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  1. #1
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    Good all mountain brakes

    Ok i posted this in the brake section but noone is responding
    ok i have a giant reign 3 and use if for all mountain xc and light freeridng. My hayes sole brakes are total crap and have broken 7 times now. I am disapointed with their power as well. I am wondering Wat are good cheap brakes (disc) for my needs. I have seen sets of bb7's + levers + cables for about 200. Wil this be the way to go? What are good hydros in this range. Ive heard that Hfx 9's can be problamatic. is this true. Are saints a good choice? Also how good are shimano hone products. They seem good but i havent heard much bout them.

    Edit: I just saw magura julies for an atractive price. How well do these perform
    Quote Originally Posted by coma13
    it's short but it's pretty.... just like a guatemalan hooker...

  2. #2
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by theg1ant
    Ok i posted this in the brake section but noone is responding
    My vote would go for Louise FR's or Formula Oro 18K (180F/160R on both). Even knowing they're more expensive.

    The Julies are just fine, but more XC oriented. I ride one of those and even though they do just fine for average trail riding, the lever feel is kinda cheap due to the plastic lever body.

    I would recommend the Julies for lighter riders, someone below the 165 pounds. Slap a set of Koolstop pads and go throw anything at them. Power and modulation is best with Koolstops front / Magura performance rear pads.

    I think they're good and reliable. Magura's CS is like sponsorship... is that good.

    All Shimano brakes are basically equal and very good indeed. There are deals on ebay on older 555 brakes for less than 130 the pair.

    Problem with Hone/Saint/XT/LX is that they aren't really cheap once you sum the price of the caliper/rotor, hose and levers as generally (not always) they're sold separately aftermarket. Add that to the fact that you have to fill them by yourself and you have to weigh in the cost of the bleed kit from the scratch.

    Hayes can be problematic indeed. You can get a very good pair or a lemon. Advantage is that Hayes parts are available everywhere. But they're the most powerful budget brake. Their feel is kinda on/off.

    Mechs is a good option too. BB7's are only in "disadvantage" against much expensive hydros and they are amongst the most reliable disk brakes.

    Hydros, in general, have more modulation and require less maintenance than mechs. Mechs require a little bit more fiddling with them, but it's very simple to do... unlike hydros, where a bleed can be tricky or troubleshooting can be a bit more difficult.

    So.. sorry for not giving a clear answer, but the truth is hydros or mechs depends on your tastes.

    Shortly... If you weigh less than 165 pounds, the Julies are your best choice. Cheap, simple, reliable brake... just make sure to put a set of Koolstop pads on front at least.
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  3. #3
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    well i hate fiddeling with hydros and i was raised with cable brakes. bb7s r cheaper and dont have a plastic lever body. If i can save more up ill get the louise but if i cant ill get the bb7s
    Quote Originally Posted by coma13
    it's short but it's pretty.... just like a guatemalan hooker...

  4. #4
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    Coming from the old Hayes Mag discs that i've had for the last 6 or so years (1 bleed and 1 set of front pads in all that time), i've been really impressed with the Avid Juicy 5s.

    I've always found hydraulic discs to be set and forget. I had a set of Formula MD-1 and the original Hayes cable disc brake before the Mags and they both sucked in terms of power and maintenance.

  5. #5
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by theg1ant
    well i hate fiddeling with hydros and i was raised with cable brakes. bb7s r cheaper and dont have a plastic lever body. If i can save more up ill get the louise but if i cant ill get the bb7s
    Hydros only have to be serviced when something goes really bad. From factory, you should not have a problem.

    Whatever you decide, good luck!
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  6. #6
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    Old school Shimano XT 4pots. Then just mix your rotor sizes around to adjust power. You should be able to find some cheap second hand.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin.mac.au
    Old school Shimano XT 4pots. Then just mix your rotor sizes around to adjust power. You should be able to find some cheap second hand.

    there are some cheap XT's on sale...not the 4pots, which are sweet but the price for the newer ones are right on!

