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  1. #326
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    Man the Paradox is a beautiful looking bike. I have a question about the V2 vs V1. I thought the chainstay length was about 16.8 or 16.9 on the V1. Looking at the banshee site it lists the V2 chainstay length as 17.3. Did it increase in the new version? One of the positive things I've read about the paradox is how playful it is because of the short chainstays. But 17.3 isn't all that short is it?
    I hate 650b because it's not as fun as 26 inch wheels and because it doesn't have the rollover ability of 29 inch wheels.

  2. #327
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    Sorry, ignore the website, we've been having some technical issues. the chainstay length of the V2 is 16.8".
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  3. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by builttoride View Post
    Sorry, ignore the website, we've been having some technical issues. the chainstay length of the V2 is 16.8".
    Thanks! That does make sense. I mean you can see how short the chainstays are just looking at a picture of the new paradox.

    I hate 650b because it's not as fun as 26 inch wheels and because it doesn't have the rollover ability of 29 inch wheels.

  4. #329
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    My Paradox is going to arrive on Monday as a replacement for Rockhopper 29er. The latter is a fine machine but has no rough charm of the former.

  5. #330
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    just bought the 29 inch Continental tires, so I can test them in big size at last (and have more orange stuff too, tbh). 2.4 MK II front and X-King 2.2 rear. Above my expectations, especially descending. Riding up the front tire is sloow but fortunately the rear one helps very much, although its cutted knobs are not precisely an input for uphills, but for downhills. Descending is like floating, seriously.

    Have tried to put the 2.4 as rear tire just for checking purposes, and it did not fit (not because of being wide tire but because of being a tall tire. (Maybe the 19mm inner width of rim helped to it?)
    Banshee Paradox V2
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  6. #331
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    I noticed that the Paradox V1 has cable guides on the down tube for a HammerSchmidt. Why doesn't the V2? What way would you route a cable for a HammerSchmidt on a V2? I'm installing one on my V2.

    Here is what I've figured so far...

    Adhesive Cable Guides on down tube.

    OR

    Run Cable along top tube, down seat tube and around to HammerSchmidt.

    Not really sure which way to go. Thanks.

  7. #332
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    Hi all,

    I spent half of last night reading all 14 pages.

    My Paradox frame was due to ship within Oz today from a private eBay seller.

    It's new and unused, still in the box but I don't expect any warranty as second owner.

    I have another thread going with some build questions.

    Build so far build is:

    Large Paradox V2 frame in raw

    Flow rims on a Hope front and X9 rear hub as purchased off eBay.

    Elixir X0 brakes

    Probably SLX cranks either 36 single ring or 36/22 dual rings

    X0 Gripshifter(s) and X7 RD

    Nobby Nic 2.35 on the front (same seller as the wheels)

    Rear tyre TBC

    Fork TBC

    Most of the forks I want only come in white or in black with a Fox price tag.

    Best options so far look like.

    Manitou Tower Pro Forks 29" - Tapered Steerer 2012 | Buy Online | ChainReactionCycles.com

    RockShox Revelation RCT3 29" 140mm Dual Air Tapered Steerer - Fanatik Bike Co. - Bellingham Wa

    Fox Racing Shox 34 TALAS 29 140 RLC FIT 15QR Tapered Steerer Factory Series - Fanatik Bike Co. - Bellingham Wa

    I am pretty sure I saw the Fox and Manitou at least on bikes in the last 14 pages.

    Any feedback on fork choices would be appreciated.

  8. #333
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    Hej guys
    thinking about building up a Paradox, i was wondering if you could run a ZS lower headset cup with RS Forks?
    I have a 150mm coil Sektor, wich i love. So i thought about getting a Revelation casting to make it 29, but donīt want to mess with the already kind of slack seatangle because of my longer forks. I can imagine the forks dials hitting the frame, using a ZS Headset. straight steerer of course...

  9. #334
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  10. #335
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    E=zangg;9608981]Hej guys
    thinking about building up a Paradox, i was wondering if you could run a ZS lower headset cup with RS Forks?
    I have a 150mm coil Sektor, wich i love. So i thought about getting a Revelation casting to make it 29, but donīt want to mess with the already kind of slack seatangle because of my longer forks. I can imagine the forks dials hitting the frame, using a ZS Headset. straight steerer of course...[/QUOTE]

    It is doable in the v2, no idea if valid for v1 thou
    Banshee Paradox V2
    Focus Thunder 650b tuned

  11. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    Hej guys
    thinking about building up a Paradox, i was wondering if you could run a ZS lower headset cup with RS Forks?
    I have a 150mm coil Sektor, wich i love. So i thought about getting a Revelation casting to make it 29, but donīt want to mess with the already kind of slack seatangle because of my longer forks. I can imagine the forks dials hitting the frame, using a ZS Headset. straight steerer of course...
    zangg, your post isn't completely clear. Your longer forks are going to affect the head angle and seat angle and an inset headset won't make much difference. If you mix and match 26" crowns with 29" legs there is no guarantee you will have appropriate offset, rake and trail measurements for your forks.

  12. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozynigma View Post
    zangg, your post isn't completely clear. Your longer forks are going to affect the head angle and seat angle and an inset headset won't make much difference. If you mix and match 26" crowns with 29" legs there is no guarantee you will have appropriate offset, rake and trail measurements for your forks.
    Additional cm of travel is reduced to 2mm more stack, by using a Cane Creek ZS cup.
    Sektors/Revelations uppers are similar to the 29er version, so the forks increased rake is coming with the casting. I am only worried about the crown hitting the frame, i guess i will ask Keith directly to be sure.

  13. #338
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    When all's done and said, in my experience looking at seperate fork lowers, the cost ends up around 60%+ of a new fork if you find a deal. My suggestion to you is to take a look at the Manitou Tower or Marz 44s that you can find on sale most places or take alook at X-Fusion and stick with the geo Banshee designed and use their 120mm fork (retails for about $400 with tapered steerer and 15mm axle) and get a great handling bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    Additional cm of travel is reduced to 2mm more stack, by using a Cane Creek ZS cup.
    Sektors/Revelations uppers are similar to the 29er version, so the forks increased rake is coming with the casting. I am only worried about the crown hitting the frame, i guess i will ask Keith directly to be sure.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??
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  14. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    When all's done and said, in my experience looking at seperate fork lowers, the cost ends up around 60%+ of a new fork if you find a deal. My suggestion to you is to take a look at the Manitou Tower or Marz 44s that you can find on sale most places or take alook at X-Fusion and stick with the geo Banshee designed and use their 120mm fork (retails for about $400 with tapered steerer and 15mm axle) and get a great handling bike.
    I would reproduce 100% of my current bike's geometry (onone 456 Evo) with new calculated mechanical trail for 29". So I guess handling won't be an issue.
    And I seriously want to avoid this 15mm axle nonsense.
    I work at a bike shop so RS small parts are affordable for me..

  15. #340
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    Remember that 29ers dont need to be that slack as 26ers to get similar feedback on the trail. That said, i would not care for a 140mm travel rs fork with 32mm stanchions. More than that would be a bit excessive imo.
    Banshee Paradox V2
    Focus Thunder 650b tuned

  16. #341
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    This is what i meant with new calculated mechanical trail. 66° is similar to RS 29er 67.5°
    My babelfish is probably on vacation, if you have problems understanding me
    Right now i have a 32mm stanchion, 150mm, 20mm through axle fork i believe to be stiff enough. A friends Dorado is far "worse".
    What are you worrying about? I think this bike will be genius with wide bars, short stem, 1x10 and fat tires. Thats what i ride today, but my 26er feels a little wrong/too small to me (1,88m), because i rode a friends 29er...

