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  1. #1
    FM
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    Prime Anticipation

    Great article on NSMB.

    The last thing MTBR needs is another 26 vs. 29'er debate, but I think this article does a great job covering the direction 29'ers are heading in, objectively. Gets me very excited for the Prime....

    Piledriver drop on a 29'er? That's ridiculous.
    Scared the living crap out of me on a 40lb, 26" FR bike....

  2. #2
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    Good read, but I'd have to tend to agree with some of the comments posted that the riders mentioned are all pros or close enough, so what they can do with any bike is above what most will be able to do. One main example of utter BS is Wade Simmons, he clearly stated that 29ers could never ride the shore and would never ride one, that is until his sponsor started making them, then his tune changed - paid and full of **** is what he is.

    Me, I'm a 29er rider, through and through, I will never ride a 26" wheeled bike again. Am so looking forward to the Prime and for that matter all of the other AM/Trail bikes coming out for 2012, it proves that the market is there and the hype isn't just hype. My only concern, (but I committed, so I will stick with it) is getting the XL with a wheelbase 3" longer than anything I've ridden before. ETT is only 1/4" longer than my Paradox (although on the geo chart is says the reach is 26mm more) , so a stem length drop of somewhere between 30-40mm and nice wide bars should do the trick, but I'm guessing it'll take a bit more muscle to get around the tight stuff, but man oh man will it be stable on the fast descents
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  3. #3
    FM
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    Personally, I wouldn't call that BS...just one rider changing his mind as the result of the evolution of 29" bikes. He certainly could be riding a slayer if he preferred smaller wheels.

    There's a lot of things which have been missing from the 29'er spectrum which are pretty much mandatory for agressive riding... namely forks and wheels that aren't flexy, weak pieces of shite. The industry is still behind the ball in a few areas, but I think people like Wade having been late adopters, is simply down to the fact that the previously offered 29'er packages mostly did suck for aggressive riding. Hence my excitement for the Prime.

  4. #4
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    Again, full of it Wade Simmons Loves 29ers - YouTube says nothing of lack of advancements, just there's just no advantage - he rides what Rocky wants him to ride and help sell. Now Keith on the other hand is an honest guy who believes in this project, but still will stick to his guns and say he doesn't believe 29ers should go further than this AM/.Trail segment, and I respect him immensely for that - but look forward to the day he maybe changes his mind Same for Dave Turner, he said he wouldn't build a 29er, but then did and admitted he did it because it was just $tupid not to as too many people wanted one $$$$$.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Personally, I wouldn't call that BS...just one rider changing his mind as the result of the evolution of 29" bikes. He certainly could be riding a slayer if he preferred smaller wheels.
    What I will say is that I am looking forward to what riders like you and others on here and other sites, who have been 26er die-hards have to say when it's their own hard cash that has to purchase the bike and they're not a sponsored rider who benefits from giving props. Me personally, I think I represent the segment of the market of riders who really love riding, but who are not naturally gifted with the talent and have to work exceedingly hard just to even hang on the wheel of better riders - I'd guess it's a big segment, the weekend warriorish type. I've been told I do have the skill, but lack the positive attitude and confidence to use it and I can vouch for that, when you're self employed and haven't seen real work in forever and no medical insurance you ride very cautiously, but I'm hoping I can push the Prime a bit and provide some useful feedback on it .


    There's a lot of things which have been missing from the 29'er spectrum which are pretty much mandatory for agressive riding... namely forks and wheels that aren't flexy, weak pieces of shite. The industry is still behind the ball in a few areas, but I think people like Wade having been late adopters, is simply down to the fact that the previously offered 29'er packages mostly did suck for aggressive riding. Hence my excitement for the Prime.
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  5. #5
    FM
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    I dunno. That video of Wade was posted in May 2007. I think it's fair to say 29'ers (as complete bikes, not just the wheelsize) were useless for Wade's riding style at that time.

    Things have changed. Just because he's a sponsored pro, doesn't mean he can't change opinions as things progress.

  6. #6
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    IIRC...that video of Wade was to be viewed tongue in cheek. There were folks (in the know) at the time commenting that he was simply "having fun" with the soap opera level of drama involved with 29 versus 26 discussions. Rumor had it, at the time, he had spent significant time on the fruit hoops & was digging them (off the record, of course!).

