I'm still thinking about getting one and am gathering opinions. I think there is someone on this board with this set-up (ChrisK?), but I believe he's still snowed in.

There is a photo on Pete Fagerlin's homepage of a 5er with the DUC fork - I wondered if that rider is around here?

Anyway, I currently use a Talas which is very good, but tends to dive a little on bigger hits however I set it up. I might switch to a Vanilla (which I already have on another bike) or take a hit on the Maverick.

I'm slightly concerned over the longer crown - dropout length (about 19mm?) as I don't want to slacken the head angle beyond 69º.

I also believe that Turner are currently testing this set-up before changing (or not) their advice on whether to use one.

Thoughts?

I'm still thinking about getting one and am gathering opinions. I think there is someone on this board with this set-up (ChrisK?), but I believe he's still snowed in.

There is a photo on Pete Fagerlin's homepage of a 5er with the DUC fork - I wondered if that rider is around here?

Anyway, I currently use a Talas which is very good, but tends to dive a little on bigger hits however I set it up. I might switch to a Vanilla (which I already have on another bike) or take a hit on the Maverick.

I'm slightly concerned over the longer crown - dropout length (about 19mm?) as I don't want to slacken the head angle beyond 69º.

I also believe that Turner are currently testing this set-up before changing (or not) their advice on whether to use one.

Thoughts?

Winter and a busy schedule have limited me to a few rides with mine on snow covered trails. I haven't been able to push it yet and I won't till the snow is gone in May. Couple of observations based on your questions though.

The head angle change isn't as dramatic and some might think. Just sitting against the wall the axle-crown height is about the same as running a standard 130mm Z-1, which a lot of people around here like a lot. But you run the Mav with a lot of sag, so on the trail I can't tell, the change is minimal. And as if that's not enough, it lowers to 100mm with the flip of a little lever.

In the end, its so much stiffer than anything I've been on that's not an 8 lb DH fork and its so smooth. Stiff, light, plush and it really doesn't turn the 5 into a chopper.

Pete does have a lot more time on his than I do and he posts here frequently. My guess is he'll turn up here any moment. Search the archives too, it has been discussed before and I posted some pics.

But it puts the Vanilla I was running to shame, so I would think it would do the same to the Talas. One ride and I was completely sold. Its the ultimate XC/epic fork and to me well worth the money.

(Sorry for getting your name wrong) :^)

I guess I'd be really interested in what Pete has to say on the matter, as like you, I've found it to be the best trail fork out there by far - I've given it a couple of short tests on a friends ML7 on which it performs faultlessly, but obviously that hasn't given me any experience of it on a 5er :^)

I'm pretty sold on the idea, I just need a bit more reasurance before dropping the cash.

I also have 2 other bike builds lined up, so I need to watch the pennies :^)

Thanks again, I secretly know you're right that this is the killer fork for the 5er...

I secretly know you're right that this is the killer fork for the 5er...
I have one on order. I will get some miles on it when I finally get done with this darn Utah trip :p . It is the same height as the Zokes a lot of us have on our bikes, but those do raise the front a bit over the Foxes, though as Chris said you run more sag on the Mav so it should work ok.

I fondled one in a shop in Fruita and it was quite the specimine. I'd say go for it.

tscheezy

Winter and a busy schedule have limited me to a few rides with mine on snow covered trails. I haven't been able to push it yet and I won't till the snow is gone in May. Couple of observations based on your questions though...
I've been watching this discussion with interest... I can't wait for some more detailed input. Chris, how would you compare the damping to the Z1? I'm very pleased with my Z and I wouldn't want to give up the suppleness or the consistency at varioius speeds. I suppose it feels different but in what way? I'm already on a 20mm through axle but I hear this is even stiffer...amazing.

Hmmm choices choices...new speakers or another fork? and what to do with the Z if I do go that way?....Hmmmm. I'll be debating this for a while, I think.:D

Winter and a busy schedule have limited me to a few rides with mine on snow covered trails. I haven't been able to push it yet and I won't till the snow is gone in May. Couple of observations based on your questions though.

The head angle change isn't as dramatic and some might think. Just sitting against the wall the axle-crown height is about the same as running a standard 130mm Z-1, which a lot of people around here like a lot. But you run the Mav with a lot of sag, so on the trail I can't tell, the change is minimal. And as if that's not enough, it lowers to 100mm with the flip of a little lever.

In the end, its so much stiffer than anything I've been on that's not an 8 lb DH fork and its so smooth. Stiff, light, plush and it really doesn't turn the 5 into a chopper.

Pete does have a lot more time on his than I do and he posts here frequently. My guess is he'll turn up here any moment. Search the archives too, it has been discussed before and I posted some pics.

But it puts the Vanilla I was running to shame, so I would think it would do the same to the Talas. One ride and I was completely sold. Its the ultimate XC/epic fork and to me well worth the money.

I've briefly ridden a Maverick and I did not think it put the Vanilla to shame. It could. I never got enough of a ride to really appreciate the ride. How does it put the Vanilla to shame? Just wondering. It is stupid expensive but may be worth it.

Jaybo

Am I the only one concerned about putting a double crown fork on a slightly beefed up cross country frame? What happens if you go down and the fork hits the top tube? :eek:

The 5-spot is not a free-ride/downhill frame, and even those often use heavy bumpers on the stanchions to protect the frame or frame stops ...

and why to go double? to save some little weight compared to a Minute or Talas, and have 6" in front for a frame that is perfectly balcanced with 5". I am: :confused:

Am I the only one concerned about putting a double crown fork on a slightly beefed up cross country frame? What happens if you go down and the fork hits the top tube? :eek:
because the Maverick fork IS a Cross Country fork! :rolleyes:

Deano, here is a good thread for you: http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=8845&highlight=fork

For Jaybo, to me its a notch above everything else out there. Put one through its paces and you will see. Stiff as hell and it just eats everything up like nothing else I've ever ridden, at least in the realm of XC forks. Its the next step in the evolution of the XC fork IMHO. Lotsa travel, stiff, plush and light. If Marz could get the Z150 weight down so you're not towing that anchor up a hill that would be dope.

For Davide and others worried about the abuse on the 5 frame, look at the Mav frame, sub 6 pounds with no gussets or anything like that and they really hammer those things. I feel if the ML7 can take it so can the 5. As Acadian pointed out, its an XC fork and for me its ridden accordingly. I will not be entering DH races with the 5. I will still ride the same trails as before, just with a different fork.

I have one on order.

nice... very nice

you will enjoy

I am talking about the double crown issue (you know, the little problem with dinging your top tube because the stanchions hit it in a fall) please read the posts before unswering, thank you :confused:

I am talking about the double crown issue (you know, the little problem with dinging your top tube because the stanchions hit it in a fall) please read the posts before unswering, thank you :confused:

The fork has fat little bumpers and Maverick doesn't seem to have any problems with the issue you speak of. A friend has abused thoroughly, including some spectacular crashes and no probs with his ML7. I did read your post and I was answering it, the ML7 is a lightweight frame that hasn't had any issues with a double crown fork on it. IMHO if the ML7 can take the abuse so can the 5. No confusion except on your part.

