Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 55
  1. #1
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540

    For Downhillers Eyes Only- New Mingus Proposal- Others Ignore

    I was cruzing through some YouTube potential music selections for my own videos and came across this downhill video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjVecRFH63o) that looked like it could fit into the Mingus type terrain. Curious if anyone else thinks it would be a good fit for Cottonwood?

    TD

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: dunerinaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,342
    Great vid! There's definitely some serious penalty for failure on some of those trails.

  3. #3
    No Clue Crew
    Reputation: big0mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,752
    That's what Mingus Mountain looks like? Sweet Jesus I gotta get up there!

    Actually, I will be up there at the end of August. Looking forward to it.

  4. #4
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike View Post
    That's what Mingus Mountain looks like? Sweet Jesus I gotta get up there!

    Actually, I will be up there at the end of August. Looking forward to it.
    b0:

    Kinda looks like the video you posted an hour ago.

    TD

  5. #5
    Shovel Ready
    Reputation: Cycle64's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5,780
    Quote Originally Posted by dunerinaz View Post
    Great vid! There's definitely some serious penalty for failure on some of those trails.
    Don't fail then.
    Currently at Mayo Clinic being tested for a kidney transplant. Donors welcome.

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation: dunerinaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,342
    Quote Originally Posted by Cycle64 View Post
    Don't fail then.
    You mean like your wheelie attempts last night?

  7. #7
    Shovel Ready
    Reputation: Cycle64's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5,780
    Quote Originally Posted by dunerinaz View Post
    You mean like your wheelie attempts last night?

    Currently at Mayo Clinic being tested for a kidney transplant. Donors welcome.

  8. #8
    K3N
    K3N is offline
    Certified slacker
    Reputation: K3N's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    201
    that vid is insane. Just awesome.

  9. #9
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540

    Think big

    How would this music work for my Sedona videos : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbvE8CY7QqE ???? Might be some good trail ideas for Flag. I spoke to the guy who got the State of Oregon to give the volunteer mountain bikers this spot to build some fun trails. Maybe Anthony could show this to the FS to get a feel for some new trail ideas. If they can do it in Oregon why not Flagstaff?

    TD

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    79
    just gotta put in the hrs of trail work/maintenance, and bam! wc level trail. 28th st imo would b closest, but kinda short. in almost 8 yrs i have only seen the 2/3 regulars building up there, and they most always stay in their own personal zones. there is obviously lots of potiental, but only two areas that i know of for the pedal challenged unload and go types.
    j

  11. #11
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by foamfreak View Post
    just gotta put in the hrs of trail work/maintenance, and bam! wc level trail. 28th st imo would b closest, but kinda short. in almost 8 yrs i have only seen the 2/3 regulars building up there, and they most always stay in their own personal zones. there is obviously lots of potiental, but only two areas that i know of for the pedal challenged unload and go types.
    j
    And the landmangers just wonder how they could harness all that energy to repair equestrain trails.

    TD

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    79
    either way.. and you're correct about this trail being a good fit for mingus, and i would ride it every day for a yr straight before i would get bored. realistically speaking though...something of that quality, with the current mingus volunteers and/or forest service, would take yrs.
    j

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,007
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    How would this music work for my Sedona videos : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbvE8CY7QqE ???? Might be some good trail ideas for Flag. I spoke to the guy who got the State of Oregon to give the volunteer mountain bikers this spot to build some fun trails. Maybe Anthony could show this to the FS to get a feel for some new trail ideas. If they can do it in Oregon why not Flagstaff?

    TD
    We are working on it TD. The terrain on Elden is very different then BR, we have a lot more rocks and steep features but there is room for some fast and flow-e kind of stuff with some big air as well. I have spent the last 3+ years exhausting all of the options to make sure we can provide the gravity riding crowd with the best possible trails and I think we are getting a good idea for a proposed system finally. I hardly ride anymore, if I get free time I'm hiking and flagging these days. So far from our talks with the Coco NF wooden structures for the most part aren't going to happen nor will do or die gaps but well built step downs, safely built doubles, step ups, and drops are ok as long as they are properly marked and have go around options. Even though Flag's terrain is very different then the BR footage you posted I think it's what makes it so special and good. IMHO the terrain around Private is some of the best in the lower 48 from what I have seen.

  14. #14
    Eroding into the trail
    Reputation: DustyBones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    897

    Only one word to describe this - AWESOME!
    NZ rocks!

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by foamfreak View Post
    either way.. and you're correct about this trail being a good fit for mingus, and i would ride it every day for a yr straight before i would get bored. realistically speaking though...something of that quality, with the current mingus volunteers and/or forest service, would take yrs.
    j
    At least you're not working with red rock ranger district here. Things should go a little quicker and be less about aesthetics and vibrational energies and more about how the actual trail is built.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by woahey View Post
    At least you're not working with red rock ranger district here. Things should go a little quicker and be less about aesthetics and vibrational energies and more about how the actual trail is built.
    i don't believe anyone associated with mtbing is currently working w/ prescott FS, or has worked w/ them for the last 2ish years, on maintaining existing trails or legally expanding the current gravity style trail system on mingus. politics aside, from my experience a trail of this magnitude on mingus would take yrs, and w/ politics..triple that time. not to mention the $$ involved if the FS/land managers are included. by the time the politics alone were worked out (if ever) on a single project like this TD most likely would not be with us, and most of the active mingus volunteers would not be physically able to ride at the level needed to get down the hill.
    j

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,007
    Quote Originally Posted by foamfreak View Post
    i don't believe anyone associated with mtbing is currently working w/ prescott FS, or has worked w/ them for the last 2ish years, on maintaining existing trails or legally expanding the current gravity style trail system on mingus. politics aside, from my experience a trail of this magnitude on mingus would take yrs, and w/ politics..triple that time. not to mention the $$ involved if the FS/land managers are included. by the time the politics alone were worked out (if ever) on a single project like this TD most likely would not be with us, and most of the active mingus volunteers would not be physically able to ride at the level needed to get down the hill.
    j
    Don't take this the wrong way but it's this attitude that has kept anything legit from happening so far. I may not get to ride all the great trails in N. Az.'s future but I want to have an active part in it for ridings future and for the kids. The non-sanctioned fr/dh trails here in Az. are way behind places that have gone legit as far as progression goes in riding and building. I'm kind of tired of the whole "If it doesn't benefit me and benefit me now then why do the work" mentality. Yep, it's going to take years and a whole lot of work but everything that is actually worth something usually does.

  18. #18
    "No Clue Crew"
    Reputation: Grave9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    2,459
    Normally when i'm out riding there is a camera crew in a chopper following me as well...... It's a really quiet chopper.......Oh and they fly really far away to get wide shots.....Most times you don't see them, but they are there...............Drew

  19. #19
    Eroding into the trail
    Reputation: DustyBones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    897
    Quote Originally Posted by Grave9 View Post
    Normally when i'm out riding there is a camera crew in a chopper following me as well...... It's a really quiet chopper.......Oh and they fly really far away to get wide shots.....Most times you don't see them, but they are there...............Drew

    Actually, it's the CIA (or NSA) using a small remote-controlled helicopter to track you! They are responsible for the most recent flats you had also!
    They are there & you can't escape their snoopage!
    The bedazzled components on your bike may have an adverse effect on their surveillance equipment, so use more of it!
    Good luck!
    I never composed this msg.

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    Don't take this the wrong way but it's this attitude that has kept anything legit from happening so far. I may not get to ride all the great trails in N. Az.'s future but I want to have an active part in it for ridings future and for the kids. The non-sanctioned fr/dh trails here in Az. are way behind places that have gone legit as far as progression goes in riding and building. I'm kind of tired of the whole "If it doesn't benefit me and benefit me now then why do the work" mentality. Yep, it's going to take years and a whole lot of work but everything that is actually worth something usually does.
    its cool bro, none taken....we all have our own ideas how to get things done trail-wise. just to be clear, i would love/support to have many "legal from the start" dh specific tracks coming off both sides of mingus for my dh talented, wc bound daughter to rip up in the future. i also completely agree that N. Central AZ has some of the best yr round riding available in the states, and also that AZ is way behind the curve in trail building and progression compared to many places in colorado, pacific NW, and BC just to name a few. i personally am aware of what my skills are, and playing politics is not one of them(ask my co-workers). but if there is somone that wants to be the front person on a project as such, be my guest! on the note of immidiate trail-building gratification...from where i was "standing" at the time, if there wasn't the few motivated poeple looking for more challenging trails for their more advanced bikes and skills in flagstaff the last decade, we all would be still dh'ing schultz. basically most of those currently poached trails in flag are most likely going to turn legal, w/ the help of people like you, sometime in the near future...same with most other areas in the states and canada. if history repeats, why would mingus be any different?
    j

