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  1. #1
    FM
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    Prime Anticipation

    Great article on NSMB.

    The last thing MTBR needs is another 26 vs. 29'er debate, but I think this article does a great job covering the direction 29'ers are heading in, objectively. Gets me very excited for the Prime....

    Piledriver drop on a 29'er? That's ridiculous.
    Scared the living crap out of me on a 40lb, 26" FR bike....

  2. #2
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    Good read, but I'd have to tend to agree with some of the comments posted that the riders mentioned are all pros or close enough, so what they can do with any bike is above what most will be able to do. One main example of utter BS is Wade Simmons, he clearly stated that 29ers could never ride the shore and would never ride one, that is until his sponsor started making them, then his tune changed - paid and full of **** is what he is.

    Me, I'm a 29er rider, through and through, I will never ride a 26" wheeled bike again. Am so looking forward to the Prime and for that matter all of the other AM/Trail bikes coming out for 2012, it proves that the market is there and the hype isn't just hype. My only concern, (but I committed, so I will stick with it) is getting the XL with a wheelbase 3" longer than anything I've ridden before. ETT is only 1/4" longer than my Paradox (although on the geo chart is says the reach is 26mm more) , so a stem length drop of somewhere between 30-40mm and nice wide bars should do the trick, but I'm guessing it'll take a bit more muscle to get around the tight stuff, but man oh man will it be stable on the fast descents
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  3. #3
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    Personally, I wouldn't call that BS...just one rider changing his mind as the result of the evolution of 29" bikes. He certainly could be riding a slayer if he preferred smaller wheels.

    There's a lot of things which have been missing from the 29'er spectrum which are pretty much mandatory for agressive riding... namely forks and wheels that aren't flexy, weak pieces of shite. The industry is still behind the ball in a few areas, but I think people like Wade having been late adopters, is simply down to the fact that the previously offered 29'er packages mostly did suck for aggressive riding. Hence my excitement for the Prime.

  4. #4
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    Again, full of it Wade Simmons Loves 29ers - YouTube says nothing of lack of advancements, just there's just no advantage - he rides what Rocky wants him to ride and help sell. Now Keith on the other hand is an honest guy who believes in this project, but still will stick to his guns and say he doesn't believe 29ers should go further than this AM/.Trail segment, and I respect him immensely for that - but look forward to the day he maybe changes his mind Same for Dave Turner, he said he wouldn't build a 29er, but then did and admitted he did it because it was just $tupid not to as too many people wanted one $$$$$.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Personally, I wouldn't call that BS...just one rider changing his mind as the result of the evolution of 29" bikes. He certainly could be riding a slayer if he preferred smaller wheels.
    What I will say is that I am looking forward to what riders like you and others on here and other sites, who have been 26er die-hards have to say when it's their own hard cash that has to purchase the bike and they're not a sponsored rider who benefits from giving props. Me personally, I think I represent the segment of the market of riders who really love riding, but who are not naturally gifted with the talent and have to work exceedingly hard just to even hang on the wheel of better riders - I'd guess it's a big segment, the weekend warriorish type. I've been told I do have the skill, but lack the positive attitude and confidence to use it and I can vouch for that, when you're self employed and haven't seen real work in forever and no medical insurance you ride very cautiously, but I'm hoping I can push the Prime a bit and provide some useful feedback on it .


    There's a lot of things which have been missing from the 29'er spectrum which are pretty much mandatory for agressive riding... namely forks and wheels that aren't flexy, weak pieces of shite. The industry is still behind the ball in a few areas, but I think people like Wade having been late adopters, is simply down to the fact that the previously offered 29'er packages mostly did suck for aggressive riding. Hence my excitement for the Prime.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  5. #5
    FM
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    I dunno. That video of Wade was posted in May 2007. I think it's fair to say 29'ers (as complete bikes, not just the wheelsize) were useless for Wade's riding style at that time.

    Things have changed. Just because he's a sponsored pro, doesn't mean he can't change opinions as things progress.

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    IIRC...that video of Wade was to be viewed tongue in cheek. There were folks (in the know) at the time commenting that he was simply "having fun" with the soap opera level of drama involved with 29 versus 26 discussions. Rumor had it, at the time, he had spent significant time on the fruit hoops & was digging them (off the record, of course!).

    PS. Look-See...See, in particular, post #44


  7. #7
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    Thanks for posting JNC, that makes a lot more sense.

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    Your average 5-6" 29er with any thing slacker then a 70 degree HA will be more then sufficient for most rolling, Shore trails. On Fromme where the ability to shuttle is unavailable I think there has been an evolution from your "Shore" bike to more pedal friendly all mountain bike. On a recent ride on Fromme ,out of six bikes, three were 29ers. Another one of the 26er riders has since purchased a 29er also. This would have been unheard only 18 months ago and will probably become more common as the new bunch of 29ers become available. Check out Lee Lau's videoes on Vimeo for lots of 29ers on the shore
    bikesonburke

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    lol I am about 95% certain Wade is taking the piss with his comments in that video.

    You are reading too much into it LyNx. Wade loves to joke around.

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    I remember when Leel was first testing the RM Altitude and all those pics, but not that thread I took the video as it seemed and I may have a biased view on the FR crowd and just took the laughing for self pompus ******s the likes a lot of the PB kids on 29er wheels. The explanation makes it clearer and I'll taker back what I said, especially after reading this little bit from NSMB, but I still hold true that Wade saying they're great doesn't mean anything to me since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly. That he gives them a nod will however maybe bring some of those PBesc type attitudes around to giving the 29" wheel a try.

    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter View Post
    IIRC...that video of Wade was to be viewed tongue in cheek. There were folks (in the know) at the time commenting that he was simply "having fun" with the soap opera level of drama involved with 29 versus 26 discussions. Rumor had it, at the time, he had spent significant time on the fruit hoops & was digging them (off the record, of course!).

    PS. Look-See...See, in particular, post #44
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

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    Not to 'come to his rescue', coz he's a bro, but Wade is genuinely stoked on the 29er. It is pretty much all he has been riding the past year or so. Although, he is much more of pedaller than shuttler than you'd think.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly.
    Wade could ride a 12" wheeled bike up those trails and make the average rider look silly as well. But then... I look silly riding with no help from Wade, so it's a moot point.

    Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.

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    I feel quite similar with the Paradox, except I have no squish to fall back on and while it is true I have a big grin after rides, I also am feeling it from the workout a HT gives you on rough/tech trails. As to 29ers in tech, I can honestly say that when I first switched from 26" FS to 29" FS I could not believe the climbs I was making that I'd had trouble making before on the 26" FS running Nevegals, while only running WTB Nanos on the 29er FS. Since getting the Paradox tech has become even more fun as it's just so nimble and easy to move around. Seems like maybe I need to visit where ever it is that Leel likes to ride/climb, as well honestly I think I prefer the challenge of a tech climb or pretty much flat/rolling trail to the descents, it's just that bit more challenging since fitness also plays a big part.

    So, what parts have you managed to squirrel away? Sadly my Paradox will be a donor of most of it's good parts to the Prime and then what ever I have around will go on the Paradox. Only thing I have really got for the Prime (and now want for all my bikes) is a 750mm wide FUNN Fatboy bar. Thinking I'm going to give a try with a nice 60mm Truvativ Hussefelt stem. Other than that it would be nice to have all new parts, but what parts I do have on the Paradox (wheels, drivetrain, cockpit etc) I am quite happy with, only other new thing I am signed up for is a new F34 fork.

    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    ..................Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.



    ...and less we forget, they're to go on this ..........
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So, what parts have you managed to squirrel away?
    Well, I was going to grab parts off my Curtlo AM Hardtail (Wifes bike), but with the wait I've been finding some good deals on used stuff. Picked up some formula the ones (older versions), straitline stem, new set of sunline bars, king headset. It may come out pretty bling. Still stealing the wheels, cranks, pedals seat & post off my other bikes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    I remember when Leel was first testing the RM Altitude and all those pics, but not that thread I took the video as it seemed and I may have a biased view on the FR crowd and just took the laughing for self pompus ******s the likes a lot of the PB kids on 29er wheels. The explanation makes it clearer and I'll taker back what I said, especially after reading this little bit from NSMB, but I still hold true that Wade saying they're great doesn't mean anything to me since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly. That he gives them a nod will however maybe bring some of those PBesc type attitudes around to giving the 29" wheel a try.
    you know lynx when you don't take 29er criticism to heart you are a much nicer guy. just realize not everyone drinks the 29er koolaid. everyone has their reasons for liking a particular bike or wheel size. we all ride mtb, what you ride it on means dick

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Wade could ride a 12" wheeled bike up those trails and make the average rider look silly as well. But then... I look silly riding with no help from Wade, so it's a moot point.

    Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.
    It's great to have another proselyte!!!
    Keep the cult alive

    Seriously tho...I think DH'ers make the best converts, since we have been used to turning bikes with our hips & can easily take advantage of the upgrade in handling/traction in techy terrain. Seamlessly translating the 29er benefits, while easily overcoming any inherent shortcomings.

    My AM HT 29er rules the roost, but the Sultan is a welcome change of pace for the more challenging all day rides. Unfortunately, I wasn't selected for the Prime test group, but I look forward to throwing a leg over one at some point
    Last edited by jncarpenter; 11-02-2011 at 04:07 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post



    Hussefelt stem is nice, until you look at the weight

    Best bang for the buck weight savings on my bike was to get rid of the 330gr lump of alu and replace it with 150gr instead

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    29er riders are worse than Baptists.

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    Yeah, yeah, I know, also nicer when there's work and money to pay the bills etc I don't mind criticism, it's those who don't, or won't even give them a try yet seem to enjoy bashing them that get to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    you know lynx when you don't take 29er criticism to heart you are a much nicer guy. just realize not everyone drinks the 29er koolaid. everyone has their reasons for liking a particular bike or wheel size. we all ride mtb, what you ride it on means dick
    Yeah, I figure as much, but as with the current heavy OEM Cdale 90mm stem I have on the Paradox, it's there for fit (or for loaner bikes) and if it works didn't cost me a lot and I'll then get a nice one when the $$ allow it.
    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    Hussefelt stem is nice, until you look at the weight

    Best bang for the buck weight savings on my bike was to get rid of the 330gr lump of alu and replace it with 150gr instead
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkslide18 View Post
    29er riders are worse than Baptists.
    Perhaps... but as a whole, we are a lot more fun to drink beer with.

  21. #21
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    But not as bad as 7 days adventist and yes we'll drink a beer or other beverage with you, no matter what wheel size you chose to ride

    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Perhaps... but as a whole, we are a lot more fun to drink beer with.
    Quote Originally Posted by darkslide18 View Post
    29er riders are worse than Baptists.
    Last edited by LyNx; 11-03-2011 at 12:22 PM.
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    I'm not in the market for a 29"er (or another bike) but I definitely like seeing videos of them on more tech terrain & the frames that are coming soon, DEFINITELY look better than all the XC bikes I've seen locally (Trek, Speesh mostly)!

    Alot of the riders on my local XC trails have said they like them because they roll over everything so easy which confused me because none of the trails have all that much to roll over...

    Seems like 29" would be best for those riders who are looking at 6 ft n' over. That's what I think whever I see the bikes....

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    Must... resist.... replacing....my aging 2010 FSR 29...
    When will the frame be available? Are they gonna be sold out within the first month?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Haunted View Post
    Must... resist.... replacing....my aging 2010 FSR 29...
    When will the frame be available? Are they gonna be sold out within the first month?
    people are still waiting for the proto frames. i imagine 2012 before this sees production. maybe keith can chime in if earlier than that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    people are still waiting for the proto frames. i imagine 2012 before this sees production. maybe keith can chime in if earlier than that.
    Darn, not what I wanted to hear. If that is the case, then I'm willing to bet that the production frame won't be available until September 2012

  26. #26
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    Actually the frames are not really Protos, just pre-production because Banshee likes to make sure they get it right before the start production, so 60 or so lucky people get basically a production frame & shock for a nominal fee, including shipping about the world, instead of retail and all they need to do is ride them and provide feedback to Banshee. I think they'll give the testers about 3 months so they have good time to eval them and the production, which will already be tooled and setup will get rolling.

    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    people are still waiting for the proto frames. i imagine 2012 before this sees production. maybe keith can chime in if earlier than that.
    Quote Originally Posted by wheel-addict View Post
    Darn, not what I wanted to hear. If that is the case, then I'm willing to bet that the production frame won't be available until September 2012
    Last edited by LyNx; 11-04-2011 at 02:08 PM.
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  27. #27
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    regardless, I really think it will be worth the wait. The Satori and Bandit 29'er look great (as does the Shinobi)... I would think the Prime probably is requiring more time and R&D, with the KS-link and more pivots, new axle system etc. I'm happy riding my current bikes till the prime comes out, since I think the KS link will ride significantly better.

