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  1. #1
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    Scott Genius a real AM bike?

    I love the look of the bike at the store.
    I do 50/50 ascent descent and the climbs are often very challenging.
    Anyone feel the Scott Genius could be a good fit?

    Does it's rear suspension work proper for some medium drops (4 feet) and chattery baby-head trails.
    There's a chance I may want to take a 6 foot drop once or twice a year too when I travel to deeper back country locations.

    Online I have also been eyeing the Specialized Enduro and Canfield The One.

  2. #2
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    Not commenting on whether that bike is "All Mountain" or not...I'm not a fan of bikes that require a bunch of fiddling with levers to switch modes while climbing/descending. I'd rather have something with a more efficient suspension design that doesn't require a bunch of frequent adjustments and changes. Bikes have enough switches and levers on them as it is. Also, I'd just end up forgetting to change it before I started a descent and get irritated.
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    The scotts handle bar lever for changing ride modes seems like what I would prefer over the way some mfgs have the lever on the rear shock. That way I can flip it when I change gears preparing for the climb or descent etc.
    I have not ridden a FS bike that didn't have to be mode changed like that...
    so please tell me what bikes/suspension types have the all around suspension that needs no tuneing on the trail...

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    The scotts handle bar lever for changing ride modes seems like what I would prefer over the way some mfgs have the lever on the rear shock. That way I can flip it when I change gears preparing for the climb or descent etc.
    I have not ridden a FS bike that didn't have to be mode changed like that...
    so please tell me what bikes/suspension types have the all around suspension that needs no tuneing on the trail...
    VPP (Santa Cruz, Intense), DW-Link (Pivot, Turner, Ibis), Maestro (Giant) all climb very well without needing any flip of propedal lever on rear shock. I think the DW-link is the best of them out of all the ones I tried.
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    Re: Scott Genius a real AM bike?

    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    The scotts handle bar lever for changing ride modes seems like what I would prefer over the way some mfgs have the lever on the rear shock. That way I can flip it when I change gears preparing for the climb or descent etc.
    I have not ridden a FS bike that didn't have to be mode changed like that...
    so please tell me what bikes/suspension types have the all around suspension that needs no tuneing on the trail...
    GT id

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    What do you mean the VPP... its one of the bikes I looked at thst does have a lever inconveniantly locsted on the rear shock to change into one of three ride modes....? Santa Cruz.


    Quote Originally Posted by BaeckerX1 View Post
    VPP (Santa Cruz, Intense), DW-Link (Pivot, Turner, Ibis), Maestro (Giant) all climb very well without needing any flip of propedal lever on rear shock. I think the DW-link is the best of them out of all the ones I tried.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    What do you mean the VPP... its one of the bikes I looked at thst does have a lever inconveniantly locsted on the rear shock to change into one of three ride modes....? Santa Cruz.
    I mean it has a proposal lever but you never need to use it...unless you pedal up a lot of smooth roads. Demo one and read reviews of those bikes.

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    I just did go demo a 2013 santa cruz bronson and it was awesome however it has a rear located 3 mode switch which is REQUIRED to be moved for the uphill, flat, and downhill modes.
    Maybe you should go chech one out...?
    The same store had a super nice looking Scott on the same stand as the Bronson and it has the same type of 3 modes however it has a handlebar lever which is much better.
    But lets not get off the topic totally yet.
    What suspension systems have more versatility and do not need a mode switch to fully enjoy.


    Quote Originally Posted by BaeckerX1 View Post
    I mean it has a proposal lever but you never need to use it...unless you pedal up a lot of smooth roads. Demo one and read reviews of those bikes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    I just did go demo a 2013 santa cruz bronson and it was awesome however it has a rear located 3 mode switch which is REQUIRED to be moved for the uphill, flat, and downhill modes.
    Maybe you should go chech one out...?
    The same store had a super nice looking Scott on the same stand as the Bronson and it has the same type of 3 modes however it has a handlebar lever which is much better.
    But lets not get off the topic totally yet.
    What suspension systems have more versatility and do not need a mode switch to fully enjoy.
    Demo a Mach 5.7 carbon. It doesn't bob while pedaling, only reacts to the terrain. Why did you think the Bronson required the propedal lever?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BaeckerX1 View Post
    Demo a Mach 5.7 carbon. It doesn't bob while pedaling, only reacts to the terrain. Pivot's DW-link is as efficient as they get. Why did you think the Bronson required the propedal lever?

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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  11. #11
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    I don't quite understand your question about "why I think" the new bronson comes with a 3 mode shock.
    The mfg made it that way, not me.

    My question is why did they go to the trouble to put a handlebar lever for the seat post but not the rear shock.
    Scott put both levers up front so it seemed like a better option of the two.

    The nearest dealer for the other bike you mentioned is a few hours drive and they only give pavement demos.
    Not sure its worth the hassle on a whim.
    Can you help me understand your recomendations better?

  12. #12
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    Pinkbikes review of the mach 5.7 says:

    The changes in shock tune and suspension geometry, added to the fact that the Mach 5.7 comes with an ultra responsive Kashima-coated shock, cause the suspension to move a little more when pedaling than some climbers like. Pivot recommends that Mach 5.7 owners use (or at least try) the RP23 shock’s Propedal function when laying down serious power. We were interested to experience this because previous Pivots, like the Mach 4 and Mach 5, had sufficient anti-squat built into the suspension to never need the Propedal anti-bob function to enhance pedaling efficiency.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    I don't quite understand your question about "why I think" the new bronson comes with a 3 mode shock.
    The mfg made it that way, not me.

    My question is why did they go to the trouble to put a handlebar lever for the seat post but not the rear shock.
    Scott put both levers up front so it seemed like a better option of the two.

    The nearest dealer for the other bike you mentioned is a few hours drive and they only give pavement demos.
    Not sure its worth the hassle on a whim.
    Can you help me understand your recomendations better?
    Just because the bike came with a propedal equipped shock DOES NOT mean the bike needs it to pedal good/efficiently.

    I installed a xfusion o2 PVA (same idea as propedal)on my gt and my bike does not need to be locked or even in the middle setting to be able to climb out of the saddle and it does not bob.

  14. #14
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    Over the years, scott has generally built very XC-specific bikes, with aggressive lockout type devices and lightweight. Many other design features have often been overlooked for these two aspects. Looking over some of their designs on Monday actually in a store, I'd say a lot of this is behind them in the general design of the bike and you only find traces, like the lockout. These days you can do a lot better than a bike that needs a lockout. Unless you absolutely have to have a certain feature that is not found on any other bike, get something that pedals well without a lockout and without loads of compression damping. Nothing is worse than getting pounded trying to get your bike uphill because the suspension has to be run on lockout or with lots of compression damping.

    And yes, lots of DW bikes, Ibis, Pivot, Turner, etc, are meant to run very little compression damping (usually lowest setting) because they do not need it to "improve pedaling" like many bikes do. Santa Cruz, Intense, and 9er are similar, not quite as refined IME, but still work very well without any lockout type devices.

    My Specialized Enduro 29er bike sags when I pedal up steep hills. Usually said hills are bumpy, so a lockout would be bad and cause me to lose traction. But the harder I pedal, the more the rear end sags down, which is a trait of a FSR suspension like specialized uses. This also makes it harder to climb because it effectively raises the front end. There isn't a great fix for this, but using granny gear helps to bring some more tension into the system like those DW bikes above use, so it makes it a little less bad, nowhere on the level of those bikes though. Again though, lockout is pretty useless in these situations and even the pro-pedal settings don't really help all that much. The reason I got the enduro is like I explained above, I was looking for some very specific features that aren't found in other bikes. That's why I took the "hit" with the climbing efficiency, fully aware before I got it. The short chainstays, ample suspension travel and low BB are worth it for me, but it's only a "mediocre" climbing bike IMO.
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  15. #15
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    But this one goes to 11.
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  16. #16
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    The Genius 900 I consider a "Trail" (more technical XC) bike, the Genius 700 I consider an "All-Mountain" bike, whereas the LT is an "Enduro: bike.
    It all depends on what wheel size you mean, but 130mm is almost too little for some of the more technical riding you are going to do. The 27.5 would be best for your riding, but the LT would still be overkill.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    I just did go demo a 2013 santa cruz bronson and it was awesome however it has a rear located 3 mode switch which is REQUIRED to be moved for the uphill, flat, and downhill modes.
    Maybe you should go chech one out...?
    The same store had a super nice looking Scott on the same stand as the Bronson and it has the same type of 3 modes however it has a handlebar lever which is much better.
    But lets not get off the topic totally yet.
    What suspension systems have more versatility and do not need a mode switch to fully enjoy.
    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    I don't quite understand your question about "why I think" the new bronson comes with a 3 mode shock.
    The mfg made it that way, not me.

    My question is why did they go to the trouble to put a handlebar lever for the seat post but not the rear shock.
    Scott put both levers up front so it seemed like a better option of the two.

    The nearest dealer for the other bike you mentioned is a few hours drive and they only give pavement demos.
    Not sure its worth the hassle on a whim.
    Can you help me understand your recomendations better?
    Quote Originally Posted by schristie11 View Post
    Pinkbikes review of the mach 5.7 says:

    The changes in shock tune and suspension geometry, added to the fact that the Mach 5.7 comes with an ultra responsive Kashima-coated shock, cause the suspension to move a little more when pedaling than some climbers like. Pivot recommends that Mach 5.7 owners use (or at least try) the RP23 shock’s Propedal function when laying down serious power. We were interested to experience this because previous Pivots, like the Mach 4 and Mach 5, had sufficient anti-squat built into the suspension to never need the Propedal anti-bob function to enhance pedaling efficiency.
    I'm trying to help you, but if you don't want to listen, then just get the Scott and don't ask for advice.

    I have a Mach 5.7 and climb some very long, steep, technical climbs in and around the Front Range of Colorado. 3k+ feet elevation gain in a single climb is very possible here. I'm telling you, I've NEVER felt the need to even touch the propedal lever. That's why I got the bike, cause I didn't want to be messing around with platform in a shock to get the bike to pedal well. Go read up on DW-link, or even VPP, or Yeti's Switch design.
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  18. #18
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    Thanks guys very helpful info and I am much more clear on it now.
    Sorry for my ignorance on the subject.
    I hate trying to read pro reviews because they often leave many questions unanswered or are skewed.
    You guys have real experiance and I appreciate that you all took time to share and help me out.

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    I demoed a Mach 5.7c, the bronsonc, and the yeti sb66c in the front range and I never flipped any levers (left in descend mode) and they all climbed extremely well. The Bronson was the worst just because of the weight of the wheels, tires and tubes.

    I even pedaled up, as much as I could, Mt. Elbert on the SB66c and left it in descend mode. It is the tallest mountain in Colorado with 4500' of climbing from camp.

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    He can be only joking have a Trance and to be honest in the trail climbing I can hardly see the difference with propedal on/off. I´d love to try DW-L, VPP and GT to see how it stacks against Maestro.

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    Check out the Pivot Mach 6 if you want a more enduro type ride. 155mm of dw link travel and 27.5 wheels. Seems legit. On my shortlist now if I ever get any green.

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    I also think the DW-link is the best of them out of all the ones I tried.
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    I have a Yeti SB-66 and I do a lot of long steep climbs (Tahoe). I leave the shock wide open all the time. Propedal doesn't improve climbing for me. It does slightly raise the BB which reduces pedal strikes. But on the rare occasion I use it, I forget to flip the lever back at the top. When I finally remember to do that I resolve to stop using propedal.

    I love not having to flip extra switches to get my bike into the right mode, particularly on a new ride when I don't even realize the descent just got serious until I'm in it. Just my $.02.

  24. #24
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    Also check knolly Chilcotin or Endorphin, Canfield The One... I have an older model Endorphin and I've never felt the need to go to propedal, I always leave that off. Pivot and Ibis also very good options.

  25. #25
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    Great advice guys. Thanjs very much for your experiance sharing.

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