Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 44
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation: srey's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    291

    Most laterally stiff 5"-6" bike

    Hey all,

    I currently ride an '05 Jamis XLT. It is built up with burly wheels and a 150mm fork. It is fine for the straight descents, though a little XCish, but the thing I hate the most about my bike is the lateral flex in the rear. Sometimes it gets downright scary when I try to rail the berms hard. I am now looking to build up a new bike, and am looking for a frame more burly than my current ride with great lateral stiffness. It would be a "one" bike, so it would have to do everything.

    What frames have you ridden that have great lateral rigidity? I have heard great things about the Banshee Rune and the Reign, but I wonder what the short list of rigid bikes would be.

  2. #2
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,034
    Knolly Endorphin.

    I have not ridden one but you can do the research. If it had as much travel as my 575 I'd pull the trigger today.....maybe. (love my bike quite a bit, lol)

  3. #3
    ಠ_ಠ
    Reputation: dulyebr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    3,189
    Quote Originally Posted by eatdrinkride
    Knolly Endorphin.

    I have not ridden one but you can do the research. If it had as much travel as my 575 I'd pull the trigger today.....maybe. (love my bike quite a bit, lol)
    Yea, I'm sure it's that 6mm that's holding you back

  4. #4
    on my 3rd wind...
    Reputation: SingleTrackHound's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    1,770
    Stiffest FS bike I've ridden was Foes Fly. For 5-6" travel range, Foes FXR has be at the top of the list for lateral stiffness.
    sth

  5. #5
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,034
    Yea, I'm sure it's that 6mm that's holding you back
    Funny.

    I was thinking it was a 5'' bike. Now I have no excuses other than the price tag, and parting with a bike I like so much.

    Damn you Knolly!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by eatdrinkride; 02-11-2009 at 10:38 PM.

  6. #6
    www.derbyrims.com
    Reputation: derby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    6,788
    Pivot Mach 5 is the stiffest 5 to 6 inch travel bike I've every flex tested. But I'm not interested in monopivots and horst links or heavier bikes that may be as stiff or marginally stiffer with this travel due to their compromised dependence on firmer damping and fork dropping for good climbing.

    I like well above average frame and swingarm stiffness, and finally have it now in my bike, a '06 Ibis Mojo with the new design '09 linkage, but high stiffness is not so important to me as overall handling balance and suspension quality.

    Having the linkage upgraded on the same bike that increased stiffness from just moderately above average to becoming very stiff, I found that the noticeable change in handling was only noticeable on smoother surface cornering and jump landings. There was nearly no noticeable improvement in handling on rougher trails.

    As a 200 lbs rider, I've found that fork stiffness is much more important to balanced, confident, and precise handling than swingarm stiffness. Suspension quality and handling geometry are both far more important than stiffness in my experience. (Flame suit zipped up and sealed! )

  7. #7
    T , V , & K Rider
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    2,339
    Another vote for the Knolly Endorphin.....plenty of lateral stiffness , tracks like a cat , excellent suspension quality ( rarely use the propedal lever position for climbs on my RP23 air shock and the travel feels deeper than 5.5 inches on larger hits ) , and one of the best mtb frames I've owned or tried ! That being said I think the new DW Turner Spot 5.5 would be another excellent choice........I'm getting the DW Sultan soon and cannot wait to ride it and see for myself the advantages of the DW - Link type rear suspension ! I also heard the new Turners are plenty stiff and perform great from reviews ! TIG.
    " A way to a deep freedom " - Tarja

  8. #8
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,139
    Quote Originally Posted by derby
    I like well above average frame and swingarm stiffness, and finally have it now in my bike, a '06 Ibis Mojo with the new design '09 linkage,
    WTF? You said your mojo didn't need the stiffening-lopes link and that it was adequately stiff before.

    Seems like you've gone back on what you've said, although that's not suprising given your reputation. At least you're now claiming the Pivot is the stifest bike you've "tested" and not the stiffest bike ever. Interesting how many Ibis owners disagree with your "above average stiffness" statement about the Mojo, but equally interesting is how you used to claim (before they made the lopes link) it was plenty stiff.

    I guess now you "finally" have it.

    Some of the things you say...

    I'm not going to tell the OP what bike to get, just don't listen to Derby, he makes outrageously unsupportable claims about bikes.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    230
    I test rode a Mojo last year when I was considering one over my Yeti 575 and I felt like the Ibis was noodley in the rear! Just my .02 cents.

  10. #10
    EDR
    Reputation: eatdrinkride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    9,034
    Quote Originally Posted by TejasMTB
    I test rode a Mojo last year when I was considering one over my Yeti 575 and I felt like the Ibis was noodley in the rear! Just my .02 cents.
    I've never been on a Mojo but fwiw I've often heard them referred to as wet noodles, but I've heard people say the say thing about the 575. Certainly these two bikes are not in the 'stiffest 5 to 6'' bike category. Still, wonderful bikes.

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Broccoli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    5,769
    Quote Originally Posted by TejasMTB
    I test rode a Mojo last year when I was considering one over my Yeti 575 and I felt like the Ibis was noodley in the rear! Just my .02 cents.
    +1. Ibis is nice enough, but it did not feel very stiff at all.

    I do not know about how important is ultimate stiffness. I can not really bend my current 07' Coiler, and I could not really bend AS-X that I had for a while some time ago. I guess there is such thing as stiff enough.

    Forks are more noticeable to me. Switching to Wotan was quite a change from my previous few rides.

  12. #12
    Captain Underpants
    Reputation: Random Drivel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    4,300
    Obviously the Turner Spot.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation: 006_007's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,245
    Knolly Endorphin is up there for sure. I do notice an increase in stiffness VS my 5spot (and I was very happy w the spot)

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    230
    Chumba XCL is a stiff one too!

  15. #15
    eBiker
    Reputation: Mr.P's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    5,108
    srey, here are some immediate solutions short of a new frame:

    - Check your rear wheel to see if there is flex there. Are you running an XC rim?
    - Do you run low pressure in a light tire? Get some real sidewalls.
    - Can you convert your hub to a bolt on?
    - how are your frame bearings? Couple years old? Get them replaced.

    Quote Originally Posted by derby
    But I'm not interested in monopivots and horst links or heavier bikes that may be as stiff or marginally stiffer with this travel due to their compromised dependence on firmer damping and fork dropping for good climbing.
    You'll need your flame suit on for that one... That is one f*ched up statement.

    It's about linkage execution and the ride quality the engineering built in...

    Unless you bite hard on the marketing...

    P

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Broccoli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    5,769
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.P
    - Can you convert your hub to a bolt on?
    Good call. Noticeable on any long travel frame.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.P
    You'll need your flame suit on for that one... That is one f*ched up statement.
    You are kind to him. I would call it a grade A bullsh.t.

    Amount or pseudo engineering drivel that many DW link advocates are producing is astonishing. Yeah, most of implementations are on decent bikes.

  17. #17
    Founder: Dirty3hirties
    Reputation: ddraewwg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,958
    I'm surprised no one's mentioned Ventana.....x5, Terramoto, or Ciclon. Either way.....they're all plenty stiff plus they are beautifully constructed.

    Aside.....

    Stiffness comes up all the time.....and it's so subjective that you're never going to get a definitive answer....just opinions (mine are no different). Seems like there's always arguments as to which is the most stiff. It's like saying which bike looks the best. I own a Mojo....and it's "stiff" for me. I'm only 155 lbs. I'm not going to have the same experience as someone who's 200 lbs. So when I say it's "stiff", that doesn't mean that someone else will/should feel the same way. I get sick of hearing people say "ohh...that bike's a noodle". If you have an opinion about a bike's stiffness, you shouldn't have to bash another bike.....but this is the internet and it's really easy to be an armchair quarterback.

    I liken this to the whole 9Qr to 20mm (or 15QR) trend. Before when manufacturers were really making only 9 mmQR, you had NO other choice....so what you defined as "stiff" is totally different than now. You can't bash someone for saying that what he said was "stiff" was wrong. It was their only system for comparison. I've switched to a 20 mm fork.....and it's stiffer for sure. But I didn't do it because I thought the 9mm QR's weren't stiff. Having said that though, I wouldn't go back to a 9.

    So the bottom line: What you think is stiff can only be what you have experienced thus far. And stiffness is not the "end all, be all" trait either. I'd rather sacrifice stiffness for a bike that fit me right.

  18. #18
    bike rider
    Reputation: Lelandjt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,287
    I agree on the wheel statements. I can feel the flex difference between 2 wheels more than I can between two frames.
    Keep the Country country.

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    7,927
    Ventana is known to make stiff bikes.

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Broccoli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    5,769
    Quote Originally Posted by ddraewwg
    And stiffness is not the "end all, be all" trait either. I'd rather sacrifice stiffness for a bike that fit me right.
    ..and there is clearly a point of rapidly diminishing returns.

  21. #21
    Professional Crastinator
    Reputation: Fleas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    2,700
    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    Good call. Noticeable on any long travel frame.



    You are kind to him. I would call it a grade A bullsh.t.

    Amount or pseudo engineering drivel that many DW link advocates are producing is astonishing. Yeah, most of implementations are on decent bikes.
    You must've heard the gears grinding in my head...

    DW*Link-equipped Iron Horse MKIII... where do those fall in the stiffness spectrum? As I have only ridden those. Mine seems not-so-stiff (at 185#), but like one comment before, it doesn't really matter on rough ground. I bought it not because local terrain requires 5" of travel (0" is plenty) but I wanted it for some out-of-state trips, so it's probably more of a cross between XC and AM (not-so-slack HT, <30#). A few trips out of state will test it good.
    It wouldn't make me trade bikes, just curious.

    Hope that wasn't leading off topic.
    Thanks,
    -F

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Broccoli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    5,769
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas
    It wouldn't make me trade bikes, just curious.
    I only did test Mojo extensively, and only rode MkIII a bit (enough to notice that it is a very nice bike), and I would certainly not trade it for anything just because of stiffness. I am close to 200lb, and it felt quite adequate. Like others here said, you may notice fork, wheels more then the difference in most good frames (and 5" implies a certain level of beef), and bolt-on rear hub may help up as well. $0.02

  23. #23
    wg
    wg is offline
    Fermented Grain Sampler
    Reputation: wg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    4,032
    I brought my same rear wheel over to the Endorphin and the Knolly is much more solid a frame for my 220# w/o gear.
    Don't harsh my mello

  24. #24
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,139
    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    Good call. Noticeable on any long travel frame.



    You are kind to him. I would call it a grade A bullsh.t.

    Amount or pseudo engineering drivel that many DW link advocates are producing is astonishing. Yeah, most of implementations are on decent bikes.
    Well, again, I don't want to push a certain bike, but the DW link does have certain benefits that are not found in other designs. As you have stated, not all of the executions have been very laterally stiff, but there are some good examples and applications of the design out there as well. As an example, iron horse designed some of their dw link bikes, and dw was responsible for the suspension kinematics, but not the entire design. Other companies may be more or less capable with bike design, and dw had to eventually design some of the iron horse bikes.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  25. #25
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,139
    Quote Originally Posted by ddraewwg
    I liken this to the whole 9Qr to 20mm (or 15QR) trend. Before when manufacturers were really making only 9 mmQR, you had NO other choice.....
    Not quite, you could use a bolt-through axle and the track nuts to gain some rigidity and a good solid interface, and you could also use a fork that requires a 20mm hub, like an old z1 (130-150mm of travel), Talas or vanilla 36 (which doesn't have to be set at 150/160mm of travel), manitou had a few, and so on. I've been using all-mountain bikes/builds since 1999, and except for one build I was using a 20mm through-axle the entire time, on that one build I used the solid bmx axle with track nuts.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •