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  1. #1
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    Rune: 1x10, short cage, and chain growth

    The online community thinking about the possibility of using a short cage rear deraileur with a 10speed 11-36 is a bit mixed, based upon my review of mtbr.com and the intraweb nets. However, I did find one thread that pointed to the 2011 Specialized Stumpjumper 29er EVO using a 11-36 10 speed with a SRAM X.0 short cage and a 33t front ring...

    http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...cname=Mountain

    I am building a up Rune and wish to run a similar set up, only with an LG1+ and a 32t. The only hiccup I can see is the chain growth might muck up the works.

    So, what kind of chain growth does the Rune have? Would it be appreciable enough to inhibit use of a short cage 10 speed rear deraileur? Is anyone running this set up successfully?

    I am coming off a Heckler that was set up 12-34 9 speed, 32/22t front, and a 105 short cage. When setting this up, "chain wrap" seemed to be the key measurement. I really like the short cage approach, since I tend to use the rear of the bike to determine how many rocks I and rub against.

  2. #2
    Sov
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    I have a short cage 9sp Saint derailleur on my Rune. Not exactly what you're looking at, but similar.

    It will not work with the 11-34 cassette I have on at the moment due to the amount of chainstay growth the Rune has. I have to lock out the 34t cog to have chain tension in the 11t cog (which is fine as I primarily shuttle this bike anyway.)

    I'm pretty certain your safest bet with 11-36 10sp would be to run a mid cage derailleur.

  3. #3
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    bear in mind that the saint short cage is even shorter than the X0 shortcage...

  4. #4
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    Rune has defo more chain growth than the spec. From what I remember their bikes have quite little growth(not thats a good thing). Why not go with a longer cage shadow derail? They are a bit harder to hit.
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  5. #5
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    I ran a 1x10 set up with a X9 short cage. Make sure to size the chain correctly. The 1st time I set it up, I used the standard size method (big ring+big cog+ 2 links) and ended up breaking the derailleur and hanger. Once I sized it correctly, it was fine.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brisco Dog
    I ran a 1x10 set up with a X9 short cage. Make sure to size the chain correctly. The 1st time I set it up, I used the standard size method (big ring+big cog+ 2 links) and ended up breaking the derailleur and hanger. Once I sized it correctly, it was fine.
    What was your ball park remedy for "sizing it correctly"? 4 links as opposed to 2?

  7. #7
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    I used the standard sizing method, but compressed the suspension. When the chain was at its longest, I then added 2 links.

  8. #8
    FM
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    Best way to figure chain length, is to remove a shock bolt, fully compress the suspension,then make the chain just long enough to run big/big. Then you are not guessing.

    I run a medium cage on my 1x9 with a 36t big cog personally....works great!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM
    Best way to figure chain length, is to remove a shock bolt, fully compress the suspension,then make the chain just long enough to run big/big. Then you are not guessing.

    I run a medium cage on my 1x9 with a 36t big cog personally....works great!
    In most modern bikes the chainstay is the longest at sag, not at bottom out
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  10. #10
    Err
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    Think this has pretty much been answered but...
    - Med cage rear der for the Rune with 1x10 (11-36)
    - Sag the suspension with the chain on your largest front and rear cogs and measure chain length ,there is a lot of growth on the Rune so it's particularly important to get this right.

  11. #11
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    Thanks for the response everyone.

    So, after some more home work (called SRAM tech line) and referencing the website...

    The way SRAM calculated compatibility is as follows:
    1. Add the differences between the biggest and smallest gears of the cogset and front rings.
    2. If the difference is <30t, short cage
    If the difference is 30-37, medium cage
    If the difference is >37, long cage
    (general guidance, results may very per application)

    Example:
    34/22 front rings and 11-36 rear cog
    34-22=12, 36-11=25, 12+25=37t, so a medium cage will work, but at the top limit

    Based on this approach, a single front 32t with a 11-36 cog falls into the short cage...kind of. I doubt if you could slam a single 55t Tri ring on there and call it a day. The SRAM tech seemed like it wouldn't be an issue. Still, I can help but worry about the chaingrowth. Two deraileurs were purchased (medium and a shorty). More to follow, starting with the modfied approach mentioned above.

    Norbar...shine on you crazy diamond. Love the avatar. Not sure about that long cage shadow suggestion. Real world results tell me other wise. The bottom of the cage is about an inch away from rim.

  12. #12
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    I wouldn't hesitate to run a short cage if I were going 1x9. Just make sure the chain is as tight as you can get it within reason in big/big and check it by cycling the suspension.

  13. #13
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    to setup for chain growth just measure the chain with the suspension bottomed out, done!
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  14. #14
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    as it was said before, the chain growth is not the biggest when the bike is bottomed out...
    more like halfway thu the travel...

  15. #15
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    simple solution, get the chain where you think it should be, then cycle the suspension with the shock out. if it binds, the solution is pretty simple, add chain.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalcolmX View Post
    as it was said before, the chain growth is not the biggest when the bike is bottomed out...
    more like halfway thu the travel...
    That depends on the suspension design. As you can see here, when the Runes suspension compresses more the chain growth increases. Although if we were to be 100% sure we should ask Keith. Awfully friendly he is!



    This is the new Rune obviously, but as far as I can see the same goes for the old one. So! I would disconnect the shock and find out where chain growth is most. And I would use the short cage X0
    Why are my shins so scarred..?

  17. #17
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    Old thread reborn here, but the question is an important one.

    The chain growth is most at bottom out, on the rune V2 the chain length required just to cope with the chain stretch is about 45mm, but I'd advise allowing for 60mm to avoid issues with gears. This is about the limit for a short cage derailleur to cope with if using a 1x10 setup with mega range cassette. You should always check by either removing the shock and cycling frame through full travel (to the point where the frame self collides) or if you have more time, then take all the air out of the shock and compress to bottom out... but remember that allowing full travel is not quite enough, you need to have at least 10mm of spare chain length to cope with changing gears at the extremes.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by builttoride View Post
    Old thread reborn here, but the question is an important one.

    The chain growth is most at bottom out, on the rune V2 the chain length required just to cope with the chain stretch is about 45mm, but I'd advise allowing for 60mm to avoid issues with gears. This is about the limit for a short cage derailleur to cope with if using a 1x10 setup with mega range cassette. You should always check by either removing the shock and cycling frame through full travel (to the point where the frame self collides) or if you have more time, then take all the air out of the shock and compress to bottom out... but remember that allowing full travel is not quite enough, you need to have at least 10mm of spare chain length to cope with changing gears at the extremes.
    So Keith, just to be clear: it's ok to use RuneV2 with new Shimano Zee short cage (11-36 version), chainguide and 11-36 cassette?

  19. #19
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    I'll answer for Keith

    It really depends on combination of chainring size, used chain devices and derailleur settings/geometry. It should, but on most toxic case you might be on the edge of the mech capacity.

    I personally am going to use Zee DH mech with 11-36 cassette and 35T front cog. If you are patient enough then wait until my frame arrives It should be at my doorstep shortly ( shortly = when the next batch of runes leaves the friendly shores of Taiwan + travel time).

  20. #20
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    ^^^^^ Nailed it!^^^^^

    That isn't a question I can answer really, as it depends on a number of factors. Generally I recommend running at least a Med cage derailleur to be safe.
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  21. #21
    ptd
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    Following works for me: 11-36 with 34 front and saint on v2.

  22. #22
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    i run 1 x 10 on mine with a short cage x9 type 2, 11-36 cassette, and 32t front with no issues.

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