  21. #21
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    23,652
    While i like the trail in the video and i did just ride a fun trail on mingus yesterday, id rather have a new DH trail in the forest in Prescott, that can link with other trails if you want to climb it, within the forest coverage of the bradshaws. I think that would privide the maximum benefit to Prescott businesses and the riding experience here.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    Yep, it's going to take years and a whole lot of work but everything that is actually worth something usually does.
    Quote Originally Posted by foamfreak View Post
    but if there is somone that wants to be the front person on a project as such, be my guest!
    j
    Unfortunately, I need income to survive for the next 30 years or so. If I could get every mtb'er in northern az to pitch in a buck a day, I'd be more than happy to spend the rest of my life trying to talk some trail sense into the guys in green.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  23. #23
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    Don't take this the wrong way but it's this attitude that has kept anything legit from happening so far. I may not get to ride all the great trails in N. Az.'s future but I want to have an active part in it for ridings future and for the kids. The non-sanctioned fr/dh trails here in Az. are way behind places that have gone legit as far as progression goes in riding and building. I'm kind of tired of the whole "If it doesn't benefit me and benefit me now then why do the work" mentality. Yep, it's going to take years and a whole lot of work but everything that is actually worth something usually does.
    ra:

    You have indicated you are out doing some investigation for some new sections of trail that will make good connector ideas between two existing trails. I am assuming some of those connector trails will possibly have a more advanced flavor to them to satisfy the riding style of some of your ridding buddies.

    It will be interesting if the FS steps up and spends the taxpayers money to get all the approvals to just OK your project for actually being a future trail. I think there has been mention of other possible trails in the Flagstaff area that you aren't the point person on at this time, so it will be interesting to see the process move forward.

    In Sedona the current leaders who would like to see new trails added talk about putting a list together of new potential projects to present to the FS for approval. I think such an idea is somewhat problematic in that once you let the land manager know where you believe a new trail should be built, if it is never approved there is a problem.

    That problem is that if the non-approved trail actually gets built in the future the person who originally put all the work into figuring out a great alignment now is a person of interest in the who built that new trail investigation.

    Rather than there being numerous persons of interest as to who built the new trail there is only one or two on a short list, since they originally came up with the original idea, and it is only logical that they may have been the ones who constructed it.

    This is where there needs to be a clear understanding between what the land manger is will to accept in a new trail project and whether they have the resources in this challenging financial period to allocate currently strained personnel's time to work on everyone's cool new trail idea.

    The problem someone like you will have is that if you come up with a new trail idea that you totally believe would be a great addition to the current quiver of Flagstaff trails, and that new idea isn't ever built you may be frustrated and may choose to...?????..move to Fall City, Oregon where your trail ideas will be embraced.

    TD

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,007
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    ra:

    You have indicated you are out doing some investigation for some new sections of trail that will make good connector ideas between two existing trails. I am assuming some of those connector trails will possibly have a more advanced flavor to them to satisfy the riding style of some of your ridding buddies.

    It will be interesting if the FS steps up and spends the taxpayers money to get all the approvals to just OK your project for actually being a future trail. I think there has been mention of other possible trails in the Flagstaff area that you aren't the point person on at this time, so it will be interesting to see the process move forward.

    In Sedona the current leaders who would like to see new trails added talk about putting a list together of new potential projects to present to the FS for approval. I think such an idea is somewhat problematic in that once you let the land manager know where you believe a new trail should be built, if it is never approved there is a problem.

    That problem is that if the non-approved trail actually gets built in the future the person who originally put all the work into figuring out a great alignment now is a person of interest in the who built that new trail investigation.

    Rather than there being numerous persons of interest as to who built the new trail there is only one or two on a short list, since they originally came up with the original idea, and it is only logical that they may have been the ones who constructed it.

    This is where there needs to be a clear understanding between what the land manger is will to accept in a new trail project and whether they have the resources in this challenging financial period to allocate currently strained personnel's time to work on everyone's cool new trail idea.

    The problem someone like you will have is that if you come up with a new trail idea that you totally believe would be a great addition to the current quiver of Flagstaff trails, and that new idea isn't ever built you may be frustrated and may choose to...?????..move to Fall City, Oregon where your trail ideas will be embraced.

