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  1. #1
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    Boo, Hiss Evil Coporate America

    Monster Energy serves up a "cease and desist" notice on Rock Art Brewery.

    http://www.rockartbrewery.com/

    Utterly ridiculous IMO. I really hope that this has a happy ending, spreading the news around the internet and maximizing the negative impact on Monster might make them think twice.

    Personally I can't stand the stuff anyway...

  2. #2
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    This was in my local paper this morning here in Fort Wayne. I'm trying to figure out how I would confuse a canned soft drink to a bottled microbrew.

  3. #3
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    ROCK ART is just down the road from me. It and MONSTER are everywhere here, but I can't see any direct, or indirect, corrolation between the two products. Though I do not drink the 'Energy Drinks' I do ROCK ART. I'll take a tour of the Brewery this weekend and see what is what.

  4. #4
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    Boycott Monster

    The only reason stuff like this succeeds is because we let it. We can vote with our feet and our wallets. A noticeable impact on sales and negative publicity will cost more to Monster in the long run. But saying nothing will only encourage this. What the guy said about "and justice for all who have the deepest pockets" ought to sound alarm bells. Do the right thing.
    "You'll thank me when it's all said and done"

  5. #5
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    read in another forum

    I was just reading about this in a home brew forum http://forum.northernbrewer.com/view...p?f=14&t=80134

    What is this Hansen crew thinking?!!! I never really like that Monster crap anyway; certainly don't now and I can't even get anything from Rock Art here in TN! I say raise a glass for the little guy!

  6. #6
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    Coporate...I LOL.

  7. #7
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    I hope Hansen sent the same notice to Ben and Jerry's ice cream. They have a sundae called the Vermonster, Rock Arts beer doesn't seem to bother them. B & J's would have deep pockets to kick their butts.

  8. #8
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    Looks like some one started a petition to support Rockart here is the link

    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/tel...ller-companies

    And here is a link to Hansen email contact if you wish to send them a direct message

    http://www.hansens.com/contact/

  9. #9
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    This stinks. I'm in. I'll go to the websites and do what I can to show my disgust against the people who make Monster energy drink.

    Unreal.

  10. #10
    Bicyclochondriac.
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    Quote Originally Posted by driver bob
    Monster Energy serves up a "cease and desist" notice on Rock Art Brewery.

    http://www.rockartbrewery.com/

    Utterly ridiculous IMO. I really hope that this has a happy ending, spreading the news around the internet and maximizing the negative impact on Monster might make them think twice.

    Personally I can't stand the stuff anyway...
    Yeah, I saw this on facebook. Sounds like Monster Drinks is following the business model of Specialized Bikes.

  11. #11
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    Three Words and a Hyphen--"Spike Jones Photo-shoot"

  12. #12
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    the petition is up to 543 signatures

    lets show some support for this business tell your friends about it

  13. #13
    Flyin Canine
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    Super lame corporate lawyers going too far. When I would use an energy drink I used to drink monster but not any more. I'll be drinking red bull unless they drop this suit. Take that corporate bastards!

  14. #14
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    **** Monster. why anyone would ingest all that sugar, caffeine, and toxic chemicals is beyond me.

    Water, Glucose, Taurine, Sucrose, Malic Acid, Panax Ginseng Root Extract, L-Cartine, Caffeine, Sodium Citrate, Sodium Benzoate (Preservative), Potassium Sorbate (Preservative), Sucralose, Niacinamide, Natural Flavor, Salt, Inositol, Guarana Seed Extract, Glucuronolactone, Certified Colors, Cyanocobalamin.


    WTF is half of that junk? poisons. oh and btw sucralose "made from sugar" is total bs. since when did sugar have chlorine in it? yes i said CHLORINE, not chloride. you know, the stuff used in swimming pools as a disinfectant. yummy.