  17. #342
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    As Helmetless said, you can't and shouldn't want to reproduce a 26" geo onto a 29" bike, I think you'll be VERY dissapointed if you do. The trail on most 26" forks is not enough to counter HAs like you'd have with the setup you're talking about, seriously, do some homework on it and you find that out.
    When Fox did the 140mm F34, they also increased the offset from 48mm to 51mm, if they hadn't the Prime with 68.5* HA would have steered like a truck most likely, instead it steers very crisply, hardly a noticeable difference from the Paradox - which I've yet to figure out quite how.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??
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  18. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    As Helmetless said, you can't and shouldn't want to reproduce a 26" geo onto a 29" bike, I think you'll be VERY dissapointed if you do. The trail on most 26" forks is not enough to counter HAs like you'd have with the setup you're talking about, seriously, do some homework on it and you find that out.
    When Fox did the 140mm F34, they also increased the offset from 48mm to 51mm, if they hadn't the Prime with 68.5* HA would have steered like a truck most likely, instead it steers very crisply, hardly a noticeable difference from the Paradox - which I've yet to figure out quite how.
    I donīt know what your post is about sorry?
    I obviously understand how a front end behaves, donīt you think? Can you calculate each mechanical trail of your bikes? I took increased fork rake into account, doing my calculations and have to remind you that RS crowns stay the same (except for gary fisher G2 geometry forks, they have a different crown) and lower legs differ in rake... so i will be running NO 26" fork geometry. Actually 1.5° increased HA on a 29er with RS Forks, in relation to a 26er HA behaves the same. Without looking at rotating masses of your wheel, but i believe running DH Tires at 1,3kg each makes more of a difference than changing wheel diameter. When i combine this with a similar seatangle, the same chainstay length and bottom bracket height, i believe handling will be just as i want it to be.
    Your observations on the primeīs and paradoxīs steering behavior make no sense to me. FS and HT bikes have one big difference:
    a hardtailīs steering changes when you compress your fork, a springy bikeīs doesnīt. HA increases roughly by 7° when you run 150mm forks, so whatever fork you have, when its sagged your HTīs HA will always be steeper than your primeīs.
    This is actually why i love hardtails. Just lean back and take the rush, lean forward and trial the **** out of it. I run 150mm forks not only to have more travel but to have a more diverse handling bike, wich feels dynamic and "all mountain" to me. 150mm allow me to run harder springs without loosing too much travel. Itīs active enough to take the rough but still has some reserves for hard hits. Man i will even drill a hole in my seattube to get the frame ready for a reverb stealth!
    Iīll let you know what Keith is answering about my crown vs. downtube issue in case anybody is interested.

  19. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    Hej guys
    thinking about building up a Paradox, i was wondering if you could run a ZS lower headset cup with RS Forks?
    I have a 150mm coil Sektor, wich i love. So i thought about getting a Revelation casting to make it 29, but donīt want to mess with the already kind of slack seatangle because of my longer forks. I can imagine the forks dials hitting the frame, using a ZS Headset. straight steerer of course...
    Hey,

    So first things first... the 2013 sektor 29 has a max travel of 140mm... which to me suggests that there is a strength or stiffness limit that rockshox are not wanting to go beyond... but it may just be becaue they don't see the demand for the extra 10mm of travel. Also you should be aware that the paradox is only covered by warranty for use with forks up to 140mm travel.... so again you will need to reduce the travel down to 140mm if you want to be covered by warranty.

    In terms of Sektor crown clearance, I just ran the numbers for you... the 26" Sektor does not have the clearance that 29" forks have (29er nearly always have more to account for steeper slope of the downtube required on 29ers). So clearance is not comfortably enough for medium paradox V2 in all adjuster positions... to point that you may have to file down adjuster nobs slightly. The clearance gets better for the larger frame sizes, but will still be close.... this is with me assuming worst case scenario. So it is workable, but you may have to slightly file the adjuster nobs down a bit.
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  20. #345
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    Glad you've gone over this with so much detail and know that the bike setup like you want will handle exactly as you would like, wouldn't want you to be disappointed like so many others trying to match 26" wheeled performance by un-reasonable 29er bikes, like comparing an EPIC 29er to a MOJO or PIVOT 429 to a PIVOT 5.7 and expecting the handling to be the same I think you'll be in for a surprise like so many lab engineers and scientist who calculate everything out but have no real world experience, switching from big DH tyres to 29" ones will not and is not going to be the same, weight is less and no matter how big those DH tyres are, they're not 1.5" taller in radius.

    So only on a HT can you manipulate the suspension to steepen or slacken the steering then, really? I have to remember that when I'm on my FS weighting the rear to keep the HA slack or slacker, with PP off or when I run PP on and weight biased forward to help steepen the HA to help speed up steering, must remember that this is not possible, only on a HT