The fork has fat little bumpers and Maverick doesn't seem to have any problems with the issue you speak of. A friend has abused thoroughly, including some spectacular crashes and no probs with his ML7. I did read your post and I was answering it, the ML7 is a lightweight frame that hasn't had any issues with a double crown fork on it. IMHO if the ML7 can take the abuse so can the 5. No confusion except on your part.

Only problem is that the Turner 5 Spot isn't covered by a warranty for dual crowns. If it was I would personally have more confidence in it.

Wait for the new 5" single crown fork he is bringing out.

I've briefly ridden a Maverick and I did not think it put the Vanilla to shame. It could. I never got enough of a ride to really appreciate the ride. How does it put the Vanilla to shame? Just wondering. It is stupid expensive but may be worth it.


The Maverick puts the Vanilla to shame.

It's MUCH stiffer.

Other notes based upon replies/questions:

The axle-to-crown height isn't an issue for me. I really can't feel the 5 mm difference (running proper sag). The fork doesn't feel chopperish at all. In fact, for me IT CLIMBS BETTER on technical goodliness because it tracks so well and is very plush.

It does have more stiction at the beginning of the travel when compared to a Vanilla.

RE: dual crown concerns. The Spot looks to be burlier in the head tube area than my Id was and the Id is "authorized" for DC forks.

Davide: Your cluelessness apparently knows no bounds. The Maverick fork isn't a freeride fork, it's an XC fork. As noted above it comes with bumpers to protect the frame.

The travel reduction really works well on extended steep climbs, but the travel stiffens up too much for my tastes for really rocky/ledgey tech climbs so I only drop the travel on lameass fireroad climbs.

The fork has fat little bumpers and Maverick doesn't seem to have any problems with the issue you speak of. A friend has abused thoroughly, including some spectacular crashes and no probs with his ML7. I did read your post and I was answering it, the ML7 is a lightweight frame that hasn't had any issues with a double crown fork on it. IMHO if the ML7 can take the abuse so can the 5. No confusion except on your part.

indeed, I never said anybody is confused but me. I am just "worried" for frame integrity of bikes that were not designed for double crowns and wondering about the marketing of the Maverick.

Manitu and Marz came out with single crown 6" (and soon longer) because people prefer single crowns vs double for rather obvious reasons. A 150mm Talas would be possible as well and weight close to the Maverick. So why go double? Just to be different?

Anyway, enough: I am sure it is a fork as good as many others, enjoy :)

and track better. I had one of those POS Rock Shox XL triple clamps when they first came out. As far as structural stiffness, it was much better than the Marz z2 that it replaced. Damping quality is another matter. My 30mm stanchioned Manitou Xvert triple clamp is stiffer than my Fox Talas in fore/aft movment. IMO, triples will always be stiffer than single crowns.

-Sp



Manitu and Marz came out with single crown 6" (and soon longer) because people prefer single crowns vs double for rather obvious reasons. A 150mm Talas would be possible as well and weight close to the Maverick. So why go double? Just to be different?

Anyway, enough: I am sure it is a fork as good as many others, enjoy :)

But that bike would explode if you even thought about riding it near a drop off?

Anyone know if the Maverick frame uses Butted or straight gauge tubing?

-Sp

The Maverick puts the Vanilla to shame.

RE: dual crown concerns. The Spot looks to be burlier in the head tube area than my Id was and the Id is "authorized" for DC forks.

The Turner might look like its thicker than an Id, but at the end of the day if you use a Maverick and you twat the side of your down and top tube leaving a dent you will not be covered by warranty. The Turner 5 Spot apparently (according to MBA) had the thinnest tubing Turner have ever used, this - perhaps - partially explains the reasoning.

I'm no expert on the fine details of the frame, of the tube thickness etc... But I have read in servrela pulbilcations that 5 Spots can't use Mavericks and still be covered by warranty. Thats enough to tell me that I shouldn't get one - so I didn't.

The Turner might look like its thicker than an Id, but at the end of the day if you use a Maverick and you twat the side of your down and top tube leaving a dent you will not be covered by warranty. The Turner 5 Spot apparently (according to MBA) had the thinnest tubing Turner have ever used....
Woah there cowboy, before people get the idea that the 5 Spot is somehow fragile, (I've seen statements morph that way over time)

The statement was the "lightest" tubeset he's ever used. That does not necessairly mean the thinest. Symantics? maybe but my point is we really don't know where or how the tubes are butted and where they aren't. DT is known for over-engineering his frames, and if you compare the Large with the Medium and Small you'll see how he changes the tubset based on the frame size. He puts that much thought into it.

That said, I agree with your points about likely voiding the warranty. Makes sense. Besides possible HT ovalization, there is the ever present TT ding factor. Still I've heard Turner is thinking it over w/resp to the Mav fork. I'd like to hear their word on it. In the end take the warranty for what it says. Warranty aside, like others have said, the ML7 seems okay with a DC, have they done something different in the TT at that point?

The Turner might look like its thicker than an Id, but at the end of the day if you use a Maverick and you twat the side of your down and top tube leaving a dent you will not be covered by warranty. The Turner 5 Spot apparently (according to MBA) had the thinnest tubing Turner have ever used, this - perhaps - partially explains the reasoning.

I'm no expert on the fine details of the frame, of the tube thickness etc... But I have read in servrela pulbilcations that 5 Spots can't use Mavericks and still be covered by warranty. Thats enough to tell me that I shouldn't get one - so I didn't.
I don't expect to be covered by warranty if I dent my frame with a dual crown, even on bikes that are "approved" for dual crowns. That would be a pilot error problem, not a manufacturing defect.

I also don't expect to be covered by warranty if the fork is responsible for making the frame fail.

It's simple.

But that bike would explode if you even thought about riding it near a drop off?

Sorry, you're going to have to translate that for me.

Your question is open to many different interpretations.

True the 5 Spot certainly isn't a flyweight, but it is only a (very well designed) trailbike.
I have consulted MBA and it doesn't mention dual crowns in the article. I do however know where I got my information from

Mountain Bike Rider
Nov 2003
"Turner says that it's the lightest tubing he has ever employed for frame production, so the 5 Spot isn't designed to be used with dual-crown forks."

What Mountain Bike last month had a letter asking what you can use a Maverick with and the Turner was one of quite a few pretigious frames that you cant use it with. Hecklers are Ok though.

I don't want to be a pedant or win an argument here, I just want to share the information I have on this side of the pond. In might argue that the 5 Spot is all about symetry - 5 at the front, 5 at the rear. Thats why I would wait for Mavericks new 5" SC fork.

If you want 6" front and end buy a Whyte 46 superbike.

Woah there cowboy, before people get the idea that the 5 Spot is somehow fragile, (I've seen statements morph that way over time)

The statement was the "lightest" tubeset he's ever used. That does not necessairly mean the thinest. Symantics? maybe but my point is we really don't know where or how the tubes are butted and where they aren't. DT is known for over-engineering his frames, and if you compare the Large with the Medium and Small you'll see how he changes the tubset based on the frame size. He puts that much thought into it.


Blippo has a point: it is worth remembering that the 5-spot frame weight is roughly the same of a Switchblade or Specialized Enduro or Rocky Mountain Slayer (just to name a few): 6 pounds frame only. These "all-mountain" bikes are not "fragile" by any means but they are not bulletproof. At the end of the story they are just around half pound (200-300 grams) heavier than more ccross-country oriented frames like Blur or Truth or Spider.

