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  1. #1
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    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?

    I'm a Brit now living in the USA and I want to buy beer that is beer. The American version(s) of IPA are way over-hopped compared to the original IPAs and just too bitter for me to enjoy them. Almost everything else I find has some food product or vegetable added to it for no good reason. Other than that, I have the lagers that are leaving me with no taste and wind.
    The stock 'bitter' that the Brits drink as a standard doesn't seem to have made it over here in brewing terms. Or has it? I don't want pumpkin or bourbon casks or ginger or coffee or chili or 9%. Give me 4% with flavour. Is there anything out there?

  2. #2
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    Lots of Amber beers on the market right now, especially with the fall seasonals being released. You might try one of those.

    I kind of understand where you're coming from. I love a solid American IPA, but I think there's a trend now where a lot of breweries just make an IPA as hoppy as possible while completely ignoring the malt characteristics to balance out the bitter.

    We are fortunate enough to have a brewery in our town (St. Boniface Brewing) that makes a fantastic bitter and a fantastic ESB. They also happen to make a great IPA that isn't overkilled too.

  3. #3
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    Where do you live, TooTall? Makes a difference...

  4. #4
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    I'm in Richmond VA with a swathe of local breweries - all doing 'quirky' and 'flavorful' crap. A couple of them are doing a 'session beer' at about 4%, but only once a year!

  6. #6
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    People want flavor in their beer but they complain when ingredients are added for more complex flavoring. **** doesn't make any sense whatsoever....


  7. #7
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    Lots of craft brewers make tasty, low ABV Bitters.

    Come to Bend and try Deschutes Bachelor Bitter. You'll be a convert!

    Your problem is that you're in Richmond, Va. You need to be in a real craft beer state!

  8. #8
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    I'd say, Goose Island Honkers Ale. Pretty good for what sounds like your looking for.

    -jc

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Stokes View Post
    People want flavor in their beer but they complain when ingredients are added for more complex flavoring. **** doesn't make any sense whatsoever....

    I guess I'm just used to brewers who can make something with depth, taste and character without raiding the pantry for the cake ingredients. Putting chili and other random **** in beer doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

  10. #10
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    Having 2000 breweries all making bitters doesn't make any sense either. The beauty of the new beer scene is that you can find something that will match almost any taste. There are quite a few American Pale Ales, English style pale ales, English style bitters, browns, ambers, stock ales, steam beers, etc that should suit you.

  11. #11
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    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?

    I find New Belgium Shift has a decent amount of flavor for it being 5%. My only beef with it is Only comes in cans.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kopish View Post
    Having 2000 breweries all making bitters doesn't make any sense either.
    Yet every single brewery does an over-hopped IPA. How's that work then?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    Yet every single brewery does an over-hopped IPA. How's that work then?
    It works because the American market loves hoppy American IPAs. The good thing about the American beer market is you really can find whatever you want. Try American Pale Ales until you find one with the right flavor and IBUs for you, they are out there everywhere in every taste preference imaginable. Litte doubt that American micros are now the best in the world by a large margin, and so diverse that you find whatever excellent beer style you want. Yes, strong and flavorful IPAs are in abundance, because the market for them is large and growing in the US. That doesn't mean you have to like them, go drink something else, there are thousands of options.

  14. #14
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    Belgian duble, triple and quads, imperial stouts, oak aged imperial stouts, oak aged belgian ales, belgian dark ales, belgian strong ales.

    That's all you need to know.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haymarket View Post
    That doesn't mean you have to like them, go drink something else, there are thousands of options.
    This is my point. I am having trouble finding anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick. I am looking and drinking and trying as I go.

    As far as all of Jayem's suggestions go - I grew up drinking imported Belgian beers as well as British beer, so I know the delights of that world. However, I don't want to drink 9% beer all the time. The pursuit of stronger flavours keeps driving the ABV up because it is easier to brew like that.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Belgian duble, triple and quads, imperial stouts, oak aged imperial stouts, oak aged belgian ales, belgian dark ales, belgian strong ales.

    That's all you need to know.
    Lest we forget the Saison!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    I guess I'm just used to brewers who can make something with depth, taste and character without raiding the pantry for the cake ingredients...
    Amen. I enjoy a big IPA, but I had a Mammoth 395 IPA on my Sierra Cascades tour this summer, and the sage and juniper berries just roached it. Ditto, BTW for Hangar 24's double IPA, cloyingly sweetened with "local orange blossom honey."

    Maybe the problem isn't so much the experimentation as much as some "divergent" palates among some craft brewers. Mikkeller is plenty experimental, I haven't tasted a single one of their beers that's out of whack.

  18. #18
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    There are plenty of English-style bitters out there, but you might have to find a beer store with a huge selection to find them.

  19. #19
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    i don't understand you Brits, why would you want a beer with lower alcohol, its less cost effective..

    There is a place in Denver that just brews English style beers, to me they all lack flavor and you spend a bunch of $$ catching a buzz because they are so low alcohol..
    BBZ

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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    I'm a Brit now living in the USA and I want to buy beer that is beer. The American version(s) of IPA are way over-hopped compared to the original IPAs and just too bitter for me to enjoy them. Almost everything else I find has some food product or vegetable added to it for no good reason. Other than that, I have the lagers that are leaving me with no taste and wind.
    The stock 'bitter' that the Brits drink as a standard doesn't seem to have made it over here in brewing terms. Or has it? I don't want pumpkin or bourbon casks or ginger or coffee or chili or 9%. Give me 4% with flavour. Is there anything out there?
    What was your go to English made Beer? I know here on the West Coast many bottle shops have a great Selection of imported British beers.

    You might be able to find what you are looking for at your local bottle shop.
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

  21. #21
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    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?

    Quote Originally Posted by billybobzia View Post
    i don't understand you Brits, why would you want a beer with lower alcohol, its less cost effective..

    There is a place in Denver that just brews English style beers, to me they all lack flavor and you spend a bunch of $$ catching a buzz because they are so low alcohol..
    Nothing better than some high abv brew's to end a ride.

  22. #22
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    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?

    What are the names of the beers you used to drink? So far all we know is bitter Brit beer. Maybe if we can know what you were drinking we could help you find something here.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by billybobzia View Post
    i don't understand you Brits, why would you want a beer with lower alcohol, its less cost effective..
    I don't drink to get drunk. I left that behind aged 17.

    I am trying not to just buy imported beers. I want to support local brewers here and drink local beers. My UK beers were Tetley Bitter, Greene King IPA, Theakstons Bitter, Badger Golden Champion, Bath Ales Gem to name a few. I was lucky enough to have lived in the South West for 4 years and developed a taste for real cider and the great variations fermenting apple juice can bring.

  24. #24
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    LOL that's why my boss drinks budlight aka piss water. Likes to drink all day and not get too f'd up. Silly rabbit.

    You should try Lagunitas Imperial Stout

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    I am trying not to just buy imported beers. I want to support local brewers here and drink local beers.
    Good on you for wanting to drink local, and that's why I asked where you lived. I can tell you that if you were here in Seattle, you'd have no problem at all finding the type of beer you're missing. There are at least three breweries I can think of locally that specialize in traditional English-style ales, and a lot of pubs have beer engines around here. (Lots of cider, too.) Hopefully, some VA and/or mid-Atlantic peeps can chime in and point you towards something local.

    That being said, dude...you may just have to adapt a tiny, tiny bit. Nothing is going to taste exactly the same as your olde regular -- that's the beauty of local craft beer. Not saying you have to learn to love every crazy uber-IBU high-grav brew out there; but I'm getting the sense that your nostalgia is going to keep you from trying something new that you might like...

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeePhroh View Post
    I'm getting the sense that your nostalgia is going to keep you from trying something new that you might like...
    Not at all. I am trying the beers but getting to the point where I don't want to buy 6 bottles because I'll have to drink it whether I like it or not.
    Ales - Buy Ale Beer Online | Total Wine & More is my local speciality store - which is no bad thing. Just trying to dodge the IPAs and bloody pumpkin and spiced beer displays!

  27. #27
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    Odell 90 Shilling. You're welcome!
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    Not at all. I am trying the beers but getting to the point where I don't want to buy 6 bottles because I'll have to drink it whether I like it or not.
    Ales - Buy Ale Beer Online | Total Wine & More is my local speciality store - which is no bad thing. Just trying to dodge the IPAs and bloody pumpkin and spiced beer displays!
    I think Total wine will let you mix n match a six pack. Or at the very least sell single bottles.

    I am not sure what all the styles and tasting notes are on the local brews on that side of the country, you might want to pull up Beer Advocate or Rate Beer when in the store and you are curious about a beer. I do that from time to time to get some basic tasting notes and overall score.
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  29. #29
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    Make A Party

    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    I don't want to buy 6 bottles because I'll have to drink it whether I like it or not.
    The crosses we must bear, eh...

    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    Ales - Buy Ale Beer Online | Total Wine & More is my local speciality store - which is no bad thing. Just trying to dodge the IPAs and bloody pumpkin and spiced beer displays!
    No, I definitely hear what you're saying. There's been a lot of talk on this forum about the dominance of high-gravity styles and other brewing gimmicks. And like any trend, there's a bunch of knuckleheads jumping on the craft bandwagon who know way more about marketing than brewing.

    But, the craft beer culture here in the PNW and other beer towns like Portland, SD, Denver, etc. is a lot more nuanced. Sure, there's a lot of "West Coast IPA" and "Bourbon-barrel-aged Imperial Stouts" around; but there's a huge range of styles represented (including a resurgence of lower-grav "session" beers).

    There are more than 160 breweries in Washington State, and more than 10 within walking distance of my house in Seattle. Are they all good? Will they all be around in ten years? Of course not, but with the depth of talent, experience and interest in the pro and semi-pro brewer community, along with the growing demand for quality local beer I'm not worried about the future of the industry. Beer is ingrained in the culture.

    So my best advice to you is to make a party! Foster that beer-culture in Richmond if it's not there yet. Hook into the local beer-geek community, then find a brewer near you and convince them to make what you want. Or start home-brewing and go pro!

  30. #30
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    try some Victory Prima Pils out of PA.
    Yards out of Philly has some english style IPAs
    Founders All Day IPA is low ABV with great hop aroma but not over the top flavor.

  31. #31
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    Try Beer Advocate.com, all you need to know.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    I guess I'm just used to brewers who can make something with depth, taste and character without raiding the pantry for the cake ingredients. Putting chili and other random **** in beer doesn't make any sense whatsoever.
    Are you speaking of English breweries? LOL. English can't make beer for ****. Not everyone lives by some 500 year old purity law, it's mindless tradition like that that has caused American craft breweries to blow right by the Euro breweries in terms of quality.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Stokes View Post
    Are you speaking of English breweries? LOL. English can't make beer for ****. Not everyone lives by some 500 year old purity law, it's mindless tradition like that that has caused American craft breweries to blow right by the Euro breweries in terms of quality.
    Do you talk this much crap all the time or am I a lucky boy? You evidently know nothing of beers from the rest of the world. I take it you haven't travelled much. If you had, you might know that British beer is mostly served on draft and any cask beer doesn't travel well. This would mean that bottled British (not English) beer is not a true reflection of what is available or how it tastes.You'd also know that purity laws are German and don't apply anywhere else, but why let facts get in the way of a cheap jibe?
    If you have any other pearls of wisdom, please share. Just look them up first would you? Thanks.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Stokes View Post
    Are you speaking of English breweries? LOL. English can't make beer for ****. Not everyone lives by some 500 year old purity law, it's mindless tradition like that that has caused American craft breweries to blow right by the Euro breweries in terms of quality.
    One good rule to follow before replying to a post would be to know what you are talking about. I'm sorry, but your comment just screams stupid American.
    Last edited by vxpro; 09-12-2013 at 06:32 PM.

  35. #35
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    That just screams Dumb ass euro

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    Do you talk this much crap all the time or am I a lucky boy? You evidently know nothing of beers from the rest of the world. I take it you haven't travelled much. If you had, you might know that British beer is mostly served on draft and any cask beer doesn't travel well. This would mean that bottled British (not English) beer is not a true reflection of what is available or how it tastes.You'd also know that purity laws are German and don't apply anywhere else, but why let facts get in the way of a cheap jibe?
    If you have any other pearls of wisdom, please share. Just look them up first would you? Thanks.
    I've been around the world. Twice. I've had near misses with STD's you've never heard about in the dirtiest brothels of Thailand. I've drank Ouzo on the porches of complete strangers in Greece, I've drank Habu Sake on the shores of Okinawa in a bottle that housed a real Habu snake. Don't try to tell me about culture or about alcohol. I've been thrown out of or puked in bars on both sides of the equator. English beer is mediocre at best, somewhere between French and Italian. Don't start threads talking **** on American styles of beer when you refuse to accept the truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by vxpro View Post
    I good rule to follow before replying to a post would be to know what you are talking about. I'm sorry, but your comment just screams stupid American.

    I know precisely what I'm talking about. Europeans have bashed American beers for as long as I can remember, now that we have caught up with and surpassed the quality of beer from other countries it's hard for Europeans to accept it. The only style of beer that Americans don't do better than the parent countries of the style are Belgians and Weizens. This is a fact.

  37. #37
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    Don't get all chapped because English beer is as bland as your food.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Stokes View Post
    Europeans have bashed American beers for as long as I can remember, now that we have caught up with and surpassed the quality of beer from other countries it's hard for Europeans to accept it. The only style of beer that Americans don't do better than the parent countries of the style are Belgians and Weizens. This is a fact.
    I don't often agree with Stokes, but when I do, it's because a Limey's been trolling.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Stokes View Post
    I know precisely what I'm talking about.
    So how come you got the purity laws so utterly wrong?

    I want to like American beers. I have come on here actively seeking more information to find something that isn't 9%, isn't over-hopped IPA and doesn't have cake ingredients added. That shouldn't be too hard in your wonderful country.

    You do seem to have travelled, got drunk and come home again. Good on you. I bet you were just as charming everywhere you visited.

  40. #40
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    Alrighty then, let's get back to finding the OP some beers that he might actually enjoy. Here are a few suggestions...
    Bell's: Best Brown Ale - Like most everything from Bell's, it's quite good.
    Rouge: Younger's Special Bitter - Not much of a Rouge fan but this is a fine example of the style.
    Firestone Walker: DBA - Nothing exeptional but a nice everyday 5% Pale Ale.

    Cheers!

  41. #41
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    Hey now...let's everybody just chill the f*k out...

    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?-hugitout.jpg

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeePhroh View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    I agree! But what I am getting tired of all the crappy hop forward/backward IPA's out there, I love a nice well balanced one. It's easy to make a good hoppy IPA, it's not easy to make a great one. So I can sympathize with TooTallUK.

    You always miss the area, food, beer, trails you grow up experiencing. Sometimes change happens fast in some area's, sometimes it takes a little longer. I can tell you if I grew up in Europe...especially Germany then I'd really be freaked out by our beer. Belgian candy sugar, fruit, espresso, spices, etc. ingredients are huge violations and can not even called "beer" over there!
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  43. #43
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    Is there anything that isn't IPA or a gimmick out there?

    Come on out to Denver for a trip. Some good rides and plenty of good beer options (and not all gimmicky).

  44. #44
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    St. George's Brewing in Hampton
    Williamsburg Alewerks
    you can get these at Total Wine
    also visit The Blue Goat in Richmond

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    So how come you got the purity laws so utterly wrong?

    I want to like American beers. I have come on here actively seeking more information to find something that isn't 9%, isn't over-hopped IPA and doesn't have cake ingredients added. That shouldn't be too hard in your wonderful country.

    You do seem to have travelled, got drunk and come home again. Good on you. I bet you were just as charming everywhere you visited.
    Why? Because It was relevant, you were complaining of the additives to beer, So I cited the Purity law being as it only allows hops, grain, yeast, and water. Figured it was something you support. And FTR, IPA's have always been hop-forward. It's pretty interesting that I would have to say this to a Brit. Don't like a strong presence of Hops? Grab a traditional pale. Still to hoppy? Well.... There's always cider.

    And yes, I was charming, broke several hearts on my journeys.

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    New Castle? lol

  47. #47
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    I just fail to see how you are having trouble finding beers that aren't hoppy or with cake ingredients. Where do you live?

    Here in Denver, I have two liquor stores within walking distance from my house that have a HUGE selection of many kinds of beer, probably only 20% fall into the category you loathe.

    I can also walk or ride a bike to at least a dozen breweries in 15 minutes and countless tap houses..

    Again, do you live in a tiny town or something? Beer is easy to find...
    BBZ

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  48. #48
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    Parallel universe on Beeradvocate:

    American Craft Beer Driving Me Back To Imports... | BeerAdvocate Community

    Thanks for the suggestions made so far. I will be searching them out.

  49. #49
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    yes and no..

    There are great American Craft Beers, there are not so great ones and bad ones, just like there are great English beers and bad ones right?

    Trying to find something new and tasty can be overwhelming, but with the internet and beer sites, why risk it, look them up before you buy them.

    I love all beer minus a few styles. I do like hoppy beers but agree there are too many poor ones, but that being said, because everyone makes one there are bound to be some really good ones too.

    I just had two newer ones in the last couple weeks that were pretty good. Alesmith IPA from San Diego (just go to Denver) and 21st amendment IPA from San Fran I think, but you can't get it in Denver.
    BBZ

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    Somebody told me a few days ago that IPA was originally made to export to India and that they added lots of hops to keep it from spoiling. Probably fermented it dry for the highest alcohol as well for the same reason. And light malt for the hot climate.

    Over time I can see how the domestic Brit version became less hoppy and the made in India as well. But the original IPA was supposedly as hoppy as practical.

    So I was told. May be true; may be just a good story.

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