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  1. #1
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    New question here. Need Real World Advice for the a 2018 Bike Purchase

    I've been looking at new bikes for my GF and myself for about 9 months. Needless to say I've driven myself mad with spreadsheets, angles, build kits and general anal retentiveness.

    We've demoed bikes and have an idea what we want / don't want. We are 'average' riders in CO's front range. We ride to have fun. We are not the fastest or the slowest people on the trail. We take trips to Fruita and Crested Butte. We aren't looking to get the most expensive bike out there. We also don't ride to the point of seeing a benefit of ultra high end components.

    She's coming from a 8-ish year old Orbea hard tail and I have a 4-ish year old Cannondale Scalpel 2. Anything we get at this point will be a huge change and upgrade.

    We've narrowed the search to the 2018 Canyon Spectral. The bike is a solid middle of the road bike. Its not overly progress, but gives good value for a long term purchase. Something like a Mondraker would be much more progressive, but the cost almost doubles to get similar build specs.

    We are looking at two different models. The frames are the same, but the bits and bobs are different. The price different is about $1000, but in my mind both have compromises. Both bikes have 12s GXE cassettes with a 32 or 34 tooth crank. The shifters are X01 vs GXE. The brakes are Guide R vs RS (I don't like either, but oh well).

    The biggest differences are the wheel sets and suspension.

    The 9.0 build has RockShox RT3/RCT and the 8.0 build has RT/RC. I'm not sure we ride hard enough to see a difference. I also don't really understand the differences between the models (outside of the number of lockouts). I also don't tinker with my sock settings. I couldn't tell you the last time I changed rebound or compression. We've never use the lockouts on our current front socks. We turn them a few times per year to ensure they work. I currently have a 3-setting Monarch rear shock, but only use Open and Pedal. I never use the Lock-out setting.

    The wheel sets are 26mm Mavic / 2.4in tires vs 30mm DT / 2.6in tires. I'm concerned about getting into a 26mm wheel set for a recreational bike. The first thing I would do, on the more expensive 9.0 build, is replace the 2.4in Mavic tires with 2.6in Maxxis (like whats on the cheaper 8.0). I would rather have the 30mm DT rims with 2.6in Maxxis tires. I feel the 30mm rims are better long term investment. They may also allow me to play with a 2.8in tire up front.

    I'm definitely leaning towards saving the 1k per bike (2k with purchasing both bikes) and getting the 8.0 model. Saving the $2k would also allow us to buy a new 1Up 3 bike hitch rack and take an extra trip to Fruita or Crested Butte in 2018. I would hate to save money upfront and then be stuck spending more on the back end. From the spec of the bikes laid out below, am I shooting myself in the foot by going with the 8.0 build?

    CF 9.0 Pro - $4,500-ish CF 8.0 - $3,500-ish
    FRAME - CANYON SPECTRAL CF
    DAMPER - ROCKSHOX DELUXE RT3
    FORK - ROCKSHOX PIKE RCT3
    HEADSET - CANYON | ACROS
    REAR DERAILLEUR - SRAM X01 EAGLE, 12S
    SHIFTERS - SRAM X01 EAGLE TRIGGER 12S
    BRAKES - SRAM GUIDE RS
    SPROCKET - SRAM XG-1275 EAGLE, 12S
    WHEELS - MAVIC XA PRO
    TIRE - MAVIC CHARGE PRO, 2.4 | MAVIC QUEST PRO, 2.4
    CRANK - TRUVATIV DESCENDANT EAGLE CARBON, 12S
    CHAINRINGS - 34
    CHAIN - SRAM GX EAGLE
    BOTTOM BRACKET - SRAM GXP
    STEM - RENTHAL APEX 35
    HANDLEBAR - RENTHAL FAT BAR LITE
    HANDLES - ERGON GD1
    SADDLE - ERGON SME3
    SEATPOST - ROCKSHOX REVERB STEALTH B1
    SEAT CLAMP - CANYON INTEGRATED
    PEDALS - DELIVERY WITHOUT
    FRAME HEIGHTS - S, M, L, XL
    COLOR - RALLY BLUE | FOREST FLARE
    WEIGHT - 13.1 KG
    FRAME - CANYON SPECTRAL CF
    DAMPER - ROCKSHOX DELUXE RT
    FORK - ROCKSHOX PIKE RC
    HEADSET - CANYON | ACROS
    REAR DERAILLEUR - SRAM GX EAGLE, 12S
    SHIFTHANDLES - SRAM GX EAGLE TRIGGER, 12S
    BRAKES - SRAM GUIDE R
    SPROCKET - SRAM XG-1275 EAGLE, 12S
    WHEELS - DT SWISS M 1700 SPLINE
    TIRE - MAXXIS MAXXIS MINION DHF, 2.6 | MAXXIS REKON +, 2.6
    CRANK - TRUVATIV DESCENDANT 6K EAGLE
    CHAINRINGS - 32
    CHAIN - SRAM GX EAGLE
    BOTTOM BRACKET - SRAM GXP
    STEM - RACEFACE AEFFECT R
    HANDLEBAR - RACEFACE AEFFECT
    HANDLES - CANYON BRACELETS
    SADDLE - SDG FLY MTN
    SEATPOST - ROCKSHOX REVERB STEALTH B1
    SEAT CLAMP - CANYON INTEGRATED
    PEDALS - DELIVERY WITHOUT
    FRAME HEIGHTS - S, M, L, XL
    COLOR - STEALTH | FOREST FLARE
    WEIGHT - 13.3 KG

  2. #2
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    For your stated priorities I think the 8.0 is more suited. The suspension differences are mainly in tweakibility, you're not a shock tweaker. GX is good quality for people who ride a lot, with a weight penalty. You're not racing, and it isn't huge anyway.
    Wheels? It's a good excuse to mount some road slicks on the current set, and buy a nicer wheelset down the line if you feel like you need it. I bet you won't.

  3. #3
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    Not in my opinion, $2k for upgrades that you don't want and prolly won't appreciate is a bad idea. Save the money, and this is coming from a guy who always says buy the high-end model. If you don't want more adjustable brakes and suspension then don't pay for it. The wide rims you want are not an expensive upgrade. After you wear the stock tires you can have those $80 rims laced to your hubs when you buy the big tires.
    oops I wasn't clipped in

  4. #4
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    Lucky for you the cheaper bike has the better wheelset. Mavic is junk. Proprietary parts and out of it skinny.

  5. #5
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    Good point about just having the wheels restrung with wider rims at a later time. Thats a heck of a lot cheaper than a new wheel set or something off of Craigslist/eBay.

  6. #6
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    Guerrilla Gravity is right there on the front range. Give them a visit.

    Your welcome

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by pryde1 View Post
    Guerrilla Gravity is right there on the front range. Give them a visit.

    Your welcome
    Yes they are. Super nice guys and the shop is about 1.5 miles from the house.

    I've been down there a few time. I like there offerings and the fact that they are a local company. The base builds are good, but the price climbs fast when parts are swapped out. They do a good job of keeping the price down, but that shows in some of the components.

    I'll have to see if they changed anything for 2018.

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  8. #8
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    Question - of your 9 months of research have you even demo'ed the Canyon? As you know the 2018 are brand new and all new bike - so I doubt you got a demo ride. Did you try the 2017?

    Personally for horst-link bike I would prefer a lockout for the rear end. You have lots of up and down in CO. I also prefer 2.6 tires and wider rims. But did you test ride a bike with 2.6 or 2.8 tires?

    Finally just to be evil. I will through another option to help with your analysis-paralysis. At the $3-$4k pricepoint, check out the Diamondback Release Carbon/Clutch. They have some year end close out sales on these right now.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundrted View Post
    Yes they are. Super nice guys and the shop is about 1.5 miles from the house.

    I've been down there a few time. I like there offerings and the fact that they are a local company. The base builds are good, but the price climbs fast when parts are swapped out. They do a good job of keeping the price down, but that shows in some of the components.

    I'll have to see if they changed anything for 2018.

    Sent from my SM-G930U using Tapatalk
    They have new price structures and build options for 2018 so you are in luck!

    I own a Smash and it is a GREAT bike and GG is fantastic to deal with. I couldn't recommend them more, especially as you are right there.

  10. #10
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    I have a GG megatrail and I love it.

    but I have been talking with a few people from diamond back and they have been really steeping up their offerings as of the last couple of years. the new Release is supposed to be a great bike! give it a look.

    good luck on your bike search

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by smoothmoose View Post
    Question - of your 9 months of research have you even demo'ed the Canyon? As you know the 2018 are brand new and all new bike - so I doubt you got a demo ride. Did you try the 2017?

    Personally for horst-link bike I would prefer a lockout for the rear end. You have lots of up and down in CO. I also prefer 2.6 tires and wider rims. But did you test ride a bike with 2.6 or 2.8 tires?

    Finally just to be evil. I will through another option to help with your analysis-paralysis. At the $3-$4k pricepoint, check out the Diamondback Release Carbon/Clutch. They have some year end close out sales on these right now.
    I have not demoed the new Canyon because I'm not cool enough to get an invite. I need to work on that .... Haha.

    We have riden the 2017 YT Jeffsy. The suspension on the 2018 Spectral looks very similar to the Jeffsy. I didn't like the demo ride but it wasn't the bike. It was the guy that set it up. The front shock was under pressure and the rear was over pressure. The tires were also over pressure. My GF's bike was setup correctly and she enjoyed the ride.

    We've tried a few different bikes with 2.6in tires and they were just fun. Also a full 27+, but I can't remember if it 2.8 or 3in. Again, it was just fun. We ride hard enough to enjoy the extra traction, but not hard enough to roll the sidewall on a wide tire.

    My anal retentive Excel pivot table puts the new Spectral between the YT Jeffsy and the Mondraker Foxxy. Closer to the Jeffsy then the Foxxy. Fit wise we liked both bikes. I'm well aware that the Mondraker suspension is completely different.

    There is always a risk with the direct to consumer, but it have a good feeling about the Spectral.

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  12. #12
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    Not to beat a dead horse, but like others have said, you really should look at GG! At least give a Shred Dogg a test ride. As far as the spec goes, Spectral CF EX 8.0 vs Shred Dogg Ride 1 Build:

    Component/Spectral/Shred Dogg - comment
    Price/$3599(plus pack & ship)/$3795 (picked up, professionally assembled) - Advantage GG
    Location/Germany/USA - Advantage GG! on your doorstep! shop local! Test Ride!
    Frame/Carbon/AL - I don't like plastic bikes + "ocean fill"
    Fork/Pike RCT3/Pike RC - Advantage Spectral, however you dont tinker so it really doesnt matter!
    Shock/Monarch RT3/Delux RT - Advantage Spectral, however you dont tinker so it really doesnt matter!
    Drivetrain/GX 11s/GX w/ e13 - Advantage GG (actually has 511% range vs Eagle @ 500%)
    Brakes/Guide RS/Guide R - I would take XT over either of these
    Seatpost/Reverb stealth/KS Lev - I like the KS
    Wheels/M1700/M1900 i30 - GG has that nice 30mm rim

    Thats what I see as the big ticket items. I would at least give the GG a fair look! Also, I am not seeing the 2018 canyon builds online (i don't think) Are they available in the US yet?
    Guerrilla Gravity BAMF
    Smash

  13. #13
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    No beating a dead horse here. All input, that is respectful, is good input. I signed up for the GG 2018 sneak peak but haven't checked out the link yet.

    GG is a solid bike. No questions there. I would be selling myself short if I didn't give one a test drive. I'm still not sure about the AL frame. I've had CF bikes since the early 2000s.

    Here is the link to the international Canyon site. I use Chrome's built in translation function to get it into English. I have confirmed with Canyon USA that only the Sram builds will be available in the US.

    https://www.canyon.com/mtb/spectral/



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  14. #14
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    id go with the CF8. cant pass on DT wheels

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundrted View Post
    I have not demoed the new Canyon because I'm not cool enough to get an invite. I need to work on that .... Haha.

    We have riden the 2017 YT Jeffsy. The suspension on the 2018 Spectral looks very similar to the Jeffsy. I didn't like the demo ride but it wasn't the bike. It was the guy that set it up. The front shock was under pressure and the rear was over pressure. The tires were also over pressure. My GF's bike was setup correctly and she enjoyed the ride.

    We've tried a few different bikes with 2.6in tires and they were just fun. Also a full 27+, but I can't remember if it 2.8 or 3in. Again, it was just fun. We ride hard enough to enjoy the extra traction, but not hard enough to roll the sidewall on a wide tire.

    My anal retentive Excel pivot table puts the new Spectral between the YT Jeffsy and the Mondraker Foxxy. Closer to the Jeffsy then the Foxxy. Fit wise we liked both bikes. I'm well aware that the Mondraker suspension is completely different.

    There is always a risk with the direct to consumer, but it have a good feeling about the Spectral.

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    I think that this article was written for OP, especially the title :-)

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/ride-m...s-opinion.html

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbfree View Post
    I think that this article was written for OP, especially the title :-)

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/ride-m...s-opinion.html
    Thanks for sharing the article.

    This is a prime example of why I don't read opinion pieces on PinBike. What is the significance if someone buys a $10k Yeti of Specialized for a once a year bike trip? Good for to them. They have the disposal income to do it and keep our beloved local bike shops in business.

    It is interesting that the author equates someone the maintains thier bike with someone that has no happiness. I know people with spotless 8k+ dollar Yetis that ride stopies, bust chains, bunny hop around switchbacks and are some pretty serious nut jobs on two wheels. You could eat off of there cassettes, too. To imply they are having less fun or there bikes lack soul is silly.

    I don't know the author's motivations, but it sounds more like a criticism of the haves vs the have nots. People with beat up older bikes justifying repressed resentment of not being able to have something they desire.

    Saying my old '93 Trek 990 with DS2 air/oil fork is better then my '12 Scalpel 2 or upcoming '18 purchase because it's more 'worn' is beyond me.

    This tread was to look at the real world impact of components and the future usability of different build kits. Investing in the correct bike now will ensure the best ROI in the future.

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  17. #17
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    Both look like mostly solid builds. The sram brakes are junk, budget to replace them on both (I just bought a new bike with RSs and they stick in the sun and have to be bled constantly. Sram sucks for warranty/customer service).

    The gx is fine other than being heavier.

    Which dt wheels does the 8 have? M1700s are on upgraded versions of dt350 hubs which are awesome, m1900s use the old pawl style hubs, not so awesome). M1501s and lower use 240s (about as good as hubs get).

    Generally mavics are fragile and proprietary so plan to sell them and buy dt or something else. I put a set on my computer mtb that's never seen off road and still broke the hub shell.

    Do check out the GG, DB release (it uses a santa Cruze/intense vpp design that works great; much better climber than most other designs). Also check out Intense. At that price point you could get a spider pro and have money left over which imo is better all around. Check out the sale at Arts. Also see what pedal pushers can do now that intense brought retail pricing down.

    Pedal pushers has a ton of rental bikes. Try out a few to see what you like. You can ride Apex from their shop. I rented a recluse foundation build and rode Apex last time I was in Golden. Good times.

    The 1up racks are great. I can toss on my mtb or bmx bike without fuss in no time.

  18. #18
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    Pics of the recluse at Apex for fun

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  19. #19
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    If you're not trying to break the top 10 on Strava the latest and greatest is not going to make much of a difference get a decently reviewed bike at the price point that you're comfortable with. Test ride one for final approval and call it a day. Her bike will be more of the dramatic change just get the air pressure tuned up in the compression and rebound settings right. Your bike you'll enjoy a little modern geometry that's a little more slack out and be able to mob the downhills a little bit better so long as it's not a s*** climber because you think it's too Slack or the seat angle to top tube length isn't right for you or what have you. Yeah actually spend more time climbing than you do descending and if you're so wore out you really can't enjoy The Descent.
    And dont forget a bar width, sweep, rolled up or down, stem length, stem spacer placment, brake lever angle, for aft height and tilt on the seat can all change the dynamic of fit let alone suspension tuning.

  20. #20
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    Thanks for the info.

    I've been looking at the Shred Dogg from GG. It's a pretty sweet bike. I can get XT breaks / drive train and an MRP Ribbon for under 4k.

    I haven't looked at internce in a while mainly because the prices were to high. Sounds like I need to give them a second look too.

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  21. #21
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    https://www.artscyclery.com/Intense_...ge-INS7CW.html


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  22. #22
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    With Canyon not a US based brand and GG at your door step.
    I would personally go with GG. The price is within a few 100, Have any problems they are local and you are helping a local LBS.
    Too Many .

  23. #23
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    Buy national especially if the desired item is a Canyon.
    You don't really want to know something about costumer service...

    And as mentioned above: avoid Mavic in general and SRAM brakes.

    Greetings from Germany

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundrted View Post
    Thanks for the info.

    I've been looking at the Shred Dogg from GG. It's a pretty sweet bike. I can get XT breaks / drive train and an MRP Ribbon for under 4k.

    I haven't looked at internce in a while mainly because the prices were to high. Sounds like I need to give them a second look too.

    Sent from my SM-G930U using Tapatalk
    And again you get sucked into consumer madness with 100 of "possibilities" to get most for your money.....while in reality any bike (with properly set suspension) in 4K range you mention will be awesome. And there will never be any ROI in financial way, as soon as you take you bike from the store it already lost probably 20% of value, let alone after few years of abuse. I hope you buy bike soon and end this 100s choice madness you got into, especially in 4K range where there is really no bad choice.

    I think PB article was about focusing on riding, not on equipment (what you do right now). Look at Pro riders - they dont care what brand, brakes etc... they ride as long as bike is properly set up and they get paid :-)
    Ride more, buy less :-)

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbfree View Post
    Look at Pro riders - they dont care what brand, brakes etc... they ride as long as bike is properly set up and they get paid :-)
    Ride more, buy less :-)
    Actually most of the Pro riders don't pay for any of their equipment, have certified equipment technicians on hand all the time, and have professional suspension experts setup their suspension for them. Yes, they started out like everyone else and paid for their stuff but once they became a "sponsored" rider, their monetary investment into new equipment was only when they WANTED something that their sponsors did not provide. Why do you think guys/girls like Emily Batty, Cam Zink, Aaron Gwin, etc. are always on the same brand components/bikes?!!

    But yes you are right, Ride More THINK less.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    Actually most of the Pro riders don't pay for any of their equipment, have certified equipment technicians on hand all the time, and have professional suspension experts setup their suspension for them. Yes, they started out like everyone else and paid for their stuff but once they became a "sponsored" rider, their monetary investment into new equipment was only when they WANTED something that their sponsors did not provide. Why do you think guys/girls like Emily Batty, Cam Zink, Aaron Gwin, etc. are always on the same brand components/bikes?!!

    But yes you are right, Ride More THINK less.
    When riders change teams, they get new bike/new equipment and they ride whatever their "home" team is providing. They can have some "personal" sponsors like pedals, grips or simmilar smaller stuff, but for sure you will not see Trek rider riding Spec Demo or riding SRAM suspension if Fox is sponsoring the team - even if he rode it for several years before going to Trek and would probably ride it even more if possible because he is so used to it. I think that proves that riders ride whatever equipment they get - usually better paycheck will decide :-)
    And lets not forget - all Pro bikes are capable of winning, it just depends who is riding them.

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    Slightly off topic, but I saw an interesting segment during last year's Road season. They interviewed professional Peloton Riders about air pressure. Most of the Riders had absolutely no idea what air pressure was in their tires. Their comment was 'my mechanic handles that' or 'I just ride the bike'.

    That kind of reaffirms the point that pro riders really just ride what they're given.

    Unlike trickle down economics, trickle-down technology actually works. Us average consumers do see the benefit of what pro riders use. It may take time, but we do get the nice components in the end.

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  28. #28
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    FWIW, I have a GG Shred Dogg and it's by far the best bike that I've ever ridden. I went to a demo event and rode as many bikes as my legs would let me and the Shred Dogg stood out as being the most dialed and fun bike of the event. I was so blown away that I ordered one on the spot. I swapped my XT brakes from my former bike to it and selected an XT drivetrain. Nice to have so many options available.

    They also have excellent customer service.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundrted View Post
    Slightly off topic, but I saw an interesting segment during last year's Road season. They interviewed professional Peloton Riders about air pressure. Most of the Riders had absolutely no idea what air pressure was in their tires. Their comment was 'my mechanic handles that' or 'I just ride the bike'.

    That kind of reaffirms the point that pro riders really just ride what they're given.

    Unlike trickle down economics, trickle-down technology actually works. Us average consumers do see the benefit of what pro riders use. It may take time, but we do get the nice components in the end.

    Sent from my SM-G930U using Tapatalk
    LOL... so refreshing to see someone else on here that is as anal retentive as I am!!! Completely agree, the main difference between road and mtb riders is that our dirt brethren actually ride varying terrain consistently enough during the off season that they do some stuff like tire swaps and air pressure on their own. There was a good article this last year on PB where they interviewed some of the team mechanics and went through the paces with a few of the riders. Really the pro dirt riders (enduro, xc, dh, etc.) pay close attention to their setups and work with their mechanics on doing the setup but @mtbfree is correct in that they ride what they are sponsored, then work with their team mechanic to tune it to them (mechanics usually have a long checklist of what each rider likes, their measurements, angles, etc.). The riders also do more "pre-rides" of the courses so they will also make last minute changes to things like tires, tire psi, suspension setup, etc. to ensure that they are running the top gear.

    I remember reading about Jerome Clementz' pre-ride routine and he usually starts the course a couple days early walking with his mechanic, checking lines, paths, etc. and then working to tune the suspension for the intended purpose (all riders do this by the way). Then he actually loads up something ridiculous like a 38t or 40t front ring on his 1x setup and does his pre-rides on that. Day of race he changes his front to a 32t or 34t depending on the race all the while making changes to his bike after consecutive laps, giving mechanic feedback and then mechanic making changes based on it sometimes to the tune of a full suspension strip down and change of oil viscosity, volumes, etc.

    For the most part, a road rider has one specific setup that works for them and ALL tarmac and they just ride it.

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