  15. #15
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    city water has chlorine in it as well among other things. not that that justifies using it to replace certain atoms in what was a sugar molecule. also consider that table salt also contains chlorine.

    edit: after looking up the chemical structure of sucralose, it is an organocholride. I'm still not saying it's good stuff, I avoid artificial sweeteners as much as possible. I figure the body knows how to process the real stuff better than anything made in lab.

    http://www.ific.org/publications/bro...alosebroch.cfm

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by emtnate
    city water has chlorine in it as well among other things. not that that justifies using it to replace certain atoms in what was a sugar molecule. also consider that table salt also contains chlorine.

    edit: after looking up the chemical structure of sucralose, it is an organocholride. I'm still not saying it's good stuff, I avoid artificial sweeteners as much as possible. I figure the body knows how to process the real stuff better than anything made in lab.

    http://www.ific.org/publications/bro...alosebroch.cfm

    actually, table salt has chloride, not chlorine. big difference.

    and yes city water has chlorine as well as flouride and a bunch of other toxins that they say are harmless and even beneficial. which is why i only drink water filtered using a halfway decent system, such as reverse osmosis in combination with several others.

    there is a reason many countries have outlawed the use of flouride in water supplies, and that's because it's a toxic chemical byproduct of the aluminum manufacturing process. ahh, aluminum, there's another toxic substance, conveniently present in anti-perspirants, cheap cookware, water bottles, lots of places. when you have some time, do a little research on aluminum, flouride, and their links to alzheimers. it's quite startling.

    last time i checked out the ingredients of a multi-vitamin, i saw no mention of chlorine, flouride, or aluminum. don't put that junk in your body, it's poison.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by emtnate
    edit: after looking up the chemical structure of sucralose, it is an organocholride.
    not trying to derail this thread any worse, but i missed this one.

    organocholrides? yea, they are in the pesticide family. do a search. sound safe now?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by salimoneus
    actually, table salt has chloride, not chlorine. big difference.
    I could be way off base here, and if that's the case, so be it, but:

    co2 has Oxygen in it, even though it's spelled out Carbon DiOxide. that would lead me to reason that scientists change the spelling of one of the elements in a compound. I'm pretty sure Sodium Chloride, salt, is sodium and chlorine.


    Not that Monster is anything but a bunch of jack asses with this stuff.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by salimoneus
    yes i said CHLORINE, not chloride. you know, the stuff used in swimming pools as a disinfectant. yummy.
    I think there is some confusion here.

    Sucrolose molecules contain chlorine atoms. That is different from the "chlorine" you stick in your swimming pool. Just because a molecule contains an an element does not mean it has chemical properties of that atom in it's elemental form or in other atoms. Water behaves nothing like oxygen gas or hydrogen gas.

    Not saying that the idea of sucrolose is not a little scary, but not because it contains the stuff you stick in your swimming pool. Countless poisons contain carbon, yet you eat it all the time.

  20. #20
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    Listen, the sucralose gets broken down by your system, and the chlorine is split apart and absorbed. Even though Splenda would like you to think that sucralose is completely inert and passes completely unchanged through your system, that is just not true. A sizable portion of the sucralose that passes through your system IS indeed broken down into it's components. Do a search, the FDA has research proving this, but they are too busy with their own agenda to bother with long term studies and valid scientific findings.

    Did you ever read how Donald Rumsfeld used his influence to push Nutrasweet through the process? Even though there were piles of scientific studies suggesting the stuff should not come anywhere near humans.

    But it's okay, you should trust the FDA, they are only looking out for your best interest right?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by sean salach
    I could be way off base here, and if that's the case, so be it, but:

    co2 has Oxygen in it, even though it's spelled out Carbon DiOxide. that would lead me to reason that scientists change the spelling of one of the elements in a compound. I'm pretty sure Sodium Chloride, salt, is sodium and chlorine.


    Not that Monster is anything but a bunch of jack asses with this stuff.

    The big difference is that salt (NaCl) dissolves into Na+ and Cl− ions. Cl- is chloride not chlorine.

