Mallet 2 or SPD M647?

Printable View

  • 10-07-2010
    big0mike
    Mallet 2 or SPD M647?
    The problem: I like being clipped in but when a foot comes out with my trusty SPDs most of the time my foot will just roll right off the pedal. It's worse when you gotta get off in the middle of some rough stuff and trying to start your foot is rolling the pedal out from underneath it. Sucks.

    Solution: New pedals? I dunno but a thought. I'm thinking some cross-breed clip/flat pedal may be a solution.

    Crank Brothers Mallet 2 or Shimano M647

    I'm thinking the mallets are probably a pretty good idea and would work better when unclipped than the Shimanos. But, I've seen a lot of complaints of broken pedals from Crank Brothers. That's makes me leary. Many of the people breaking them have said go with the Shimanos.

    Any more current opinions before I make a purchase?

    Thanks,
  • 10-08-2010
    GR1822
    I'm 230 plus gear, and haven't had a problem yet with my crank bros candies. Been riding the same pair for well over a year.
  • 10-08-2010
    AZ_AlanS
    Check out the Time Z control pedals. I run Time Atac and like the time mechanics far better than SPD.
  • 10-08-2010
    Jibro
    I am a fan of the Crank Bros Pedals. The concave feature of the pedals works great when clipped in. And there are plenty of haters as I'm sure we shall see.
    As far as riding unclipped, the advantage does not go to Crank Bros. With the egg beater able to rotate freely inside the platform, just being able to ride unclipped can be a challenge. Clipped in different story, though. I rode 661 filters with mallet 2 until switching to flats a months ago.
  • 10-08-2010
    kdimon
    I have been pretty happy with my crankbrother acids I did crack one on south mountain but they replaced it no questions asked.
  • 10-08-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ_AlanS
    Check out the Time Z control pedals. I run Time Atac and like the time mechanics far better than SPD.

    I know that's a popular option but they don't look like they'd be as good UNclipped as the Mallet's. They don't have a larger cage and they don't have the little screws. That, of course, is just my opinion based on LOOKING at them, no actual experience, so I could be completely off-base.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jibro
    I am a fan of the Crank Bros Pedals. The concave feature of the pedals works great when clipped in. And there are plenty of haters as I'm sure we shall see.
    As far as riding unclipped, the advantage does not go to Crank Bros. With the egg beater able to rotate freely inside the platform, just being able to ride unclipped can be a challenge. Clipped in different story, though. I rode 661 filters with mallet 2 until switching to flats a months ago.

    Not sure what you mean by the "concave feature" of the pedals...

    If the egg beater rotates freely does that make it a little more difficult to clip in? Seems like it would.
  • 10-08-2010
    azdog
    647's no question. I had a crash where I clipped a rock on a high speed section of geronimo. Tally was a cracked rib, broken helmet visor, bent crank, and only slight scratches to the outer cage of the pedal. The spindle was intact although the pedal took the direct hit. Not sure if a time pedal or mallet would take that abuse.
  • 10-08-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by azdog
    647's no question. I had a crash where I clipped a rock on a high speed section of geronimo. Tally was a cracked rib, broken helmet visor, bent crank, and only slight scratches to the outer cage of the pedal. The spindle was intact although the pedal took the direct hit. Not sure if a time pedal or mallet would take that abuse.

    When you are unclipped, either intentionally or not, do you feel like you can really pedal? Does it feel like a flat pedal? Every time I'm unclipped on my SPDs I feel like I'm pedaling on a spindle only and I wind up concentrating so hard on getting clipped in that I can neither watch my line or even get enough momentum to keep a line.

    The Mallet looks like it would feel like a flat moreso than the Shimanos. The Shimano has it's "contraption" more at an angle so it seems like it would be higher above the platform than the Mallets.
  • 10-08-2010
    azdog
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by big0mike
    The Mallet looks like it would feel like a flat moreso than the Shimanos. The Shimano has it's "contraption" more at an angle so it seems like it would be higher above the platform than the Mallets.

    The angle is more for easier insertion. Once you're in it does feel flat. I've raced them at bootleg and the pedal seems to guide you in when you're trying to clip in at technical points in the trail. I have a pair that I'm not using right now that you're welcome to try. Just shoot me a pm. I usually ride PMP during the week.
  • 10-08-2010
    berzerker
    Stay away from the mallet. As soon as you smack a rock with the bottom of your pedal, and you will, the spring will bend and you're screwed. Shimano uses two seperate springs so if you do bend one side, you'll still have the other side working. Time Z's are the same. I've been beating up on my Z's for a couple years. They still work perfect. The thing they have that the CB's don't is the skid plate which allows the rocks to slide past the spring.
  • 10-08-2010
    Jibro
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by big0mike
    I know that's a popular option but they don't look like they'd be as good UNclipped as the Mallet's. They don't have a larger cage and they don't have the little screws. That, of course, is just my opinion based on LOOKING at them, no actual experience, so I could be completely off-base.


    Not sure what you mean by the "concave feature" of the pedals...

    If the egg beater rotates freely does that make it a little more difficult to clip in? Seems like it would.

    Concave- the outsides are higher than than the center. Look at the profile of a mallet and you'll see the concave. The concave allows the shoe to make full contact once clipped in vs other designs that are flat. Flat clip-in platform designs do little more than give a comfort level for the mind, becuse the sides are lower than the clip in area. Thus, the shoe just floats in the clip and rarely touches the outer edge of the platform.

    The egg beater rotating freely is a feature on all of their pedals. It actually is easier to clip in. You can clip in pushing down from the top, sliding the foot forward, or sliding the foot back. The trick is unclipping if your used to spd. Egg beaters (EBs) can only be unclipped from a sideways motion. Spd's can pull right out from the top if the force is great enough, the mechanical nature of EBs does not allow this to happen.

    Hope this helps
  • 10-08-2010
    Jibro
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by azdog
    The angle is more for easier insertion.

    Expert opinion :eek:
  • 10-08-2010
    AZ_AlanS
    I know you mentioned that you like to be clipped in but have you considered going to a good flat pedal like the Kona WahWahs and 661's? If you are riding more rough and technical terrain you should definately consider it. Takes a little getting used to on rocky climbs but overall you can do everything you do clipped in plus some.

    I still ride clipped in on long endurance type rides but mostly ride flats. Still a little sketchy on step downs where there is no lip to pre-load the suspension but other than that I like the freedom and the ability to dab or slide your inside foot in a loose corner.
  • 10-08-2010
    azdog
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jibro
    Expert opinion :eek:

    I know! that whole post sounded dirty as I was writing it!
  • 10-08-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jibro
    Concave- the outsides are higher than than the center. Look at the profile of a mallet and you'll see the concave. The concave allows the shoe to make full contact once clipped in vs other designs that are flat. Flat clip-in platform designs do little more than give a comfort level for the mind, becuse the sides are lower than the clip in area. Thus, the shoe just floats in the clip and rarely touches the outer edge of the platform.

    I knew what concave meant :) I've never seen them up close and the pics I've seen do not show that concave shape. That's a great feature and exactly how it should be designed. Otherwise, like you said, the only thing it's accomplishing is making you FEEL better.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ_AlanS
    I know you mentioned that you like to be clipped in but have you considered going to a good flat pedal like the Kona WahWahs and 661's? If you are riding more rough and technical terrain you should definitely consider it. Takes a little getting used to on rocky climbs but overall you can do everything you do clipped in plus some.

    I still ride clipped in on long endurance type rides but mostly ride flats. Still a little sketchy on step downs where there is no lip to pre-load the suspension but other than that I like the freedom and the ability to dab or slide your inside foot in a loose corner.

    Actually, I have considered it but when you've been clipped in for the better part of 10 years it's a bad habit to break. I'm getting more into technical stuff now so I definitely see the benefit but still now when I'm unclipped I feel like a retard peddling. I may still consider it but I'm not giving it a ton of thought as of yet. Certainly as I progress to more sketchy stuff I'll consider it more strongly. I'm still struggling on some of the easy technical stuff now :( Maybe that's a good time to make the jump?
  • 10-08-2010
    papatini
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by berzerker
    Stay away from the mallet. As soon as you smack a rock with the bottom of your pedal, and you will, the spring will bend and you're screwed. Shimano uses two seperate springs so if you do bend one side, you'll still have the other side working. Time Z's are the same. I've been beating up on my Z's for a couple years. They still work perfect. The thing they have that the CB's don't is the skid plate which allows the rocks to slide past the spring.

    I have smacked the piss out of my mallets hundreds of times, with no damage to the spring. Can't say it won't happen, but it never has for me.

    I am hard-over for the mallets, after using SPDs for several years. I will never go back.

    Good luck.
  • 10-08-2010
    BIGHORN LEW
    +10 on the time Zss TIME pedals are pure hassle free quality and last a long time. :cornut:
  • 10-08-2010
    BIGHORN LEW
    +10 on the time Z's. TIME pedals are pure hassle free quality and last a long time. :cornut:
  • 10-08-2010
    GR1822
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by berzerker
    Stay away from the mallet. As soon as you smack a rock with the bottom of your pedal, and you will, the spring will bend and you're screwed. Shimano uses two seperate springs so if you do bend one side, you'll still have the other side working. Time Z's are the same. I've been beating up on my Z's for a couple years. They still work perfect. The thing they have that the CB's don't is the skid plate which allows the rocks to slide past the spring.

    I've hit plenty of rocks, and have been "bounced" out of my pedal when the bottom wings hit. I also have bent a wing, but the pedal still work just fine.
    Dunno how you would bend a spring, but you seem to speak from experience, so I'll take your word for it.
  • 10-08-2010
    cstem
    I have felt the "roll" you feel with the pedals- and I fixed it by getting into some 525's which are a little heavier and they do not spin as smoothly. They still spin smooth- but when you spin them with a hand, they only rotate abouot 5 times instead of 10 or more. Never slowed me down, and I noticed that clipping in during sketch became less of an issue.

    Granted, I switched bikes and pedals,so maybe I just got instantly better! Shoes can play a part too. If the front claws are too pronounced- they would be hitting the pedal before the clips did.
  • 10-08-2010
    Pitch
    My experience is to stick with Shimano: 3 broken CB pedals this year alone: 1 bent "eggbeater" cage (Mallets), 2 broken spindles (1 Mallet, 1 Candy). Also have shredded standard Eggbeaters and the cheap Smarty pedals in the past. This was with riding CB pedals for only 3 years. The other 17 years I have been riding: no broken Shimano pedals, but several broken Wellgo (Shimano knock-offs). So, I am back on Shimano pedals. I have tried the ATAC alums, and did not care for the clip mechanism... but at least they did not break.
  • 10-08-2010
    big0mike
    Man, this is tough. I really want to try the Mallets because they look like the best compromise between a clip & flat. But, the breakage problems worry me. On the other hand NO complaints from Shimano. Maybe I'll just try the Mallets. I'm sure I don't ride anywhere near as hard as those that are breaking them constantly. Or maybe I'll just go with whatever I can get into for the least amount of money. Damn...
  • 10-09-2010
    Jayem
    Never EVER buy a clipless pedal with the intent of "clipping out" when you get to technical or difficult sections. This almost gaurentees crashing, as you lack the skill and confidence to ride such section. Clipless pedals give you more control due to the interface (like a ski binding), if you "unclip", you've defeated that and should probably be walking the section. It also means that you're probably slowing down and might not have enough momentum to do the section. Once your feet "bounce" of the clipless pedals, you're pretty screwed. I highly advise to NOT buy clipless pedals based on how they may "seem" when you are unclipped.


    You should also know that the mallets don't work exactly like the eggbeaters that have no cage. The cage around the mallets prevents entry in some cases, requiring you to "roll" your foot across the pedal. Sometimes this works, sometimes it does not and your foot goes shooting off. If that mechanism (which is free to spin) rotates around for whatever reason, it is NOT going to work well as a "flat pedal" (but again, there are no clipless pedals that do). I found their exit to be unpredictable due to how fast the cleats wear down and the deal with hitting rocks from the bottom. CB pedals only ever lasted a few months for me in AZ, the rocks simply ate them.
  • 10-09-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jayem
    Never EVER buy a clipless pedal with the intent of "clipping out" when you get to technical or difficult sections. This almost gaurentees crashing, as you lack the skill and confidence to ride such section. ... Once your feet "bounce" of the clipless pedals, you're pretty screwed. I highly advise to NOT buy clipless pedals based on how they may "seem" when you are unclipped.

    I have never INTENDED to clip out for a section. If it's that sketchy I either WANT the control of being anchored to the bike properly or I stop and walk it. With that said I've always had my clips set pretty loose so that my feet come out fairly easily. It's those times when I'm inadvertently unclipped that I'd like to be able to continue without rolling my foot off the pedal or having to fidget and fight with it to get it in while trying to pedal, maintain momentum and balance, lean back to shift the weight around...

    Fairly often it's a quick section with a rock hit that kicks me out and I'm able to just stick it right back in. Not always... It's for those other occasions that I think some kind of hybrid pedal might be beneficial.
  • 10-09-2010
    eatdrinkride
    Quote:

    when I'm inadvertently unclipped that I'd like to be able to continue without rolling my foot off the pedal or having to fidget and fight with it to get it in while trying to pedal, maintain momentum and balance, lean back to shift the weight around...

    Fairly often it's a quick section with a rock hit that kicks me out and I'm able to just stick it right back in. Not always... It's for those other occasions that I think some kind of hybrid pedal might be beneficial.
    Here's my .02

    I've owned EB's, Mallets, regular Shimano spd's and now DX 647's. My take....

    Never really liked the Mallets. Ran plain eggbeaters before trying the Mallets. Wanted a better pedal for when I was/came unclipped. Results...? Didn't care for them. They absolutely suck to try and ride unclipped as my cleat would slide all over the place. Harder to get into than plain EB's but not a huge deal, just never like them. Ditched CB pedals for Shimano.

    Have been loving regular Shimano spd's (520's and 540's) for 6 years now. A few months ago I decided I wanted to try the 647's. Seemed like they would provide a bit of a platform for landing drops and would be easier to pedal when unclipped. Results....? I like the added stability landing drops, it's not a huge difference but still, it's nice. As far as riding unclipped? Not great but better than the Mallets IIRC. I really only wanted an improvement in those uphill situations where you fail on a rock attempt or whatever and you need to get started again up a steep uphill grade. In that application they are ok......and just ok. Better than the 540's since you can at least mash for a few turns until finding a smoother spot to clip in but the cleat interface still comes into play, making it a bit of a sketchy deal. Still, do-able.

    Bottom line. Seems like all clipless pedals are impractical for use while not clipped in. Not sure you'll find what you are hoping to find but the 647's are at least a good option. Just don't expect too much.
  • 10-09-2010
    berzerker
    A good pair of shoes will help. Hard-sole performance/racing type shoes will slip off any pedal with a quickness. Take a look at Shimano's DX shoe, or comparable bmx-style spd compatible shoe. The soft grippy sole will help you stay on the peds, and make the hike-a-bikes much easier. :thumbsup:
  • 10-09-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by eatdrinkride
    ... I really only wanted an improvement in those uphill situations where you fail on a rock attempt or whatever and you need to get started again up a steep uphill grade. In that application they are ok......and just ok. Better than the 540's since you can at least mash for a few turns until finding a smoother spot to clip in but the cleat interface still comes into play, making it a bit of a sketchy deal. Still, do-able.

    Exactly the situation I'm looking for... At the very least they should help the pedal NOT roll under your foot.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by eatdrinkride
    Bottom line. Seems like all clipless pedals are impracticable for use while not clipped in. Not sure you'll find what you are hoping to find but the 647's are at least a good option. Just don't expect too much.

    Yeah, I was kinda thinking that as well but having no experience with anything but a pair of 12-year-old Nashbar SPD knock-offs I figured I'd ask.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by berzerker
    A good pair of shoes will help. Hard-sole performance/racing type shoes will slip off any pedal with a quickness. Take a look at Shimano's DX shoe, or comparable bmx-style spd compatible shoe. The soft grippy sole will help you stay on the peds, and make the hike-a-bikes much easier. :thumbsup:

    The very first pair of shoes I had were hard. They lasted a while and I never really tested them. The second pair had a softer sole. They've lasted quite some time but after my HAB adventure of 5+ miles on Mt Lemmon they are toast. Some Gorilla glue has them holding on but I'm looking at these now:

    http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...Mt42+Shoe.aspx
    http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...+Shoes+09.aspx
  • 10-09-2010
    Grunion
    Love my Mallets. and I own both. Mallets are what i rid
  • 10-09-2010
    PhxChem
    FWIW, I have broken a couple of egg beater SPRINGS! Of everything that broke....the spring? Yes.......they apparently just broke by use (couple of years road bike worth).

    Now, I'm on some Nashbar SPD knock-offs....PITA to clip in compared to egg beaters, but they do the job for now.
  • 10-09-2010
    MootsRider
    Spring Tension Adjustment
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by big0mike
    I've always had my clips set pretty loose so that my feet come out fairly easily.

    If it makes a difference to you, consider that SPDs are adjustable, while the CBs are not.
  • 10-09-2010
    Grunion
    Mallets are also lighter than any shimano pedal made
  • 10-09-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by MootsRider
    If it makes a difference to you, consider that SPDs are adjustable, while the CBs are not.

    Yeah, that probably does make a difference...

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Grunion
    Mallets are also lighter than any shimano pedal made

    Not a weight weeny so that one doesn't matter to me...
  • 10-09-2010
    Jayem
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Grunion
    Mallets are also lighter than any shimano pedal made

    Mallets are 300 grams? Sweet! The new shimano platform-ish XTR pedals are 398g, so heavier than the mallets :( The older XTR pedals are 325g, but still heavier than those featherweight mallets :(

    Of course, I think you're completely wrong, lots of shimano pedals are lighter than mallets, including XT level, and even my 540s. Of course, some shimano pedals are heavier, like the 545s, 647s, etc, but I feel that's weight well spent, compared to the snapped axles of mallets.
  • 10-10-2010
    bionicman
    was running Time atacs for the longest time - great pedals until you come unclipped on a climb or technical section
    then I hear what your saying about concentrating on trying to get clipped in & forget it on mid climb - felt as if your trying to pedal on screwdrivers...

    switched to shimano's 647's & have used the same pair on several different bikes for about a year now - they have taken some massive rock hits on some bikes with low BB without an issue

    I have the adjustable spring tension set to the lowest setting & have only came unclipped during hard efforts once or twice
    with the low spring tension I have no issues twisting my ankle a bit to unclip during sketchy corners

    I will echo the mention above regarding shoe choice - shoe choice with a slightly softer sole will allow you to take more advantage from the platform around the clip

    IMO for everything but maybe competitive XC pedals are something you should not weight weenie about - its one of your main control points on a bike.....
  • 10-11-2010
    h2ojunkie
    I ran the M647s for about 10 months now, before I had the lower version with the not as good plastic part. The M647 are much better than those cheaper ones. They are definitely able to pedal a bit clipped out even with a hard sole shoe, but I'm sure something like Five Ten Hellcat SPD or that other shoe you were looking at would work much better when clipped out.

    I just put flats on my mountain bike and bought a pair of Five Ten shoes and the combination is super grippy even if it is a different style of riding. I know it will take me a while to get used to them. You do feel much more free when riding. If you have any knee trouble from your leg being in one spot it would help with that. Just takes some time to learn just like when you started with clips.
  • 10-12-2010
    Blatant
    I typically try to stay away from pedal debates. I also typically disagree with just about everything Jayem types, but not today. He's absolutely correct.

    When I do run clipless (on my SS), I have a strong personal preference for Time pedals; having used all the major pedal mechanisms, I like Time the best.

    I swapped to flats/5.10s well over a year ago and can't personally see ever going back to clipless on my bigger travel bike.

    More to the point of the post, do not buy clipless pedals with a larger platform with the idea you'll be able to do any significant pedalling if you come unclipped. You will not be able to, unless perhaps (as suggested above), you get some sort of grippy shoe with a cleat interface.

    The platform of the pedal will not overcome the metal cleat of your shoe skittering all over the place.
  • 10-12-2010
    big0mike
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Blatant
    More to the point of the post, do not buy clipless pedals with a larger platform with the idea you'll be able to do any significant pedalling if you come unclipped. You will not be able to, unless perhaps (as suggested above), you get some sort of grippy shoe with a cleat interface.

    The platform of the pedal will not overcome the metal cleat of your shoe skittering all over the place.

    I don't expect to be able to do a lot of pedaling without being in. Hopefully, just enough to get me out of the section that popped me out, though. Guess we'll see...

    I pulled the trigger on the 647s and a new pair of Shimano shoes that appear to have "grippy" soles. Should be here tomorrow and ready for a weekend ride.
  • 10-17-2010
    big0mike
    Well, my first ride on the 647s was inconclusive. Did some relatively non-challenging sections of T100 and never came out of the pedals.

    Second ride up BCT this weekend proved they were a good purchase. Three times I popped out on some rocky areas. The first time I struggled to get back in and managed to clip it and pedal out. The second time I popped out I started to fidget my way back in when I thought, "Hey, dumbass. You got these pedals so you could pedal through this rough stuff if you pop out. Just pedal through it." And I did. Pedaled right through and when I got a few yards away through the rough or loose patch I clipped right in.

    Worked like a champ. :thumbsup:
  • 10-19-2010
    Boyonabyke
    Got to agree with Jayem... 647's. Of if on a budget 545's. Around here Crank Brothers is also known as Fail Brothers among the XC racers, where equipment failure is just plain unacceptable.
  • 10-30-2010
    panzer103
    I just bought a pair of Mallet 2s just last night. i hope that they work well. I'm use to shimano pedals b/c I have used them for years and years. Mallets look great and they seem to make sense with a "platform" pedal with a clipless pedal. Shimano 647s just dont do it for me. I have heard that CB isnt nearly as positive with clicking in. Should I have heeded the warnings? Perhaps, but I'll see when I get my Mallets in the mail
  • 10-30-2010
    papatini
    My experience with the CB Mallets has been very positive. I haven't had any failure problems noted in this thread, and I ride almost every day. I like these pedals much more than Shimano style SPDs, but I have never used those in a dual-platform style.

    I also use a more racing style shoe, with a very rigid lower. I have had a very different experience than Blatant. If I come out on techy stuff, I can still pedal very well until I manage to clip in again.