    PS. Look-See...See, in particular, post #44


  7. #7
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    Thanks for posting JNC, that makes a lot more sense.

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    Your average 5-6" 29er with any thing slacker then a 70 degree HA will be more then sufficient for most rolling, Shore trails. On Fromme where the ability to shuttle is unavailable I think there has been an evolution from your "Shore" bike to more pedal friendly all mountain bike. On a recent ride on Fromme ,out of six bikes, three were 29ers. Another one of the 26er riders has since purchased a 29er also. This would have been unheard only 18 months ago and will probably become more common as the new bunch of 29ers become available. Check out Lee Lau's videoes on Vimeo for lots of 29ers on the shore
    bikesonburke

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    lol I am about 95% certain Wade is taking the piss with his comments in that video.

    You are reading too much into it LyNx. Wade loves to joke around.

  10. #10
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    I remember when Leel was first testing the RM Altitude and all those pics, but not that thread I took the video as it seemed and I may have a biased view on the FR crowd and just took the laughing for self pompus ******s the likes a lot of the PB kids on 29er wheels. The explanation makes it clearer and I'll taker back what I said, especially after reading this little bit from NSMB, but I still hold true that Wade saying they're great doesn't mean anything to me since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly. That he gives them a nod will however maybe bring some of those PBesc type attitudes around to giving the 29" wheel a try.

    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter View Post
    IIRC...that video of Wade was to be viewed tongue in cheek. There were folks (in the know) at the time commenting that he was simply "having fun" with the soap opera level of drama involved with 29 versus 26 discussions. Rumor had it, at the time, he had spent significant time on the fruit hoops & was digging them (off the record, of course!).

    PS. Look-See...See, in particular, post #44
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    Not to 'come to his rescue', coz he's a bro, but Wade is genuinely stoked on the 29er. It is pretty much all he has been riding the past year or so. Although, he is much more of pedaller than shuttler than you'd think.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly.
    Wade could ride a 12" wheeled bike up those trails and make the average rider look silly as well. But then... I look silly riding with no help from Wade, so it's a moot point.

    Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.

  13. #13
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    I feel quite similar with the Paradox, except I have no squish to fall back on and while it is true I have a big grin after rides, I also am feeling it from the workout a HT gives you on rough/tech trails. As to 29ers in tech, I can honestly say that when I first switched from 26" FS to 29" FS I could not believe the climbs I was making that I'd had trouble making before on the 26" FS running Nevegals, while only running WTB Nanos on the 29er FS. Since getting the Paradox tech has become even more fun as it's just so nimble and easy to move around. Seems like maybe I need to visit where ever it is that Leel likes to ride/climb, as well honestly I think I prefer the challenge of a tech climb or pretty much flat/rolling trail to the descents, it's just that bit more challenging since fitness also plays a big part.

    So, what parts have you managed to squirrel away? Sadly my Paradox will be a donor of most of it's good parts to the Prime and then what ever I have around will go on the Paradox. Only thing I have really got for the Prime (and now want for all my bikes) is a 750mm wide FUNN Fatboy bar. Thinking I'm going to give a try with a nice 60mm Truvativ Hussefelt stem. Other than that it would be nice to have all new parts, but what parts I do have on the Paradox (wheels, drivetrain, cockpit etc) I am quite happy with, only other new thing I am signed up for is a new F34 fork.

    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    ..................Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.



    ...and less we forget, they're to go on this ..........
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So, what parts have you managed to squirrel away?
    Well, I was going to grab parts off my Curtlo AM Hardtail (Wifes bike), but with the wait I've been finding some good deals on used stuff. Picked up some formula the ones (older versions), straitline stem, new set of sunline bars, king headset. It may come out pretty bling. Still stealing the wheels, cranks, pedals seat & post off my other bikes.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    I remember when Leel was first testing the RM Altitude and all those pics, but not that thread I took the video as it seemed and I may have a biased view on the FR crowd and just took the laughing for self pompus ******s the likes a lot of the PB kids on 29er wheels. The explanation makes it clearer and I'll taker back what I said, especially after reading this little bit from NSMB, but I still hold true that Wade saying they're great doesn't mean anything to me since as so many point out he could ride a 12" wheeled kids bike down those trails and make me or the avg rider look silly. That he gives them a nod will however maybe bring some of those PBesc type attitudes around to giving the 29" wheel a try.
    you know lynx when you don't take 29er criticism to heart you are a much nicer guy. just realize not everyone drinks the 29er koolaid. everyone has their reasons for liking a particular bike or wheel size. we all ride mtb, what you ride it on means dick

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Wade could ride a 12" wheeled bike up those trails and make the average rider look silly as well. But then... I look silly riding with no help from Wade, so it's a moot point.

    Anyways, back on topic!
    As mentioned in the first post, not looking to rehash the 26 vs 29 debate. But I am glad to see people opening their minds to the potential of 29'ers on more technical trails. Even semi-vertical donkey paths like Leel prefers to ride

    The prime delays have provided a little more time to squirell away parts and get stoked. Many rides on my Yelli have me missing the full squish, just as many rides on my Rune have me missing the bigger wheels.

    That is all.
    It's great to have another proselyte!!!
    Keep the cult alive

    Seriously tho...I think DH'ers make the best converts, since we have been used to turning bikes with our hips & can easily take advantage of the upgrade in handling/traction in techy terrain. Seamlessly translating the 29er benefits, while easily overcoming any inherent shortcomings.

    My AM HT 29er rules the roost, but the Sultan is a welcome change of pace for the more challenging all day rides. Unfortunately, I wasn't selected for the Prime test group, but I look forward to throwing a leg over one at some point
    Last edited by jncarpenter; 11-02-2011 at 04:07 PM.


  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post



    Hussefelt stem is nice, until you look at the weight

    Best bang for the buck weight savings on my bike was to get rid of the 330gr lump of alu and replace it with 150gr instead

  18. #18
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    29er riders are worse than Baptists.

  19. #19
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    Yeah, yeah, I know, also nicer when there's work and money to pay the bills etc I don't mind criticism, it's those who don't, or won't even give them a try yet seem to enjoy bashing them that get to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    you know lynx when you don't take 29er criticism to heart you are a much nicer guy. just realize not everyone drinks the 29er koolaid. everyone has their reasons for liking a particular bike or wheel size. we all ride mtb, what you ride it on means dick
    Yeah, I figure as much, but as with the current heavy OEM Cdale 90mm stem I have on the Paradox, it's there for fit (or for loaner bikes) and if it works didn't cost me a lot and I'll then get a nice one when the $$ allow it.
    Quote Originally Posted by sakucee View Post
    Hussefelt stem is nice, until you look at the weight

    Best bang for the buck weight savings on my bike was to get rid of the 330gr lump of alu and replace it with 150gr instead
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkslide18 View Post
    29er riders are worse than Baptists.
    Perhaps... but as a whole, we are a lot more fun to drink beer with.

  21. #21
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    But not as bad as 7 days adventist and yes we'll drink a beer or other beverage with you, no matter what wheel size you chose to ride

    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    Perhaps... but as a whole, we are a lot more fun to drink beer with.
    Quote Originally Posted by darkslide18 View Post
    29er riders are worse than Baptists.
    Last edited by LyNx; 11-03-2011 at 12:22 PM.
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    I'm not in the market for a 29"er (or another bike) but I definitely like seeing videos of them on more tech terrain & the frames that are coming soon, DEFINITELY look better than all the XC bikes I've seen locally (Trek, Speesh mostly)!

    Alot of the riders on my local XC trails have said they like them because they roll over everything so easy which confused me because none of the trails have all that much to roll over...

    Seems like 29" would be best for those riders who are looking at 6 ft n' over. That's what I think whever I see the bikes....

  23. #23
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    Must... resist.... replacing....my aging 2010 FSR 29...
    When will the frame be available? Are they gonna be sold out within the first month?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Haunted View Post
    Must... resist.... replacing....my aging 2010 FSR 29...
    When will the frame be available? Are they gonna be sold out within the first month?
    people are still waiting for the proto frames. i imagine 2012 before this sees production. maybe keith can chime in if earlier than that.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    people are still waiting for the proto frames. i imagine 2012 before this sees production. maybe keith can chime in if earlier than that.
    Darn, not what I wanted to hear. If that is the case, then I'm willing to bet that the production frame won't be available until September 2012

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