    As per http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/minerals/sodium/

    Sodium (Na+) and chloride (Cl-) are the principal ions in the fluid outside of cells (extracellular fluid), which includes blood plasma. As such, they play critical roles in a number of life-sustaining processes (2).

    When sucralose breaks down, chlorine atoms are released, not chloride.

    I'm not a biologist but there is a difference between the two. One is stable and essential for life, the other is toxic.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by salimoneus
    The big difference is that salt (NaCl) dissolves into Na+ and Cl− ions. Cl- is chloride not chlorine.

    As per http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/minerals/sodium/




    When sucralose breaks down, chlorine atoms are released, not chloride.

    I'm not a biologist but there is a difference between the two. One is stable and essential for life, the other is toxic.
    1- A chloride ion IS a chlorine atom.

    2- Where have you read that the breakdown releases a lone chlorine atom? I have seen claims that the sucrolose can break down, but the chlorine atom is associated with a larger organic compound (the one I have seen refered to is 1,6-dichlorofructose).

    I'm not going to argue whether sucrolose is safe, but your assertion that this has anything to do with the chlorine you throw in your pool is way off base. I have read a few of the concerns about sucrolose, and that is not one of them.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by salimoneus
    not trying to derail this thread any worse, but i missed this one.

    organocholrides? yea, they are in the pesticide family. do a search. sound safe now?
    I think you are really confused....

    All "organochloride" means is that it is an organic molecule with a chlorine atom covalently attached. There are a HUGE variety of them. Some are toxic, some not. You've (naturally) got a whole mess of them in you right now.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kapusta
    1- A chloride ion IS a chlorine atom.

    2- Where have you read that the breakdown releases a lone chlorine atom? I have seen claims that the sucrolose can break down, but the chlorine atom is associated with a larger organic compound (the one I have seen refered to is 1,6-dichlorofructose).

    I'm not going to argue whether sucrolose is safe, but your assertion that this has anything to do with the chlorine you throw in your pool is way off base. I have read a few of the concerns about sucrolose, and that is not one of them.
    Evidence has shown that the chlorine released is actually a part of another complex molecule called dichlorofructose. There is more info about that here and several other places.

    The point is that we just don't know what negative effects can come from exposure to these chlorine based chemical byproducts. They have not been tested extensively, no long term studies have been done. Why would anyone want to take a chance with a compound that is strikingly similar in structure to toxic pesticides is beyond me. Especially with so many natural sweetening alternatives available like Xylitol and Stevia.

    When the Splenda people tell you that sucralose is not absorbed by the body and is completely safe, and then we come to find out that up to 27% of sucralose is potentially absorbed in humans, that sounds like misinformation and outright lies to me.

    But if you feel safe using this stuff, please by all means don't let me stop you. I guess someone needs to be the guinea pigs since apparently the FDA was so quick to pull the trigger with it's blessing.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by salimoneus
    I may have over simplified. When I said the sucralose does indeed get broken down and chlorine is released, evidence has shown that the chlorine released is actually a part of another complex molecule called dichlorofructose. There is more info about that here and several other places.

    The point is that we just don't know what negative effects can come from exposure to these chlorine based chemical byproducts. They have not been tested extensively, no long term studies have been done. Why would anyone want to take a chance with a compound that is strikingly similar in structure to toxic pesticides is beyond me. Especially with so many natural sweetening alternatives available like Xylitol and Stevia.

    But if you feel safe using this stuff, please by all means don't let me stop you. I guess someone needs to be the guinea pigs since apparently the FDA was so quick to pull the trigger with it's blessing.


    I'm not arguing whether it is safe or not, just that giving bugus/misleading info (such as it realeases the same type of chlorine you put in your pool, or that organochlorides are all a type of pesticide) does not serve any useful purpose and hurts your credibility. That was not oversimplification, it was dead wrong.

    Just give the relevant and accurate info (such as what you just gave in the post I am responding to). That's perfectly valid, and is enough to make me think twice about it's safety.

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