issue which is eating at me, the rest of the bike was fine.

  21. #21
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    That sucks dude, I would PM Mike from BD and let him know the situation.
    http://forums.mtbr.com/member.php?u=306041

  22. #22
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    It's kind of cheesy that they don't have a phone number to call to speak to an actual person about a problem.


    Screw it...at this point, I would just file a complaint with the credit card company. I would then send an e-mail to bikes direct telling them that I had filed the complaint with the credit card company, and if they want the bike back, they can send me a return shipping label and I would be happy to send it back to them (at their cost). Otherwise, they are out the money and the bike.
    Since I don't like writing, I don't have a blog to pimp. This space for rent.

  23. #23
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    Looks like u ether ordered the wrong bike or they sent u the wrong one. Look a bunch of posts up at diference between 2007 and 2010, with that said I would not accept that bike. I would want the better parts that u are owed. Mike should correct this no problem.
    SS Rigid =
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    There is no distraction. You only hear the sound of your breath and the crunch of the wheels across the dirt.

  24. #24
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    Give them a day or two to get back, these posts are 4 hours apart... ****ty there's no phone number though. I've seen Mike from BD post quite often when there's an issue - so have the faith.

  25. #25
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    Sounds like he got the Fantom Comp DS, what does the frame say.

    My Fantom 29PRO SL will arrive tomorrow hope all goes well.

  26. #26
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    The easiest way to get a response in this case is to file a BBB complaint. Bikes Direct is based out of Dallas. I'd wait a few days to see if they resolve on their own. If they don't, you WILL hear from them if you file a complaint.
    Now go home and get your ******* shinebox.

  27. #27
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    Here's a thought that's outside the box... Why don't you go to the Moto thread and post there? Mike from BD is always monitoring there and better yet PM the man yourself.

    Give BD a few days to respond and if they don't then trash them. From what I've seen, BD resolves these type issues just about every time. Give it a try.
    26FS & 29Rigid... best of both worlds

  28. #28
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    give them atleast 2 days to get a response from them. looks like they sent you the wrong item.
    2000 something DB Sorrento
    2010 Motobecane 29Pro SL

  29. #29
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    I ordered a Motobecane and had no problems with BD. I had to email them about something and their customer service was really prompt. Why not try to contact them and see if they can explain themselves? As someone earlier posted, they may have accidentally sent the closeout model.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil42
    I ordered a Motobecane and had no problems with BD. I had to email them about something and their customer service was really prompt. Why not try to contact them and see if they can explain themselves? As someone earlier posted, they may have accidentally sent the closeout model.

    OP stated that he has e-mailed them twice but they never responded.

    Personally I shy away from company's that don't list a phone number on their website or hide it deep within the site. I ordered some GPS items and one place only had easy access for online orders. Had to did way too deep to find a phone number. To me those places don't have a emphasis on live service so I look elsewhere just due to reason above.

  31. #31
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    Name: Bikesdirect.com Mr. Mike Spratt, President
    Phone: (214) 341-4116
    Address: 9848 Robin Hill Ln
    Dallas, TX 75238-2122
    from the bbb.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by wi_bigfoot
    OP stated that he has e-mailed them twice but they never responded.

    Personally I shy away from company's that don't list a phone number on their website or hide it deep within the site. I ordered some GPS items and one place only had easy access for online orders. Had to did way too deep to find a phone number. To me those places don't have a emphasis on live service so I look elsewhere just due to reason above.
    I don't think that's accurate in this case. Mike attaches his own name to each and every bike that goes out of that company, and with it, his reputation. BikesDirect really wouldn't have become such a force in the bike business if they weren't doing something right. If you think he's not out there, just look up his profile here and see him in sometimes 10+ page threads based on Motobecane bikes. The guy is on top of things here.

  33. #33
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  34. #34
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    Hey but at least you saved a few bucks!
    :wq

  35. #35
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    its becomeng the norm for websites to bury phone numbersm under faq and troubleshooting guides, i recently had a problem with my bosch tankless heater, and it took me about 3 weeks of calls and automated trouble shooting guides before i got a hold of a person

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blurr

    And what does this say about where customer service is? Sure we will buy it back but don't call us.


    From your link -

    "Email us at bikesdirectbikes@aol.com or fax request to 904-249-3987 for proper return instructions"

    Not saying right or wrong but I won't do buisness with this type of company.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    I don't think that's accurate in this case. Mike attaches his own name to each and every bike that goes out of that company, and with it, his reputation. BikesDirect really wouldn't have become such a force in the bike business if they weren't doing something right. If you think he's not out there, just look up his profile here and see him in sometimes 10+ page threads based on Motobecane bikes. The guy is on top of things here.

    I'm not attacking Mike or saying he isn't doing a good job. I'm simply saying I don't deal with companys that don't have great customer service and by not having a phone number for the customer to reach you is a sign that they don't want to be bothered by the customer. For that reason Bikesdirect would never get any business from me.

  38. #38
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    Semi OT:

    Customer support is extremely expensive. Phone support is even moreso. To have expectations of paying way less than full retail and then requiring a voice on the other end to calm your nerves about a mistake is, in my opinion, unrealistic expectations. The fact that some online retailers do provide stellar phone support is an exception, not a rule.

    Now, I'm not saying phone support shouldn't be provided if there's a truly legitimate exception, but most customers have no clue what's legitimate. Making a support phone number available right upfront will encourage most customers to just call that rather than actually reading through the FAQs/knowledge bases that will likely answer 90% of the problems.

    I speak of this because I've been a support engineer for almost ten years now for multiple technology companies, and it's always been a fight to get enough resources to cover phones/email queries that are really valid and we really want to fix quickly for customers versus the inane questions that come through the pipeline on the phone or email queues that ask questions equivalent to: "How do I pump my tires?"

    In a perfect world, every company small and large would have an 800 number for customers, and customers will have already RTFM'd before considering calling it. But that's never the case. So what's the next best thing? Make the customer 'jump through hoops' and force them to read FAQs before giving them a real number to call.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaelin
    Semi OT:

    Customer support is extremely expensive. Phone support is even moreso. To have expectations of paying way less than full retail and then requiring a voice on the other end to calm your nerves about a mistake is, in my opinion, unrealistic expectations. The fact that some online retailers do provide stellar phone support is an exception, not a rule.

    Now, I'm not saying phone support shouldn't be provided if there's a truly legitimate exception, but most customers have no clue what's legitimate. Making a support phone number available right upfront will encourage most customers to just call that rather than actually reading through the FAQs/knowledge bases that will likely answer 90% of the problems.

    I speak of this because I've been a support engineer for almost ten years now for multiple technology companies, and it's always been a fight to get enough resources to cover phones/email queries that are really valid and we really want to fix quickly for customers versus the inane questions that come through the pipeline on the phone or email queues that ask questions equivalent to: "How do I pump my tires?"

    In a perfect world, every company small and large would have an 800 number for customers, and customers will have already RTFM'd before considering calling it. But that's never the case. So what's the next best thing? Make the customer 'jump through hoops' and force them to read FAQs before giving them a real number to call.

    I work in the support industry and have for 19 years (15 yrs doing tech support and 4 as a supervisor for customer service) so I understand what you are saying. All I can say then is you get what you pay for and then don't complain when they don't respond to the e-mails. For me I give my money to the local LBS who will be there when I need then and not unanswered e-mails. I am your customer who will pay more for great service then price shop for the "best deal"

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by wi_bigfoot
    I work in the support industry and have for 19 years (15 yrs doing tech support and 4 as a supervisor for customer service) so I understand what you are saying. All I can say then is you get what you pay for and then don't complain when they don't respond to the e-mails. For me I give my money to the local LBS who will be there when I need then and not unanswered e-mails. I am your customer who will pay more for great service then price shop for the "best deal"
    Exactly. A big part of BDs cost savings is trimmed down customer service (no phone, but e-mail communication is good as long as you are OK without instant gratification).

    Personally, I would rather save the money by purchasing from BD because I know what I want and I know how to assemble and repair it. In fact I have never taken advantage of LBS free tune ups on the three bikes I have purchased over the years from them because I can do it on the spot with more efficiency and I enjoy it. I now look at these little LBS incentives as a waste of my money.

    In the case of my $1900 Moto Fly Ti, nobody can touch the same spec and quality bike for under $4000, so you tell me that having a phone number to call or a showroom to walk into is worth $2000 extra!

    To each his own, but it boils down to how much extra money you are willing to spend for service. You are either a turn key customer or a do it your selfer. I am the latter.
    Whoever invented the bicycle deserves the thanks of humanity.
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by wi_bigfoot
    I work in the support industry and have for 19 years (15 yrs doing tech support and 4 as a supervisor for customer service) so I understand what you are saying. All I can say then is you get what you pay for and then don't complain when they don't respond to the e-mails. For me I give my money to the local LBS who will be there when I need then and not unanswered e-mails. I am your customer who will pay more for great service then price shop for the "best deal"
    That's how I feel about it. When someone is able to offer a similar product at a considerably lower price, something is usually going to be sacrificed to make that price point.
    :wq

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by nachomc
    That's how I feel about it. When someone is able to offer a similar product at a considerably lower price, something is usually going to be sacrificed to make that price point.
    Yep. I did my homework before buying my bike from BD and I knew the risks. I might have to ship the bike back on my dime in the event of a frame failure. I might have to wait a few days to hear from their customer support. I would have to pay a mechanic to work on the bike, or learn to do it myself. I read forums and reviews of the bikes, all before buying the bike, so I knew what I was getting into.

    That being said, I would still raise hell if I was the OP! They shipped the wrong bike, or it was improperly specced on the website or in the warehouse. Either way, it's not the OP's problem, it is BD's. So I would expect BD to make it right, and the sooner the better for their reputation.

  43. #43
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    i researched BD a lot before making a decision on buying. i was looking at the cliff4900 and couldnt really find anything bad being said about the bike at all but, i couldnt really find anything good either though. so after finding a blog bashing motobecane and crappy customer service (lack of replies to inquiries from Mike, forcing the customer to mail the entire bike back instead of just looking at photos of the broken frame). so, i ended up scouring craigslist for a week or two and ended up scooping up a 7 month old Avalanche2.0 for half the price of the Cliff4900. overall, i would love to see and try out a Windsor bike because they do look like a really good deal for the money. This will be my first "PAcific cycles" GT frame so im eager to see how they hold up after the new management. good luck with your frame issue and please keep us updated. i may end up going through BD for my wifes bike upgrade here in the hear future.

  44. #44
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    there is also a Bikesdirect user (i think his username is bikesdirect) at roadbikereview. he went back and fourth with another member there about LBS vs Online in one of my threads.
    he acknowledges that they do not have a customer support # and do not plan to have one. he says it is how it keeps their prices down. and "...it obviously is working." I ended up not buying my bike from them. return service and customer service is very important to me.

    keep trying at it and make more threads in these forums about it. you'll get their attention. and if they dont want to respond, the bad publicity will bite them this spring.
    RH SL Pro

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by louisssss
    there is also a Bikesdirect user (i think his username is bikesdirect) at roadbikereview. he went back and fourth with another member there about LBS vs Online in one of my threads.
    he acknowledges that they do not have a customer support # and do not plan to have one. he says it is how it keeps their prices down. and "...it obviously is working." I ended up not buying my bike from them. return service and customer service is very important to me.

    keep trying at it and make more threads in these forums about it. you'll get their attention. and if they dont want to respond, the bad publicity will bite them this spring.

    I would suggest then that they do a better e-mail response then if that is the only method you give them. In some ways it's working since they are getting by with it. I agree 100% that keep the pressure on and they could change. What drives a business? Earning $$$. Start losing that and you will need to listen to your customers at some point.

  46. #46
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    When did you get the bike, when did you e-mail BD? Going to a credit card chargeback quickly is not cool and should be a last resort. So far you haven't started a thread in the actual Motobecane forum which I would imagine Mike from BD is subscribed to so he gets an e-mail automatically when a new thread is created.

    PM him, start a thread in the proper forum, and since it's Easter weekend, give it a couple of days to get a response. If it's just a simple shipping error that can be fixed, you don't want to open a credit card case on it too quickly---save that for later down the road.

  47. #47
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    op, when did you e-mail bd? maybe they're not checking e-mail on good friday or even this weekend. i usually don't care about a company not posting a phone number as long as they are responsive through other channels. hopefully they come through and respond. also, shouldn't have a need to find him or pm him on here- i would hope he checks his business e-mails first

    good luck!
    - 1995 Giant ATX 870
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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJETT
    When did you get the bike, when did you e-mail BD? Going to a credit card chargeback quickly is not cool and should be a last resort. So far you haven't started a thread in the actual Motobecane forum which I would imagine Mike from BD is subscribed to so he gets an e-mail automatically when a new thread is created.

    PM him, start a thread in the proper forum, and since it's Easter weekend, give it a couple of days to get a response. If it's just a simple shipping error that can be fixed, you don't want to open a credit card case on it too quickly---save that for later down the road.
    I know the CC charge-back is the last resort. I sent two emails, one was Friday 3/26, and one on Tuesday 3/30. That would effectively given BD a week, not counting weekends to get back to me. I have recieved numerous PM's with various contact emails from site-users. This site has been more than helpful. I guess other than the parts issue, having to go to other measures to contact them is poor CS to me. What if I didn't know about this forum? I would be stuck in wonderland until they get back to me. To all that have posted with response, thank you, I will take it from here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dirttrax
    I know the CC charge-back is the last resort. I sent two emails, one was Friday 3/26, and one on Tuesday 3/30. That would effectively given BD a week, not counting weekends to get back to me. I have recieved numerous PM's with various contact emails from site-users. This site has been more than helpful. I guess other than the parts issue, having to go to other measures to contact them is poor CS to me. What if I didn't know about this forum? I would be stuck in wonderland until they get back to me. To all that have posted with response, thank you, I will take it from here.
    I don't see how you're making this BD's problem, when it looks like yours for not being a good shopper. If I was laying down cash, I'd definitely look to see the clearly stated terms on their website and send some emails, just in case there is a problem, just to know what to do. It sounds like their model is not what you wanted, but you expected something different despite their model being clear. BD has tons of great deals, happy customers all over the world riding, soI'm going to say it's the op's problem, not BD.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by glitz
    I don't see how you're making this BD's problem, when it looks like yours for not being a good shopper. If I was laying down cash, I'd definitely look to see the clearly stated terms on their website and send some emails, just in case there is a problem, just to know what to do. It sounds like their model is not what you wanted, but you expected something different despite their model being clear. BD has tons of great deals, happy customers all over the world riding, soI'm going to say it's the op's problem, not BD.

    If the bike was not as advertised how does that become the op's problem ? If the bike includes downgraded parts how does it become the op's problem ? If it takes more than one calander week to get a nonresponce from Bikes Direct , how does that not reflect as anything but very poor customer service ?

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