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  1. #1
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    System v User v Social trails

    Sorry for my ignorance, but what do the above actually mean and what is the relevance to the various Sedona threads here?

    And no, I am not trolling but I am Canadian and we just ride "trails"...

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixZeroSixOne View Post
    Sorry for my ignorance, but what do the above actually mean and what is the relevance to the various Sedona threads here?

    And no, I am not trolling but I am Canadian and we just ride "trails"...
    You forgot "rouge" and "rogue."

    Just ride. If somebody starts chasing you, it's likely you're on a social trail, in somebody's backyard, or it's TD asking if you'd like to help him smooth over her relationship with the FS...literally.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  3. #3
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    It is best to ignore any thread regarding social trails in the AZ forum and focus on the Photo Friday threads.

    You're welcome.

    "Nobody ever told me not to try" - Curious George Soundtrack by Jack Johnson

  4. #4
    PMP,TAN,LAUNDRY
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    There's usually beer cans on social trails.
    Bender to AZDog: I'm not the best person to give advice on not riding!

  5. #5
    My other ride is your mom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noelg View Post
    It is best to ignore any thread regarding social trails in the AZ forum and focus on the Photo Friday threads.

    You're welcome.

    +1

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixZeroSixOne View Post
    Sorry for my ignorance, but what do the above actually mean and what is the relevance to the various Sedona threads here?

    And no, I am not trolling but I am Canadian and we just ride "trails"...
    Six:

    In Sedona there is a huge system of trails. I have friends who belong to the Westerners Hiking Club and they have shared maps with me, that have of the vast hiking trail that many of the long term members have hiked for years.

    I would venture to guess there is easily over 150 trails they use that the general public has no clue about. I guess you would call those trails user built hiking trails.

    In Sedona you also have a lot of private residences backing up to the National forest Service land and for easy access many of those property owners have created their own little trail that connect to either a FS system trail or a user-built trail some people like to call those trails social trails when they are actually residence owner user built trails.

    In the Color Cove area you have a large equestrian community and they have developed several trails out of their area that connect to user built and system trails. I guess you call those horse trails.

    I guess a new unauthorized trail under construction would be called an illegal trail. Once the trail is completed it may turn into a user built trail status if it becomes a popular trail for mainly hikers or bikers.

    We use to call the user built trails unsanctioned trails, but when the FS decided to adopt trails in Sedona they came up with the term user built trails.

    As we all know many communities though out the US have trails that have been created by users. Many of those trails were not designed by an individual who understood sustainable trail building techniques.

    I just rode a trail in Jackson Hole Wyoming called the Black Canyon trail. I have no clue about this amazing trail, but I can tell you it wasn't routed by an individual or group that was very knowledgeable about sustainable trail building. In the upper section the trail has very few grade reversals and many of the turns don't have grade reversals at the beginning or end of the turns.

    My point is that many user built trails in Sedona are built better than FS system trails and are not illegal to ride so hopefully someday they can be adopted so proper signage can be installed to allow better navigating by the advanced skilled mountain biking community.

    Hope that helps.

    TD

  7. #7
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    So:

    'System' = trails which are known by, maybe even built by, the landowner (usually the local FS?) which are available to the general public. Also includes trails which were built illegally/un-authorized but have now been 'adopted' and trails which were sanctioned by the landowner but maybe built by individuals/volunteers. Correct?

    'User' = trails built by volunteer labor on FS land but not built by Forest Service paid crews. Correct?

    'Social' = trails built on private property which a landowner permits public access to (or maybe does not know about).

    I'm still confused about which trails I could potentially ride when down in Sedona without being ticketed or shot at by an angry landowner...

  8. #8
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    Mountain bikers are rarely shot in Sedona. Just ride and have fun.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixZeroSixOne View Post

    I'm still confused about which trails I could potentially ride when down in Sedona without being ticketed or shot at by an angry landowner...
    The land that the mountain bike trails are on is all FS land, except two that only I have been given permission to ride on and you will never find, so don't worry about those.
    All other mountain bike trails (system or user built) are currently OK to ride unless posted otherwise.

    If you are an advanced technical rider then the user built trails are the most challenging.

    Obviously you can't ride in the wilderness so Earl's Loop, Birdcage and Marge's Draw are illegal to ride. You will never find Earl's Loop or Birdcage, but Marge's Draw is sometimes ridden by out of town bikers because they can't believe a wilderness trail is next to someones backyard.

    My recent online map provides all the mountain bike trails that are legal to ride at this time.

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