    TD
    I'm not sure I understand all of this TD. I don't think it's as confusing as your making it. We have Already acquired the money for the NEPA studies for the Dry Lake Hills and the Elden areas, from here on out it's trying to figure out what trails will work and how to reroute them to be more sustainable and actually more fun. This is all I have been up to really. Upper Oldham and Private Reserve could be the first two that we have agreed could be the best fits so far. We are going to be making something happen and either way the legit trails we will build will be more professionally built and more fun. We are only talking about trails here, it's not that big of a deal really. We will be making something happen. If it all falls through then I guess things won't be much different then they are now except the relationship between the Coco NF and the fr/dh community will suffer.

    I won't be relocating any time soon, I love Flagstaff for many more reasons then the riding and I have to stay close to my daughter.

    So I'm not sure where you were going with that and honestly I can't follow it so well, I hope you can make it a little easier for me to understand.

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    ra:

    In Sedona the current leaders who would like to see new trails added talk about putting a list together of new potential projects to present to the FS for approval. I think such an idea is somewhat problematic in that once you let the land manager know where you believe a new trail should be built, if it is never approved there is a problem.

    That problem is that if the non-approved trail actually gets built in the future the person who originally put all the work into figuring out a great alignment now is a person of interest in the who built that new trail investigation.

    Rather than there being numerous persons of interest as to who built the new trail there is only one or two on a short list, since they originally came up with the original idea, and it is only logical that they may have been the ones who constructed it.

    TD
    i believe that this is the main reason why most dedicated trail builders keep to themselves, other than TD, and only reveal the fruits of their vision/labor once the project they are on is complete/sustainable... when they no longer have the need to be around such project w/ tools in their hands. basically eliminating the chances of fines/jail. this idea has worked great for many years/decades in mtb riding areas. from my experience poached trails usually end up w/ the FS/land managers turning a blind eye to the situation until finally caving in and adopting such trails as legal. currently i am not aware of anyone getting in trouble for building non-sanctioned trails in AZ, or anywhere else for that matter. so why should the motivated visionaries ever stop????
    j

  26. #26
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    I'm not sure I understand all of this TD. I don't think it's as confusing as your making it. We have Already acquired the money for the NEPA studies for the Dry Lake Hills and the Elden areas, from here on out it's trying to figure out what trails will work and how to reroute them to be more sustainable and actually more fun. This is all I have been up to really. Upper Oldham and Private Reserve could be the first two that we have agreed could be the best fits so far. We are going to be making something happen and either way the legit trails we will build will be more professionally built and more fun. We are only talking about trails here, it's not that big of a deal really. We will be making something happen. If it all falls through then I guess things won't be much different then they are now except the relationship between the Coco NF and the fr/dh community will suffer.

    I won't be relocating any time soon, I love Flagstaff for many more reasons then the riding and I have to stay close to my daughter.

    So I'm not sure where you were going with that and honestly I can't follow it so well, I hope you can make it a little easier for me to understand.
    ra:

    I know my original post is somewhat confusing as normal. It wasn't intended to be that way, but it obviously ended up being that way. I am just trying to see how you and others have changed their mind set from a trail building mode out of the system to a building within the system and whether you are sharing all your new trail ideas with the land manager?

    You indicated you guys have all the funds available for the required studies for two different areas. I am curious how much money that is and where did it come from?

    I know that in Sedona the sharing of new trail ideas with the landmanager hasn't happened yet since we haven't even gotten a no brainer trail approved yet, due to a lack of funding to pay for the studies or the individuals who would do the studies having higher priorities they are currently working on.

    This makes the process longer than what one would hope for and I am curiuos if you guys have come up with the solution. Recently, you guys generated over $800 in funds from the recent flim. Does all that money go to paying for future studies, since that is one of the first steps of any project?

    TD

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,007
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    ra:

    I know my original post is somewhat confusing as normal. It wasn't intended to be that way, but it obviously ended up being that way. I am just trying to see how you and others have changed their mind set from a trail building mode out of the system to a building within the system and whether you are sharing all your new trail ideas with the land manager?

    You indicated you guys have all the funds available for the required studies for two different areas. I am curious how much money that is and where did it come from?

    I know that in Sedona the sharing of new trail ideas with the landmanager hasn't happened yet since we haven't even gotten a no brainer trail approved yet, due to a lack of funding to pay for the studies or the individuals who would do the studies having higher priorities they are currently working on.

    This makes the process longer than what one would hope for and I am curiuos if you guys have come up with the solution. Recently, you guys generated over $800 in funds from the recent flim. Does all that money go to paying for future studies, since that is one of the first steps of any project?

    TD
    There have not been any new social trails built in this area that I know of for at least 6 years now. We really want to have legit trails and not have people going out on there own and creating poorly built lines, we want to have a positive and productive outlet for the more advanced riders here and create a strong relationship with the local NF. We have shared ideas and some trails will become closed while others will be rerouted and then possibly some new trails will be added as well.

    Heres a link to the info your looking for.


    http://flagstaffbiking.org/2011/06/1...-in-flagstaff/

  28. #28
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    There have not been any new social trails built in this area that I know of for at least 6 years now. We really want to have legit trails and not have people going out on there own and creating poorly built lines, we want to have a positive and productive outlet for the more advanced riders here and create a strong relationship with the local NF. We have shared ideas and some trails will become closed while others will be rerouted and then possibly some new trails will be added as well.
    ra:

    When you say there are no new social trails that you know of in the last 6 years that is a pretty interesting statement. I don't mean to be a total pessimist, but that seems impossible. What do you define as a new social trail.

    Recently, I have been told there are several new moto trails that have popped up over the last 6 years that mountain bikers now ride. Do they count as a new social trail that hasn't had a study on it prior to being burned in?

    I know that no longer happens :, and going forward there will be little if any new social trails in the future.

    TD

  29. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation: helimech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,811
    WOW, amazing! If this was on Mingus TD, I would never come home.
    ****BIRD

  30. #30
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by helimech View Post
    WOW, amazing! If this was on Mingus TD, I would never come home.
    heli:

    I have something also amazing I will soon share with you. Only someone like you will appreciate the biking skill necessary to pull this little video I am doing for your viewing pleasure.

    TD

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    There have not been any new social trails built in this area that I know of for at least 6 years now. We really want to have legit trails and not have people going out on there own and creating poorly built lines/[/url]
    I think this is part of Sedona's problem: there are always people making their own trails. I've chatted with the USFS on this issue before and that's pretty much what is making them frustrated with the MTB crowd. They are spending more time and money desperately trying to keep the social trails from being built to have any time to talk about building legal, legitimate trails. Not to mention the 1-5 million tourons who are looking for the starbucks on chicken point calling for directions.

    If the MTB community raised some dough to pay for the studies, I'm certain it'd be a huge push to making legal trial building happen. If we're going to expect the FS to do it all on their dime, we're on their time line.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: helimech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,811
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    heli:

    I have something also amazing I will soon share with you. Only someone like you will appreciate the biking skill necessary to pull this little video I am doing for your viewing pleasure.

    TD

    Thanks TD . Give me a yell when your ready.
    ****BIRD

  33. #33
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by helimech View Post
    Thanks TD . Give me a yell when your ready.
    heli:

    It's a short clip that you might be able to relate to. Should be done within 30 minutes.

    TD

  34. #34
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Out of 27 riders on the last Mt. Bike Heaven Group Ride, Tex was the only one I saw pull this off:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CJuufxkAH8

    TD

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation: helimech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,811
    Nice, well done Tex . Up by the "cow pies"? Gonna have to take a look around the next time I'm up there. Thanks TD.
    ****BIRD

  36. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,007
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    ra:

    When you say there are no new social trails that you know of in the last 6 years that is a pretty interesting statement. I don't mean to be a total pessimist, but that seems impossible. What do you define as a new social trail.

    Recently, I have been told there are several new moto trails that have popped up over the last 6 years that mountain bikers now ride. Do they count as a new social trail that hasn't had a study on it prior to being burned in?

    I know that no longer happens :, and going forward there will be little if any new social trails in the future.

    TD
    Well we are hoping by creating a very well built and thought out system that all riders can be involved with that the creating of the "burned in lines" can hopefully stop. We only have one Mt. Elden which is a small area to work with and in the future if we work together we can only hope that illegal trail building will be frowned on by the community. I would like to believe that we can come up with a long term plan that works for all users interested in the said area and not end up abusing that zone to the point it's being damaged. I guess I'm sounding a little like a puppet but honestly I love Elden and I would like to see a plan that works for everyone and is also protected. There are lots of different ideas of what an ideal "experience" is for any recreational person and I would like to believe that we can all get along and come up with some solutions.

    The social trails that your talking about I don't think are on the DLH or Elden but I could be wrong.

    The folks I'm representing just want to be able to build legal fr/dh/am trails with technical challenges and so far the FS is being open to these ideas, they realize by not creating options and outlets for these people that social trail building will continue but if we can get organized and start working together we might be able to make something special and legit actually work. I think that is pretty cool.

    I'm kind of surprised that there isn't a stronger advocacy group for the Sedona area, just imagine what could happen if you guys had a much stronger voice. I'm very thankful to have FBO here in Flag.

  37. #37
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by helimech View Post
    Nice, well done Tex . Up by the "cow pies"? Gonna have to take a look around the next time I'm up there. Thanks TD.
    That's the spot that I don't think you are always able to clean, but I don't think you hang a left and and drop down the steep part to do the wheelie drop. After you clean the upper section I think you continue straight ahead.

    TD

  38. #38
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by woahey View Post
    I think this is part of Sedona's problem: there are always people making their own trails. I've chatted with the USFS on this issue before and that's pretty much what is making them frustrated with the MTB crowd. They are spending more time and money desperately trying to keep the social trails from being built to have any time to talk about building legal, legitimate trails. Not to mention the 1-5 million tourons who are looking for the starbucks on chicken point calling for directions.

    If the MTB community raised some dough to pay for the studies, I'm certain it'd be a huge push to making legal trial building happen. If we're going to expect the FS to do it all on their dime, we're on their time line.
    wh:

    I personally don't believe what you have just stated, but that is my personal opinion.

    As far as the dough to do the studies why don't you get it done? Maybe you can find some school funding project that they have $184,000 laying around to get Special Ed brought into the system.

    That trail is totally sustainable and should not have any archeological issues since it's in the middle of a bunch of cactus that no one would want to live in.

    TD

  39. #39
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    23,652
    Quote Originally Posted by woahey View Post
    I think this is part of Sedona's problem: there are always people making their own trails. I've chatted with the USFS on this issue before and that's pretty much what is making them frustrated with the MTB crowd. They are spending more time and money desperately trying to keep the social trails from being built to have any time to talk about building legal, legitimate trails. Not to mention the 1-5 million tourons who are looking for the starbucks on chicken point calling for directions.

    If the MTB community raised some dough to pay for the studies, I'm certain it'd be a huge push to making legal trial building happen. If we're going to expect the FS to do it all on their dime, we're on their time line.
    That sounds like BS. They didn't step up and now they are overwhelmed because others did?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  40. #40
    "No Clue Crew"
    Reputation: Grave9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    2,459
    Quote Originally Posted by DustyBones View Post

    Actually, it's the CIA (or NSA) using a small remote-controlled helicopter to track you! They are responsible for the most recent flats you had also!
    They are there & you can't escape their snoopage!
    The bedazzled components on your bike may have an adverse effect on their surveillance equipment, so use more of it!
    Good luck!
    I never composed this msg.
    I'm beginning to think you're right. I was wondering why they never release any videos! Thanks...........D

  41. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation: rockman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    5,275
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    That's the spot that I don't think you are always able to clean, but I don't think you hang a left and and drop down the steep part to do the wheelie drop. After you clean the upper section I think you continue straight ahead.

    TD
    That's pretty cool. I've tried to pull that off camber move off and have failed every time. And even if I had made it I don't think I would have thought to just drop straight down instead of continuing across. Of course if your brakes fail the next drop is more like 500'

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation: helimech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,811
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    That's the spot that I don't think you are always able to clean, but I don't think you hang a left and and drop down the steep part to do the wheelie drop. After you clean the upper section I think you continue straight ahead.

    TD
    Ahhh yes, that spot looks familiar now. Never thought of doing that, well I guess if you F up that off camber spot that could happen. WooHoo.
    ****BIRD

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    All I was saying is the BS excuse that was given to me when I asked why it is so hard to get new trails built or adepted. Some trails are well-built and are "sustainable" and all that and should be adopted in and a few even are or will be. Unfortunately, it seems as though they're more concerned with the ones that aren't and that's what they'd rather spend their time and energy working on.

    What I can't believe is that it takes $200K to get a study done on a 2 mile trail. I was thinking more like several thousand...so much for thinking. Should've known that you have to multiply the cost of anything by 1000 if the government is involved.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  44. #44
    Eroding into the trail
    Reputation: DustyBones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    897
    [QUOTE=Grave9

    Just lookin' out for ya!

    On a much sadder note, I have heard that several DVDs have been released in eastern-block countries at ridiculously low prices w/strange
    commentary!
    Not available for US market!

  45. #45
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by woahey View Post
    All I was saying is the BS excuse that was given to me when I asked why it is so hard to get new trails built or adepted. Some trails are well-built and are "sustainable" and all that and should be adopted in and a few even are or will be. Unfortunately, it seems as though they're more concerned with the ones that aren't and that's what they'd rather spend their time and energy working on.

    What I can't believe is that it takes $200K to get a study done on a 2 mile trail. I was thinking more like several thousand...so much for thinking. Should've known that you have to multiply the cost of anything by 1000 if the government is involved.
    wh:

    I am really curious who you have talked to at the FS about getting new trails built or adopted. We all understand that the Red Rock Ranger District has been trying to work with the mountain biking community in the last two years, and our relationship is much improved. In the sceam of priories ther are much higher priorities in this district than building a new mountain biking trail.

    The politics are so against the building of a new mountain biking trail that the FS has learned how to play the game. They meet with the mountain bikers and pretend they are interested, but they know full well that their hands are tied and resources aren't there to make it happen and therfore they don't put a lot of effort into trying to start a new trail project.

    Sedona is a very unique situation compared to the rest of the country. Despite the lack of help from the FS the trails outside of the system network seem to meet the needs of the advanced biking community.

    It amazes me when I ride those trails and think how lucky I am to get to enjoy such a diverse system of trails pretty much the whole year long. The beauty of Sedona is world class and today as I rode Hog Heaven uphill I thought it doesn't get much more challenging than this.

    We have a lot to be thankful here in Sedona and the fact that the FS has higher priorities than building new trails here is a small price to pay for having such a special place to live and ride.

    We are riding Gunslinger tomorrow to check out the new re-route. Apparently the owner who put up the fence created a new trail that bypasses his property, but doesn't deminish the great character of the trail. What a country.

    TD

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    wh:

    We all understand that the Red Rock Ranger District has been trying to work with the mountain biking community in the last two years, and our relationship is much improved.

    The politics are so against the building of a new mountain biking trail that the FS has learned how to play the game. They meet with the mountain bikers and pretend they are interested, but they know full well that their hands are tied and resources aren't there to make it happen and therfore they don't put a lot of effort into trying to start a new trail project.
    TD
    Exactly. And they're not condoning any "rogue" trail-building either. But you are right, we have a ton of trails that are already built and offer great riding with great views.

    The FS has come a long way, hell they're even knowingly hiring bikers.

    Glad to hear about Gunslinger, interested to hear how the new route is.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  47. #47
    banned
    Reputation: traildoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    5,540
    Quote Originally Posted by woahey View Post
    Exactly. And they're not condoning any "rogue" trail-building either. But you are right, we have a ton of trails that are already built and offer great riding with great views.

    The FS has come a long way, hell they're even knowingly hiring bikers.

    Glad to hear about Gunslinger, interested to hear how the new route is.
    wh:

    The new routing rode nicely and James waved to us as we rode by his house on FS property.

    TD

  48. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation: woahey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    wh:

    The new routing rode nicely and James waved to us as we rode by his house on FS property.

    TD
    Good to hear. It always gets sticky when land is sold with a trail going along its border. Can't wait to check it out.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youíll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    12
    So I didn't see it mentioned anywhere but the link to the video that TD posted initially from youtube is actually the last chapter of last years epic MTB movie "Follow Me"... My point is if you have not seen this movie from beginning to end then I suggest you visit the PirateBay or Isohunt.

  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation: dhmental's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    36
    I'm in to help build new trails if needed. Building new lines can be almost as fun as riding them for me.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Mingus
    By azdog in forum Arizona
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 07-02-2010, 06:12 AM
  2. Mingus Trail 105
    By tonebone2000 in forum Arizona
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-25-2010, 09:57 PM
  3. Mingus??
    By Kymmster in forum Arizona
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-16-2010, 06:37 AM
  4. Mingus Conditions?
    By Trail-Shredder in forum Arizona
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 03-21-2010, 03:07 PM
  5. Mingus Mt.
    By art23 in forum Arizona
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 01-01-2010, 10:36 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •