Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 53
  1. #1
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162

    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! Heads up on National!

    This is on National trail just above the Mormon/National split. The big rock in the center of the pic finally broke loose during the recent rain and is now partially in the line as you head down. Depending on how wide you take that section you could potentially clip the left pedal so just be aware that things have changed. It's a big heavy rock so moving it isn't much of an option without a few people and some guidance from the Park Rangers.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Heads up on National!-rock2.jpg  

    Heads up on National!-rock1.jpg  

    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    531
    Thanks for the info, I'll check it out for myself tomorrow AM.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation: tysonnemb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,085
    Yeah thanks. I was also thinking of riding there tomorrow, so good to know.
    “Think of bicycles as rideable art that can just about save the world.”
-Grant Petersen

  4. #4
    SamuraiBunnyGuy
    Reputation: longhairmike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    2,573
    those damn boyscout leaders were at it again

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    1,290
    Quote Originally Posted by longhairmike View Post
    those damn boyscout leaders were at it again
    Well, at that potential energy was just waiting to kill a Weblo...

    Luckily, it was nature and not a hiker (Tone Loc)....

  6. #6
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    24,649
    Need TD to fix.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation: metalaficionado's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    1,990
    Thanks, I will put that on my 12,000 item checklists of things to watch out for on National.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    184
    Now why didn't it fall in front of the step up and make a ramp so that my lame ass could finally make it up that feature?

  9. #9
    SamuraiBunnyGuy
    Reputation: longhairmike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    2,573
    Quote Originally Posted by metalaficionado View Post
    Thanks, I will put that on my 12,000 item checklists of things to watch out for on National.
    40 are actual safety concerns,, the other 11,960 are boobs

  10. #10
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    Boom!
    Quote Originally Posted by longhairmike View Post
    40 are actual safety concerns,, the other 11,960 are boobs
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation: tmarkos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,356
    Thanks Kenny.

  12. #12
    Give it a crank
    Reputation: Mtn-Rider's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    2,995
    Is there any rock on National you don't know? Thanks!

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation: cstem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    2,843
    Just curious, if you are speaking of riding wide left in the first pic, why would anyone ride that side? The better line appears to be to the right, lofting into the next turn for a nice apex. This is based on (not memory thats for sure!) the second pic where the line coming down is on the left kinda behind the tree in the forefront.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  14. #14
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    I actually like to jump the rocky section heading into this turn and carry my speed as much as possible. That puts me wide left if I really push it, I've even used that wall as a landing/berm on many occasions. It's a tight window to land in but it sets you up better for that tight left around the rock that sticks out just below this (I've clipped my shoulder on that baby wayyyy too many times)
    Quote Originally Posted by cstem View Post
    Just curious, if you are speaking of riding wide left in the first pic, why would anyone ride that side? The better line appears to be to the right, lofting into the next turn for a nice apex. This is based on (not memory thats for sure!) the second pic where the line coming down is on the left kinda behind the tree in the forefront.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  15. #15
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    I don't have many other hobbies
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn-Rider View Post
    Is there any rock on National you don't know? Thanks!
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    81
    Hi, I was planning to ride the National Trail soon. I was interested in doing a loop. Which would be the best way to ride the national trail as a loop? Up the Desert classic trail to the Buena Vista lookout and back down National trail? Or the way Cosmic Ray guidebook reccomends: from Pima Canyon Trailhead up National to Buena Vista lookout and down Desert Classic? Just in Phoenix for a quick vacation. Any other good rides in the South Mountain area? I'm looking for technical to expert trails. Thanks for the info!

  17. #17
    powered by bacon
    Reputation: helidave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    436

    Re: Heads up on National!

    Quote Originally Posted by Max-Lesoine-Moab View Post
    Hi, I was planning to ride the National Trail soon. I was interested in doing a loop. Which would be the best way to ride the national trail as a loop? Up the Desert classic trail to the Buena Vista lookout and back down National trail? Or the way Cosmic Ray guidebook reccomends: from Pima Canyon Trailhead up National to Buena Vista lookout and down Desert Classic? Just in Phoenix for a quick vacation. Any other good rides in the South Mountain area? I'm looking for technical to expert trails. Thanks for the info!
    National doesn't loop, and it doesn't intersect with Desert Classic anywhere. Start at Pima Canyon trailhead and go up National 'til you get tired, then turn around and come back down. That will give yo a nice tech climb and some of the best DH on South Mountain

  18. #18
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    You can make a loop with Desert Classic to National but the best stuff for what you're after will be on National. I would recommend riding Natl from Pima all the way to Telegraph Pass then take the road back to Buena Vista and back down Natl (or back on Natl from Telegraph if you're feeling it). Here's the profile for that loop if you're interested...Mountain Bike Ride Profile | Wet SoMo loop near Phoenix | Times and Records | Strava

    You should also check out Alta trail. Cool climb and one of the most techy descents anywhere.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation: bugaroo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    477
    Bikes and boobs sounds like two hobbies to me.
    AKA: G-wat

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    184
    Quote Originally Posted by Max-Lesoine-Moab View Post
    Hi, I was planning to ride the National Trail soon. I was interested in doing a loop. Which would be the best way to ride the national trail as a loop? Up the Desert classic trail to the Buena Vista lookout and back down National trail? Or the way Cosmic Ray guidebook reccomends: from Pima Canyon Trailhead up National to Buena Vista lookout and down Desert Classic? Just in Phoenix for a quick vacation. Any other good rides in the South Mountain area? I'm looking for technical to expert trails. Thanks for the info!
    For technical and more difficult you would want to do Geronimo, 32nd St, and Holbert.

  21. #21
    DFL>DNF>DNS
    Reputation: freeskier46's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    2,593
    If you want to sample National, go with Kenbentit's route. Here's a very similar one to that: Start @46th St trailhead, climb Javelina to Mormon Loop, Up Mormon Loop to National then pick up Ken's route. After you bomb down National, start back up the Mormon Loop over to Javelina for a nice finishing descent to 46th St.

    If you liked all that, then go check out Alta trail per Ken's suggestion. Ride it east->west.
    I ride the crappy trails so you don't have to
    My Two Schillingsworth

  22. #22
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    ^Yes!^ Adding in Javelina is very good idea.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation: chongoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    1,926
    Here is one of my favorite tech loops at South Mountain.
    Best double down SoMo route

  24. #24
    Sun Devils
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    315
    Nor should you!

    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    I don't have many other hobbies

  25. #25
    dirt visionary
    Reputation: clockwork's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    6,371
    dang that spot has bad luck with mother nature. Remember the big Saguaro that was on the right as you were heading down .
    Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of
    arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body.

  26. #26
    Just Joshin' ya!
    Reputation: PrincipalRider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    1,916
    Quote Originally Posted by climnron View Post
    Now why didn't it fall in front of the step up and make a ramp so that my lame ass could finally make it up that feature?
    I was thinking the same thing. But then it would not be any fun on the way down. Or maybe slightly less fun.
    Getting a dropper post is like getting a bidet. I didn't know I needed one until I get one and boy, does my ass thank me.

  27. #27
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    Yep! I have a pic of that one after it fell over. Such a bummer and it trotally changed that section..
    Quote Originally Posted by clockwork View Post
    dang that spot has bad luck with mother nature. Remember the big Saguaro that was on the right as you were heading down .
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    194
    So, what's the trick to get up that rock?

  29. #29
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,078

    Re: Heads up on National!

    Quote Originally Posted by nomoclips View Post
    So, what's the trick to get up that rock?
    Couple ways probably to approach it but I think I set the front wheel on top, kinda lurch forward and up to unweight the rear and pedal thru the whole move. I probably pause the pedal stroke just briefly during the lift, idk.

  30. #30
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    I like to come into that spot in Middle ring and 1st or 2nd cog. Carry a decent speed up to the ledge then sort of pedal wheelie the front wheel up and as soon as it clears the upper edge I'll shift my weight forward onto the front wheel and loft the back end so I don't hang up. Here's a vid I did a couple of years ago, that move is at 2:20ish...
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation: chongoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    1,926
    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    I like to come into that spot in Middle ring and 1st or 2nd cog. Carry a decent speed up to the ledge then sort of pedal wheelie the front wheel up and as soon as it clears the upper edge I'll shift my weight forward onto the front wheel and loft the back end so I don't hang up. Here's a vid I did a couple of years ago, that move is at 2:20ish...
    Ken, I remembered this video when I was out in the drizzle on Saturday afternoon. I was inspired to catch this video of the tough left turn up the rock before the last descent back to the fire road.
    This is the spot with the rock line bypass that used to have a palo verde tree that fell over a while back. The trail just goes up the step, but it's hard to approach and finish the move. It's one of my favorite climb moves on the trail. Simple looking, but actually quite hard to execute.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL2c...k5YA42vpUvgDwg

  32. #32
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    Oh yeah, that one is weird balance/power move kinda thing. Very trials-ish
    Quote Originally Posted by chongoman View Post
    Ken, I remembered this video when I was out in the drizzle on Saturday afternoon. I was inspired to catch this video of the tough left turn up the rock before the last descent back to the fire road.
    This is the spot with the rock line bypass that used to have a palo verde tree that fell over a while back. The trail just goes up the step, but it's hard to approach and finish the move. It's one of my favorite climb moves on the trail. Simple looking, but actually quite hard to execute.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL2c...k5YA42vpUvgDwg
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  33. #33
    Vitamin Bike Added
    Reputation: MTBCanuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    607
    Wow Kenny, that section looks totally different right now, has the rain filled dirt into the off-camber wash out that is normally just beyond where the picture stops? I have been off my daily bread of three times a week national riding for 20 days now trying to heal from my last big crash and have wondered what affect all this recent rain may have had.
    Keep the rubber side down

  34. #34
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    Nah, that spot is pretty much the same. There is quite a bit of sand/silt in places but overall Natl is the same old beast. This last bit of rain was pretty decent for the trails since it wasn't the "all at once" storm that we usually get.
    Quote Originally Posted by MTBCanuck View Post
    Wow Kenny, that section looks totally different right now, has the rain filled dirt into the off-camber wash out that is normally just beyond where the picture stops? I have been off my daily bread of three times a week national riding for 20 days now trying to heal from my last big crash and have wondered what affect all this recent rain may have had.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    194
    What section is this on? Hard to figure out from the angle of the dangle?

    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    Oh yeah, that one is weird balance/power move kinda thing. Very trials-ish

  36. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation: chongoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    1,926
    Quote Originally Posted by nomoclips View Post
    What section is this on? Hard to figure out from the angle of the dangle?
    It's right about here.

    33° 21.472', -112° 0.752'

    https://www.google.com/maps/preview#...!2m1!1e3&fid=7

  37. #37
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    5,210
    That rock must've been the magic that propelled me to clean it on the climb this morning. Thanks, Mother Nature.

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    250
    Darn erosion!

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    194
    Went out there yesterday. That boulder would look nice in my front yard.

  40. #40
    Pivotal figure
    Reputation: kenbentit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    6,162
    It'll just fit into your pack nicely too!
    Quote Originally Posted by nomoclips View Post
    Went out there yesterday. That boulder would look nice in my front yard.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  41. #41
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation: big0mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,802
    Even thought it's not in my way it must've helped out since I cleaned that climb this morning

  42. #42
    Vitamin Bike Added
    Reputation: MTBCanuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    607
    Lunging up that rock continues to psych me out, I need to hammer it when I get back on the bike... I mean if mike can clean it without a crash sequence video....
    Keep the rubber side down

  43. #43
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,078

    Re: Heads up on National!

    Quote Originally Posted by MTBCanuck View Post
    Lunging up that rock continues to psych me out, I need to hammer it when I get back on the bike... I mean if mike can clean it without a crash sequence video....
    Mountain biking is funny. My buddy who is a pretty good rider has never made that step up... Well maybe once or twice but I can't remember seeing it. I make it about 70 percent of the time. He also cleans stuff that I can't make. Its just funny how that works.

  44. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mtnbiketodd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    378
    It is not in the way going up but man it makes it harder for me to safely walk down it without falling

  45. #45
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation: big0mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,802
    Quote Originally Posted by MTBCanuck View Post
    Lunging up that rock continues to psych me out, I need to hammer it when I get back on the bike... I mean if mike can clean it without a crash sequence video....
    I've been on my back a couple times at that point... But, point taken

    Quote Originally Posted by eatdrinkride View Post
    Mountain biking is funny. My buddy who is a pretty good rider has never made that step up... I make it about 70 percent of the time. He also cleans stuff that I can't make.
    It's a deceptively difficult move. We were actually talking about it above it while resting. It would be a piece of cake if it were on flat ground. But, it's on an incline so you can't stop pedaling for a second and the "good" approach isn't straight on. I'm 40% making it lately...

  46. #46
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,078

    Re: Heads up on National!

    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike View Post
    :


    It's a deceptively difficult move. We were actually talking about it above it while resting. It would be a piece of cake if it were on flat ground. But, it's on an incline so you can't stop pedaling for a second and the "good" approach isn't straight on. I'm 40% making it lately...
    It is difficult. I just have a better feeling on the techie ups than I do on most techie downs. Even when I don't make it, I almost always feel like I'm going to make it. I've gone over on my back more than once on that big rock step up going up the upper waterfall. But I almost always feel like I'm going to make it. It's largely mental for me. And I just feel comfortable on the ups.

  47. #47
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation: big0mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,802
    Quote Originally Posted by eatdrinkride View Post
    It is difficult. I just have a better feeling on the techie ups than I do on most techie downs. Even when I don't make it, I almost always feel like I'm going to make it. I've gone over on my back more than once on that big rock step up going up the upper waterfall. But I almost always feel like I'm going to make it. It's largely mental for me. And I just feel comfortable on the ups.
    If you're talking about that first rock step just above the "loitering area" above the waterfall I just made that today for the first time. Made it up that, the next little step, then fizzled out. Baby steps...

    I feel a little like you do. I don't feel nearly as comfortable going down. I just have absolutely no faith in any tire when I lean even a little bit. When it's straight and rocky I keep up moderately well but when it starts to turn and get loose I don't even try to keep up. It's rubber on loose dirt and rocks. The tire can not hold you up so I lose all my time in the turns. Maybe I just haven't found a tire worth a sh|t yet...

  48. #48
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    5,210
    That's because you run $20 tires, ya cheap bastid.

    Mike, me and our friend Chan had probably our most successful run EVER on National yesterday from a technical "make" perspective. One for the books for sure.

  49. #49
    Vitamin Bike Added
    Reputation: MTBCanuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    607
    See guys and I can clean upper waterfall up about 80% but I charge at it like a maniac to make it up that far right step/ roller whereas the discussed rock of this thread has a little dip after the rock that traps my tire and kills my momentum and I crash so now I am school girl central on that feature. Another nice compare is to lunging the triangle which I get 90%, do you think it's a higher step?
    Keep the rubber side down

  50. #50
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,078

    Re: Heads up on National!

    Quote Originally Posted by MTBCanuck View Post
    . Another nice compare is to lunging the triangle which I get 90%, do you think it's a higher step?
    Are you talking about attacking the triangle on the way UP national, to the far left side? I have never successfully made that move.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Heads up
    By Kliemann53 in forum Washington
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-22-2013, 01:56 PM
  2. Heads in, heads out on rim lace?
    By flyxaos in forum Wheels and Tires
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-14-2013, 05:06 PM
  3. Thanks for the Heads Up
    By scooter_dude in forum Passion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 01-12-2013, 10:57 AM
  4. Just a heads up
    By whoopwhoop in forum Downhill - Freeride
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-29-2011, 07:01 PM
  5. Somo: Ranger, National, 620, National, Bajada
    By chongoman in forum Arizona
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 01-17-2011, 07:57 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •