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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    Couple of things: I don't think alcohol content has anything to do with the affect on T levels. How many beer devotes also race? My understanding is that beer is unique among alcoholic beverages.

    The main reason I started this thread was due to the oddity of having a beer forum here in the first place. I suppose this site consist of a VERY broad range of members. The sites I compare it to are primarily MMA\MA\boxing and weight lifting sites. Those sites take a very critical stance on beer all due to the negative affects associated with pursuit of the sport(s) in question. I just find it interesting the number of people herein that don't care about the outcome of beer consumption.

    I don't give a darn if you guys drink every day. That's just me, I don't care if you smoke, drink, ram each other in the ass etc and so on. Just an observation that I find it odd so many herein drink beer and seem to also aspire to be fast on a bike. I suppose that last point is where I got off track. How many of you are in the upper echelon of your peers
    on race day and still are OK with regular consumption of beer?

    PS: Why don't some of you sling some more derogatory insults my way, my self esteem is high enough that your "insults" roll right off my back.

    PS2: To the person giving me a negative rep and the comment "dbag dingleberry" over starting this thread. Come on, are you so small minded you can't endure discourse on this topic without resorting to name calling? Why aren't you man enough to set me straight and tell me where I am wrong? I started this thread with serious intent. You might want to get a hormone panel and see if all that beer has caused you a problem.

    Chas chill bro, chill. Us beer forum regulars are just getting a bit tired of the common "beer is bad for you" threads. You just happened to post another one of these. Yes, beer may be bad for you in excess, but I still fail to believe that a beer a night is going to cause me any harm, and there is no convincing me otherwise. That being said, a lot of these threads digress in to petty arguments, where neither side will be convinced to change there stance on the subject. Like most of these threads I am guessing it will divulge in to poo flinging, and therefor after a few more days and I will likely be posting pictures of unicorns, narwhals, and cats to lighten the mood.

    As you yourself just stated; MTBR has an entire sub-forum devoted to beer. It is a staple in much of mountain biking culture. In fact some times it is required to drink alcoholic liquids in some of the single speed races I have attended. I race (less now than before) and have an average of 2 beers a night, weigh 155lbs with 5% body fat. I am the guy who regularly brings beers for post ride parking lot revelry, and have never met anyone who has said "no thanks man, it causes cancer" or "na man im watching my testosterone levels" I have however heard, "thanks but i don't drink" or "no thanks bud, I have a long drive" If these threads were more like how we would react in a parking lot post ride in reality, rather through our anonymous MTBR personas sitting in front of a computer, they would be much more enjoyable. I am game to talk about health risks of beer, I am just getting a bit tired of the negativity that is stemming from it.

    Here is a picture I took of an aid station I assisted at for a local race this summer. It was at the top of the worst climb, and dubbed "bacon hill" for the past 3 years, as the aid station provides bacon, doughnuts, bacon-doughnut sandwiches, coke, gue, beer, and for single speeders Jameson Whiskey. The guy who won the race this year did a wheelie, while taking a shot and eating a piece of bacon.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Beer and your manhood-0915121010a.jpg  

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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guerdonian View Post
    The guy who won the race this year did a wheelie, while taking a shot and eating a piece of bacon.
    Unpossible!

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  3. #53
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    That race just made my short list of races to attend. I need details man!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    Id scrap the passion forum all together, its a breeding ground for unicorn milkers, rainbow chasers and candy cotton farters.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFryauff View Post
    Unpossible!
    I would have said the same if I hadn't seen it myself. There were witnesses. Oh and he got 3rd or 4th overall, but 1st in the Single Speed, should have specified.

    Quote Originally Posted by monzie View Post
    That race just made my short list of races to attend. I need details man!
    Solid race that connects a lot of my local trails. Probably will be competing next year, thought about it this year, but sitting around eating bacon, doughnuts and whiskey while watching others suffer sounded much more enjoyable.
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guerdonian View Post
    Like most of these threads I am guessing it will divulge in to poo flinging, and therefor after a few more days and I will likely be posting pictures of unicorns, narwhals, and cats to lighten the mood.
    Sir, as a regular member of this forum, I am offended by your assertion.


  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeePhroh View Post
    Sir, as a regular member of this forum, I am offended by your assertion.
    LOL,
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  7. #57
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    Peaty cracked a beer before he reached the end of his run at Windham this year...does he still hold the record for the most UCI world cup wins in any discipline?
    MERCY! MERCY! MERCY!

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    Couple of things: I don't think alcohol content has anything to do with the affect on T levels. How many beer devotes also race? My understanding is that beer is unique among alcoholic beverages.

    The main reason I started this thread was due to the oddity of having a beer forum here in the first place. I suppose this site consist of a VERY broad range of members. The sites I compare it to are primarily MMA\MA\boxing and weight lifting sites. Those sites take a very critical stance on beer all due to the negative affects associated with pursuit of the sport(s) in question. I just find it interesting the number of people herein that don't care about the outcome of beer consumption.

    I don't give a darn if you guys drink every day. That's just me, I don't care if you smoke, drink, ram each other in the ass etc and so on. Just an observation that I find it odd so many herein drink beer and seem to also aspire to be fast on a bike. I suppose that last point is where I got off track. How many of you are in the upper echelon of your peers
    on race day and still are OK with regular consumption of beer?

    PS: Why don't some of you sling some more derogatory insults my way, my self esteem is high enough that your "insults" roll right off my back.

    PS2: To the person giving me a negative rep and the comment "dbag dingleberry" over starting this thread. Come on, are you so small minded you can't endure discourse on this topic without resorting to name calling? Why aren't you man enough to set me straight and tell me where I am wrong? I started this thread with serious intent. You might want to get a hormone panel and see if all that beer has caused you a problem.
    As others have stated, Riding Bikes is not a competitive sport for most people who do so, it is just something they like to do for fun that also has good health side effects.

    Have you ever heard of doing a pub crawl by bike?

    Bikes n Beer have a major connection, yes you and a few others might take your biking very seriously and thus you feel that people who drink beer are just ruining their competitive edge, but really if we were pro racers we also would not be drinking beer like we do.

    You have to understand that your OP comes off a bit like you are a troll just trying to stir up a flame war. I know someone else who has made a habit of doing that in this sub-forum over the years.

    As to the negative rep, I always sign my negative and positive rep with my name. I think it shows weak character to attack someone like that without owning up to your words.
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

  9. #59
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    Here's a good summary of alcohol's effects on your hormones, expanding beyond just your sex hormones. Cheers.

    Alcohol Alert From NIAAA

    Hormones are chemical messengers that control and coordinate the functions of all tissues and organs. Each hormone is secreted from a particular gland and distributed throughout the body to act on tissues at different sites. Two areas of the brain, the hypothalamus and the pituitary, release hormones, as do glands in other parts of the body, such as the thyroid, thyroid glands, gonads, pancreas, and parathyroid.

    For hormones to function properly, their amount and the timing of their release must be finely coordinated, and the target tissues must be able to respond to them accurately. Alcohol can impair the functions of the hormone-releasing glands and of the target tissues, thereby causing serious medical consequences.

    Hormones control four major areas of body function: production, utilization, and storage of energy; reproduction; maintenance of the internal environment (e.g., blood pressure and bone mass); and growth and development.

    This Alcohol Alert describes how, by interfering with hormone actions, alcohol can alter blood sugar levels and exacerbate or cause diabetes (1-4); impair reproductive functions (5,6); and interfere with calcium metabolism and bone structure, increasing the risk of osteoporosis (7). Conversely, hormones also may affect alcohol consumption by influencing alcohol-seeking behavior.
    Alcohol's Effects on Hormones

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    You have to understand that your OP comes off a bit like you are a troll just trying to stir up a flame war.
    I understand your point, I am not trolling. For the record I drink beer! I love beer. No, not as much as many herein but I love to drink a cool, I hope this is OK, Shiner Bock.

    I still want to know about the topic of this thread???????