  8. #8
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    Hope M4's 200mm /180mm, D/H performance at XC weight,
    loads of modulation, one finger operation,reliable, ideal for those long rides.

  9. #9
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    There are a lot of very good brakes around now to choose from. I would recommend Juicy 5's, Louise FR or Hope mono4, they are on my bikes and all work superbly. You should add the cost of a bleed kit if you'll be fitting them yourself as most lines are supplied as if the brakes were going on a pennyfarthing.
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  10. #10
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    The only problem I've noticed with discs is that the rotor is never perfect. Which means you'll always have some brake drag with hydros because they automatically adjust as the pads wear. With mechs , at least with bb7s, you can back the pads off just enough to eliminate the rub. You might have to pull the lever a little more, but overall performance will be better. Just MHO. I like mechs otheres like hydros and like everything else it generally comes down to personal preference and budget.

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  11. #11
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    cambria bike

    has BB7 sets (levers 2 calipers, 2 rotors, and a set of sealed flak jacket cables for $169 in their closeout section !!!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by A MAN CALLED HORSE
    There are a lot of very good brakes around now to choose from. I would recommend Juicy 5's, Louise FR or Hope mono4, they are on my bikes and all work superbly. You should add the cost of a bleed kit if you'll be fitting them yourself as most lines are supplied as if the brakes were going on a pennyfarthing.

    hopes do not need bleed kits, if you're very careful with the hosecutting and reinstallation. i've done lots of hose cuts and never had to bleed once. avids can be trickier but same goes for the juicys.

    that said i think the juicys are stronger than the hopes.

  13. #13
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    I had the original Avid mechs, which I eventually upgraded to a 185mm front rotor, and I thought they were pretty good. On my last bike I decided to switch to Hayes and got some OEM HFX Mags. After a couple years of fiddling with them, I've finally decided to go back to Avid mechs. I didn't notice a huge difference in braking power between these two, and after 2 occurrences of brake fluid spilling all over the place, I've had enough.

    But, I know other people who love their Hayes. Most likely I'm just not that good at maintaining them.

  14. #14
    BBW
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    Avids BB7

    Save money, save yourself from the mess of fluids, get lots of stopping power (185mm) and with a good set of cables (avid jacket, goretech, etc) they are smooth and powerful.
    they are not hydros so you need sometimes in rough sections 2 fingers instead of 1 with hydros.... but no mess

    Also my philosophy is that in the mountain things has to be as simple and reliable as they can!!!!!
    Imgine yourself in a foreign place or in a trip where your hydros died on you
    A simple cable is all you need to fix your mechs!!!!


  15. #15
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    I have a reign2 which came with avid juicy 5. I put a 203 on the front and they work perfectly heaps of power. I bent the rear disc and replaced the disc in < 5 minutes easy re align. They do however make some noise sometimes but no pad drag.

  16. #16
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    On my Prophet 400 I run Avid Juicy 5s. There are very smooth, and responsive. I recomend the 185mm rotors.

  17. #17
    SLX
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    I have hayes hfx 9 HD they have quarks but they work well. The only thing I dont like about them are the rotors, some how I bent mine a bit and they need truing the new ones got the V cut so they will eject any branches or leaves ( I got the older round ones and get small branches caught). Ive got 8 out in front and 6 rear. plenty o power Made for downhilling but if you want to put up with a few extra grams they are great for xc. My bike is full of goodies but people never comment on anything but the brakes. I put bonz levers on mine. some people have problems but if you can get them to work they last forever. Put the responsiblity on your bike shop and buy it from them. just incase you cant get them to work.

    My new build is shimano saint levers and calipers. They seemed like they were going to be cheap but it adds up and seem to cost 2 much. Of course I went all saint hubs cranks sooo you know how shimano is expensive. You dont have to get the hubs they work with any other hub or rotor. Very good technology and well made however more complex than hayes. Although they are easier to bleed. I havent used them as much as my hayes so I cant compare. Ive got 8" front and 8" rear
    Last edited by SLX; 04-23-2006 at 11:33 PM.