    Stoked as I am, snow is falling in the mountains here, so it really doesn't matter if it comes next week or next spring, it's going to be next season before I can get it up here.

    (sorry to rehash these pics, they were highlights of my summer! )




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    ... and if we just ...

    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Actually the frames are not really Protos, just pre-production because Banshee likes to make sure they get it right before the start production, so 60 or so lucky people get basically a production frame & shock for a nominal price including shipping about the world, instead of retail and all they need to do is ride them and provide feedback to Banshee. I think they'll give the testers about 3 months so they have good time to eval them and the production, which will already be tooled and setup will get rolling.
    I was on the list at one time after some emails with jay. Haven't heard much on delivery and I'm not sure I'm still in line anymore after being disappointed in my current Banshee's pivots having issues. I'd still like to see one as being a current owner who has had frame issues it'd be nice to compare the newer bearing setup against the old bushing system. Jay had said he had forwarded my name for the list to Keith but Keith still hasn't confirmed either way if I'm getting a Prime or not.

    As much as I'm pi$$ed at the current situation regarding the bushings I still want Banshee to do well and move on to better things and keep making good bikes. I'm giving the Trner a chance because I'm not thrilled with waiting for a fix that I'm not sure will solve the current gushing issues. I want a reliable ride and right now I can't say that about my Rune or spitty
    Last edited by qbert2000; 11-04-2011 at 02:45 PM.

  29. #29
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    Holy crap, where exactly is that dude? Absolutely fantastic, would love to ride there someday. Think I might even give up pretty much year 'round riding if I had views like that to ride to.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    .......Stoked as I am, snow is falling in the mountains here, so it really doesn't matter if it comes next week or next spring, it's going to be next season before I can get it up here.
    (sorry to rehash these pics, they were highlights of my summer! )

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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Holy crap, where exactly is that dude? Absolutely fantastic, would love to ride there someday. Think I might even give up pretty much year 'round riding if I had views like that to ride to.
    Angel's staircase, near Twisp, Wa.
    Lots of other great trails in that area, here are a few. This will all be prime prime territory

    That is the con of living here though, those rides are only snow-free for 8-12 weeks every year. But in the winter we have a lot more low-elevation stuff that is less XC and more flow style, all mountain, skills park stuff. It just gets wet, and I end up doing the majority of off-season riding at night (using off-season daylight hours for trail work).



    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10323561@N07/6202292343/" title="IMG_2463 by emailsucks98, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6152/6202292343_fe056bf0f6_b.jpg" width="807" height="1024" alt="IMG_2463"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10323561@N07/5070502948/" title="IMG_3608 by emailsucks98, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4126/5070502948_60e18a78ff_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="IMG_3608"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10323561@N07/3921703910/" title="IMG_4761 by emailsucks98, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2520/3921703910_429c7eaed9_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="IMG_4761"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10323561@N07/3921706846/" title="pp3 by emailsucks98, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2662/3921706846_d759cfb7e0_b.jpg" width="1024" height="312" alt="pp3"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10323561@N07/4010200429/" title="IMG_4849 by emailsucks98, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2470/4010200429_6f3b57d7a6_b.jpg" width="1024" height="575" alt="IMG_4849"></a>

  31. #31
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    I'm jealous.
    konahonzo

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    Nice, really nice FM, looks like a lot of trails that I'd like. Curious, the pic I quoted, you don't happen to have it without the bike and looking slightly to the right of the one with the bike? Would make an excellent desktop image.
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  33. #33
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    Sure thing, take your pic(k)!
    A few to choose from, look here and here. You can download the images in whichever size you like from Flickr.

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    Thanks. My next trip away I think I'm going to have a heavy pack on some days and have to ride a bit more careful than usual as I'll be luggin my D7000 around to capture some images like those

    BTW, forgot to say, like the Curtlo, he does really nice work at some damn good prices. Have considered getting him to do me a steel AM geo HT, but with some couplers to make it travel-able
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Sure thing, take your pic(k)!
    A few to choose from, look here and here. You can download the images in whichever size you like from Flickr.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

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    New question here. 44mm, 48mm or 51mm offset???

    OK, so in anticipation have been doing a bit of digging since that damn Micro Ti 44 deal keeps coming up in threads and here's what I found and what I want to know.........The 44 Micro Ti uses a 44mm offset, the new Fox F34 uses a 51mm offset and my current Minute uses a 48mm offset So which direction should I go for more travel and slacker HA if I already like my Minute? I'm thinking the Fox will behave better than the 44 Ti and more like my 120 Minute on the Paradox. Anyone who actually gets the whole offset thing care to chime in?
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    If A-C Values are same the fork with longer offset is slacker.

    If you want exact values that would require maths and... well, cba, tbh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    If A-C Values are same the fork with longer offset is slacker.
    I think that's backwards. A further offset to the front would steepen the HA. The axle is raised since the fork is at an angle and the further the offset, the more the axle has to drop, steepening the HA. That how it appears to me anyways.
    "Don't feel bad. A lot of people have no talent"

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    Er right, serves me right writing stuff too tired, meant to say _shorter_ offset is slacker, if a-c values are same, i think i got it right this time, maybe?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    OK, so in anticipation have been doing a bit of digging since that damn Micro Ti 44 deal keeps coming up in threads and here's what I found and what I want to know.........The 44 Micro Ti uses a 44mm offset, the new Fox F34 uses a 51mm offset and my current Minute uses a 48mm offset So which direction should I go for more travel and slacker HA if I already like my Minute? I'm thinking the Fox will behave better than the 44 Ti and more like my 120 Minute on the Paradox. Anyone who actually gets the whole offset thing care to chime in?
    You may want to ask in the shocks forum, but I went from a 41.5 mm offset on the minute to 48 mm on the same fork (new 20mm TA lowers) and liked the handling with the increased offset. I'm thinking with the slacker head angle, you'd want at least the 48mm offset if not more. You'll notice that longer forks usually have more offset due to being used on bikes with slacker head angles (39mm for a reba as opposed to 42 mm on a boxxer [both for 26
    ' forks - 29er reba has more offset]).
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    Yeah I'm counting on that too, figure the extra 3mm offset should help "offset" the slacker geo and help keep the steering similar, but know it's not just the fork/HA/offset that determines how a bike handles, the roughly 3/4" longer than Paradox stays will also help to slow the bike down a bit in terms of handling speed I think, so maybe it'll require a bit more body english or will the much shorter stem I plan on running help compensate

    Yeah, I was a bit shocked when I move from the 100mm Reba with 38mm offset to the new 120mm Minute on the rip9 and the steering actually felt a bit faster even though I'd slacked out the HA about 3/4*- had not realised that the 20mm TA offset was 48mm as compared to the QR version 44mm. I also built the Paradox up initially with the old 100mm Reba and then the 120 Minute and again same thing as before, felt much better, more confidence steering, but a bit faster - some of this, actually probably alot can be attributed to the 20mm TA as compared to the QR on the Reba and getting immediate response and very little lag on input.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jwiffle View Post
    You may want to ask in the shocks forum, but I went from a 41.5 mm offset on the minute to 48 mm on the same fork (new 20mm TA lowers) and liked the handling with the increased offset. I'm thinking with the slacker head angle, you'd want at least the 48mm offset if not more. You'll notice that longer forks usually have more offset due to being used on bikes with slacker head angles (39mm for a reba as opposed to 42 mm on a boxxer [both for 26
    ' forks - 29er reba has more offset]).
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    I just bounced new WB Loop at LBS, very-very smooth for un-unsed fork, looks real nice in white, also i think offset on the Loop is 44mm.

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    Tapered steerer? Stanchions any bigger than 32mm? What's the cost? AFAIK they're not far off the Foxs.

    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    I just bounced new WB Loop at LBS, very-very smooth for un-unsed fork, looks real nice in white, also i think offset on the Loop is 44mm.
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    It is 32mm and the weight was 2kg on the mark with uncut steerer+axle, it didnt seem flexy... although these are the things when you only notice when you push the said item in trails real life.. i also liked the tapered axle system.

    I dunno, i'd say our lbs guy has them more of and RS price range than Fox, Fox is uber expensive here.

    And yup, tapered steerer, the adjustment knobs were nice solid alu like on Fox. Lower legs had tapered bulge on the where the bearings were etc.

  44. #44
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    Well if you get a chance to actually ride on one, please report back.

    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    It is 32mm and the weight was 2kg on the mark with uncut steerer+axle, it didnt seem flexy... although these are the things when you only notice when you push the said item in trails real life.. i also liked the tapered axle system.

    I dunno, i'd say our lbs guy has them more of and RS price range than Fox, Fox is uber expensive here.

    And yup, tapered steerer, the adjustment knobs were nice solid alu like on Fox. Lower legs had tapered bulge on the where the bearings were etc.
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    Will do!

    Oh yeah, the Aura does work as advertised, when you put the 'lock out' on you can hear the oil squished thru really slowly the damping circuit when moving the fork slow, when you give it sharp input the compression releases instant, no lag or delay which is very cool feature.

    I say 'lock out' because it really isn't really a lock out, but it turns up the slow speed compression to a crawl, until a hit opens the valving and it moves freely.

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    New question here. Headset

    OK, I'm officially getting seriously POd trying to find the right headset for the Prime, seems as though you can easily find a ZS44/49EC tapered headset, or ZS44/ZS56 tapered, or full external 1.125-1.5", but for the %$^@#&@ life of me I cannot easily find a ZS49 upper/EC49 lower headset, only solution I'm finding is to buy both headsets and use the top from one and bottom from another Anyone have links to anything? I know what I need - ZS49/EC49 - but seems not many/any carry them or at least where I look doesn't
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    thought it was 44mm upper

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    Unless it has changed since the last time I talked to Keith, he said it would be a straight 1.5" (49/49) Traditional headtube like the Rune and that the production ones would maybe be 44/49 tapered like the Spitfire. All I'm finding easily in the ZS49/EC49 configuration is damned expensive anglesets. Only geo adjustments I plan on trying are those offered by the frame and running it with my Minute 120mm using a 49-30 crown race adapter.
    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    thought it was 44mm upper
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    When I needed the same headset, Chad at Red Barn pieced together what I needed. He said Cane Creek will sell uppers and lowers separately.
    "Don't feel bad. A lot of people have no talent"

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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Unless it has changed since the last time I talked to Keith, he said it would be a straight 1.5" (49/49) Traditional headtube like the Rune and that the production ones would maybe be 44/49 tapered like the Spitfire. All I'm finding easily in the ZS49/EC49 configuration is damned expensive anglesets. Only geo adjustments I plan on trying are those offered by the frame and running it with my Minute 120mm using a 49-30 crown race adapter.
    If all else fails:

    Nuke Proof Warhead 49IETS Headset 2011 | Buy Online | ChainReactionCycles.com

    Nukeproof 49IETS

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunerinaz View Post
    When I needed the same headset, Chad at Red Barn pieced together what I needed. He said Cane Creek will sell uppers and lowers separately.
    Yup. I bought a CC 40 from him for my Yelli Screamy, and that's how it worked.

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    Hey Lynx, check out Universalcyles.com, they sell Cane Creek lowers and uppers separately as well.
    konahonzo

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    Hum, thought I had checked them, but my browsing history says otherwise My problem is that for online I keep most of my shopping in one place so CC info stays safe, but have thought of venturing to another store as well, might give AE Bike a shot, they have good prices and AFAIK they're reputable.
    Quote Originally Posted by eurospek View Post
    Hey Lynx, check out Universalcyles.com, they sell Cane Creek lowers and uppers separately as well.
    Yeah, I saw the Nukeproof on CRC and bookmarked it. BTW, which brand would you guys go with, CC or Nuke? I've no experience with Nuke, loads with CC, been running S3 headsets for a while now with no issues.
    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    Yeah, I figure a small shop like that would be able to do it directly from QBP, was looking for something online and easy, but might give a store front shop a go for stuff like this. Most likely would give Drop n Zone a go as they seem like a good shop who als deals Banshee.
    Quote Originally Posted by dunerinaz View Post
    When I needed the same headset, Chad at Red Barn pieced together what I needed. He said Cane Creek will sell uppers and lowers separately.
    Curious, but anyone else besides me think that the prices on the CC 40 upper and lowers are a bit high compared to the S3 they replace? You can still get S3 headsets for $35, so $60+ for the 40 seems quite high to me - it's not like it's the 110 or Hope or CK or anything, just the "Joe Public" line

    Damn I'm getting easily agitated now that FM resurrected thoughts about the Prime, had put it to the back of the brain to just wait until and then he goes and dredges it up Patience is not a virtue I have loads of
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Curious, but anyone else besides me think that the prices on the CC 40 upper and lowers are a bit high compared to the S3 they replace? You can still get S3 headsets for $35, so $60+ for the 40 seems quite high to me - it's not like it's the 110 or Hope or CK or anything, just the "Joe Public" line
    Agreed, especially since the CC40 is supposed to be the replacement for the S3.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Yeah, I saw the Nukeproof on CRC and bookmarked it. BTW, which brand would you guys go with, CC or Nuke? I've no experience with Nuke, loads with CC, been running S3 headsets for a while now with no issues.
    I've seen their headsets in person and it is solid looking kit with machine bearings, personally i run nukeproof hubs and pedals on my Orange and the pedals been solid despite the abuse they've got, still working perfectly and they have been bashed to rocks, a lot.

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    So much for using the likes of A.E.Bike, they want $48 US just to ship the headset down here I'm guessing a brick and mortar like Drop n Zone will be more reasonable shipping wise, heck even CRC only wanted $17 US to ship the NukeProof here. Seriously, if you don't want the hassle of international business just don't offer it, don't charge stupidly overpriced shipping I'm guessing anyone of you guys could walk into Fed Ex/UPS with a headset and ask how much to ship to Barbados and they'd tell you under $20
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So much for using the likes of A.E.Bike, they want $48 US just to ship the headset down here I'm guessing a brick and mortar like Drop n Zone will be more reasonable shipping wise, heck even CRC only wanted $17 US to ship the NukeProof here. Seriously, if you don't want the hassle of international business just don't offer it, don't charge stupidly overpriced shipping I'm guessing anyone of you guys could walk into Fed Ex/UPS with a headset and ask how much to ship to Barbados and they'd tell you under $20
    international shipping with ups is retarded. they charge brokerage fees vs usps who doesn't. depending on which method of shipping that was it could be accurate. some vendors list ups expedited international so you see all fees including taxes in the destination country so the customer doesn't call later all pissed that the $15 shipping is now $48 at the door.

    so if that quote was ups it might be close. not saying you couldn't get it cheaper with another carrier, it just doesn't mean aebike is ripping you off.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So much for using the likes of A.E.Bike, they want $48 US just to ship the headset down here I'm guessing a brick and mortar like Drop n Zone will be more reasonable shipping wise, heck even CRC only wanted $17 US to ship the NukeProof here. Seriously, if you don't want the hassle of international business just don't offer it, don't charge stupidly overpriced shipping I'm guessing anyone of you guys could walk into Fed Ex/UPS with a headset and ask how much to ship to Barbados and they'd tell you under $20
    also, some vendors do their paperwork very accurately as far as customs go while others will play the with #'s to help out the customer which is great until they get caught

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    So close,

    And oh soooo happy......Hey what's everybody's plan for a fork the new 34? All good things come to those who wait....CF.

  60. #60
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    Yeah, yeah I know, good things come to those that wait

    As good as the 44 Micro Ti on Chainlove are looking @ $350, I'm signed up as I said for the F34 with the 51mm offset as I think this will perform the best steering wise and is what Keith used when designing the frame AFAIK.
    Quote Originally Posted by CRAZY FRED View Post
    And oh soooo happy......Hey what's everybody's plan for a fork the new 34? All good things come to those who wait....CF.
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  61. #61
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    For those interested in the Fox 34, these are by far the cheapest prices that I have found when shopping around for a Talas 34 for the Canfield Yelli Screamy, but ultimately ended up with a Fox F29 Float 120 FIT RLC as I said I'm not going to overbuild another bike like I have with my Transition TransAM with a Fox Float 36 for singletrack duties of the Midwest lol.

    Maybe if I lived somewhere like FM, I'd get a stouter fork for sure. But the Banshee Prime definitely calls for one of these without a doubt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    OK, I'm officially getting seriously POd trying to find the right headset for the Prime, seems as though you can easily find a ZS44/49EC tapered headset, or ZS44/ZS56 tapered, or full external 1.125-1.5", but for the %$^@#&@ life of me I cannot easily find a ZS49 upper/EC49 lower headset, only solution I'm finding is to buy both headsets and use the top from one and bottom from another Anyone have links to anything? I know what I need - ZS49/EC49 - but seems not many/any carry them or at least where I look doesn't
    You can order them direct from cane creek, either off of their website using the (admittedly confusing) headset finder or by phone. I personally just went for a CC 40 for now.

  63. #63
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    Yeah I am stoked on the Prime...The problem I am having is tires...trying to find winter tires for coastal BC riding for my Prime. Any recommendations?

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by mudpuppy View Post
    Yeah I am stoked on the Prime...The problem I am having is tires...trying to find winter tires for coastal BC riding for my Prime. Any recommendations?
    Specialized Purgatory 2.4's!
    Had them up at squamish & whistler this summer on the yelli, they did great.
    Also do great locally, same weather, year round...much better than the rampages they replaced, which were scary on wet roots. They can take a beating tubeless, on stans flows.


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    Awesome, thanks...probably end up picking up a pair of those.

    If anyone comes across of any stans flows wheels for a good deal please let me know, sun charger pro's would would be awesome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mudpuppy View Post
    Yeah I am stoked on the Prime...The problem I am having is tires...trying to find winter tires for coastal BC riding for my Prime. Any recommendations?
    Hans Dampf.

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    Prime Parts

    My Prime is coming w/ 150mm rear hub spacing so I'm planning on selling my current wheelset (135mm spacing) if anyone is interested:

    Rear: Chris King hub w/ stainless steel driveshell and fun bolts, 32H Flow 29er rim
    Front: Hope Pro II hub, 32H 29er Flow rim (I have both the 20mm TA and 9mm QR adapters)

    Also planning on selling my current frame/fork to help fund the Prime project:

    Frame: XL Stumpy FSR 29er (2011)
    Fork: Rockshox Reba RLT Ti 29er, tapered steer, 20mm TA,

    Other stuff I'm trying to clear out of the shop to help fund:

    Fork: Rockshox Reba SL 29er, 1-1/8 steer, QR
    Headset: Chris King 1-1/8 press fit, gold color

    CAN NOT WAIT FOR THE PRIME!!!

    Stu

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    I just bounced new WB Loop at LBS, very-very smooth for un-unsed fork, looks real nice in white, also i think offset on the Loop is 44mm.