    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    I donīt know what your post is about sorry?
    I obviously understand how a front end behaves, donīt you think? Can you calculate each mechanical trail of your bikes? I took increased fork rake into account, doing my calculations and have to remind you that RS crowns stay the same (except for gary fisher G2 geometry forks, they have a different crown) and lower legs differ in rake... so i will be running NO 26" fork geometry. Actually 1.5° increased HA on a 29er with RS Forks, in relation to a 26er HA behaves the same. Without looking at rotating masses of your wheel, but i believe running DH Tires at 1,3kg each makes more of a difference than changing wheel diameter. When i combine this with a similar seatangle, the same chainstay length and bottom bracket height, i believe handling will be just as i want it to be.
    Your observations on the primeīs and paradoxīs steering behavior make no sense to me. FS and HT bikes have one big difference:
    a hardtailīs steering changes when you compress your fork, a springy bikeīs doesnīt. HA increases roughly by 7° when you run 150mm forks, so whatever fork you have, when its sagged your HTīs HA will always be steeper than your primeīs.
    This is actually why i love hardtails. Just lean back and take the rush, lean forward and trial the **** out of it. I run 150mm forks not only to have more travel but to have a more diverse handling bike, wich feels dynamic and "all mountain" to me. 150mm allow me to run harder springs without loosing too much travel. Itīs active enough to take the rough but still has some reserves for hard hits. Man i will even drill a hole in my seattube to get the frame ready for a reverb stealth!
    Iīll let you know what Keith is answering about my crown vs. downtube issue in case anybody is interested.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??
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  21. #346
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    You are one sorry f$cker..
    idk about your opinion. I got my own skills and experience...
    I didn't tell you that fs bikes DON'T react to weight transfer, but hardtails naturally do this more!
    I know why I am usually not on forums!
    Good day to you, good Sir!

  22. #347
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    OK, so bit out of sorts when I answered about what you were doing, so maybe didn't make 100% sense. Went back over what you plan and I think I get it now...you're going to use a 26" based Sektor upper and Rev lowers (to get the 46mm offset), what you'll end up with is a fork with about 120-125mm of useable travel due to the fact that the Rev lowers are about 25-30mm taller at the seals than the Sektor, so with a ZS headset you'd end up with almost the exact same angles, if not maybe a tad steeper than the original stock geo using a normal 120mm 29er fork off the shelf.....You want to save some money and make a custom 120mm travel fork for you to build the Paradox around instead of just buying a complete fork - Got it


    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    You are one sorry f$cker..
    idk about your opinion. I got my own skills and experience...
    I didn't tell you that fs bikes DON'T react to weight transfer, but hardtails naturally do this more!
    I know why I am usually not on forums!
    Good day to you, good Sir!
    Originally Posted by ozynigma View Post
    zangg, your post isn't completely clear. Your longer forks are going to affect the head angle and seat angle and an inset headset won't make much difference. If you mix and match 26" crowns with 29" legs there is no guarantee you will have appropriate offset, rake and trail measurements for your forks.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??
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  23. #348
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    Can you two get a room or something? I hate it when lovers take their spats public.
    I hate 650b because it's not as fun as 26 inch wheels and because it doesn't have the rollover ability of 29 inch wheels.

  24. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by zangg View Post
    You are one sorry f$cker..
    idk about your opinion. I got my own skills and experience...
    I didn't tell you that fs bikes DON'T react to weight transfer, but hardtails naturally do this more!
    I know why I am usually not on forums!
    Good day to you, good Sir!
    Hey zangg, don't take it personally, I think Lynx has a head angle obsession.

    I have learnt some new stuff from your questions so I am glad you asked them on this forum.

    I was in a similar situation with my Paradox build which is in another recent thread.

    I wanted to recycle as much as I could from my Chameleon 26'er. I asked my mechanic mate whether I could put Revelation 29'er lowers on my 140mm Revelation 26'er forks. He was not sure and raised the rake and offset issues with me. Not knowing I didn't risk it and bought a new fork. I will be selling the old fork.

    I also contemplated recycling the blue Industry Nine hubs built into 26" wheels but by the time I buy new I9 spokes, new rims and sell the old spokes/rims for scrap value I am better off buying a new wheelset (which I did).

    As Lynx just pointed out, I was thinking that you will lose some of your 150mm travel with the longer lowers. So maybe you don't need to reduce the lower headset stack height at all.

  25. #350
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    Just for updating purposes
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0045.jpg  

    Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0055.jpg  

    Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0048.jpg  

    Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0050.jpg  

    Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0041.jpg  

    Paradox Updated for 2012-dsc_0062.jpg  

    Last edited by Helmetless; 10-04-2012 at 06:33 PM.
    Banshee Paradox V2
    Focus Thunder 650b tuned

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