  18. #18
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    How about K24s 180/160? Those should, if I'm not mistaken, be pretty beastly brakes for the weight.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by robdamanii
    How about K24s 180/160? Those should, if I'm not mistaken, be pretty beastly brakes for the weight.

    i have 160/160's and they're very powerful right out of the box. they remind me very much of the juicy's....but the formulas have their own type of 'turkey gobble'....i would think 180's or larger would be amazingly powerful.

    plus the k24's came with a fistful of decals. i love that

  20. #20
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by robdamanii
    How about K24s 180/160? Those should, if I'm not mistaken, be pretty beastly brakes for the weight.

    For my budget, I'd take a lookt at the K18's.... a bit heavier and lacking the bite point adjustment of the 24's... but for around 160 bucks a wheel, they're pretty nice brakes.
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  21. #21
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    I would go the avid bb7s if anything, I have a pair of the Hayes HFX9 HDs and they are phenomenal, never had a problem and blow any of the other hydros I have tried out of the water, but my brother just got some BB7s and they are the next best thing of everything I have tried and youll have a bunch of cash leftover too

  22. #22
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    If you want mechanical go with the Avid BB7's, sounds like you have a good price going their. If you decide to take the plunge with hydro's go with the Hayes HFX-Mag.

  23. #23
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    Hey Guys,
    Just FYI the Oro K18 are actually the same weight as the Oro K24. A front weights 395g with a 160mm rotor/IS adaptor and all the fasteners....

    There are 2 differences between the K18 and K24:


    1. The K24 has nickel plated fasteners whereas the K18 fasteners are zinc plated.
    2. The K24 has the FCS system (adjustable lever contact point) whereas the K18's is non-adjustable.

    Hope that clears up any confusion.

    Thanks


    Chris

  24. #24
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    well i cant spend much more than 200 bucks total. 250 if u include instalation / hose cutting. I think i will go with the bb7's because theyre easy to fix. ican mantain cable brakes really well (ive gotten good at ajusting those tings) and also ill have some extra cash for my new shoes and grips fund
    Quote Originally Posted by coma13
    it's short but it's pretty.... just like a guatemalan hooker...

  25. #25
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    This is probobly the best deal you will find anywhere! I got them for $160 shipped including two 8 inch XT rotors!

    http://classifieds.mtbr.com/cgi-bin/...uery=retrieval
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  26. #26
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    I think blue sky cycling has a deal for the BB7s for 70 a wheel right now

  27. #27
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    Avid Juicy's here. 8" front 6" rear. Debating on going 8" FR and RR. HMMMM decisions.

  28. #28
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    another vote for BB7's
    i'm 6'3", 225 lbs. with gear, and run 7" rotors front and rear
    BB7's give me plenty of power and modulation. I used to have 6's front and rear, and got terrible brake fade over long descents, switched to 7's and it's all good now.

    great brakes for the money, performance rivals that of hydros, and you'll have cash left over for beer.

    cheers.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by drum714
    This is probobly the best deal you will find anywhere! I got them for $160 shipped including two 8 inch XT rotors!

    http://classifieds.mtbr.com/cgi-bin/...uery=retrieval
    I've always thought my Avid BB7s were really good brakes--- Powerful, easy to set up and adjust, cheap, etc, but I got a chance to demo a 6.6 last week when I was in San Diego and they had the Shimano XT hydro discs. Nice brakes. Easier lever effort. Better modulation. They did squawk like a banshee though.

    Is this place a shop? Do you still need a special hub or disc adaptor to run the shimano hydro discs?
    Last edited by KRob; 04-27-2006 at 04:17 PM.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by blender
    another vote for BB7's
    i'm 6'3", 225 lbs. with gear, and run 7" rotors front and rear
    BB7's give me plenty of power and modulation. I used to have 6's front and rear, and got terrible brake fade over long descents, switched to 7's and it's all good now.

    great brakes for the money, performance rivals that of hydros, and you'll have cash left over for beer.

    cheers.
    Ditto. I've got the same setup as you plus an inch in height and 15 or so lbs - I love these brakes.