For Jaybo, to me its a notch above everything else out there. Put one through its paces and you will see. Stiff as hell and it just eats everything up like nothing else I've ever ridden, at least in the realm of XC forks. Its the next step in the evolution of the XC fork IMHO. Lotsa travel, stiff, plush and light. If Marz could get the Z150 weight down so you're not towing that anchor up a hill that would be dope.

For Davide and others worried about the abuse on the 5 frame, look at the Mav frame, sub 6 pounds with no gussets or anything like that and they really hammer those things. I feel if the ML7 can take it so can the 5. As Acadian pointed out, its an XC fork and for me its ridden accordingly. I will not be entering DH races with the 5. I will still ride the same trails as before, just with a different fork.

However, I'm very interested in one from a purely spectator perspective. I have buzzed down a short hill on one and thought is was nice but not revolutionary. The 6" of travel was cool.

It will be cold day in Hades before I'm plugging 1k down for a fork. No value judgment inteneded but that is a lot of cash for a fork.

Jaybo

Blippo has a point: it is worth remembering that the 5-spot frame weight is roughly the same of a Switchblade or Specialized Enduro or Rocky Mountain Slayer (just to name a few): 6 pounds frame only. These "all-mountain" bikes are not "fragile" by any means but they are not bulletproof. At the end of the story they are just around half pound (200-300 grams) heavier than more ccross-country oriented frames like Blur or Truth or Spider.

A half-pound of Al can go a LONG way in the hands of a intelligent frame designer.

If I recall, the 5 Spot is more or less the same weight as the Id. Actually a hair lighter, and that small amount could easily be attributed to the Id's larger shock, longer spring, and longer rockers -possibly-. This is not a comparison of durability... just pointing out they are both more or less the same weight and one is DC compatible.

I'm not trying to make the 5 Spot out to be an RFX. It sure as heck isn't. I've just seen in the past, how conversations could go from light to thin to fragile in rather short order.

I totally agree. The 'Spot was not designed for a DC fork. I have absolutely no idea how it handles or will hold up long term on one. No the warranty does not allow it. Yes most frames will dent from a crash turned DC.... There are several folks here far better qualified to discuss this.

I only advance the idea that it's unlikely the bike is underbuilt, and would suggest it's tubes are is not unusually thin. But rather he's not using straight gauge tubes this time around. I've handled some frames that had tubes that felt quite a bit thinner...that's not scientific in the least, but I'm sure I was not my imagination it either. I could flex the tube in my hand. I could ping it and hear the difference. What that means in real world terms is...I moved on to something else.
I'll stop here as I have no empirical data to offer.

The Maverick puts the Vanilla to shame.

It's MUCH stiffer.

Hey Pete:

Have you had a chance to ride a 5 Spot (or any other bike) with an '03 Z1FR?

I've been thinking about getting the Maverick, but don't want to give up any of the plushness and stiffness of the Z1. I think that the Z1 is stiffer and plusher than the Vanilla, but have no basis of comparison for the Maverick.

I'm about ready to build up some new wheels. I need to make a decision soon so that I can build using the Maverick hub.....assuming that I'm going to use that fork.

Thanks.

Hey Pete:

Have you had a chance to ride a 5 Spot (or any other bike) with an '03 Z1FR?


No I haven't but I have a buddy with one and he's tested the Maverick a bit, although I don't recall his reaction. I'll hop on his bike the next time we ride and report my comparison.

No I haven't but I have a buddy with one and he's tested the Maverick a bit, although I don't recall his reaction. I'll hop on his bike the next time we ride and report my comparison.

I'm looking forward to your report. My wallet isn't......but I am. I've already started dropping hints to the wife that I may "need" to upgrade my fork and wheels pretty soon.

But that bike would explode if you even thought about riding it near a drop off?

Anyone know if the Maverick frame uses Butted or straight gauge tubing?

-Sp

Regardless, the ML-7 is pretty light. A large frame is about 6lbs.

I've been caning mine for 10 months now with the Maverick dual crown. Thus far, I've had no problems with the frame.

Other parts are wearing out faster... because I'm riding faster and harder.

I am dying to get on a 5 Spot/Maverick for our more burly local rides, such as those near Harrisonburg, Canaan, and Snowshoe.

Some say they don't think the M-fork is better than the Fox Vanilla.

The Vanilla is a truly great fork, but the Maverick is better in every category. Way better.

But, I don't believe that technically unskilled riders will be able to apprehend the differences. I don't mean that as any sort of personal criticism towards anyone on this board.

If you are among the fastest technical riders in your circle of friends AND you know how to tune your suspension, then you will probably *really* appreciate the fork's qualities. As an XC fork, it's absurdly good.

IMHO, the archetypal Maverick customer:
- Over 30
- Riding for more than 10 years
- Likes to ride long distances over technical terrain
- Learned to ride on fully rigid or hardtail before moving to full suspension
- Rides fast, but within limits... maybe because of past broken bones

I think we are all pretty much saying the same thing: qualitatively the spot (and a large number of around 6 pounds frames) is not an RFX but it is stronger than a more cross-country oriented (around 5.5) frame. To quantify the extent of "stronger" vs "weaker" probably takes a couple of PhD dissertations :)

However, I'm very interested in one from a purely spectator perspective. I have buzzed down a short hill on one and thought is was nice but not revolutionary. The 6" of travel was cool.

Fine by me, makes no difference whether or not anyone chooses to go the same route I did. It funny how much debate something like this gets. Its just a fork. People say it costs too much, it'll kill the warranty and so forth...

Whatever, I already have it on the 5 so debating dings on the frame is obviously irrelevant to me. My warranty is about up anyway and the frame is holding up just fine. I don't trash wheels and crack frames so I'm confident I'll be all right.

BTW, I said the Mav is the next step in the evolution of the XC fork, not revolutionary. Slight difference, and I don't think there'll be anything really revolutionary in terms of MTB's anymore, and that includes SPV junk. But that's another thread.

But, for me, it's a notch above all other XC forks out there and worth the $$$. Plus its more than just 6", its the precision of the stiffest fork outside of the big DH stuff I have ever ridden. Just me though. Enjoy.

...IMHO, the archetypal Maverick customer:
- Over 30
- Riding for more than 10 years
- Likes to ride long distances over technical terrain
- Learned to ride on fully rigid or hardtail before moving to full suspension
- Rides fast, but within limits... maybe because of past broken bones
That describes me to a pretty well.

You forgot: Has a wad of cash burning a hole in his/her pocket to replace an already top shelf fork :D .

Now if someone could just give me the lowdown on how it feels compared to a Z1...and even better how it feels compared to a QR20...

I await Pete's and Chris's input with great anticipation. Damm, my front wheel and two Thompson stems aren't even a year old. Guess I better get familiar with Ebay.
Thinking...thinking...thinking...

IMHO, the archetypal Maverick customer:
- Over 30
- Riding for more than 10 years
- Likes to ride long distances over technical terrain
- Learned to ride on fully rigid or hardtail before moving to full suspension
- Rides fast, but within limits... maybe because of past broken bones

On the above points, check, check, check, check, 1/2 check... seperated shoulder, sprained knee, sprained wrist, cuts, bruises and many others I don't remember, but luckily nothing broken... yet.