    The Loop 29er forks with a 1.125 " straight steerer have 48mm of offset. Tapered versions have 49mm.
    Abandoned the 26" wheel in May '03

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch F. Fletch View Post
    My Prime is coming w/ 150mm rear hub spacing so I'm planning on selling my current wheelset (135mm spacing) if anyone is interested:

    Rear: Chris King hub w/ stainless steel driveshell and fun bolts, 32H Flow 29er rim
    Front: Hope Pro II hub, 32H 29er Flow rim (I have both the 20mm TA and 9mm QR adapters)

    Also planning on selling my current frame/fork to help fund the Prime project:

    Frame: XL Stumpy FSR 29er (2011)
    Fork: Rockshox Reba RLT Ti 29er, tapered steer, 20mm TA,

    Other stuff I'm trying to clear out of the shop to help fund:

    Fork: Rockshox Reba SL 29er, 1-1/8 steer, QR
    Headset: Chris King 1-1/8 press fit, gold color



    CAN NOT WAIT FOR THE PRIME!!!

    Stu
    just curious, why 150mm rear?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 29erchico View Post
    The Loop 29er forks with a 1.125 " straight steerer have 48mm of offset. Tapered versions have 49mm.
    Thanks for the info, is this from WB directly? I couldnt find specs anywhere so tried to measure it

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    Thanks for the info, is this from WB directly? I couldnt find specs anywhere so tried to measure it
    Link:

    http://www.mountainracingproducts.co...IST-Sheet1.pdf

    I got the info off of a computer that could not open up the PDF, and the print was way small. Now that I can see the PDF it shows 46mm offset for the 1.125" steerer. & 49mm offset, as previously stated, for the tapered version.
    Abandoned the 26" wheel in May '03

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    just curious, why 150mm rear?
    Personally I went for the 150 to increase the width of the triangle with the wider hub flanges that some hubs offer in the 150 (not all 150 hubs offer this though - I went with a Burgtec). Being over 200 lbs I just wanted to make the wheel laterally stiffer.

  73. #73
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    150mm spacing

    I went with 150mm spacing for less flex in rear triangle but primarily for a stronger rear wheel. I am going to run a 36H Chris King with the stainless driveshell and a Flow rim. I have a long history of hammering rear wheels and flexing frames (and recently breaking a SJ FSR rear triangle).

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    So are the original specs for rear hub choices staying the same as originally listed? 135 and 150 are the two rear hub options or did the 142 get added in there. Just trying to pick up parts to build my wheelset during our long cold winter. All we get to ride here the next 6 months are our fatbikes. Thanks

  75. #75
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    Maybe Keith will chime in, but haven't gotten any e-mails from him to contradict that, so I'd safely say that those are the 2 options available still. Best thing to do is buy a good rear hub that's easy to change and will do all the different standards, Hope Pro2, cheap and does it all, could also do Hadley and CK AFAIK.

    Quote Originally Posted by murphy87 View Post
    So are the original specs for rear hub choices staying the same as originally listed? 135 and 150 are the two rear hub options or did the 142 get added in there. Just trying to pick up parts to build my wheelset during our long cold winter. All we get to ride here the next 6 months are our fatbikes. Thanks
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  76. #76
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    I don't think you can convert to any 135 to 150 since the hub shell is wider. You can, however, swap out between 135mm and 142mm with SOME hub manufacturers. It's also my understanding that there aren't plans to offer 142mm spacing (at least for this wave).

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch F. Fletch View Post
    I don't think you can convert to any 135 to 150 since the hub shell is wider. You can, however, swap out between 135mm and 142mm with SOME hub manufacturers. It's also my understanding that there aren't plans to offer 142mm spacing (at least for this wave).
    My experience is that you're correct.
    Some 150 hubs have slightly wider flange spacing, while others use the same flange spacing as the 135 version, but either way the rotor tabs sit farther out than they would on a 135 hub shell. 150 rear can help to provide more clearance between big tires and drivetrains. With a 150 rear, you can add 7mm of BB spacers and still have an ideal 2x10 chainline....

    Personally- having checked out x142 on the new Knollys and Diamondbacks- I think it's the future... and adoption is much better than it was when Keith posted the initial prime design. I'd like to see x142 drops at some point, but the beauty of the prime drop-outs is they can be added any time....potentially with geometry tweaks too...

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    OK, I'm officially getting seriously POd trying to find the right headset for the Prime, seems as though you can easily find a ZS44/49EC tapered headset, or ZS44/ZS56 tapered, or full external 1.125-1.5", but for the %$^@#&@ life of me I cannot easily find a ZS49 upper/EC49 lower headset, only solution I'm finding is to buy both headsets and use the top from one and bottom from another Anyone have links to anything? I know what I need - ZS49/EC49 - but seems not many/any carry them or at least where I look doesn't
    Take a Midol and chill out. Universal Cycles -- Headsets & Parts > Cane Creek Headsets near the bottom you can buy just the upper assembly and just the lower assembly to make it work perfectly for you.

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    ^ Said the same thing. In post #52.
    konahonzo

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Just got confirmation on the FD from Keith, says either SRAM S3 or Shimano E-type will work, i.e. Low Mount, Direct Mount FDs. Just looking at some and wondering if to go for the older M770 or newer M785, 770 is supposed to be for a 3 x 9 and fits a 44t and the 785 is for 2x10 - Will be running a 24/38 dual ring setup using 9 spd cogs. I've not really had any trouble running 3x FD using 2 rings before, wondering if the dedicated 2x will be a big enough improvement to worry about, costs slightly more.
    Curious - I was told by Keith that only the S-3 mount SRAM would work, not the e-type. That was a couple of months ago though, stuff must have changed...

  81. #81
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    ^ Did you pick a fork yet?
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  82. #82
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    Just got confirmation on the FD from Keith, says either SRAM S3 or Shimano E-type will work, i.e. Low Mount, Direct Mount FDs. Just looking at some and wondering if to go for the older M770 or newer M785, 770 is supposed to be for a 3 x 9 and fits a 44t and the 785 is for 2x10 - Will be running a 24/38 dual ring setup using 9 spd cogs. I've not really had any trouble running 3x FD using 2 rings before, wondering if the dedicated 2x will be a big enough improvement to worry about, costs slightly more.
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    I signed up for the Fox 34 deal.
    Most of my build is ready, had trouble with tires as I had ordered the Conti Trail King 2.2's from BikeBling back in May, they cancelled the order (without telling me) in mid October, ended up getting a good deal on some Panarace Rampage 2.35's to start with. Hopefully they will ride well in snow...
    Other than that a mostly XT 10spd build with 180mm cranks, Formula K-24 brakes that I've had kicking around, Flow rims (in green ano), Burgtec 150 mm rear, Hope Evo front.

  84. #84
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    Yup, same thing I was told a few months back, but he also said he was working on making it compatible so either brand could be used and he's stuck to his word - just got the e-mail this AM confirming, since I want to get it and the headset ordered.

    Anyone want to decipher Shimanos' tech language for me? Looking at the SLX M660, says it's for a 42t ring and has a Maximum capacity of 18T, but Top-middle Minimum Capacity: 10T. The XT M785 it says for a 38-40 ring and a Total capacity of 12T, nothing else - is total and maximum here the same thing???


    Quote Originally Posted by MartinS View Post
    Curious - I was told by Keith that only the S-3 mount SRAM would work, not the e-type. That was a couple of months ago though, stuff must have changed...
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Yup, same thing I was told a few months back, but he also said he was working on making it compatible so either brand could be used and he's stuck to his word - just got the e-mail this AM confirming, since I want to get it and the headset ordered.

    Anyone want to decipher Shimanos' tech language for me? Looking at the SLX M660, says it's for a 42t ring and has a Maximum capacity of 18T, but Top-middle Minimum Capacity: 10T. The XT M785 it says for a 38-40 ring and a Total capacity of 12T, nothing else - is total and maximum here the same thing???
    Hmm, just picked up my SRAM X9 S3.... haven't been a fan of SRAM front derailleurs in the past.

    Here's a run down on tooth capacity;

    Front Derailleur Overview - Bicycle Parts at discount prices / the Buyer's Guide / Bicycle Parts at their finest! / Professional Bicycle Source / Bike Pro

  86. #86
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    Hey guys,

    Originally the prime was only compatible with SRAM standard after a bit of a mix up from Shimano supplying the wrong model to me causes clearance issues when protos were produced. But I worked with the Shimano guys to resolve the issue and sort things out and changed my design again to make the pre production frames compatible with both manufacturers... shouldn't be a problem now (Jay has tested a whole loads of FD options and they seem to all fit now).

    As for dropouts... for production I may well be changing the design a bit depending on how some testing goes on a new design I might test to offer a slightly more versitle system that will reduce cost to end user a bit (current dropouts have proven to be very expensive to manufacture!) for real production and will offer all 3 dropout standards if it all works out.
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  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by builttoride View Post
    Hey guys,

    Originally the prime was only compatible with SRAM standard after a bit of a mix up from Shimano supplying the wrong model to me causes clearance issues when protos were produced. But I worked with the Shimano guys to resolve the issue and sort things out and changed my design again to make the pre production frames compatible with both manufacturers... shouldn't be a problem now (Jay has tested a whole loads of FD options and they seem to all fit now).

    As for dropouts... for production I may well be changing the design a bit depending on how some testing goes on a new design I might test to offer a slightly more versitle system that will reduce cost to end user a bit (current dropouts have proven to be very expensive to manufacture!) for real production and will offer all 3 dropout standards if it all works out.
    More front der options = good. Not that I am that particular about my front ders.
    Reduced cost = good. Need I comment?
    More rear dropout options = good. I was anticipating being able to run the newer 142x12 axle.
    Stop in at Element Sports. www.elementsport.com
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  88. #88
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    Oh damn, getting all jittery again with all the talk and knowing just how close the time is to these getting out there, let's hope my ride tomorrow AM on the P'dox settles me down for the week. Seems that these days I can go about a year and a bit without new toys, but after that I seem to get all jittery for something shiny and new. I'm hoping the Prime cures this for me and all I see in the future is upgrades to the used components it will start out with, well with the exception of getting a V2 P'dox
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  89. #89
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    Hey guys, I'm curious. I've got a Paradox, patiently awaiting the Prime. I'm not criticizing, just wondering, why some of you are stock piling parts for your builds already. Did I miss the latest news on availability date?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpy29er View Post
    Hey guys, I'm curious. I've got a Paradox, patiently awaiting the Prime. I'm not criticizing, just wondering, why some of you are stock piling parts for your builds already. Did I miss the latest news on availability date?
    The people stock piling are waiting for the pre-production Prime. I don't know how far it is away but it's a lot closer than the production version.

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpy29er View Post
    Hey guys, I'm curious. I've got a Paradox, patiently awaiting the Prime. I'm not criticizing, just wondering, why some of you are stock piling parts for your builds already. Did I miss the latest news on availability date?
    Good question.

    I'm not going to buy a Prime until I can get a big stanchion 20mm TA 160mm travel single crown fork to put on it. To "get me by" until such time I'm building a Bandit 29 with a WB Loop 140 up front and a Pushed Monarch Plus RC3 controlling the rear.

    The rumor mill has it that WB has such a fork with 165mm travel in the works. Whatever bigger fork I end up with, I may limit the fork travel to 155mm or a bit less so as to not slacken the HTA all the way down to 67.5 degrees.
    Abandoned the 26" wheel in May '03

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmac999 View Post
    The people stock piling are waiting for the pre-production Prime. I don't know how far it is away but it's a lot closer than the production version.
    That's what I was thinking, but I thought that I would ask. I have been also considering building up a new Stumpy EVO, but I will hold out for the Prime.

  93. #93
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    Exactamundo Prime Pre-Production frames are very near being finished and shipped to the signed up testers (those you're seeing in this thread talking about parts etc) so we're getting ready for that and getting the parts so there's no waiting when the frame arrives I'm lucky in that all I have to deal with is a bit more rain until sometime end of this month into next maybe and then we should have a few months of relatively dry weather, so I'll be riding all "winter", unlike some of the other guys who could be snowed in.
    Quote Originally Posted by kmac999
    The people stock piling are waiting for the pre-production Prime. I don't know how far it is away but it's a lot closer than the production version.

    You do realise though that Keith designed and specifically said that the Prime is a trail bike right, not a FR bike? Agree bigger stanchions probably would be nice, but I'm hoping that the bump to 34's is going to help stiffen things up enough for my paltry 165lbs. I am liking the RS PLUS RC3 as well and it's a future shock upgrade I think for my Prime. Haven't heard anything confirmed in the mill, but I would have to suspect that after this years showing of longer travel 29ers by so many manufacturers that there have to be forks in the works with larger stanchions.
    Quote Originally Posted by 29erchico View Post
    I'm not going to buy a Prime until I can get a big stanchion 20mm TA 160mm travel single crown fork to put on it. To "get me by" until such time I'm building a Bandit 29 with a WB Loop 140 up front and a Pushed Monarch Plus RC3 controlling the rear.

    The rumor mill has it that WB has such a fork with 165mm travel in the works. Whatever bigger fork I end up with, I may limit the fork travel to 155mm or a bit less so as to not slacken the HTA all the way down to 67.5 degrees.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  94. #94
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    lynx

    I am no free rider. Looking for a tough, stiff & plush trail bike. Something playful yet forgiving & confidence inspiring on rugged trails.

    My current ride has 20mm more front travel than the back, this setup seems to work pretty well, so I'm thinking that having 20-25mm more travel in the front than rear would be about right. That is why I will probably set a Prime up with 155mm or less front travel. Not just focusing on big fork stanchions, but would also really like a 20mm TA and an AC reduction feature for climbing. Seeking balanced performance by making a bunch of hopefully wise choices in setup. Much like what Keith is striving to do in designing the frame.

    As far as a rear shock on a Prime goes, I'm leaning on towards a coil unit & have heard some really good things about how sweet a tricked out X Fusion coil shock can be.
    Abandoned the 26" wheel in May '03

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Exactamundo Prime Pre-Production frames are very near being finished and shipped to the signed up testers (those you're seeing in this thread talking about parts etc) so we're getting ready for that and getting the parts so there's no waiting when the frame arrives I'm lucky in that all I have to deal with is a bit more rain until sometime end of this month into next maybe and then we should have a few months of relatively dry weather, so I'll be riding all "winter", unlike some of the other guys who could be snowed in.
    How does that testing process all work? Are you guys paying full boat for these frames? Are you going to get revised frames if changes are made?
    konahonzo

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by eurospek View Post
    How does that testing process all work? Are you guys paying full boat for these frames? Are you going to get revised frames if changes are made?
    Eurospek, there's info here on the testing program.

    I think it's a very cost effective way for banshee to get a lot of testing data input, from a wide variety of riders who will subject the frames to all sorts of different conditions. Looking at how the Legend was developed, it seems like Banshee can get a lot of useful information through this process. We are paying for the frames, and although they're a good deal, it's not significantly less than some FS 29'er frames on the market... I mention this so it's clear the testing will be objective- not a "mountain bike action" review.

    I'm going to get feedback from as many local riders as possible on my frame, and pass all the information back to Banshee.
    I have a few people in mind who will help make sure the frame is put through the paces
    Hopefully my wheels will survive any loaner testing

  97. #97
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    DITTO w/ FM.
    I'm not quite sure how it'll go since I've been on a Paradox for over a year now and this bike has checked all the boxes basically (minus the few revisions it's had) FUN out of this world, so the Prime will have a lot to live up to, so to speak in my mind. I've a bad feeling though going by the Paradox that the Prime is going to put me in a few situations where I'll be wondering WTF I'm doing there, this is above my level and yet riding/making whatever.

    I sadly don't have a boat load of friends here my size, but there's a few and they're more XC and 26" wheels, so should be interesting to hear their thoughts on it. 29ers down here though are taking off, probably 60% of our MTB riders ride 29ers and I'll be lending my Paradox out once I get the Prime to a few 26er hold outs to try to sway them over

    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Eurospek, there's info here on the testing program.

    I think it's a very cost effective way for banshee to get a lot of testing data input, from a wide variety of riders who will subject the frames to all sorts of different conditions. Looking at how the Legend was developed, it seems like Banshee can get a lot of useful information through this process. .................Hopefully my wheels will survive any loaner testing
    OK, cool so you're running what a 140mm fork on your current bike then? It will be interesting to see how Keith has managed to balance the Prime out or if it'll be like the Spitty in having a wide range of possible fork travel options - I'm thinking the 140mm upfront paired to the 130mm out back will be just about perfect balance wise and small tweaks can be made with the adjustable geo. Personally although I like my 69* Paradox and was one of the ones who called for the slacker 68* on it, I can't see wanting to go below 67.5* either on the Prime, actually I think I will keep it somewhat "steep" around 68-68.5* to help the long wheelbase my XL will have. In my testing I plan to try the fork stock @140mm and also @ 130mm and 120mm to see how it effects the handling and overall characteristics of the bike.

    Yeah, those X-Fusion shocks and forks look quite sweet and given the fact that they already have custom tuned shocks for the Spitty and Rune I'm thinking that one might also be offered for the Prime.Will say though, with the weight loss of an air shock and the great reviews the RS PLUS RC3 has gotten I definitely think that's tops on my list of shocks.
    Quote Originally Posted by 29erchico View Post
    lynx

    I am no free rider. Looking for a tough, stiff & plush trail bike. Something playful yet forgiving & confidence inspiring on rugged trails.

    My current ride has 20mm more front travel than the back, this setup seems to work pretty well, so I'm thinking that having 20-25mm more travel in the front than rear would be about right. That is why I will probably set a Prime up with 155mm or less front travel. Not just focusing on big fork stanchions, but would also really like a 20mm TA and an AC reduction feature for climbing. Seeking balanced performance by making a bunch of hopefully wise choices in setup. Much like what Keith is striving to do in designing the frame.

    As far as a rear shock on a Prime goes, I'm leaning on towards a coil unit & have heard some really good things about how sweet a tricked out X Fusion coil shock can be.
    Last edited by LyNx; 11-19-2011 at 10:36 AM.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  98. #98
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    Yeah, I plan on lending mine out to some tall/big guys here on the Island too....can't wait! Got my email asking for shipping info last night...hehe...

    Please someone buy my Rune/wheels/Forks....

  99. #99
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    All I have to say to you is Can we NOT talk ab out this frame for the next how many ever weks so I can try to put it to the back of my thoughts and try to get some work done
    Quote Originally Posted by mudpuppy View Post
    Yeah, I plan on lending mine out to some tall/big guys here on the Island too....can't wait! Got my email asking for shipping info last night...hehe...

    Please someone buy my Rune/wheels/Forks....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Prime Anticipation-195860_159600044098675_102595099799170_340104_6506132_n.jpg  

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  100. #100
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    God that is sexy....WANT....wonder if our fox goodies will be Kashima coated (crosses fingers),

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