Just curious to see what others think about/have experienced with QR vs TA. I have a steel HT built up with a 2008 RS Revelation at 130mm. I have QR now and have considered swapping over to TA.
Other than eliminating some fork flex, does TA offer a substantial level of safety to the rider? Basically, if taking drops/hits NO larger than 3 or 4 feet, is TA needed or is QR suffucient?
I have said "more robust". English is not my native language, but I have assumed that "robustness" (of the whole system) includes more then strength.
Somebody on wikipedia states that "Robustness is the quality of being able to withstand stresses, pressures, or changes in procedure or circumstance". That's the "procedure and circumstance" that I was thinking about. And with more tension and less bushings it is possibly just a tiny bit stiffer.
I would not be terribly surprised if pure strength is also improved - with less moving parts, but yes, you are absolutely right, properly setup QR is in no danger of breaking. Maybe with the exception of those 50g ti sets for hardcore weenies (and why do not they use far stronger ti bolt-ons, such as 47g set of Control Tech Race, I have no idea.)
I rode a 20mm TA for the first time this weekend and all I can say is WOW! huge improvement from the 9mm dt swiss axle I was using. comparing it to a standard QR is not even in the same universe.
OK so it looks like it is just VERY desireable but not necessary. I'm just getting into more aggressive riding and found a good deal on a QR Revelation, had a wheelset with std QR so that is what I am using. I don't plan on doing anything too crazy, I have young kids. Guess when it is time for a new wheelset or fork, I'll take the plunge all at once.
I'm a big guy, so this may not apply much to you regular sized folks.
Since switching to TA forks and bolt on rear hubs I find my bike tracks a straight line much better through the rough stuff. Especially off camber landings after a drop or jump, or entering a rock garden into a turn.
For me the difference is night and day. I don't mind running a QR on the rear for the most part, but I can tell a difference with my bolt on wheels in lateral stiffness.
I havent had the pleasure of riding a bike with a 12mm bolt on rear wheel yet, but can imagine it would be even stiffer.....but a frame designed for a 12mm bolt on rear is going to be a burlier frame anyways.
I'm running hope pro 2 hubs 20mm TA front on a 36 Talas, and a 10mm bolt on rear on my BMC superstroke, which is a super burley frame. When I was running a QR on the rear I did feel some slight flexing occasionally which I do not notice since putting the hope on there.
Hubs laced to Flows with DT comps.
If you are a bigger guy, or riding aggressively, you will come to appreciate the TA and Bolt On setup, and you will notice a difference.
That's wrong, sorry. I always check my QRs are tight before I ride (store bike with wheels off) and yet I've had a QR undo under heavy braking. Pure luck that I didn't fall and smash my face in. I only use TA now.
Look up 'Russel Pinder' on STW for another example. Fox settled his case after he was left paralysed when his wheel was ejected from the dropouts.
QR has no place on the front wheel of a mountain bike running discs IMHO. Wasn't a problem with rim brakes but with discs it is. Something to do with the angle of the force generated.
Regardless of the safety issue, I find the Maxle to be far easier to use and just a better system all-round.
As retro mentions above, I have heard of issues using QRs with disc brakes, particularly as they are getting more and more powerful, but no personal experiences to speak of.
Having used the Maxle system, I would never go back to a QR system, for these reasons.
The 15QR system works incredibly well too. More user friendly than 9mm, and definitely improved performance. The Fox 20mm quick release on the 36 series works really well too. Easy to use and super stable.
I guess the masses have spoken. I just figured that some manufacturers build AM wheelsets w/ QR only so it must have been safe. I'll be swapping over but it's gonna take some time.
New fork + new wheels = lots of money.
That's wrong, sorry. I always check my QRs are tight before I ride (store bike with wheels off) and yet I've had a QR undo under heavy braking. Pure luck that I didn't fall and smash my face in. I only use TA now.
Look up 'Russel Pinder' on STW for another example. Fox settled his case after he was left paralysed when his wheel was ejected from the dropouts.
QR has no place on the front wheel of a mountain bike running discs IMHO. Wasn't a problem with rim brakes but with discs it is. Something to do with the angle of the force generated.
Well, TAs come loose also. One of my riding buddies bot to the bottom of a DH run and found his Marzocchi TA axle dangerously loose:eekster:. I do agree that TAs are more secure, but they need to be checked periodically also.
As for performance, no question that TA is stiffer and tracks better. It's also a lot more convenient to install. No more jiggling the wheel to get it aligned right!
Well, TAs come loose also. One of my riding buddies bot to the bottom of a DH run and found his Marzocchi TA axle dangerously loose. I do agree that TAs are more secure, but they need to be checked periodically also.
Most of my riding buddies have QR fork-mount bike racks on their vehicles.
One of my bikes has an '07 Fox36 (pinch bolt 20mm) and I have a QR rack adapter, but I find it annoying to remove/install the front wheel every time, likely a Maxle would make it pretty painless I guess.
Have QR racks kept anyone from going to 20mm or 15mm forks?
I'm a small guy who doesn't do huge drops/jumps, but the difference between QR (even a "stiff" QR setup) and a 20mm is huge. Very much worth doing. I'd not build up another QR mtb unless a super light XC racer or rigid bike.
I would never let a bike rack keep me from getting a TA fork. I'd sell it and buy a new one (racks seem to sell pretty well where I live). Thru Axles are enough of an advantage in performance, safety, and convenience that I'd be willing to do that. But I don't think it would even be necessary. All the racks I can think of accept adapters for TA20mm or TA15mm forks.
Most of my riding buddies have QR fork-mount bike racks on their vehicles.
One of my bikes has an '07 Fox36 (pinch bolt 20mm) and I have a QR rack adapter, but I find it annoying to remove/install the front wheel every time, likely a Maxle would make it pretty painless I guess.
Have QR racks kept anyone from going to 20mm or 15mm forks?
Nope. I had a QR rack on my Jeep, bought one for my BMW, and now have a pickup so I dont use my BMW for bike duty any more. I too have an 07 Fox 36 with the pinch bolt, and I too dislike the hurricane Fork up. But it works, and it gets(got) my bike to the trail. A bit extra vs. a QR, but the benefit everywhere else on the trail was worth it.
I, unlike Scrublover, am a big guy, but I too will never own another bike without a 20mm. Even if I build an XC bike it will probably have a Maxle lite, or a 15mm axle.
I got QR on my 08 Fuel EX8. I just got some Easton Havocs for it, partly because they give me option to get TA later when I do my next AM build. I don't see how you lose wheel with QR though, it won't come out of my Fox fork unless I unscrew it a little bit out of the recesses.
That's wrong, sorry. I always check my QRs are tight before I ride (store bike with wheels off) and yet I've had a QR undo under heavy braking. Pure luck that I didn't fall and smash my face in. I only use TA now.
Look up 'Russel Pinder' on STW for another example. Fox settled his case after he was left paralysed when his wheel was ejected from the dropouts.
QR has no place on the front wheel of a mountain bike running discs IMHO. Wasn't a problem with rim brakes but with discs it is. Something to do with the angle of the force generated.
okay, i just read about russel pinder and it sounds like a one in a million thing. the fork, brake, and skewer allignment would have to be just right. sounds like he just was majorly unlucky. besides he is suing fox, not the skewer mfg. but i cant argue about the braking forces. but in the same respect i dont think skewers are really meant to stand up to that, they're more of a xc/ trail thing and in that application i say they are pretty good. if you're braking hard enough to undo a skewer its a pretty good sign your riding terrain outside the realms qr skewers were designed for.
In the 9mm format, that hub will not be significantly different than any other 9mm QR. The skewer is still supporting the load. A 9mm bolt through would be more reliable and might stiffen the front end up a touch, but it's still not as solid as a 15QR or 20TA.
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