BTW, I was seriously looking at a Mav frame before the 5. There was one hanging in the shop I checked out. Its a nicely built frame. I fondled it for awhile and though its nice, I wanted rear shock options in case it crapped out. Large, blue and 5.8 pounds on the scale, came so close to pulling the trigger on that one and then the 5 hit the market.

Interesting side note:
When I was shopping I considered the Id, 5-spot and RFX. I wanted dual-crown compatibility, so I called around to see what manufactureres said.

According to Ellsworth, the Id is dual-crown approved, but for a 6" fork only. Warranty is void is you go to a 7" fork. Kinda pointless since most dual-crowns are 7" now.

I asked turner about a Z150 on a 5-spot and they said "sure, no problem, it can handle ANY single-crown fork. It's not the travel, it's the extra leverage of a dual crown that is not approved."

Then my friend, who owns a 5.7" titus switchblade, called titus to see what they thought about a 6" or dual-crown. Supposedly they told him that it could take a dual-crown 6", but not a single-crown 6" fork. They said that single-crown 6" puts more leverage on the head tube than a dual crown. And they pointed out that if he wanted that much travel, he'd be much better off with a frame designed for such a fork.

Anyways, I thought that was kinda weird info, opposite between titus and turner. crazy.


Only problem is that the Turner 5 Spot isn't covered by a warranty for dual crowns. If it was I would personally have more confidence in it.

Wait for the new 5" single crown fork he is bringing out.

Then my friend, who owns a 5.7" titus switchblade, called titus to see what they thought about a 6" or dual-crown. Supposedly they told him that it could take a dual-crown 6", but not a single-crown 6" fork. They said that single-crown 6" puts more leverage on the head tube than a dual crown. And they pointed out that if he wanted that much travel, he'd be much better off with a frame designed for such a fork.

Anyways, I thought that was kinda weird info, opposite between titus and turner. crazy.

... but it seems like all of the stress on a SC fork is absorbed in the steerer and sent to the headtube. On a DC fork it seems like its distributed more through the fork and both the crowns. Different for sure. To me Titus' explanation makes sense. But what do I know.

But I think most of the worries are outside the realm of the purpose of the frame and fork. Most DC forks are on DH or big hit freeride bike and get bashed. The 5-spot and Mav fork clearly aren't cut from that cloth. They are the very definition of long travel XC.

The Mav doesn't even have a traditional steerer in case anyone didn't know. It's basically a long bolt that attaches to top cap below the crown with a seat for the headset race.

Just my $.02

But, for me, it's a notch above all other XC forks out there and worth the $$$. Plus its more than just 6", its the precision of the stiffest fork outside of the big DH stuff I have ever ridden. Just me though. Enjoy.
Damn you all the hell! I'm going to have to agree with my wife that this forum has increased my mnt. bike spending by say... oh 40-50% or so. Luckily I learned the lesson early on in my marriage never to make the mistake of saying "This is the last (insert any part, frame, or purchase related to this sport) I'll ever buy". MTBR.com should get a commision from some of these manufacturers Turner, Maverick, Chris King, all of 'em. I think Tscheezy (should've never ridden with him if I didn't want to spend money) said something about it being like "an arms race".

Don't forget to budget taking her out to dinner. I took my wife out for a nice dinner the evening my RFX arrived. (surprise!)

"It's all about safety, honey...." (my turner is called "safety bike" now)

Damn you all the hell! I'm going to have to agree with my wife that this forum has increased my mnt. bike spending by say... oh 40-50% or so. Luckily I learned the lesson early on in my marriage never to make the mistake of saying "This is the last (insert any part, frame, or purchase related to this sport) I'll ever buy". MTBR.com should get a commision from some of these manufacturers Turner, Maverick, Chris King, all of 'em. I think Tscheezy (should've never ridden with him if I didn't want to spend money) said something about it being like "an arms race".

"It's all about safety, honey...." (my turner is called "safety bike" now)

HA! That's almost verbatim to the excuse I used to purchase a $180.00 Giro Switchblade (again I should've never seen Tscheezy's) instead of the $90 Havoc to replace the helmet I cracked with this weekend's digger. "Honey think about all the dental bills this will prevent." With the 5 Spot it was to alleviate back pain. I know, I know, I have no shame :D . In the end she gives me one of these, :rolleyes:, and realizes that I take care of the family first and is very supportive of my extra curricular activities. The fact that I just bought her a treadmill (it was that or a Burner, to each their own) and a Mini iPod helps too.

...we apologize for the temporary hi-jacking of this thread, now back to your regularly scheduled discussion...

SC forks have more flex front to back than DC forks. That energy is dissipated into flex instead of being placed on the head tube on SC forks.

-Sp

... but it seems like all of the stress on a SC fork is absorbed in the steerer and sent to the headtube. On a DC fork it seems like its distributed more through the fork and both the crowns. Different for sure. To me Titus' explanation makes sense. But what do I know.

Just my $.02

HA! That's almost verbatim to the excuse I used to purchase a $180.00 Giro Switchblade (again I should've never seen Tscheezy's) instead of the $90 Havoc to replace the helmet I cracked with this weekend's digger. "Honey think about all the dental bills this will prevent." With the 5 Spot it was to alleviate back pain. I know, I know, I have no shame :D . In the end she gives me one of these, :rolleyes:, and realizes that I take care of the family first and is very supportive of my extra curricular activities. The fact that I just bought her a treadmill (it was that or a Burner, to each their own) and a Mini iPod helps too.

...we apologize for the temporary hi-jacking of this thread, now back to your regularly scheduled discussion...
Heh, reminds me of just before I got married, I had nailed a tree or two in consecutive rides and my bride to be insisted I wear a full face helmet for all my rides, so I wouldn't be in bandages at the wedding...uh okay sweetie!

I gotta post that "Bikers Prenuptual" gag I wrote up way back in the day...

Now my kid helps me feed my habit by always pointing out all the pedal cuts on my legs...that ratonalized my recent armor purchase.

Arms race indeed. I can't believe I'm seriously considering this fork...Sombody stop me...is anyone running a 8" rotor and '04 Shimano calipers on this?

Heh, reminds me of just before I got married, I had nailed a tree or two in consecutive rides and my bride to be insisted I wear a full face helmet for all my rides, so I wouldn't be in bandages at the wedding...uh okay sweetie!

I'm surprised that my wife even agreed to go out with me when we first met. I was still recovering from a nasty case of trail rash which covered most of the left half of my neck and face and I hadn't shaved for a good two weeks as a result. Two weeks later we're still dating and I dislocate my right shoulder and end up in a sling. Atleast the scabs where starting to molt off of my face in blotchy patches. Needless to say I looked tweaked :eek:. I guess she figured I didn't have anywhere to go but up hill from there. Boy was she wrong :D !

Back to the arms race... 'er, I mean fork, all the discussion and positive reviews definately have me tempted. I'm very anxious to get Tscheezy's and AK_Chris' opinion as they both get some miles with this fork. I'd also like to get atleast a full season out of my fairly new Z1 SL, and sell a few misc. items on the classifieds or eBay to take the sting out of the price tag. I agree with AK_Chris on the issues some are having with this fork...
It funny how much debate something like this gets. Its just a fork. People say it costs too much, it'll kill the warranty and so forth...

But that bike would explode if you even thought about riding it near a drop off?

Anyone know if the Maverick frame uses Butted or straight gauge tubing?

-Sp


The ML7 uses custom butted 6069 tubing.

Woah there cowboy, before people get the idea that the 5 Spot is somehow fragile, (I've seen statements morph that way over time)

The statement was the "lightest" tubeset he's ever used. That does not necessairly mean the thinest. Symantics? maybe but my point is we really don't know where or how the tubes are butted and where they aren't. DT is known for over-engineering his frames, and if you compare the Large with the Medium and Small you'll see how he changes the tubset based on the frame size. He puts that much thought into it.

That said, I agree with your points about likely voiding the warranty. Makes sense. Besides possible HT ovalization, there is the ever present TT ding factor. Still I've heard Turner is thinking it over w/resp to the Mav fork. I'd like to hear their word on it. In the end take the warranty for what it says. Warranty aside, like others have said, the ML7 seems okay with a DC, have they done something different in the TT at that point?


The folks at Turner bicycles are riding and testing a Maverick fork. Should they decide to alter their warranty, and allow the use of the Maverick Fork on the 5-spot, I will be the first to post that news.

Regards,

Steven

Can you give us some preliminary information on the Single Crown fork that you will be releasing? Some specs and the target date for official release?

Can you give us some preliminary information on the Single Crown fork that you will be releasing? Some specs and the target date for official release?

The fork is a 2005 model and is targeted to begin shipping in the Spring of next year. With regards to the specs, I'd prefer not to go into any more detail then I have already on this forum, as things are always subject to change. The prototypes are:

Single Crown, Inverted
Air Sprung, oil damped, with Rebound damping control
3.3 lbs.
120mm travel with lockdown to 80mm
24mm axle

That is about all I can say at this time.

Steven

when you change to the 4" setting, approximately how much stiffer does the fork get? Also, since the Fox Talas was last year's "oo-lah lah" fork because it was one of the first air forks to be able to get more than 4" of travel, I am curious how other forks are going about getting more than 4" of travel. I remember reading that the spring rate ramped up too much if the fork had the same internal structure as say a 4" fork but with 5" of travel.
Is there new technology being used to get the longer travel air forks? This question is not targeted at any specific fork manufacturer, just curious how the air spring works for long travel.

1 more question. might as well get it straight from the horses mouth. How does the suspension of the current duc feel compared to:

-Fox vanilla
-Fox Talas
-Z1 FR
-Manitou sherman (non spv)
-Manitou sherman (spv)

thanks,

-Sp

The fork is a 2005 model and is targeted to begin shipping in the Spring of next year. With regards to the specs, I'd prefer not to go into any more detail then I have already on this forum, as things are always subject to change. The prototypes are:

Single Crown, Inverted
Air Sprung, oil damped, with Rebound damping control
3.3 lbs.
120mm travel with lockdown to 80mm
24mm axle

That is about all I can say at this time.

Steven

One other question to those with experience, I suffer from acute patellaimpactaphobia...I really hate slamming my knee, and often do anyway on the stem. This setup looks like the stem would eliminate that problem, I've heard people do hit their knees on the wider fork leg tops on DCs.

Could someone tell me if this would be the case with here as well? Unfortunately I don't think I'll get the opportunity to try this fork before I buy it.

One other question to those with experience, I suffer from acute patellaimpactaphobia...I really hate slamming my knee, and often do anyway on the stem. This setup looks like the stem would eliminate that problem, I've heard people do hit their knees on the wider fork leg tops on DCs.

Could someone tell me if this would be the case with here as well? Unfortunately I don't think I'll get the opportunity to try this fork before I buy it.

Not sure where you hit your Patella.

If it is at the top of the headset the DC will make no difference (just look at the photos, any recessed-bolt-style stem, e.g. Thomsom or Kore, will obtain the same distance from your saddle).

If you hit the stem while turning you might be worse off: now you have the top crown to contend with ... :(

and track better. I had one of those POS Rock Shox XL triple clamps when they first came out. As far as structural stiffness, it was much better than the Marz z2 that it replaced. Damping quality is another matter. My 30mm stanchioned Manitou Xvert triple clamp is stiffer than my Fox Talas in fore/aft movment. IMO, triples will always be stiffer than single crowns.

-Sp

I think you are missing my point, which is simply that many people don't like double crowns because they are "bulky", "limit" the turning angle, and are not fun for the frame to deal with in case of a crash ... of course many people like them, in downhill-freeride situations, because of the reasons you list, and because it used to be hard to build a stiff enough single crown above 4", than 5", now 6".

Yup.

I don't think it can reall be said that a dual-crown is always stiffer than a single-crown. My new Z150 with QR20 is noticeably stiffer than my previous 2003 Z1 with normal QR. I'd agree that on paper, a dual crown makes for a stiffer fork. But there are other factors to front-end stiffnes. My understanding is that marzocchi went to the steel stanchions on the Z150 to stiffen it up- whereas the T's still have alloy stanchions. I certainly haven't experienced any flex, although I have bottomed it out a few times.

I think you are missing my point, which is simply that many people don't like double crowns because they are "bulky", "limit" the turning angle, and are not fun for the frame to deal with in case of a crash ... of course many people like them, in downhill-freeride situations, because of the reasons you list, and because it used to be hard to build a stiff enough single crown above 4", than 5", now 6".

Not sure where you hit your Patella.

If it is at the top of the headset the DC will make no difference (just look at the photos, any recessed-bolt-style stem, e.g. Thomsom or Kore, will obtain the same distance from your saddle).

If you hit the stem while turning you might be worse off: now you have the top crown to contend with ... :(
Neither...

When it happens, I hit my knee squarely on the back of the stem. Not the headset, not the neck of the stem while turning. It only happens on a steep climb when I try to get that critical power stroke over something technical and sketchy and the rear tire slips. Sometimes, somehow, the unexpeded free stroke brings my knee right into stem/steerer tube clamp. In my mind I can still feel the pain like it just happened.

To say that a Z1-150 lacks rigidity would be indeed kind of a joke! I actually don't see ANY problem with the Z1 5" or any FOX either

Now that I think about, my only experience with a double crown fork was with a RS, oh gosh what was its name, came out in 1996 amid a fanfare about weight saving and rigidity, it was trumpeted, guess what, the "cross country double crown"!

It was so horrible, both in its action and in its lack of stifness. My Z1 1996 was leaps and bounds above it!!!!

So you are right, one should always qualify ...

PS by the way is the Turner behind Maverick the same person that was behind Rock Shock in the early nineties? Some of the marketing seems similar.

Neither...

When it happens, I hit my knee squarely on the back of the stem. Not the headset, not the neck of the stem while turning. It only happens on a steep climb when I try to get that critical power stroke over something technical and sketchy and the rear tire slips. Sometimes, somehow, the unexpeded free stroke brings my knee right into stem/steerer tube clamp. In my mind I can still feel the pain like it just happened.


... maybe the stem on the mav will gain you about 1 or 2cm (you will still hit the area just under where the stem/bolt would be on a "normal" fork) ... maybe knee-guards? ;)

To say that a Z1-150 lacks rigidity would be indeed kind of a joke! I actually don't see ANY problem with the Z1 5" or any FOX either

While you "might not see a problem " based upon your idle and typically misinformed speculation, the fact remains that the Maverick is MUCH stiffer than the Vanilla RLC.

p.s. Your speculation about DC forks and limitaions of "turning angles" are equally misinformed. In the real world, on tight technical trails, I haven't had a problem with any of my DC forks, from a Mr. T to a Super T to an 888 to the Maverick. If you have the skills, it's not an issue...