  31. #31
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    I don't agree

    Quote Originally Posted by cameronm_99
    The only problem I've noticed with discs is that the rotor is never perfect. Which means you'll always have some brake drag with hydros because they automatically adjust as the pads wear. With mechs , at least with bb7s, you can back the pads off just enough to eliminate the rub. You might have to pull the lever a little more, but overall performance will be better. Just MHO. I like mechs otheres like hydros and like everything else it generally comes down to personal preference and budget.

    Cameron
    After two years of running BB7s on two bikes, I have come to accept that, no matter what I do, there will always be a squeak generated by slight rub. I can back the pads off two or three clicks, but I still get a squeak. (And I don't think the rotors are warped, at least not that much.)

    Having said that, the BB7s are powerful enough. I ran the 160/160 I had originally bought for my XC HT on my FS (I had run out of money for components and didn't want to wait to ride the thing). They worked well enough, just a little weak on some really steep downhills. If you like the mechs, then just be sure to run a 185 up front to give you a bit more power. And be prepared to think there are mice squeaking inside your hubs.

  32. #32
    Te mortuo heres tibi sim?
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    Another fan of the juicy5 setup. On both bikes, replaced bb7 mechanicals with Paul Love levers and fully sealed cable runs.

    Kept the same rotor sizes and the same pad compounds. Very slightly more power, but waaaaaay more modulation and far better lever feel.

    Other hydros I've only had a chance to feel on friend's bikes, but based on that I went for the Juicys. That and reviews and other emptybeer users annecdotal evidence.

    Juicy-5: fairly inexpensive, fairly light, easy to swap rotor sizes, idiot proof setup, super easy to bleed, and pretty easy to get parts for anywhere.
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  33. #33
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by cameronm_99
    The only problem I've noticed with discs is that the rotor is never perfect. Which means you'll always have some brake drag with hydros because they automatically adjust as the pads wear. With mechs , at least with bb7s, you can back the pads off just enough to eliminate the rub. You might have to pull the lever a little more, but overall performance will be better. Just MHO. I like mechs otheres like hydros and like everything else it generally comes down to personal preference and budget.

    Cameron
    errr... no.

    My Julies only touch the rotor where it's badly warped. They rub no more than my BBDB's were. No more than my M515's.
    Besides, the beauty of discs (mechs or hydros) is that brake rub may be annoying, but it's not a real issue... unless your caliper is badly aligned or your rotor severely warped.

    I couldn't stand the rubbing of my vees... too much drag. But any of my discs are much better in that regard and the difference between my hydros and former mechs is non-existant in that regard.

    One more thing... if you back off the pads on a BB7/BBDB, you change the modulation and power... not to mention the lever contact point. IMHO... too long lever throw feels awful. I like brakes that work with shorter lever throws and start modulating with force.

    Vees were a
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  34. #34
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    man, bb7 are really durable and the adjustability is just great...i recommend these, don't get fooled by hydro-hype
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    I've always thought my Avid BB7s were really good brakes--- Powerful, easy to set up and adjust, cheap, etc, but I got a chance to demo a 6.6 last week when I was in San Diego and they had the Shimano XT hydro discs. Nice brakes. Easier lever effort. Better modulation. They did squawk like a banshee though.

    Is this place a shop? Do you still need a special hub or disc adaptor to run the shimano hydro discs?
    I agree, I had an Avid 6 inch front on my Rockhopper and then 6 inch BB7ís on the front and rear of my Palomino.
    I always liked them and didnít feel the need to go with hydro.
    Now I have XT (dual control) on both my bikes, and I REALLY like them. More power, better modulation, less fade (not that there was much with the Avids).
    My XTís only make noise when they get wet.
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  36. #36
    Still on Training Wheels!
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob
    Is this place a shop? Do you still need a special hub or disc adaptor to run the shimano hydro discs?
    Yes they are in the NW somewhere.

    They make the XT rotors in both Center lock as well as 6 bolt. You can still use any rotor you want with the XT brakes, I just got the XT rotors because they where cheap.
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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