    Why does everyone have to get so defensive? It was an honest question that was primarily motivated when it dawned on my the difference in attitude among a few of the boards I frequent. My gut tells me that mtbr is very much more diverse than the other boards I frequent.

    Still, why can't we just have a straightforward discussion without jumping to the conclusion that I am a troll? I am sorry but I don't buy that this sub-forum is all that troll ridden with people saying beer is unhealthy. My benchmark is the number of threads on the wheel/tire sub-forum arguing about the dangers of ghetto tubeless.
    Nobody cares...........

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    I understand your point, I am not trolling. For the record I drink beer! I love beer. No, not as much as many herein but I love to drink a cool, I hope this is OK, Shiner Bock.

    I still want to know about the topic of this thread???????

    Why does everyone have to get so defensive? It was an honest question that was primarily motivated when it dawned on my the difference in attitude among a few of the boards I frequent. My gut tells me that mtbr is very much more diverse than the other boards I frequent.

    Still, why can't we just have a straightforward discussion without jumping to the conclusion that I am a troll? I am sorry but I don't buy that this sub-forum is all that troll ridden with people saying beer is unhealthy. My benchmark is the number of threads on the wheel/tire sub-forum arguing about the dangers of ghetto tubeless.
    Frankly, I think the rabid defensiveness in this forum is simply because many people here have heavy drinking issues and they are tired of hearing complaints from friends and family about it. The last thing they want to hear in this forum are facts about the downside of alcohol use which are perceived as more of what friends, family and possibly employers and law enforcement are telling them. That and excessive alcohol use causes impaired brain function which makes a lot of people kind of dim-witted. Also, completely ignore Klugejr, everything that's not oblivious happy-talk about beer is a troll to him.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    I still want to know about the topic of this thread???????

    Why does everyone have to get so defensive?

    Still, why can't we just have a straightforward discussion without jumping to the conclusion that I am a troll?
    OK then - you came across as a troll - and you were judgemental. If you can't see that in your subsequent posts, then you need to understand a little more about how others might see you....

    Anyway - I'll bite. Can you please provide me with a link or two so I can understand why you think alcohol reduces my testosterone levels and why that might concern me. I will then look at that and give you a response to your question. I'd not heard of this concern before, so please provide me with what you know. Thanks.

  13. #63
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    I am glad it reduces the big T.

    Been drinking since I was 15, got my third kid last week (now 34).

    Figure I would have 16 or 17 kids by now if it weren't for beer.

    Cheaper to buy beer than feed 17 kids.

  14. #64
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    Here are two:

    Hops Compound May Prevent Prostate Cancer

    Inhibition of testosterone synthesis by etha... [Alcohol. 1989 May-Jun] - PubMed - NCBI

    I did not realize this topic was in dispute. Seems like it is settled in the medical community. The only thing open for discussion is "does it matter to the individual and to what degree is it true".

    I don't understand the need for me to do others research, but those of you that care
    can start here: (Use the search function.)

    Home - PubMed - NCBI

    or perhaps the Journal of Endocrinology or many other scholarly journals.

    The only things I find that are dismissive of the effect are people that "seem" to be biased in favor of beer and drink.

    @lulanok: what does watching TV have to do with this issue? Is there recent coverage about this? I would not know as I typically only use the TV for movies and for 1 or 2 very specific shows. We don't watch much TV around here, I'd rather spent thad time in the gym, on my bike or working. TV is pretty much a waste and/or for the brain dead IMO.

    @TooTallUK: Where, in my original post, was I "judgmental"? I never judged others for drinking beer, hell, I've admitted that I like beer. I will also admit I have greatly curtailed my drinking of ALL alcohol for health reasons. The fact is - I was reaching out to the one group on this board that I thought might have considered the issue. Seems like everyone jumped the gun and got all defensive instead of considering the obvious.
    Nobody cares...........

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    I did not realize this topic was in dispute.
    Here's some fun math based upon the study you linked.

    1.5g/kg alcohol intake as defined in your study requires that someone 175lbs drinks roughly 4 beers:

    Ethanol is 0.789g/ml. An average 12oz. (354.9ml) beer at 5% has approximately 14g of ethanol by the following calculation:

    354.9ml x 5% ethanol x 0.789g/ml = ~14g.

    In order to reach 1.5g/kg, a person weighing 175 lbs (79.38 kg) would have to drink:

    79.38kg / 1.5g/kg = 52.92 g of ethanol, or approximately 3.8 beers.




    Conversely, low amounts of alcohol may increase testosterone levels:

    Testosterone Increases in Men After a Low Dose of Alcohol - Sarkola - 2006 - Alcoholism: Clinical and Experimental Research - Wiley Online Library


    Just some stuff to think about while drinking a beer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thom H View Post
    Oh, just man the heck up. I am 60, and if I could ever catch a cute one, me thinks that ain't the problem. My wife told me to go to the doc and get some of those pills that would help improve our sex life. When I brought her home some diet pills, I was moved out to the couch.
    Now, That's funny.
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  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    Here's some fun math based upon the study you linked.

    1.5g/kg alcohol intake as defined in your study requires that someone 175lbs drinks roughly 4 beers:

    Ethanol is 0.789g/ml. An average 12oz. (354.9ml) beer at 5% has approximately 14g of ethanol by the following calculation:

    354.9ml x 5% ethanol x 0.789g/ml = ~14g.

    In order to reach 1.5g/kg, a person weighing 175 lbs (79.38 kg) would have to drink:

    79.38kg / 1.5g/kg = 52.92 g of ethanol, or approximately 3.8 beers.




    Conversely, low amounts of alcohol may increase testosterone levels:

    Testosterone Increases in Men After a Low Dose of Alcohol - Sarkola - 2006 - Alcoholism: Clinical and Experimental Research - Wiley Online Library


    Just some stuff to think about while drinking a beer.
    Imagine that. Small amounts of alcohol drinking has some positive effects but heavy alcohol drinking greater than current guidelines has some very negative effects. Haven't we heard this somewhere before? Like a hundred times? And this simple message has generated angry and irrational resistance?

    Another dimension to this is that alcohol also increases estrogen levels in both men and women, that's why it's a breast cancer risk factor. I'm enjoying a delicious Bell's Winter White today as my daily testosterone and estrogen raiser.

  18. #68
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    Man, there are a lot of people here who need a beer.
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    You've referenced two research projects. Their subjects? Rats. RATS. Not human beings. I just thought I'd make that clear.

    I think the vast majority of people understand that heavy consumption of alcohol, of any kind, is bad for your health - as your drunken rat buddies demonstrate. All things in moderation. Apart from people trying to make valid points and referencing rats. That is just begging for abuse.

    I wasn't being lazy on the research front - I'd never heard of the 'issue' so wanted to know what had impressed upon you that this was a problem. i also couldn't find anything valid as far as research and evidence goes. Now I know. Rats.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by lostboyscout View Post
    man, there are a lot of people here who need a beer.
    true that!!!
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  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guerdonian View Post
    true that!!!
    Yeah I agree. I feel my nipples and breasts aren't quite perky enough. I better go get my beer/estrogen fix.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TooTallUK View Post
    You've referenced two research projects. Their subjects? Rats. RATS. Not human beings. I just thought I'd make that clear.

    I think the vast majority of people understand that heavy consumption of alcohol, of any kind, is bad for your health - as your drunken rat buddies demonstrate. All things in moderation. Apart from people trying to make valid points and referencing rats. That is just begging for abuse.

    I wasn't being lazy on the research front - I'd never heard of the 'issue' so wanted to know what had impressed upon you that this was a problem. i also couldn't find anything valid as far as research and evidence goes. Now I know. Rats.
    I don't put much stock in or have much concern about the testosterone impacts from my beer consumption (and I do love beer!), but I just had to comment on this as the child of a medical researcher.

    Rats and other lab animals are the primary subjects for MOST medical research. Why? Several reasons. Chief among them is that you can control your inputs on the experiment, which is much harder to do for humans (that is, controlling diet and other environmental factors to know that it is really the alcohol that is creating the outputs you are measuring and not some other factor). Rats and other lab animals also have a shorter life cycle and so you can measure impacts over a lifetime more effectively. You can also selectively breed animals to select for specific traits, genetic propensities, or ensure limited genetic variation in the population studied. And, you can perform an autopsy on the dead animals (for things like Alzheimer's, this is the only way to distinguish it from other forms of dementia, for example). Most if not all of this is difficult or impossible with human test subjects.

    A good deal of research that starts out with animals eventually moves to humans for more long term study. But as far as testing medicines, treatments, disease, etc., using animal test subjects is very reliable and helps researchers get to their conclusions more quickly.

    Performing this research on animals does not make it any less scientifically significant or reliable.

    That said, I have a nice pilsner waiting for me at home. Along with my two children and (satisfied) wife.

    Everything in moderation. Except biking...

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel View Post
    I understand your point, I am not trolling. For the record I drink beer! I love beer. No, not as much as many herein but I love to drink a cool, I hope this is OK, Shiner Bock.

    I still want to know about the topic of this thread???????

    Why does everyone have to get so defensive? It was an honest question that was primarily motivated when it dawned on my the difference in attitude among a few of the boards I frequent. My gut tells me that mtbr is very much more diverse than the other boards I frequent.

    Still, why can't we just have a straightforward discussion without jumping to the conclusion that I am a troll? I am sorry but I don't buy that this sub-forum is all that troll ridden with people saying beer is unhealthy. My benchmark is the number of threads on the wheel/tire sub-forum arguing about the dangers of ghetto tubeless.
    Posting something negative about a hobby/topic in a forum designed around that topic is trolling, whether you think it is or not. tl1 is a specialist at this and refuses to quit. It would be the same if you went into a F1 forum and touted how NASCAR is better, or visa versa. At some point you become a troll who is simply looking to create online controversy by insulting peoples interests. I am sorry you cannot see how your original post did that, but in one quick post you insulted fans of craft beer by making a statement that because we drink beer we are going to have less man juice. Not one study conducted on Humans who drink moderate Beer has ever proven that to be so, it is just not true.

    Quote Originally Posted by tl1 View Post
    Frankly, I think the rabid defensiveness in this forum is simply because many people here have heavy drinking issues and they are tired of hearing complaints from friends and family about it. The last thing they want to hear in this forum are facts about the downside of alcohol use which are perceived as more of what friends, family and possibly employers and law enforcement are telling them. That and excessive alcohol use causes impaired brain function which makes a lot of people kind of dim-witted. Also, completely ignore Klugejr, everything that's not oblivious happy-talk about beer is a troll to him.
    I am guessing you are referring to me, Klurejr, but go ahead and misspell my online handle.

    I am not a binge drinker, nor am I a heavy drinker. At most I drink 20-30oz of beer in a week.

    However I can state with certainty that you tl1 are a troll in the beer forum who wont quit because you continue to get a rise out of people. This is the last thing I will ever respond to you, you are a troll, go away.
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    This.





    Also to the OP, Drinking in moderation will not reduce a mans testosterone. If it was truly an issue men would of stopped being able to make babies a long time ago. You do realize beer has been around longer than trumped up studies.
    Ha! I love it, I got an unsigned neg rep for this post that just said "troll"

    very clever whoever you are, very clever.......
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    Posting something negative about a hobby/topic in a forum designed around that topic is trolling, whether you think it is or not.
    Your logic is flawed. You're effectively saying that if there was say a mountain bike part that consistently failed when used hard and heavily, putting people's health, well being and life at risk then honestly posting about it would somehow be trolling and an outrage to the people that really liked that particular bike part. Beer/alcohol is exactly like that. If used very lightly and sparingly it's fine, if used hard and heavily it fails and is very damaging to human health. That is the complete sum of my message about beer. The hysterical responses to the facts are actually the only trolling going on.

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