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Thread: 2013 Spitfire

  1. #401
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiawatha-de View Post
    Is that scale reading 7.15 lbs? Can't tell if that's the current time or weight? Is that a veggie scale or what?
    I read it as 7lbs15.3oz.

  2. #402
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    I just got off of a Yeti SB 66 and the frame weights were actually pretty similar to the Spitfire. My frame was a small and weighed in at 7.5lbs with quick release drop outs, about a 100g heavier with the threw axle. I preferred the stiffness and efficiency of the Yeti over some lighter options, I think stiffness is hard to quantify numerically but makes a significant difference in ride quality especially landing off camber etc. I think the most important thing for a bike is Fit i.e. geometry. The Yeti just had too slack a seat angle climb comfortably on for a long time. I am excited about the Spity because it is stiff with spot on geometry. Mine should be here next week.

  3. #403
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    weight

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogboy View Post
    I read it as 7lbs15.3oz.
    That makes more sense. Just 7/10 shy of 8lbs.

    Weight is kinda of a big deal for a bike in this category. One of the reasons I bought the V1 Spitfire was because of the relatively low weight. I climb the spitfire more than I descend and use it as an XC bike as I'm constantly pedaling all the time. In these situations weight can be an issue as your plugging along rather than ripping along. (The spitfire does rip on the flats, however it is obvious that one can feel a little loss in momentum on the uphill due to the extra weight and the slight pedal feedback that occurred).
    With that said I have a fully dedicated XC bike that is much lighter and faster (trek Superfly 100 29'er), but I was always pulling out the Spitfire for everyday riding as the fun factor was more overall. The climbing was always good with the V1 cause I got the weight pretty low and the descents and trail carving were just way to much fun and made up for its sluggishness on the ups.
    If anything the extra weight will make you a stronger rider in terms of pedaling and endurance. I'm still gonna run my V2 as an XC bike so it will be interesting to see the difference with the added weight which I'm sure will be primarily noticeable on the ascents. The extra weight will probably be noticeable at first and then quickly disappear once I get accustomed.
    I'm hoping the extra weight isn't so noticeable that it takes the fun out of pedaling the bike. Kinda like my wildcard did when I tried to XC the thing. Not fun at all.

  4. #404
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    A simple guess is that a 650b wheel would not fit in the rear with the 26'' dropouts... but maybe it does. Would someone try?

  5. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    What argument?
    Don't get me wrong, light bikes are great if there are no compromises taken getting there.
    The spitfire has adjustable drop-outs, those will add weight compared to the simpler designs used by other brands.

    Transition lists the covert as 7.68lb with shock, no adjustable drop-outs. The carbon version is 6.8lbs & $2800. Those are reasonable weights IMO ...

    ... I just don't see much point in getting hung up over <1lb of frame weight, you are getting extra durability, stiffness and adjustability with it. Frame weight doesn't tell you much about how the bike will actually ride.


    Plus: Banshee builds Bikes that are meant to be ridden hard, real hard if you are willing or able to. This inevitably means something more Flesh/Material to achieve the Durability and Stiffness that is needed for this Purpose => a bit more Frame-Weight than average.
    But how much more? Compared to what? What Features included? Prize? Turner 5 Spot? TR Bandit? SC Blur? Liteville 301? Canyon Nerve AM? Intense Trazer? Spezi Stumpjumper? Devinci Dixon? Nicolai Helius AC? Trek Fuel EX/Remedy? any other Aluminum-Frame with 5/5,5" Travel ... ?

  6. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by meekkho View Post
    Hi
    Is that a medium or a small?
    it's a medium (i'm pretty sure)

    this one i think is a large:


  7. #407
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    Yeah that's a large.

    And NoStyle, no bike company makes bikes that aren't made to be ridden hard. That's a crazy argument.. "Ok here is your new Blur LT, now don't go to fast, ride anything off camber, or do any jumps" said no one ever. In this day and age 6lb bikes can be ripped on for years. This isn't 2005 when bikes were breaking all over the place if they weighed less than 8lb, this is 2012 where you can have a 170mm freeride bike weighing in under 30lb, or a 210mm DH bike weighing in at 33 and under.

    But I am tired of beating the dead horse, the Spitfire is heavy for it's category, bottom line. Does it make it worse? Probably not. Does the heavy weight make it better? Probably not. Sure the bike as whole is better than many, but even then that's personal preference, just like wanting a light bike.

  8. #408
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    Quote Originally Posted by savo View Post
    A simple guess is that a 650b wheel would not fit in the rear with the 26'' dropouts... but maybe it does. Would someone try?
    i think keith mentioned he designed the frame for tonnes of tire/mud clearance, so if you ran a pinner tire you could fit a 650 wheel in with 26" dropouts and keep the backend super short. oh but maybe he was talking about the rune...

  9. #409
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dlongb13 View Post
    But I am tired of beating the dead horse, the Spitfire is heavy for it's category, bottom line. Does it make it worse? Probably not. Does the heavy weight make it better? Probably not. Sure the bike as whole is better than many, but even then that's personal preference, just like wanting a light bike.
    Maybe save 1/4lb with a quick release fork?!

  10. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by boomforeal View Post
    i think keith mentioned he designed the frame for tonnes of tire/mud clearance, so if you ran a pinner tire you could fit a 650 wheel in with 26" dropouts and keep the backend super short. oh but maybe he was talking about the rune...
    Yes he mentioned it about the Spitty after I questioned all the clearance I saw in a previous picture.

    I am very curious about this as well to see what size if any 650B wheel/tire combo will fit the 26" dropouts. Hopefully someone will give it a shot for kicks and giggles.
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  11. #411
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiawatha-de View Post
    Is that scale reading 7.15 lbs? Can't tell if that's the current time or weight? Is that a veggie scale or what?
    7 lbs 15. 3 oz.....Just under 8 lbs

  12. #412
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    Just checked UPS, bike sat in Portland for 3 days! Will be here Tuesday non. All parts cleaned prepped and ready to go.

  13. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    Yes he mentioned it about the Spitty after I questioned all the clearance I saw in a previous picture.

    I am very curious about this as well to see what size if any 650B wheel/tire combo will fit the 26" dropouts. Hopefully someone will give it a shot for kicks and giggles.
    Nevermind, +2
    Last edited by hrdude; 01-17-2013 at 08:25 PM.

  14. #414
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    But so would the front...

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    Got my frame and parts ready to build but have to admit I'm having second thoughts about frame size.

    I have a medium and I am 175cm (5'9") tall.

    I think I am ok with most of the numbers, but the reach is 1 3/4" (44.5mm) longer than my med Rune. That seems HUGH. I've been liking a 70mm stem on the Rune, and was going to go to a 60mm on the spity but that is not nearly enough. Not sure how the bike would climb technical single track with a 50mm, but that still seem too long of reach. The WB is quite long too.

    I'm not sure how accurate my rune reach is as I measured it with a level and tape measure. Came out to 381mm. Reach on med Spity in 427mm
    Should I get a small? Any opinions?.....Keith?

  16. #416
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nescafe View Post
    Got my frame and parts ready to build but have to admit I'm having second thoughts about frame size.

    I have a medium and I am 175cm (5'9") tall.

    I think I am ok with most of the numbers, but the reach is 1 3/4" (44.5mm) longer than my med Rune. That seems HUGH. I've been liking a 70mm stem on the Rune, and was going to go to a 60mm on the spity but that is not nearly enough. Not sure how the bike would climb technical single track with a 50mm, but that still seem too long of reach. The WB is quite long too.

    I'm not sure how accurate my rune reach is as I measured it with a level and tape measure. Came out to 381mm. Reach on med Spity in 427mm
    Should I get a small? Any opinions?.....Keith?
    If you stick with the medium frame you'd definitely benefit from droping to a 50mm stem (the V2 frames are designed to work better with shorter stems). The reach number shouldn't really be considered on its own. In seated position, the top tube of the V1 and V2 are the same (presuming same parts), but the reach is longer because I have steepened the seat tube on the V2.

    At 5'9" you may benefit from being on a small frame if you generally prefer the feeling of smaller frames, you are close to borderline on sizes, although for all day rides I would still put you on a medium with shorter stem.

    The new frames have a more agressive geometry that helps with weight distribution, so climbing with a short stem is not going to be an issue. Switching to the more forward position may take a couple of rides to get used to, but once you do you'll feel more comfortable at speed and have better front wheel traction.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nescafe View Post
    Got my frame and parts ready to build but have to admit I'm having second thoughts about frame size.

    I have a medium and I am 175cm (5'9") tall.

    I think I am ok with most of the numbers, but the reach is 1 3/4" (44.5mm) longer than my med Rune. That seems HUGH. I've been liking a 70mm stem on the Rune, and was going to go to a 60mm on the spity but that is not nearly enough. Not sure how the bike would climb technical single track with a 50mm, but that still seem too long of reach. The WB is quite long too.

    I'm not sure how accurate my rune reach is as I measured it with a level and tape measure. Came out to 381mm. Reach on med Spity in 427mm
    Should I get a small? Any opinions?.....Keith?
    I'm 5'10 and originally had a 70 mm stem on my V1 spitfire. I could have even gone to a 60mm which would have probably helped to liven up the front end. The wheelbase is much longer on the spitfire and helps with climbing. The low front end and seat angle help, too.

    I believe anything over 50mm might hinder maneuverability of the front end on the spitfire because the wheelbase is plenty long (just a guess).

    I'm actually gonna run a 40mm stem on my new V2 due to the slight geo changes and I'm suspecting it will not have any effect on it's climbing potential, but rather make it more lively.

  18. #418
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    Oh yeah, forgot to say my V1 was a medium and my V2 is gonna be a medium.

    I had trouble with sizing between a medium and large when the V1 spitfire came out in 2010. I went with Keith's advice and went with the medium. He was right with his suggestions.

    What stem length do you suggest running on the V2 spitfire, Keith?

  19. #419
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    Stem length is a personal thing, and depends on arm length, riding style, frame size etc, but generally I wouldn't recommend going over 60mm for the V2 frames. Personally when I went from a large spitfire V1 (I'm just over 6'2" and have fairly long arms) with 70mm stem. I went to a large V2 and currently have a 60mm stem with same bars, and I'm considering going to 50mm stem just to make things a touch more lively, as I don't feel I need a 60mm stem to stay comfortable and certainly not to keep the front end down as I have no issues with that.... only you can choose what is best for you.
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  20. #420
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    Thanks for your reply's and insight Keith.

    Some of the trails I ride are slow speed tight twisty "black diamond" so a smaller bike might be better, but
    a short stem as you recommend (on these bikes) on a small would make the cockpit too small for seated pedaling for me. If I went with a small I would need a new dropper post as well as mine would be short. I hope with this geometry that the WB wont feel as long as it is on the trails I like to ride. Thanks again, looking forward to get her built up today.

  21. #421
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    Ok, I went to the local bike shop and found a frame. So I weighed it.

    Size medium raw/clear coat comes in at 8.00 lbs exactly with 12x142 dropouts and axle.


    My black frame I ordered still hasn't arrived yet.
    Last edited by Lead-Sled; 01-20-2013 at 09:27 PM.

  22. #422
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    My black one is sitting at ups. I'll have it Tuesday.

  23. #423
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    8.00 lbs??? Pffff ... that´s way to heavy, man ...

  24. #424
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    Here is my large spitfire I just built up last night. Super stoked on this bike!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2013 Spitfire-image.jpg  


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    ...and i am now officially rethinking my decision to switch to a red frame. but all the colors look good, seems like you can't go wrong. sharp bike joe!

    edit: i was supposed to pick up my frame on friday but showed up late to lights out and locked doors... damn had all the parts laid out and beers on ice to build it this weekend! won't be able to make another pickup run until thursday afternoon, trying to convince my wife to play courier on her lunch break tomorrow

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    So glad I got black

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    So it begins...

  28. #428
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    I'm getting super jealous seeing all these new frames...I just want to get my new Spitfire on order, but I still haven't heard back from Trident regarding actually ordering my upgrade deal.

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    My V2 arrived with all the parts ready to swap from the V1, but can't ride until after board exams in 2.5 weeks.

    Keith: I have a suggestion. You probably have a few experts/pros riding the V2 with intentions of giving professional ride reports, but have you ever considered shipping one out to Pinkbike's Brad Walton? He has reviewed many bikes and rips without a doubt. Plus, his ride reports on Pinkbike are very technical, well-thought out, exhaustive, and articulate.
    Banshee would benefit from his impressions, I believe. Just a suggestion. Reason I mention it is because his ride reports are well-respected. I could give mine, but they would include words like cool, fun, so-so, awesome.....
    Looking forward to the first ride on my V2. Anyone feel free to chime in on their ride. They should be trickling in by now. Unless your snowed in.

  30. #430
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    Looks like Brad already got his hands on a Rune V2.

    Mountain Biking Photos - Pinkbike

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    So frames come with all the 12x142 dropouts right? Including 650b ones?

  32. #432
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dlongb13 View Post
    So frames come with all the 12x142 dropouts right? Including 650b ones?
    No, you choose your dropouts when you order the frame. Extra dropouts are available for around $70-ish I beleive.

  33. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiawatha-de View Post
    My V2 arrived with all the parts ready to swap from the V1, but can't ride until after board exams in 2.5 weeks.

    Keith: I have a suggestion. You probably have a few experts/pros riding the V2 with intentions of giving professional ride reports, but have you ever considered shipping one out to Pinkbike's Brad Walton? He has reviewed many bikes and rips without a doubt. Plus, his ride reports on Pinkbike are very technical, well-thought out, exhaustive, and articulate.
    Banshee would benefit from his impressions, I believe. Just a suggestion. Reason I mention it is because his ride reports are well-respected. I could give mine, but they would include words like cool, fun, so-so, awesome.....
    Looking forward to the first ride on my V2. Anyone feel free to chime in on their ride. They should be trickling in by now. Unless your snowed in.
    OK..... I am no expert or pro but do have a dozen years of north shore riding, the last 3 on my Rune for AM and consider myself an advanced rider.
    Rode the last 4 days on my medium spity v2 and defiantly feel the extra inch of WB over my v1 Rune as well as the added reach when out of the saddle.

    Im 5'9" with a 30" inseam.
    Had 70mm stem and 28" bars on the med rune
    Have 60mm and 29.5 on the med spitfire.
    Same 160 Lyrik u turn coil
    As many are coming off a Rune like me I will make some comparisons as I see them.

    On the 22/32 fire road climbs I cant say I notice much difference.
    On the short climbs on the trails I've been riding out of the saddle it feels as good or maybe better than the Rune.

    The suspension feels awesome. Much better than I thought. The fox CTD soaks up the chunder and the feels just as good landing hits. My isx6 shock on the Rune needed service and it wasn't quite getting full travel. The v2 Spitfire suspension feels much better.

    The Spitfire is a little tougher to manual, and on slow speed pops I have to lean back a little more.

    In the air it feels good.

    On the trail, I have to really lean forward. I have been getting faster every ride but I'm still having a hard time finding the sweet spot to get the proper traction and braking in the tighter corners.

    Most of the trails I ride are Twisty with lots of pops and I wonder if a small frame would have been better for me.
    If I was an inch or two taller the fit would be better. I am going 1.5" wider with the bars on this bike. I may try a 50mm stem to push me back a bit but that would hamper single track climbing.

    It seems like I'm shifting my weight back (to pop off things) and forth (to trail ride) a lot more which isn't good.
    Once I get better at finding the sweet spot and start cornering better this bike will be an absolute blast, after all I've just had four days on it.

    Just my observations, your results may vary.
    Last edited by Nescafe; 01-22-2013 at 11:23 PM.

  34. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haus Boss View Post
    Looks like Brad already got his hands on a Rune V2.

    Mountain Biking Photos - Pinkbike
    interesting

    Quote Originally Posted by Nescafe View Post
    Just my observations, your results may vary.
    this is interesting too. planning the same transition (rune to a spitfire) in the same locale - but i don't think i'm going to have any fit issues. you don't seem blown away...

  35. #435
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nescafe View Post
    Just my observations, your results may vary.
    Maybe try increasing the head angle with the flip chips into the upper position to give a 67 degree head angle to match the V1 (Rune V1 had 67 deg head angle).

    You have also put a 10mm shorter stem on which will also move your weight back. Maybe try putting the 70mm stem onto the spitfire and see how it goes.

  36. #436
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    Are you saying that you feel your weight is too far back or that you need to move your weight back when you're airing off of bumps in the trail? One thing that strikes me is that if you shorten your stem and widen your bars, it's kind of a wash. Add that to the fact that the consensus seems to be that the V2's are a bit longer than the V1's and it may be that you are too far forward compared to what you're used to. This would make it feel like you need to get back all the time. If it were me I'd try a shorter stem if anything. Steepening the HA a bit will also make manualing a little easier and would shorten the wheelbase. Just a thought....my frame hasn't arrived but I'll post my thoughts when it's ready (going large V1 spitty to V2).

  37. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by joemosq View Post
    Here is my large spitfire I just built up last night. Super stoked on this bike!
    can I ask you what's your height and if is 650ed?

    in case you are 6',1- 6',2 and 34-35" inseam, how do you feel it?

  38. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nescafe View Post
    OK..... I am no expert or pro but do have a dozen years of north shore riding, the last 3 on my Rune for AM and consider myself an advanced rider.
    Rode the last 4 days on my medium spity v2 and defiantly feel the extra inch of WB over my v1 Rune as well as the added reach when out of the saddle.

    Im 5'9" with a 30" inseam.
    Had 70mm stem and 28" bars on the med rune
    Have 60mm and 29.5 on the med spitfire.
    Same 160 Lyrik u turn coil
    As many are coming off a Rune like me I will make some comparisons as I see them.

    On the 22/32 fire road climbs I cant say I notice much difference.
    On the short climbs on the trails I've been riding out of the saddle it feels as good or maybe better than the Rune.

    The suspension feels awesome. Much better than I thought. The fox CTD soaks up the chunder and the feels just as good landing hits. My isx6 shock on the Rune needed service and it wasn't quite getting full travel. The v2 Spitfire suspension feels much better.

    The Spitfire is a little tougher to manual, and on slow speed pops I have to lean back a little more.

    In the air it feels good.

    On the trail, I have to really lean forward. I have been getting faster every ride but I'm still having a hard time finding the sweet spot to get the proper traction and braking in the tighter corners.

    Most of the trails I ride are Twisty with lots of pops and I wonder if a small frame would have been better for me.
    If I was an inch or two taller the fit would be better. I am going 1.5" wider with the bars on this bike. I may try a 50mm stem to push me back a bit but that would hamper single track climbing.

    It seems like I'm shifting my weight back (to pop off things) and forth (to trail ride) a lot more which isn't good.
    Once I get better at finding the sweet spot and start cornering better this bike will be an absolute blast, after all I've just had four days on it.

    Just my observations, your results may vary.
    I would definitely try going with a shorter stem. Even down to 30 mm if you have to. Maybe try some riser bars or increased stack height, too. I think finding the sweet spot on the spitfire involves messing with the front end,

  39. #439
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    The new breed of Banshee's are definitely designed around shorter stem length to help create a more fun ride without sacrificing weight distribution. If going from a V1 spitfire to a V2 spitfire of same size, I'd suggest you shorten stem by 10-20mm (depending on personal peferance, and assuming bar length remains the same, if bars go wider then take another 5-10mm off stem length).
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  40. #440
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    I'll add a little more info to my post above.

    I've been riding between the steep and middle settings. Don't really want to go too slack. Middle feels better.
    Saddle is full forward on the rails with the 60mm stem and feels comfortable climbing.

    I have taken the 45mm stem off my DH bike to try for the next ride. I hope I will not have to move back and forth as much now
    Some of the rides I do, have extended technical singletrack climbs, and I question how this will be with a short stem which seems necessary for me.

  41. #441
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    3050 grams outta the box - medium black frame only, no shock/hardware, no dropouts, no seatpost. With the shock/hardware and x12 dropouts added, its just over 3400 grams.
    Last edited by Breal604; 01-24-2013 at 10:56 AM.

  42. #442
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    5 days 5 rides on the new bike.
    After a week and a half of unusualy great winter conditions in Vancouver, we are back to the rain.
    On days like this I usually do trail work instead of ride, but, new bike........you know!

    One ride in sloppy conditions does not warrant a review, but I will say the shorter stem feels way better(for me). Much easier to get the front up and less weight shifting back and forth.

    Also, I remember the feeling of going from a single pivot bike to a VPP years ago and how each pedal stroke felt like it propeled you forward. I get a little of that feeling with the KS link over the v1 Rune.

  43. #443
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    Does anyone have any 650b dropouts they would be willing to sell. Trident is out, banshee is out. Four week lead time. I need these dropouts!!

  44. #444
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dlongb13 View Post
    Does anyone have any 650b dropouts they would be willing to sell. Trident is out, banshee is out. Four week lead time. I need these dropouts!!
    We have them... but we are in Europe !!

  45. #445
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    Check shipping to 45205 in Ohio. Seriously. I picked up some 650b Enve wheels and now I can't run them!

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    I put my order in for a Frame/650b Drop outs a week and a half ago or so.
    Red, L,
    Just ordered my CC DBair from Cane Creek
    XX1,
    Arch EX on DT 240s, Sapim CX Ray
    Trail XO brakes
    enve bars, thompson, etc etc

  47. #447
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    Quote Originally Posted by phallski View Post
    I put my order in for a Frame/650b Drop outs a week and a half ago or so.
    Red, L,
    Just ordered my CC DBair from Cane Creek
    XX1,
    Arch EX on DT 240s, Sapim CX Ray
    Trail XO brakes
    enve bars, thompson, etc etc
    Sounds nice and a lightweight build/objective? What fork you gonna use?
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  48. #448
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    Full build spec is as follows, Going with a 150 RCT3 Revelation. I'm planning around 28 lbs complete, including a chainguide, dropper, and Shimano DX SPD's. This will be a one bike quiver for me, riding in the Salt Lake/Park City area, so I want it strong for shuttles/riding lifts at DV, but also light enough to climb 4-5k/day.
    Frame Spitfire V2
    Shock CC DB Air
    Headset Cane Creen 110
    Fork Revelation449.28
    Stem Thomson X4
    Bar Enve DH
    Shifter XX1
    R.Derailleur XX1
    Chain XX1
    Cassette XX1
    Cranks XX1
    Bottom Bracket GXP
    Chainguide LG1
    Brakes x0 Trail
    Rotors HSX160/180
    Front Hub DT 240s 15mm CenterLock
    Rear Hub Dt240s 12x142 Centerlock
    Rims Arch EX
    Spokes Sapim CX-Ray
    Nipples Wheelsmith
    Tire F
    Tire R
    Post Lev
    Saddle Silverado Pro
    Grips Longneck
    Pedals DX

  49. #449
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    Assembling mine now. Due to the non-availability of the 650B dropouts the build has changed a slight bit. Gonna be wicked. Pics up later tonight. Also, don't know if I am allowed to do this or not, but check my for sale stuff. I have some killer 650B DT Swiss wheels for sale in there that would be awesome on this bike. I just got lucky and scored some Enve 650B's so mine are for sale. Brand new.

  50. #450
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    built up with all the parts from my rune:

    - bagged out xt/x9 drive train, still waiting for an s3 front derailleur
    - 36 float (damn this thing is heavy! soon to be swapped out for a revelation methinks)
    - xt/singletrack wheels with minion exo's (again, heavy as hell but they'll do. i've got some 650 drop outs ordered, and hopefully will be able to build myself a nice mid-size wheelset later this year)
    - new slx brakes, work wicked good
    - manitou isx-6 shock - having to pretty much relearn how to set this thing up, suspension acts much different from the rune's. range of adjustment is retarded

    probably weighs closer to 35 lbs than 30, but who cares
    Last edited by boomforeal; 01-29-2013 at 12:11 PM.

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