It is true, anger and obsession are powerful emotions and it is indeed interesting that you find an object for such emotions in your computer. Some suggestions: (i) take apart your computer, the font of your obsession might be there, (ii) take your computer to Calistoga (on your way to your mud-bath) and put the computer on top of "old faithful", (iii) alternatively you might want to take a mud-bath with your computer, or (iv) you can persevere with your little obsession. We all know what your choice will be, don't we? ;) you are fun!

PS It is also probably very true that when one spends most of his time in the mud or taking mud photographs a double crown helps enormously. I am sure that I am not even remotely aware of all the sublime varieties of mud you have encountered, but I can see how a double crown would work so much better in your muddy situations.

PS by the way is the Turner behind Maverick the same person that was behind Rock Shock in the early nineties? Some of the marketing seems similar.

Yep. Paul Turner isn't it? So many Turners now in cycling...

Neither...

When it happens, I hit my knee squarely on the back of the stem. Not the headset, not the neck of the stem while turning. It only happens on a steep climb when I try to get that critical power stroke over something technical and sketchy and the rear tire slips. Sometimes, somehow, the unexpeded free stroke brings my knee right into stem/steerer tube clamp. In my mind I can still feel the pain like it just happened.

Hmmm, the old knee-to-the-stem syndrome. Its gonna happen from time-to-time, sort of like slipping a pedal and smashing your shin. Its just part of riding a mountain bike. By your description of when it happens, I would say the chances are higher because you are in the midst of a power stroke and rocking your bike to the side, which then brings your knee in line with your stem. Roach makes a great guard for the stem, which several of my friends use and adds just enough padding to take the edge off. I think it is still available.

With regards to our fork, It would be pretty difficult to mash your knee into the crown below the stem, as it sits directly on top of your headset. You would have a better chance of smashing your knee into the top tube. If you happen to be at Sea otter, stop by and I'll let you check out our demo bike.

Later,

Steven

Hmmm, the old knee-to-the-stem syndrome. Its gonna happen from time-to-time, sort of like slipping a pedal and smashing your shin. Its just part of riding a mountain bike. By your description of when it happens, I would say the chances are higher because you are in the midst of a power stroke and rocking your bike to the side, which then brings your knee in line with your stem. Roach makes a great guard for the stem, which several of my friends use and adds just enough padding to take the edge off. I think it is still available.

With regards to our fork, It would be pretty difficult to mash your knee into the crown below the stem, as it sits directly on top of your headset. You would have a better chance of smashing your knee into the top tube. If you happen to be at Sea otter, stop by and I'll let you check out our demo bike.

Later,

Steven

Your frames are now half reasonable. Do you think you will lower your forks down to $600 or something, so it is more doable for us?

Thanks,

Jaybo

Hmmm, the old knee-to-the-stem syndrome. Its gonna happen from time-to-time, sort of like slipping a pedal and smashing your shin. Its just part of riding a mountain bike. By your description of when it happens, I would say the chances are higher because you are in the midst of a power stroke and rocking your bike to the side, which then brings your knee in line with your stem. Roach makes a great guard for the stem, which several of my friends use and adds just enough padding to take the edge off. I think it is still available.

With regards to our fork, It would be pretty difficult to mash your knee into the crown below the stem, as it sits directly on top of your headset. You would have a better chance of smashing your knee into the top tube. If you happen to be at Sea otter, stop by and I'll let you check out our demo bike.

Later,

StevenThanks.

I think I have the knee/stem smash issue under control. Knee pads seem to do the trick. For now my old roller blade pads are very effective. Later today I'm picking up some Rally legs pads I ordered at my LBS so that's a done deal as far as the stem is concerned.

My question is, not having any experience with DC forks, would the top part of the fork legs, near where they meet the crown, be a place I would/could hit my knee, say during a tight turn? a Slipped stroke (while still clipped in) yatta, yatta? Is it a rare/occasional target or could it be a regular impact issue?

I'm wondering if the combination of this particular DC fork, and the 5 Spot would be more, less, or a non issue as far as knee banging is concerned.

I don't think I'll make the Sea Otter this year. The commute from NY is a killer. :p

Your frames are now half reasonable. Do you think you will lower your forks down to $600 or something, so it is more doable for us?

Thanks,

Jaybo

Jaybo, Because of the costs associated with welding/manufacturing the upper structure on our Dual Crown Fork, I do not forsee the price dropping. One of the reasons we began development of a Single Crown fork (you may have seen pics of it on this forum) was to bring the ride quality of our dual crown to market at a lower pricepoint. By eliminating the welded upper structure used on our dual crown, we anticipate the SC frok hitting the market around $600.

Steven

38" inseam! chop a several inches off and you'll be ok :-)

-Sp


Thanks.

I think I have the knee/stem smash issue under control. Knee pads seem to do the trick. For now my old roller blade pads are very effective. Later today I'm picking up some Rally legs pads I ordered at my LBS so that's a done deal as far as the stem is concerned.

My question is, not having any experience with DC forks, would the top part of the fork legs, near where they meet the crown, be a place I would/could hit my knee, say during a tight turn? a Slipped stroke (while still clipped in) yatta, yatta? Is it a rare/occasional target or could it be a regular impact issue?

I'm wondering if the combination of this particular DC fork, and the 5 Spot would be more, less, or a non issue as far as knee banging is concerned.

I don't think I'll make the Sea Otter this year. The commute from NY is a killer. :p

Thanks.

I think I have the knee/stem smash issue under control. Knee pads seem to do the trick. For now my old roller blade pads are very effective. Later today I'm picking up some Rally legs pads I ordered at my LBS so that's a done deal as far as the stem is concerned.

My question is, not having any experience with DC forks, would the top part of the fork legs, near where they meet the crown, be a place I would/could hit my knee, say during a tight turn? a Slipped stroke (while still clipped in) yatta, yatta? Is it a rare/occasional target or could it be a regular impact issue?

I'm wondering if the combination of this particular DC fork, and the 5 Spot would be more, less, or a non issue as far as knee banging is concerned.

I don't think I'll make the Sea Otter this year. The commute from NY is a killer. :p


The short answer is yes, you could hit your knee on the uppers. However, I would not let that steer you away from considering our fork as a match to your 5-spot.

AWESOME assumptions!


It is true, anger and obsession are powerful emotions and it is indeed interesting that you find an object for such emotions in your computer.

Why do you assume that I am angry just because I have been correcting your erroneous claims?


PS It is also probably very true that when one spends most of his time in the mud or taking mud photographs a double crown helps enormously. .
Why do you assume that I spend most of my time taking mud photographs?

I am sure that I am not even remotely aware of all the sublime varieties of mud you have encountered, but I can see how a double crown would work so much better in your muddy situations.
Fact:

You apparently know practically nothing about how DC forks perform, let alone how the Maverick performs.

You do a disservice to this board and to the people that are looking for good and reliable information by spouting your ill-conceived fantasies.

Perhaps you should stick to facts, rather than posting whatever odd notion pops into your melon. You would look like less of an idiot, maybe.

Cheers and have a great day!

My question is, not having any experience with DC forks, would the top part of the fork legs, near where they meet the crown, be a place I would/could hit my knee, say during a tight turn? a Slipped stroke (while still clipped in) yatta, yatta? Is it a rare/occasional target or could it be a regular impact issue?


Sure it could happen but the Maverick is much more knee friendly due to it being smooth without sharp edges.

Somewhere, I have a picture of my kneecap with a core sample that was taken from it when I smacked it into the top of my Super T (the compression knob is like a little Ginsu)

Sure it could happen but the Maverick is much more knee friendly due to it being smooth without sharp edges.

Somewhere, I have a picture of my kneecap with a core sample that was taken from it when I smacked it into the top of my Super T (the compression knob is like a little Ginsu)


I had a Stratos DC and the top caps and crowns were nicely machined and damn sharp. My knees looked like I got in a fight with a cactus after each ride. I taped a couple tubes to the top of each leg and it didn't help much. The fork wasn't all that great anyway so I got rid of it.

The Mav doesn't have nearly as much crap protruding as any other DC fork. Its a lot more knee friendly.

Sure it could happen but the Maverick is much more knee friendly due to it being smooth without sharp edges.

Somewhere, I have a picture of my kneecap with a core sample that was taken from it when I smacked it into the top of my Super T (the compression knob is like a little Ginsu)
Thanks Pete & Steve.

Pete, I'll pass on the gory shot...I'm still getting over that shot of when your buddy Ginsu-ed his hamstring on his seatpost clamp.

But if you feel like sharing a pic, I'd be interested in seeing that full shot of your Spot with the Maverick fork on it. I can't seem to find it.

A clumsy knee ping here and there wouldn't change my mind. But If I hit it every time I tried to make a sharp standing turn on a climb or something like that... But I have no experience on a DC so I don't know how likely this is, hence my inquiry.

There's a Maverick Dealer in Briarcliff, I think it's time for a visit....

38" inseam! chop a several inches off and you'll be ok :-)

-Sp
The words "Chop", "Inches" and "Inseam" should never be used in the same sentence.
There is no reduction in this area that I, or my wife, would appreciate.:D

The words "Chop", "Inches" and "Inseam" should never be used in the same sentence.
There is no reduction in this area that I, or my wife, would appreciate.:D


I friend of mine went over the bar into some barb wire...well, I can't say anymore. It wasn't pretty. I will jus say the barb wire had some ornaments. Not really. A friend of mine in high school did get a testicle removed because it lost blood flow. Ouch!

Jaybo

In my search for my next bike, I spent a lot of time ping-ponging back and forth between the Turner 5-spot (with a fox pro-pedal air) and the ML-7, both with the Maverick DC fork. In the course of all this, I've spoken to several of the Maverick fork riders across the country (since I will be the first one in the seventh largest city in the US, imagine that!) and asked questions about rigidity, knee-interface and tuning for heavier riders like myself.

I've also spoken to dealers, although that requires some filtering of the "best thing since sliced bread" syndrome many have for whichever high-end fork/component they discuss.

The 5-spot turns out to be more bike than I "need", and I prefer the pedaling behavior of the Klein Palominos I've test ridden, so I went with the ML-7, and the CD fork. The Mav fork appears to be duro, stiff and precise and as light-feeling as described.

From an SS to a boing-boing...

Thanks Pete & Steve.

Pete, I'll pass on the gory shot...I'm still getting over that shot of when your buddy Ginsu-ed his hamstring on his seatpost clamp.

But if you feel like sharing a pic, I'd be interested in seeing that full shot of your Spot with the Maverick fork on it. I can't seem to find it.

A clumsy knee ping here and there wouldn't change my mind. But If I hit it every time I tried to make a sharp standing turn on a climb or something like that... But I have no experience on a DC so I don't know how likely this is, hence my inquiry.

There's a Maverick Dealer in Briarcliff, I think it's time for a visit....

CK has just announced (through Maverick) that they will be producing a 24mm hub for the Maverick fork. That was the one thing that I didn't like about the Maverick...couldn't use a King (I know, I know that's nit-picking). Well that and it costs so much. I'll interested in seeing the SC version.

CK has just announced (through Maverick) that they will be producing a 24mm hub for the Maverick fork. That was the one thing that I didn't like about the Maverick...couldn't use a King (I know, I know that's nit-picking). Well that and it costs so much. I'll interested in seeing the SC version.Shoot, you think the fork is expensive? Just wait 'till you see the price of a custom, fits-one-kind-of-fork-only Chris King hub.

That said, if I do get a Maverick fork, I'll be shooting for the CK hub too...in for a penny donchaknow. :D

Come to think of it, I sort of vaguely remember M.A. was corting Thompson components to come up with a stem as well... I don't know if anything became of that...or even if my memory of this is correct. But it would be slick to have a CK hub and a Thompson stem on a Maverick fork. :cool:

Shoot, you think the fork is expensive? Just wait 'till you see the price of a custom, fits-one-kind-of-fork-only Chris King hub.

That said, if I do get a Maverick fork, I'll be shooting for the CK hub too...in for a penny donchaknow. :D

Come to think of it, I sort of vaguely remember M.A. was corting Thompson components to come up with a stem as well... I don't know if anything became of that...or even if my memory of this is correct. But it would be slick to have a CK hub and a Thompson stem on a Maverick fork. :cool:

A King front hub. Laugh. When is the last time a front hub either improved or hurt your riding experience? Never! However, that opinion stated, I am smitten with the same disease that causes me to spend way more on bike frames then any sane human would. I have to laugh at both the notion of a King hub or Thomson stem. No real value except bike jewelry. I want both!

Jaybo

I'm still thinking about getting one and am gathering opinions. I think there is someone on this board with this set-up (ChrisK?), but I believe he's still snowed in.

There is a photo on Pete Fagerlin's homepage of a 5er with the DUC fork - I wondered if that rider is around here?

Anyway, I currently use a Talas which is very good, but tends to dive a little on bigger hits however I set it up. I might switch to a Vanilla (which I already have on another bike) or take a hit on the Maverick.

I'm slightly concerned over the longer crown - dropout length (about 19mm?) as I don't want to slacken the head angle beyond 69º.

I also believe that Turner are currently testing this set-up before changing (or not) their advice on whether to use one.

Thoughts?

The word I have heard so far is the Maverick is a good fork, but is still a new fork to the market. I would wonder if it has the slow speed damping and spring rate to keep it from diving too much myself. I have only played with one, not really ridden one. I would also consider the Manitou Minute 1:00 fork. I have ridden that fork, and with some tuning, it can ride better than the Fox Vanilla forx. I will be getting one soon after enough time on one recently sold me.

.... I have to laugh at both the notion of a King hub or Thomson stem. No real value except bike jewelry. I want both........

.............hey, wasn't that the same logic you used on the 5 Spot (prior to your purchase)?:p ;) :D

The word I have heard so far is the Maverick is a good fork, but is still a new fork to the market. I would wonder if it has the slow speed damping and spring rate to keep it from diving too much myself. I have only played with one, not really ridden one. I would also consider the Manitou Minute 1:00 fork. I have ridden that fork, and with some tuning, it can ride better than the Fox Vanilla forx. I will be getting one soon after enough time on one recently sold me.
Dang, seriously!?? I was so close to getting one and decided against it b/c it had 30mm stanchions instead of the 32 on the Vanilla. I was looking for a stiffer fork and coming off a Black, I figured the Minute wasn't going to be as stiff as the Vanilla. Is that really the case? Does the Minute track as well as the Vanilla? Well, I guess the point is moot now since I already have the Vanilla but it would still be good to know.

Dang, seriously!?? I was so close to getting one and decided against it b/c it had 30mm stanchions instead of the 32 on the Vanilla. I was looking for a stiffer fork and coming off a Black, I figured the Minute wasn't going to be as stiff as the Vanilla. Is that really the case? Does the Minute track as well as the Vanilla? Well, I guess the point is moot now since I already have the Vanilla but it would still be good to know.

The Minute feels stiffer at the crown area than the Vanilla, I think because of the extra long skirt of the crown draping over the top of the stancions. The lowers seem stiffer at the arch area. Otherwise the Vanilla should be stiffer in the stancions between the crown and lowers, but all in all I felt the Minute was about the same stiffness or slightly better on the trail. Again this is what I felt, weather it is in a labratory test I dunno. Thing is on the SPV, is with the 3 way on the rear of my 5 Spot, the front needs the platform balance somewhat, the Fox even with a different shim arrangement on the compression piston, just does not have it. The Fox needs a different piston all together. If I were to stay on the Romic with a softer valving, The Fox does just fine most situations until your in rollers and woops all the time then the lack of slow speed damping control is real noticeable.

Pete, I'll pass on the gory shot...
Too late.

http://home.pacbell.net/psf0/marzocchi_effect.jpg

Geebus! Why didn't you give a warning!?! Blech, my lunch almost came back up :(

[QUOTE=Bikezilla]Thanks Pete & Steve.

Pete, I'll pass on the gory shot...I'm still getting over that shot of when your buddy Ginsu-ed his hamstring on his seatpost clamp.

But if you feel like sharing a pic, I'd be interested in seeing that full shot of your Spot with the Maverick fork on it. I can't seem to find it.

QUOTE]


Blasphemy! You'll never see Pete post a picture of his complete bike. But, if he ever does, I'm sure it will be leaning on the couch.

But if you feel like sharing a pic, I'd be interested in seeing that full shot of your Spot with the Maverick fork on it. I can't seem to find it.


http://www.petefagerlin.com/images/bd/DSCN0036.jpg

Tnx for the core sample...yech.

As for the bike shot, I was thinking of the one where it was propped up somehow. Mostly front oriented, could see the Ti spring and such. I can't seem to find that thread.

Tnx for the core sample...yech.

As for the bike shot, I was thinking of the one where it was propped up somehow. Mostly front oriented, could see the Ti spring and such. I can't seem to find that thread.
http://www.petefagerlin.com/images/airpower.jpg

FM,

Which rear tire is that? I'm currently running a Geax Sturdy with a Weirwolf up front and love it.

not my bike.......

But, I'm running a sturdy UST 2.25 in back, and a python UST 2.3 in front. Great combo, at least for the local conditions!

FM,

Which rear tire is that? I'm currently running a Geax Sturdy with a Weirwolf up front and love it.

Yeah, that's the ticket! Tnx.

Oooh, you do like tight compositions don't you? The flora makes a nice backdrop. How do you find time to ride if you're always looking for shots like these?:D

The word I have heard so far is the Maverick is a good fork, but is still a new fork to the market. I would wonder if it has the slow speed damping and spring rate to keep it from diving too much myself. I have only played with one, not really ridden one. I would also consider the Manitou Minute 1:00 fork. I have ridden that fork, and with some tuning, it can ride better than the Fox Vanilla forx. I will be getting one soon after enough time on one recently sold me.

Better riding then the Vanilla? Huh! I thought I was fickle.

Jaybo

[QUOTE=EB The Mav fork appears to be duro, stiff and precise and as light-feeling as described.

From an SS to a boing-boing...[/QUOTE]


Yes, it is!

Palisworth

Aaaaiiiieeee!!!!! What’s this?!? What sacrilege and demonic practices have plagued the Turner forum? Not only is it an Ellsworth, it’s a SINGLE PIVOT Ellsworth! Jed get the women and children to safety. Earl you grab the pitchfork and torches we’ve got some work to do.



Sorry Palisworth I just couldn't resist. Nice fork though. ;)

Davide you obviously cannot stand the notion of dinging your bike, so dont ride it off road. rocks, roots and crashes have always been the biggest danger to my bikes frame. dont like it dont buy it. but if others want to let them. we are all adults and if we mess up are bikes thats our $1895. so be it. thats it those with the mavericks enjoy. i do not meet the above criteria for owning a maverick fork so i will stick to the vanilla for now.

...pesky leg hairs they could have deflected that menacing damper screw.

How did you get your knee to whack that - OTB action?

Sean

Aaaaiiiieeee!!!!! What’s this?!? What sacrilege and demonic practices have plagued the Turner forum? Not only is it an Ellsworth, it’s a SINGLE PIVOT Ellsworth! Jed get the women and children to safety. Earl you grab the pitchfork and torches we’ve got some work to do.



Sorry Palisworth I just couldn't resist. Nice fork though. ;)


I'm sorry Dog..... ;) here you are!

Palisworth

A fork which is stiffer (as in a dual crown) does not transmit more stress to the frame. It simply flexes less while transmitting the same amount of stress to the frame. A single crown does not really dissipate a lot of stress through flex inside the crown or steerer tube.

While in St. George, coming off Church Rocks with Crash and Barny, I stupidly tried to ride over a motorcycle barrier which was a steel bar about 2 feet off the ground. I got the front tire over ok but then just slammed the down tube right into the bar with my full body weight. I sorta thought I would fold the bike in half with that little maneuver, but try as I may, I could not make out even the slightest ding in the down tube afterwards. A few days later I did manage to dent the down tube when I crashed while trying to hop over a gap between a boulder and a slickrock ledge. I didn't set up right and didn't get the front wheel it quite all the way across the void, and ended up going down hard into the hole front-wheel-first, again putting my full body weight into the bike. The result was a little, tiny, dimple-sized ding. If I can't seem to dent my bike badly with steel bars or sandstone ledges, I'm far from worried about a rubber-bumpered Mav fork. The Spot may have some thin tubing relative to other Turners, but it is a relative measure. That is still some wicked tuff stuff.

tscheezy

Better riding then the Vanilla? Huh! I thought I was fickle.

Jaybo

Remember I have only been on one which is on a Giant VT. And I had a few hours on it. The real test will be 3-4 rides worth in rough stuff. I need a few weeks to tell you the difference I feel with it on my 5 Spot which I am used to, vs. the Giant which I am not used to.

help me understand.

-Sp

A fork which is stiffer (as in a dual crown) does not transmit more stress to the frame. It simply flexes less while transmitting the same amount of stress to the frame. A single crown does not really dissipate a lot of stress through flex inside the crown or steerer tube.

tscheezy

While in St. George, coming off Church Rocks with Crash and Barny, I stupidly tried to ride over a motorcycle barrier which was a steel bar about 2 feet off the ground.

:rolleyes: