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  1. #1
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    Best big volume single ply front tire for desert gnar.

    I've got a worn out Nev 2.1 on the back so I'm going to switch the Pani Rampage 2.35 I'm currently running on the front to the back and get a new front before my trip to AZ.

    What do you suggest? I want something at least as big as the Blue Groove 2.35 at about the same weight (750-900gr).... but better rolling. I've seen lots of favorites in various threads but can't seem to find one thread that list them all and compares.

    These are the ones that come up frequently:

    Maxxis: Not sure the difference in these three.
    Advantage
    High Roller
    Minion

    WTB:
    Weir Wolf 2.35
    Mutuno Raptor 2.4

    Schwalbe:
    Big Betty 2.4

    I'm running tubes currently but am considering switching back to Stans on XM321 rims. I have the rim strips and Stans stuff.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  2. #2
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    wierwolf 2.5, the 2.3 is tiny.

    High volume single ply light tire= ripped sidewalls.

    The motoraptor IMO is junk, sketchy, hard compound, not much traction, it breaks predictibly, but that's about it. You can do better.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  3. #3
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    KROB,

    I run Maxxis DH 2 ply tires (Minion front and rear), simply because I cut a tires like butter. But most of the crew I ride with run Kenda Kinetics 2.6 Stick E. They are more like 2.4 and they love them. You will want a nice Stick E tire for SOMO. Most of the trails I have planned (if you're still in) will have lots of granite.

    http://www.kendausa.com/bicycle/weeklyspecials.htm

    Kenda has them on sale for $10

    Still looking at the 26th and 27th?
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  4. #4
    workin' it Administrator
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    I haven't personally tried them but my next tires when my old ones wear out will be the Maxxis DHF and DHR minions. Meaty and large knobbed. They run small. A 2.3 is about a 2.2 so be forewarned although i have seen the 2.4 advantage and it is huge. I would also try those.

    Are you full sus, front boing or old school (rigid)? That will make a difference too.

    On my full sus I am currently running the WTB timberwolfs in the 2.3 not a high volume as you would think. I have a pair of Specialized DH tires next, seriously jumbo awesome tire.

    On my SS (rigid) I run the IRC trailbear(freedom cross (stupid name)) in the 2.2 and 2.5 size. Rolls fast-ish but cheap and grippy. (FWIW: SS is stan-ed and the Full sus is slime tubed)
    Try this: HTFU

  5. #5
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    Try out specialized 2.4 enduro pro (front) and nokian 2.3 gazzalodi SWA. Both tires can take alot of abuse and haven't had a problem. The enduro wears kinda quick but it grabs the earth very nicely. they have ran down greenie to la milagrosa and also the gnar of goat camp. Later.
    ****BIRD

  6. #6
    mr. wonderful
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er

    Kenda has them on sale for $10
    you just gave up my super secret stash. now i'm going to have to pony up for a baker's dozen.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtbag
    you just gave up my super secret stash. now i'm going to have to pony up for a baker's dozen.

    OOOOPPPPSSS!!!!
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er
    KROB,

    I run Maxxis DH 2 ply tires (Minion front and rear), simply because I cut a tires like butter. But most of the crew I ride with run Kenda Kinetics 2.6 Stick E. They are more like 2.4 and they love them. You will want a nice Stick E tire for SOMO. Most of the trails I have planned (if you're still in) will have lots of granite.

    http://www.kendausa.com/bicycle/weeklyspecials.htm

    Kenda has them on sale for $10

    Still looking at the 26th and 27th?
    I haven't really had much trouble tearing sidewalls (Just one tear on the Nev running stans) even at pretty rocky places like Bootleg and Cowboy trails and I don't want to pack the extra weight of a true 2-ply downhill tire up the hill.... so that's why I want to stick to single ply.

    I just called Kenda.... they're closed. Hope Dirtbag didn't buy up all of them. Hard to go wrong at ten bucks. Do these roll any better than the BG?

    Yep. Still planning on the 26th and 27th.
    Last edited by KRob; 02-07-2007 at 08:28 AM.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockcrusher
    Are you full sus, front boing or old school (rigid)? That will make a difference too.
    Intense 6.6 full boinger.

    Like I said above I just can't wrap my brain around pedalling a 1300gr tire up hills and on more XC type trails (eventhough people say it's more about the rolling resistance than the weight) so I'm wanting something in the 800gr range and low rolling resistance.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  10. #10
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    The Mutano is specifically not recommended for Stans. Quite narrow for a 2.4, but rolls very fast and corners well in any conditions except copious mud. My 29" WW low treads make the 26" version seem very interesting, plus the little one's have reinforced sidewalls.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    I haven't really had much trouble tearing sidewalls (Just one tear on the Nev running stans) even at pretty rocky places like Bootleg and Cowboy trails and I don't want to pack the extra weight of a true 2-ply downhill tire up the hill.... so that's why I want to stick to single ply.

    I just called Kenda.... they're closed. Hope Dirtbag didn't buy up all of them. Hard to go wrong at $10 bucks. Do these roll any better than the BG?

    Yep. Still planning on the 26th and 27th.

    They roll about the same, maybe a bit slower than a BG.
    I will put in for those 2 days off. Look forward to meeting you. Leg armor is highly recommended if you have some. Granite hurts Is anyone else coming with you?
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  12. #12
    Neg reppers r my biatches
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    Maxxis Minion / High Roller 2.35s = girly in size, but o.k.

    Maxxis Advantage 2.4 = Very large volume...way bigger than Maxxis 2.35s. Single ply, average sidewalls for single ply meaning not that great

    Schwalbe Big Betty 2.4s = B!TCHIN. Their reinforced sidewalls (via rubber insert) are amazing. Technically single ply but WAY more robust than any single ply I have ever seen. The perfect compromise....my 2 were 921 and 937 grams. About same size as Advantage so very large volume. Also appear to be faster rolling than Advantages. Only downside is that Schwalbes are not cheap....but worth it. Tires are so important compared to other crap we obsess over so go for it.

  13. #13
    No, that's not phonetic
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    I second the Kinetics 2.6 Stick-e tires. Front and rear. My large Nevegals and Blue Grooves shed knobs off the sidewalls pretty fast, but the Kinetics fare much better. The Stick-e rubber is great, though you may want a non sticky tire in back for lots of slickrock. In the rear, the Tioga Factory DH 2.3 is huge and will last a bit longer.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er
    They roll about the same, maybe a bit slower than a BG.
    I will put in for those 2 days off. Look forward to meeting you. Leg armor is highly recommended if you have some. Granite hurts Is anyone else coming with you?
    Unless I can find some ripping good deal on the Betty's I'm going to order the Kinetics tomorrow. The BBs sound like they'd hold up better and have lower rolling resistance.... but I'll bet they're not 5 times better.

    Yep I gots the leg and elbow armour. I always wear it on the rocks. I tend to fall over for the stupidest reasons.

    Nope. Just me.... well riding anyway. Look forward to meeting you too.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ionsmuse
    The Mutano is specifically not recommended for Stans. Quite narrow for a 2.4, but rolls very fast and corners well in any conditions except copious mud. My 29" WW low treads make the 26" version seem very interesting, plus the little one's have reinforced sidewalls.
    Yeah, I meant the Motoraptor 2.4 but apparently there's better treads out there. You like the WeirWolf? Are people running the the 2.5 WW down there? The center knobs do look pretty low....or is that just on the LT version? Reinforced side walls is good.
    Last edited by KRob; 02-05-2007 at 11:50 PM.
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  16. #16
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    FWIW I tried a single ply Maxxis Minion 2.5 (60a durometer) on the front on a recent trip to Phoenix. It was very secure on most surfaces - gripped bare rock well, great on rubble and loose stuff and floats well on sand. It has come through two weeks of abuse with little wear or damage, despite three outings on National plus Goat Camp and Milagrosa - both of which are way more tyre abusive. I did originally order a 2.35 but it was way too skinny - go for the 2.5.

    I ran a dual ply Maxxis Hansventure on the back but will bring something lighter next time - also it was a softer compound and he knobs got pretty ragged, especially after Sedona slickrock - seemed bullet proof otherwise.

    Rider weight and style is also an issue - I am relatively light and ride fairly conservatively. A heavier more Gonzo appraoch will probably need a dual ply rear at least.
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  17. #17
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    Sounds like you made your decision already. But here's what I found:

    WTB 2.3" WW "Race" tires don't hold up at South Mtn. 2 rides. 2 sidewall hernias (and multiple partial tears). Like the next tire, good option when you're not expecting sharp rocks. Better than the mutano in gravel.

    WTB 2.4" Mutano "race" - really a 2.2" tire with low knob height and light weight (<600g). Only had this out 1 time in south mountain and no full tears (Scratches and partials yes). By far my fave front tire for fast rolling single track if you know you're not going to encounter razor sharp rocks.

    Maxxis Highroller 2.5" - 1200 grams make the pedal uphill a grunt. Cruising trails in middle/middle is fine, but I wouldn't want to try to pedal these much faster. however, multiple trips to So Mtn and no tears.

    I may try a highroller 2.3" next. I think its around 850 grams. May provide enough traction and protection for some of the rockier areas while pedaling well enough for the smoother tracks.

    29er notes:

    Bontrager Jones XR (29er) in 2.3". One ride at South Mtn, 1 sidewall hernia. Front pushes in sand more than I'd like. Back provides good traction despite smallish looking knobs.

    Specialized Resolution - THink its ~2.3". One ride at SoMo and no nicks/cuts. Cruising around town (okay, to the bar) got a goathead.

    Hmm, what I'm getting out of this is that I should be riding my 29er more.

  18. #18
    Neg reppers r my biatches
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pontius_Pirate
    Sounds like you made your decision already. But here's what I found:

    WTB 2.3" WW "Race" tires don't hold up at South Mtn. 2 rides. 2 sidewall hernias (and multiple partial tears). Like the next tire, good option when you're not expecting sharp rocks. Better than the mutano in gravel.

    WTB 2.4" Mutano "race" - really a 2.2" tire with low knob height and light weight (<600g). Only had this out 1 time in south mountain and no full tears (Scratches and partials yes). By far my fave front tire for fast rolling single track if you know you're not going to encounter razor sharp rocks.

    Maxxis Highroller 2.5" - 1200 grams make the pedal uphill a grunt. Cruising trails in middle/middle is fine, but I wouldn't want to try to pedal these much faster. however, multiple trips to So Mtn and no tears.

    I may try a highroller 2.3" next. I think its around 850 grams. May provide enough traction and protection for some of the rockier areas while pedaling well enough for the smoother tracks.

    29er notes:

    Bontrager Jones XR (29er) in 2.3". One ride at South Mtn, 1 sidewall hernia. Front pushes in sand more than I'd like. Back provides good traction despite smallish looking knobs.

    Specialized Resolution - THink its ~2.3". One ride at SoMo and no nicks/cuts. Cruising around town (okay, to the bar) got a goathead.

    Hmm, what I'm getting out of this is that I should be riding my 29er more.
    i have a barely touched Maxxis Highroller 2.35 for sale in the classifieds.....$12 plus shipping if you want it. Have other tires too

  19. #19
    involuntary dismounter
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle
    i have a barely touched Maxxis Highroller 2.35 for sale in the classifieds.....$12 plus shipping if you want it. Have other tires too

    selling off the stash?
    let me know when you wanna get rid of the bike...i want first dibs on the good deal!
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  20. #20
    Neg reppers r my biatches
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    Quote Originally Posted by dHarriet

    selling off the stash?
    let me know when you wanna get rid of the bike...i want first dibs on the good deal!
    i am thinking about it.....dont even ride anymore anyway. if i sell it i can at least contribute to the mountain biking community financially

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tor-y-Foel
    FWIW I tried a single ply Maxxis Minion 2.5 (60a durometer) on the front on a recent trip to Phoenix.
    Where'd you get that 2.5 single ply Minnion. They don't show it on their site Do you know what it weighs?
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    Yeah, I meant the Motoraptor 2.4 but apparently there's better treads out there. You like the WeirWolf? Are people running the the 2.5 WW down there? The center knobs do look pretty low....or is that just on the LT version? Reinforced side walls is good.
    The Moto is ok, not good or bad in any conditions. The compound is tough as anything, they're very popular rental bike tires in places like Moab.

    I ride a 29er, and love the WW LT; but I'm also not riding a 6x6 bike either. For me, the LT is an excellent blend of speed, cush, and dry conditions grip. The "normal" 2.5 WW is a pretty different tire.

    IF I owned a 6.6, I'd put something like a Timberwolf on it.

  23. #23
    Saucy Size
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    Quote Originally Posted by tscheezy
    I second the Kinetics 2.6 Stick-e tires. Front and rear. My large Nevegals and Blue Grooves shed knobs off the sidewalls pretty fast, but the Kinetics fare much better. The Stick-e rubber is great, though you may want a non sticky tire in back for lots of slickrock. In the rear, the Tioga Factory DH 2.3 is huge and will last a bit longer.
    Just called and ordered these up. Now down to $5 per tire! I ordered 3 f/r sets.

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  24. #24
    Neg reppers r my biatches
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    Where'd you get that 2.5 single ply Minnion. They don't show it on their site Do you know what it weighs?
    i was wondering the same thing.....i thought only the 2.35s came with that option

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul B
    Just called and ordered these up. Now down to $5 per tire! I ordered 3 f/r sets.

    p.
    Yep. Me too. If you order the bulk it's only $5. Although I'm a little sceptical because the one with the "B" code for bulk says it's the standard compound. The person on the phone said that's a misprint and they're all the Stick-E compound. I asked her if she was sure and she went and asked her boss and she came back and said yes.

    This would have to be a pretty crappy tire to not be worth FIVE bucks.
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  26. #26
    mr. wonderful
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul B
    Just called and ordered these up. Now down to $5 per tire! I ordered 3 f/r sets.

    p.
    WOW!! and i thought you tweekin' behind the tool shed PB

    not only are these my favorite tire at any price, 65 bones for a bakers dozen is hard to turn away

    i am in full agreement with tscheezy on these things: reasonably light, i've had slower rolling tires, great tread pattern tuned to front and rear, really sticky, great durability (for sticky rubber), can easily mount tubeless (regardless of what anyone at Kenda says).

    i ran BGs and Nevs for a year or two prior with good results except for torn side nobs. i went to Big Bettys for better rolling and sidewalls, but they are a MPITA to mount tubeless AND the side nobs ripped and the rubber broke down much faster than the Kendas AND they are $40-$50 ea. the last BB lasted about 2 weeks before it was toast so sidewall durabilty is a non-issue.

    i have had the kenetics mounted for about 10-12 weeks. the rear is looking a little ratty, i have patched one little bead bite, and it has a tubeless crochet patch hanging out of it, but it is still working great. i think i can easily get a few more weeks out of it.

  27. #27
    Brit on a trip
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    Where'd you get that 2.5 single ply Minnion. They don't show it on their site Do you know what it weighs?
    I got it at Chain Reacton Cycles (Ireland) before I came over from the UK - they get all sorts of OEM stuff so it could have come from anywhere - not much help then if they are unavailable over there The weight was around 900 grammes as far as I can remember. I will see if I can get a rear for when I come back for the Spring Fling
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  28. #28
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    Those prices suckered me in....a couple fronts and a rear.

    For KRob:

    I like the Weirwolf 2.5's also. I currently have a Timberwolf 2.5 on the front and it works nicely. It's hard to evaluate tires right now because conditions are kind of moist (up here), and everything hooks up well. I only have one ride on the timberwolf in these good conditions, so take it with a grain of salt. The WW 2.5's are great when it's loose.

    Stay away from the Conti Diesel IMO, unless you like drifting.

    For 29ers, I have been very pleased with the Nevegal up front.

  29. #29
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    The ones with the B are indeed bulk and are the same exact tire with Stick-E they just don't come with packaging. I just ordered 2 sets myself, killer deal on a great tire

  30. #30
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    Got mine yesterday. $30 for three tires and two tubes ain't bad. All were Stick E.

  31. #31
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    Got mine, too: $30 for 6 tires, all Stick-E. Taking a set out for a ride right now!

    p.
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul B
    $30 for 6 tires, all Stick-E. .
    I was including shipping BTW.

    Still possibly the best biking deal I've ever gotten.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    I was including shipping BTW.
    Yep I got mine too. In fact they're sitting right here on my desk as we speak.
    LOL. Yeah, the shipping on mine was almost more than the tires. $15 for three tires and $11 for the shipping. That's insane.

    Do the guys who run these tires down there use stans. How are they for mounting up?
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  34. #34
    trail "cleaner"
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    Our Secret Is Out!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    Yep I got mine too. In fact they're sitting right here on my desk as we speak.
    LOL. Yeah, the shipping on mine was almost more than the tires. $15 for three tires and $11 for the shipping. That's insane.

    Do the guys who run these tires down there use stans. How are they for mounting up?
    Dirt Bag and Tisser. How dare you Just kiddin'. Krob, yep we run them tubeless. Dirt Bag and I use them on Mavic 819/823 rims and also on Stan's strips for nontubeless rims. They mount up very easy and it's a crap shoot if they seal perfectly the first time using homemade tire sealant. Usually, they leak some until you hit the trail and then they'll seal up competely. I've been running these tires for quite awhile now. No question one of the BEST tires for SOMO WRT performance and now the value is purely icing on the cake
    No dabs allowed!

  35. #35
    Glutton for punishment
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    I'm running the 2.5 WW f/r on my SuperMoto.

    I don't have any real issues with them - no cut sidewalls, traction issues or whatnot. They're reasonably big, roll nicely, and stick really well to the trail.

    A little rant if you will:

    I've never run sticky rubber tires on my bike - mostly because I'm a cheapskate and have a (possibly incorrect) view that sticky rubber wears really fast and I'll need to get yet another tire sooner than later. Granted, a $10 Kenda is right up my alley!

    That said, what I really don't get is the apparent requirement of sticky rubber tires to enjoy or survive certain parts of the rides here in Phoenix. I guess I should grab some sticky tires and maybe I'll have an epiphany of some sort...

    Rant off.

    ScottN

  36. #36
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    Meh, the Stick-E is gravy. People say they wear kind of fast, but I squeezed many hundreds of miles out of my Nevegal/Blue Groove set I installed on the Stinky in Whistler two years ago.

    At $5 apiece, seriously, they're disposable. The only reason I'm not going to UST them is because I'll probably have to redo them in six months.

    p.
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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    I was including shipping BTW.

    Still possibly the best biking deal I've ever gotten.
    it's definitely high on my list as well

    a few questions about this kinetics 2.6 folding:

    1) i wonder, what's the shelf life of tires? i've never "stocked up" on a tire before, but at this price it might makes sense

    2) is this tire more like a true 2.4 or a 2.5?

    3) does anyone have a weight on it? i have only been able to find the weight for the wire bead version which was around 1200 claim and 1050 actual or something..

  38. #38
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    I just picked up 2 sets of the kinetic sticke 2.6s. I've been wanting some bigger tires that I could swap onto my bike for Globe/Flag/Somo situations, and at $5 each, the price is right. I ripped off knobs like crazy on the last set of kendas I had, they lasted about 15 riding hours before I was afraid to use them, but for $5 I don't care!
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  39. #39
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    Just thought I'd update this thread and give a little report on these tires.

    I mounted the front Kenda Kinetics 2.6 on Mavic XM321 rims with stans and it aired up nicely and leaked slowly for the first few days until I took it out on a real ride. Since then it's been good. The sizing is more like a 2.4... Maybe a bit bigger than a Kenda Blue Groove 2.35.

    This tire rocked the techy, loose, rocky descents at SoMo and Goat Camp. It didn't get squirrely on the loose bably heads near the top of Goat Camp DH and stuck very well on the rocks. It tracked amazing and accurately, went where I pointed it, and took all the abuse I dished out. It even rolled pretty well. Saturday morning I did a quick spin around Hawes/Mine Loop with a little out and back on Twisted Sister and it was fine on this more XC type terrain too. It drifts a bit in fast flat corners with loose sand on hard pack.... but once I discovered its behavior, I started gaining more confidence in it.

    Great tire.



    On a side note the Panny Rampage I moved to the rear worked well too. It sealed up from the get-go with the stans and hardly lost any pressure the whole week. It rolls very nicely and climbing traction is pretty good. It slipped a bit on some of the sand-over-rock techy climbs on SoMo and was a bit prone to skidding with braking due to the ramped edge when mounted as directed.

    I'd be interested to see how the Kinetics would've compared on the back in the same conditions. A bit stickier tire would've been nice on those techy, ledgy climbs at SoMo and loose steep descents at GC. Its sqaure edged knob may have been better for braking too.

    Think I'll order me some more. Thanks for the insider info!
    Oh, and here's a link to the ride report over on Passion.
    Last edited by KRob; 03-02-2007 at 01:19 PM.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  40. #40
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    Yea these are some nice tires, I was able to put some miles on them this past weekend, and they held up great in all conditions, and rolled pretty damn good too. Very similar sounding terrain as my fellow desert rat. They aren't too bad in the weight dept either at roughly 850g. This is a very good tire even at several times the price.

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