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  1. #1
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    Norcal style trails in the desert?

    Where is this trail? What is the name of it?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Norcal style trails in the desert?-12122012.jpg  


  2. #2
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    Don't worry, our awesome park rangers or old-goat riders probably have ripped it out by now. We can't have anything cool here, because someone might get hurt.

  3. #3
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    Vincit qui patitur
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    Is it just me, or does that plank turn seem pretty useless? Sure the turn is off camber, but it seems over kill. Using rocks on the outside to build up a berm would have seemed to make more sense. Also, wood does not last very long here in the dez.

    What do I know though. Regardless, I guess it is cool that people are putting some effort into the trails.

    No clue where it is at.

  5. #5
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    I know where it is and I can tell you its still there. That being said Im not sure I want to post its location on a public forum. PM me if you want details. There is also a nice 10 foot roller about 5 yards after it.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by SugarHigh View Post
    Is it just me, or does that plank turn seem pretty useless? Sure the turn is off camber, but it seems over kill. Using rocks on the outside to build up a berm would have seemed to make more sense. Also, wood does not last very long here in the dez.

    What do I know though. Regardless, I guess it is cool that people are putting some effort into the trails.

    No clue where it is at.
    It just allows you to carry more speed through that section from the previous turn. Its fun if you can link the previous turn into that planked turn with speed, then slam the brakes for the 10 foot roller and blast down the fall line to a 2 foot step drop into the wash.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  7. #7
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    Good idea, I like the new segments out there.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgaarmy View Post
    Where is this trail? What is the name of it?
    Gila Monster in Gold Canyon.. I have cleaned that a couple times...

    Jabert

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    Cool trail....i should try it sometime.

    -S

    Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk 2

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    The trail is fairly vanilla with a fun finish. The wood is a gimmick for sure.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jabert View Post
    XXXXXXXX in XXXXXXX.. I have cleaned that a couple times...

    Jabert
    Can you delete your response please. I answered the OP's question in a private message. I personally dont think we should publicize that type of building on a public forum. Call me paranoid ...
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Douger-1 View Post
    Can you delete your response please. I answered the OP's question in a private message. I personally dont think we should publicize that type of building on a public forum. Call me paranoid ...
    Okay, you're paranoid...and spot on.

    Any "secret" type trail should be kept secret, especially if said trail has unnatural features that certain land managers, etc. might feel takes away from the beauty of its surroundings.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgaarmy View Post
    Where is this trail? What is the name of it?
    No, but I can tell you where this one is!!Norcal style trails in the desert?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1355436091.686540.jpg

  14. #14
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    Not sure why all the paranoia if it's on a designated trail, I'm sure the land manager knows about it.

  15. #15
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    I hope the termites don't end up eating all your hard work. Make sure to use an exterior grade pressure treated lumber and seal up wherever the wood is cut.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by CridgeMTBT View Post
    No, but I can tell you where this one is!!Click image for larger version. 

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    Isn't that at FINS? Is it worth the drive from the QC area to ride FINS?

  17. #17
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    Maybe it is ...... maybe it isnt.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ECEGatorTuro View Post
    Isn't that at FINS? Is it worth the drive from the QC area to ride FINS?
    I would go check out Goat Camp XC if you're driving that far.

  19. #19
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    Yes, it is. And it is worth the drive! I drive from west side out to Hawes, but if I lied on the east side I'd drive out to FINS.

  20. #20
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    The Gold Canyon trails are well known now and there are maps on the net. Not secret anymore. The wood section is prettty harmless with no real dangers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Douger-1 View Post
    Can you delete your response please. I answered the OP's question in a private message. I personally dont think we should publicize that type of building on a public forum. Call me paranoid ...

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    FYI; the small wood section was built to continue the flow around, and very close to, a large saguahro. The builders wanted to ensure that no damage to it would result from the trail. covering the roots (at ground level) with dirt/rocks etc perhaps would have led to smothering it; thus the short raised wooden section.

    And yes, it does lead directly to the 'Trans Canada Hiway'; aka gulp n go..............try it. You'll like it...if you make it.
    TS

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TransitionSenior View Post
    FYI; the small wood section was built to continue the flow around, and very close to, a large saguahro. The builders wanted to ensure that no damage to it would result from the trail. covering the roots (at ground level) with dirt/rocks etc perhaps would have led to smothering it; thus the short raised wooden section.

    And yes, it does lead directly to the 'Trans Canada Hiway'; aka gulp n go..............try it. You'll like it...if you make it.
    TS
    TS:

    Some of the viewers on this forum crack me up. The builder of the ramp puts in a feature to protect a really nice Saguaro and of course the AZ Highway Patrol is obviously going to understand its merit. They have a lot better things to do like chasing the 2012 NODfest across the desert to catch some riders smoking a few joints.

    Whoever built that ramp deserves a medal and a free trip to Sedona .

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    TS:
    Some of the viewers on this forum crack me up. The builder of the ramp puts in a feature to protect a really nice Saguaro and of course the AZ Highway Patrol is obviously going to understand its merit. They have a lot better things to do like chasing the 2012 NODfest across the desert to catch some riders smoking a few joints.

    Whoever built that ramp deserves a medal and a free trip to Sedona .
    I think you get a lot of interesting reactions from the forum viewers as well.

    So is it that we question what pirate trail builders do, or that some of us get paranoid about listing stuff like this on-line?

    After hearing why they built it, I think it is cool and I really respect their efforts out there.
    Last edited by SugarHigh; 12-14-2012 at 09:49 AM.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    TS:

    Some of the viewers on this forum crack me up. The builder of the ramp puts in a feature to protect a really nice Saguaro and of course the AZ Highway Patrol is obviously going to understand its merit. They have a lot better things to do like chasing the 2012 NODfest across the desert to catch some riders smoking a few joints.

    Whoever built that ramp deserves a medal and a free trip to Sedona .
    ^^^Still does not get it.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  25. #25
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    edit: Double post.
    Last edited by gila monster; 12-14-2012 at 11:00 AM.

  26. #26
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    I don't get these wooden ramps etc. If you don't like riding on dirt stick to a skate park. Even more so I can't believe how irate some mtb riders get about somebody moving a rock on a trail to make it easier yet somehow hauling a load of lumber and nails into the desert or woods is way cool.

    I hope this isn't an illegal build but I suspect it is. If wrong on this one my comments are still relevant to other situations out there.

    Building stuff like this on public land without permission just gives the anti mtb land managers and other bike haters more ammo. If you want to do it on private land or even on public land with permission I still don't get it but I don't care. I don't have to ride on it if I don't want to. I'm not saying I'm against this type of trail and would never ride one, just that people need to be thoughtful and respectful before going out and building them illegally. Doing it illegally on public land creates a situation that can threaten trails everywhere and I do care about that. Building an illegal trail in the dirt can cause issues but this kind of project just screams FU to the land managers.

    I've been rock climbing in the west for over 30 years and have seen climbers do this same sort of thing and have it totally backfire on them and get areas closed and create a generally bad image in the minds of land managers. If you are going to bend or break the rules you should at least be discrete about it.

    BTW I'm pretty sure saguaro roots are supposed to be underground so putting more dirt on top of them probably won't hurt the cactus. I think that is the lamest excuse ever. It would have been easier to move the trail. I suspect it isn't about that at all but rather about, "Hey look at me, look what I did." If the builders were really so concerned about the environment they wouldn't have hauled a bunch of crap out there and built the trail in the first place.

  27. #27
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    Whiskey might or might not have been involved in the bridging of the saguaro roots...but there's no as-of-yet hash stash cactus...so far as I know...

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    I don't have an opinion on that trail other than I like to ride everything and every type of trail, and that feature looks fun.

    In regards to disturbing the root zone of a Saguaro being no big deal... wrong. You might be surprised at how much changing the grade or adding or taking away soil can have a HUGE impact on a sensitive species like the Saguaro. Even an inch or two. It might be no big deal, it might take years for the damage to be visible to the untrained eye, or it might kill the plant out right in short order.

    I make a decent living diagnosing and treating problems with trees and native surface plants. Most of the problems I see are either man made disturbances to the root zone, or over/under watering of the root zone. This is equally true for a 100 foot pine tree or a Saguaro.

    This is why I was laughing at a certain forum members opinion on trails within a Arizona Cypress study area in Sedona being of little consequence to the trees. He may be right by accident, or he may be very wrong. Either way, he isn't qualified to make that statement.

    That being said, I would ride the hell out of the above trail, the trails in Sedona and do so with a **** eating grin.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuctionGoat View Post
    In regards to disturbing the root zone of a Saguaro being no big deal... wrong. You might be surprised at how much changing the grade or adding or taking away soil can have a HUGE impact on a sensitive species like the Saguaro. Even an inch or two. It might be no big deal, it might take years for the damage to be visible to the untrained eye, or it might kill the plant out right in short order.
    Thanks for the validation, SG. I was involved in relocating over 16 THOUSAND cacti during the 4-lane divided upgrade to US-60 between Florence Junction and Superior, so I know a little bit about the sensitivity of saguaro roots.

    As to "hauling all that crap out there," yeah, it was done to protect an old-growth saguaro not as a worthy cause but as a necessity. And yeah, there is a certain amount of pride invested in a first attempt at a bridge/ladder that again was installed to serve a purpose. A re-route certainly would have been an alternative, but the trail was routed as it was to take advantage of an old mining prospecting trench (talk about hauling crap out there...does a backhoe and dynamite and an abandoned trench count?) and the big red rock with the "gulp-n-go" roll-off.

    The trails that are appearing in GC are multi-use, as evidenced by the many hikers and equestrians (and even cattle) that also use and enjoy them.

    Aren't there bigger issues to get pissed off about?

  30. #30
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    What a country!

  31. #31
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    I'm not pissed off except that by doing stuff like this it puts a big target on all of our backs. I'm a biologist myself and I've done my share of saguaro transplanting and have been an environmental consultant. In my opinion there is way to much hand ringing over individual organisms rather than populations. The number of plants and animals negatively impacted by mountain biking and trail building is totally insignificant compared to the habitat lost to development. I used to do spotted owl, desert tortoise, and other endangered animal studies and can't believe the decisions made by land managers in spite of the kind of data they were presented with.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by gila monster View Post
    I'm not pissed off except that by doing stuff like this it puts a big target on all of our backs. .
    So does posting a picture online and telling everyone where it is.
    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  33. #33
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    That's what Norcal riding is like? No wonder they love such terrible bike geometry out there. Leave the desert alone, go there .
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  34. #34
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    I lived in NorCal for 18 years and we didn't have trails like that. Maybe they mean PacNW?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    I lived in NorCal for 18 years and we didn't have trails like that. Maybe they mean PacNW?
    Once you're you're north of LA, you're practically in Canada anyway.........

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    I lived in NorCal for 18 years and we didn't have trails like that. Maybe they mean PacNW?
    When was the last time you were in Soquel Demo Forest ?
    Because, one is never enough.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2BeerJoe View Post
    When was the last time you were in Soquel Demo Forest ?
    So are the trails in demo like Rockville, Skeggs, Folsom, Auburn, Tahoe, Downieville, or is there enough variation that most of the trails in NorCal are NOT like demo?

    Rocky chunk, wet mossy dirt, dry hard pack, sandy alpine, dusty powder, wet hard pack, mud, pine needles, rutted hard pack, gravel, and all sorts of stuff in between. California is one of the most varied climates, even moreso than AZ, and there aren't ladders and skinnies everywhere.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    So are the trails in demo like Rockville, Skeggs, Folsom, Auburn, Tahoe, Downieville, or is there enough variation that most of the trails in NorCal are NOT like demo?

    Rocky chunk, wet mossy dirt, dry hard pack, sandy alpine, dusty powder, wet hard pack, mud, pine needles, rutted hard pack, gravel, and all sorts of stuff in between. California is one of the most varied climates, even moreso than AZ, and there aren't ladders and skinnies everywhere.
    Jayem:

    I agree Demo is a great place to ride. A friend of mine turned the Corral trail into a full on Northshore trail. Very few people rode that trail because it lost a lot of verticle w/o much fun stuff to ride.

    After he got done with the trail it had jumps, log rolls, gaps and steep rollins. It all lasted about three months before Ranger Ed found out about it and cut up all the log rolls and demolished the jumps.

    After a couple years of missing those kinds of features the trail stewards went in and made that trail fun to ride again. Who knows what that trail would be like if Ranger Ed had left it alone. For sure it would still be a very fun trail, now it's only a memory.

  39. #39
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    TD; when is your book coming out?
    TS

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    So, how can you tell who is who/which is which with those GMs?
    Other than 1 is always right aka correct; the other, the opposite. I'm with you wtf. Well done transplanting all those cacti! We could use you up in BC. Along with that
    TD pal of yours........where building trail IS appreciated! (You'd be a great tree planter!)
    ride on.
    TS

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by TransitionSenior View Post
    TD; when is your book coming out?
    TS
    No book necessary. Just go into my posting history in MTBR and copy all the posts I have done, and it will make a couple books of the history of mountain biking trail improvements and enhancements. I haven't ever changed my stance on making sustainable trail improvements from the day I started posting.

    Working at Snyder Livestock in Yearington, NV taught me the value of hard work and getting my hands dirty.

    I also have NEVER catered to the elitists who can't stand me making the trails rideable by myself and the other 30% of the advanced riders. Now that trails like Slim Shady have been dumbed down to a beginner level we all understand the FS stands behind my kind of trail improvements in Sedona. They will NEVER admit it but their recent projects prove my work is as good or better than what Plumber Phil has been working on lately.

    I can't wait to get out and ride the Hangover World Class Uphill to see how the new re-route held up in the recent rain event. Should be able to get the new base packed in nicely.

    TD
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Norcal style trails in the desert?-004a.jpg  

    Last edited by traildoc; 12-15-2012 at 06:25 PM.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by TransitionSenior View Post
    So, how can you tell who is who/which is which with those GMs?
    Other than 1 is always right aka correct; the other, the opposite. I'm with you wtf. Well done transplanting all those cacti! We could use you up in BC. Along with that
    TD pal of yours........where building trail IS appreciated! (You'd be a great tree planter!)
    ride on.
    TS
    Good stuff out there. Still need to get out there and ride more

    What I need to know...
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by PhxChem; 12-15-2012 at 06:23 PM. Reason: The way I'm typing, I must be drunk

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