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  1. #1
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    SMP North trail sabotage ?

    On my ride today on Sidewinder downhill coming around a blind corner this is laying across the trail.

    SMP North trail sabotage ?-003.jpg

  2. #2
    Meatbomb
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    The horror.

    Did you go around or bunny hop?

  3. #3
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    It raises the question - why the mountain biker hate? I've never understood the dislike toward mountain bikers from hikers and equestrians. When I was riding Black Canyon last month, I came across some hikers and was quite happy to see them because they were the first human beings I'd seen in a few hours. I tried to chat with them but they looked at me as if I was some undesirable vagabond who was somehow ruining their pristine environment. And equestrians usually get annoyed that they have to pull their horse over to the side of the trail to let us pass.....hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    The horror.

    Did you go around or bunny hop?
    Stopped and moved it, don't know why the biker I passed just before this didn't move it.

  5. #5
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    yeah, honestly, there are times when I come across a big obstacle in the middle of the trail(like a rock or something) that wasn't there the last time and can possibly be a hazard to someone. Most of the time I'll stop and kick it out of the way, but sometimes, just don't feel like stopping.
    Don't get excited you anti-trail-cleanser folks...I'm not dumbing down any trails, just removing something that wasn't there before that could hurt someone not expecting it.
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  6. #6
    Meatbomb
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    Maybe the pic is not doing it justice but that does not look like an overly dangerous piece of sabotage to me.. looks like a big stick in the trail in plain sight.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    It raises the question - why the mountain biker hate?
    All it takes is couple of a-holes.

  8. #8
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    SMP North trail sabotage ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    It raises the question - why the mountain biker hate? I've never understood the dislike toward mountain bikers from hikers and equestrians. When I was riding Black Canyon last month, I came across some hikers and was quite happy to see them because they were the first human beings I'd seen in a few hours. I tried to chat with them but they looked at me as if I was some undesirable vagabond who was somehow ruining their pristine environment. And equestrians usually get annoyed that they have to pull their horse over to the side of the trail to let us pass.....hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.
    Yeah - I don't know if a branch in the trail is mountain biker hate.

    Maybe the hikers just didn't want to be social. BCT is a place to get away from it all, not necessarily meaning they hate mountain bikers.

    Bikes yield to horses - has always been the rule. It is for everyone's safety. Please don't complain about that!

  9. #9
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    What are you guys talking about? I've never seen any hate in my direction by hikers or equestrians. They always step aside even if they don't need to, most of them say "hi" and sometimes I hear "have a good ride".
    May be it's because I'm not a local one here, but I really don't see any hate when I'm riding.

  10. #10
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    Maybe I am just awesome, but I would just loft a front and lift the rear to clear that on my SS hardtail. So the F what? Who gives a shat if a hiker moves a rock to make it a little easier to walk over or something. As long as its not a booby trap I say let it go. We ride mountain bikes on trails, not BMX tracks. We should always expect the unexpected and this is why I ride EVERY trail like its the first time.We are the minority vs. hikers and the complete newbs vs. horse riders and need to earn our chops. Like I have said before, if every one of us made it a priority to say at least 5 words to whomever we encounter on the trail (even other bikes) it would go a long way to helping our acceptance. Seriously-STFU and ride like nice humans, and if an encounter with someone else on our beautiful trails while we are experiencing things that many others never will is going to ruin your day, you need another hobby. Oh and for the Strava-haters, I can do all that and still get a top 10 on a new trail.
    Quote Originally Posted by Azpilot View Post
    On my ride today on Sidewinder downhill coming around a blind corner this is laying across the trail.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	003.jpg 
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    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  11. #11
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    ^^^ Word. Be friendly, don't be a stack up roadie... and if you manage to be friendly to every hiker/biker - as in say hi and thank them for moving out of the way - and still get a KOM then you are truly a bad ass.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    And equestrians usually get annoyed that they have to pull their horse over to the side of the trail to let us pass.....hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.
    Well, whatever's easier for you......that's what it says on the sign, right?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azpilot View Post
    On my ride today on Sidewinder downhill coming around a blind corner this is laying across the trail.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	003.jpg 
Views:	225 
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ID:	854403
    Seems like plenty of space go around. No big deal. Personally I never ride blind. I always watch the trail in front as it is easy to forget which turn is which and then assume some trail feature is coming. So I always rely on the trail in front rater than what I remember. Unlike road biking, mtn biking is all about reacting to what the trail throws at you. I once when around a blind turn at the start of the big central climb on on these trails (from west to east) and the trail was washed out badly. There was a 3 foot deep 6 foot wide square edge drop that running water carved. That thing was ready hurt a biker coming by too fast, but was caused by nature. Thing happen and you must always ride prepared. That log could easily have been someone hurt in the middle of the trail too. You must always ride with your head up prepared for anything.
    Joe
    '12 Santa Cruz Highball 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", '06 Rocky Mtn Switch 26" XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  14. #14
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    I came in here expecting to see some moto made its way through the system rutting up corners or something. It's dumb if somebody put that there with the intent on injuring a trail user. That being said, if you are coming around a blind corner and see that and aren't able to maneuver over or around it... what were you going to do if it was another trail user in that exact spot? At least the obstacle here won't react in any way - unlike a hiker with earbuds in, or a mom pushing her kids around in a stroller or an equestrian.

    Oh, and I guess the "techy section" count on SMP just went from 0 to 1 =)

  15. #15
    How much further ???
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    Now that's funny.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    It raises the question - why the mountain biker hate? I've never understood the dislike toward mountain bikers from hikers and equestrians. When I was riding Black Canyon last month, I came across some hikers and was quite happy to see them because they were the first human beings I'd seen in a few hours. I tried to chat with them but they looked at me as if I was some undesirable vagabond who was somehow ruining their pristine environment. And equestrians usually get annoyed that they have to pull their horse over to the side of the trail to let us pass.....hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.
    Two words: Specialized!
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    It raises the question - why the mountain biker hate? I've never understood the dislike toward mountain bikers from hikers and equestrians.
    Because there are just enough of us out there that act like complete douche bags on the trail (don't slow down, don't yield properly, riding off-trail) that they assume we are all like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    And equestrians usually get annoyed that they have to pull their horse over to the side of the trail to let us pass.....hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.
    I hate to say it but if this is your yielding policy then you are part of the problem. I've not ridden every trail in AZ but I've NEVER been on one that EVERYONE was not supposed to yield to horses. Horses > Hikers and Hikers > MTBers and MTBers yield to EVERYONE.

    Yes, I understand that it's almost ALWAYS easier for a hiker to take two steps off the path and let us by. Fortunately, most hikers understand this. But, that's not the rule.

    And horses... Why would anyone want to put themselves in danger of being trampled or kicked by a 2000# animal? Stop, let them by, continue on unscathed. Simple, really.

    MTBers yield to everyone. When we all start abiding by the rules maybe there will be less MTB hate?

    Quote Originally Posted by cstem View Post
    Like I have said before, if every one of us made it a priority to say at least 5 words to whomever we encounter on the trail (even other bikes) it would go a long way to helping our acceptance.
    That's precisely why I throw a "good morning" out to everyone I pass on the trail.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    hey, its much easier to pull your horse over than to completely stop your ride, lose all of your momentum, and push your bike on foot so you don't startle a horse. Some people just can't adapt to the 21st century, I guess.
    Respectfully disagree
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  19. #19
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    I agree with your disagreement.

  20. #20
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    What is the proper course of action when approaching horses from the rear? I typically let my presence be known as soon as possible and let the riders set the stage.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    What is the proper course of action when approaching horses from the rear? I typically let my presence be known as soon as possible and let the riders set the stage.
    Yep, that's typically what I do. I usually use my rear hub as a "warning" for any other trail users. If I'm approaching from the back, I'll coast a bit so they can hear I'm coming.

    With horses, I'll try and get the rider's attention as early as possible and ask what they want me to do. FYI, I do the same if we are coming in opposite direction.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  22. #22
    Just another half mile...
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    Bells work really well in this situation. Ding Ding followed by a good Morning or afternoon and then ask if we may pass and then let them find a comfortable and safe spot to pull off the trail. . Received lots of compliments and thanks from equestrians and hikers using the bell when coming up from behind. IMO every MTBer should have a bell to DING DING.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    What is the proper course of action when approaching horses from the rear? I typically let my presence be known as soon as possible and let the riders set the stage.

  23. #23
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    I do have a bell but I don't use it when approaching a horse from behind. Next time I'll ask if it's a good way to signal I'm approaching. Hikers get the ding ding every time.

    When approaching a horse head on I always stop and step a few feet off the downhill side of the trail and wait for them to pass.

  24. #24
    Give it a crank
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    You saw a log in the middle of the trail and assumed it was maliciously placed there by either a hiker or equestrian?

    You need to ride more, you'll see more, and assume less.

  25. #25
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    I was riding once and there was what I thought to be a rock in the middle of the trail but it was really a desert tortoise saboteur. I shook my fist in the air yelling "damn you..... damn you... tortoise" as I rode around him.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  26. #26
    Meatbomb
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    never pick up a tortoise and remove it from the trail. let it be.

  27. #27
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    SHUT DOWN EVERYTHING, there is savage wood out there trying to maim mountain bikers...
    I don't think that is anything to be worried about, just move it and carry on.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    never pick up a tortoise and remove it from the trail. let it be.
    What if the tortoise was put there maliciously by a hiker to hurt mountain bikers?

  29. #29
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    In my case I truly believe the tortoise himself was trying to maliciously hurt me. You should have seen the stink eye he was giving me when I foiled his evil plan and simply rode around him.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  30. #30
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    log

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  31. #31
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    Not a very good attempt at "sabotaging" a trail. I took the statement and picture as a joke.

    As for horses, a horse needs to know that it is a person coming up from behind so the best method is a soft voice. A bell or hub is not something they might recognize and startle them.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike View Post
    ..That's precisely why I throw a "good morning" out to everyone I pass on the trail.
    That is what I do. Even if I working hard on a climb I always verbalize with a hiker. Could be "thank you", "good morning", "have great hike". Whatever, but I seems to work. Plus in groups I will tell them if there are more riders behind me. Always a cheerful tone too. I always slow down as well unless I am climbing at slow pace.

    The only ones I don't talk too have ear buds jammed in their ears and can't hear me anyway. When I comes to horses I slow down and yield to the actions of the riders. If they pull off to let pass then great. They are on big sometimes unpredictable animals so I give then a wide berth. Most will give me space to ride but I assume nothing and just react to what they do.
    Joe
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Douger-1 View Post
    I was riding once and there was what I thought to be a rock in the middle of the trail but it was really a desert tortoise saboteur. I shook my fist in the air yelling "damn you..... damn you... tortoise" as I rode around him.
    Wait I you did not crash? That must have been a major miracle!
    Joe
    '12 Santa Cruz Highball 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", '06 Rocky Mtn Switch 26" XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    never pick up a tortoise and remove it from the trail. let it be.
    2 words:

    Turtle soup

  35. #35
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    I think horses are just lucky they don't taste really good and that eating them is generally taboo. Never hear of a rider giving trail respect to cows or chickens.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

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    Quote Originally Posted by cstem View Post
    I think horses are just lucky they don't taste really good and that eating them is generally taboo. Never hear of a rider giving trail respect to cows or chickens.
    Actually they taste real good, it's just that we Americans romanticize horses.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    What is the proper course of action when approaching horses from the rear? I typically let my presence be known as soon as possible and let the riders set the stage.
    i would do my best michael winslow impression to talk to the horse.

  38. #38
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    I'm not implying that mountain bikers should just ride by horses with complete disregard for the safety of their riders. That would be both reckless and disrespectful. I'm simply stating that mountain bikers are suffering a greater inconvenience by losing all of their momentum, dismounting and walking their bikes than equestrians who merely have to pull their horses to the side of the trail for a brief moment. One would think that that would lead to just a little bit of gratitude on the part of equestrians, as opposed to a "We were here first, what kind of a nut rides a bike on a mountain anyway" mentality.

  39. #39
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    I don't have much momentum to lose so it's not that big of a deal to me.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    I'm not implying that mountain bikers should just ride by horses with complete disregard for the safety of their riders. That would be both reckless and disrespectful. I'm simply stating that mountain bikers are suffering a greater inconvenience by losing all of their momentum, dismounting and walking their bikes than equestrians who merely have to pull their horses to the side of the trail for a brief moment. One would think that that would lead to just a little bit of gratitude on the part of equestrians, as opposed to a "We were here first, what kind of a nut rides a bike on a mountain anyway" mentality.
    You are only thinking of this from the horse riders perspective and not the horse. What if the horse is thinking "Man I had some awesome trotting going on there and was really in the zone, then this f'n mountain biker comes around the corner and breaks my flow. Fat a$$ was going to let me trot that corner hard and now I have to stop. Guess Im just going to take a dump now instead."
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCTJ View Post
    I'm not implying that mountain bikers should just ride by horses with complete disregard for the safety of their riders. That would be both reckless and disrespectful. I'm simply stating that mountain bikers are suffering a greater inconvenience by losing all of their momentum, dismounting and walking their bikes than equestrians who merely have to pull their horses to the side of the trail for a brief moment. One would think that that would lead to just a little bit of gratitude on the part of equestrians, as opposed to a "We were here first, what kind of a nut rides a bike on a mountain anyway" mentality.
    Sorry, but I think you might be a bit in the dark in regards to what it takes to control and one-ton animal. And it has nothing to do with "we were here first." By the way, are you suggesting that they pull that one-ton animal off the trail, which likely will cause some damage.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  42. #42
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    The OP was just lucky they didn't put a rattlesnake in the trail around that blind corner. Luckily, this is Arizona and we don't have to worry about dangerous things when we mountain bike.
    Can't wait for the snow to melt and the dirt to dry

  43. #43
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    Quick story on how good hiker karma pays off.

    Few weeks when I prerode McDowell AES course and I lost my car keys and a smartphone coming down the Bell Pass. All the shaking just ripped the saddlebag. So I get to my car parked by Basha's on Bell and I realize I have no keys or my phone. Thankfully Ray was with me so we called my wife to pick me.

    Meanwhile the hikers that found my phone, called my wife on her phone. I asked them where they were so I can pick up my lost things and they said they were driving by Basha's. I quickly told them that that is where I was and had the stuff delivered to my car within next two minutes.
    I remembered passing these hikers and as always being courteous. I especially remembered them because they just happened to be a couple of young, attractive girls.
    Anyway, good karma pays off.

    Now go earn you karma.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by metalaficionado View Post
    Quick story on how good hiker karma pays off.

    Few weeks when I prerode McDowell AES course and I lost my car keys and a smartphone coming down the Bell Pass. All the shaking just ripped the saddlebag. So I get to my car parked by Basha's on Bell and I realize I have no keys or my phone. Thankfully Ray was with me so we called my wife to pick me.

    Meanwhile the hikers that found my phone, called my wife on her phone. I asked them where they were so I can pick up my lost things and they said they were driving by Basha's. I quickly told them that that is where I was and had the stuff delivered to my car within next two minutes.
    I remembered passing these hikers and as always being courteous. I especially remembered them because they just happened to be a couple of young, attractive girls.
    Anyway, good karma pays off.

    Now go earn you karma.
    So...can I have their phone number?

  45. #45
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    Speaking of bells... That's why I like my bear bell. It's always making noise so if approaching a horse (or hiker) from behind it would hear me from some distance and not be startled by a sudden, load bell.

    Sent from my Thunderbolt via TapATalk 4

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike View Post
    Speaking of bells... That's why I like my bear bell. It's always making noise so if approaching a horse (or hiker) from behind it would hear me from some distance and not be startled by a sudden, load bell.

    Sent from my Thunderbolt via TapATalk 4
    That would drive me ****ing bonkers.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  47. #47
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    I will ask my wife, that should go over well.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Casual Observer View Post
    That would drive me ****ing bonkers.
    I keep the muffler on it so it's not crazy loud but it's always jingling. I don't think I've ever noticed it...

  49. #49
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    First off, bunny hop that sh*t and keep rolling!

    Second, the bell works just fine for me, and I talk to just about anyone I pass who is not tuned out with the earbuds. Kill em' with kindness, were just riding bikes (unless I am going for a PR or KOM, then all bets are off........!)

  50. #50
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    Dear Abby,
    I've noticed that red lights and stop signs really inconvenience me. I mean, my car loses all momentum. If I'm inconvenienced, do I still have to follow the rules?

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