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Thread: Freeride?

  1. #1
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    Freeride?

    Why is Free ride a no no word here?

    Why is it as soon as some one hits a jump or a drop the F word goes flying and people get shunned?

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    You can talk about it here though you may get better responses on the DH/FR forum: http://forums.mtbr.com/downhill-freeride/
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    AM is a contemporary term for regular trail riding or perhaps even lycra free mountain biking. Freeride is more about pointing downhill and taking big air! The only common ground here is that lycra is illegal in both

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    Shunned?

    I thought that was an Amish concept...

    I haven't read all the posts in this forum, but I would hope we're not getting full of ourselves in this whole issue of "classification". Sure the forum is about a specific type of riding, and Shiggy makes a perfect point about the DH/FR forum being a better place to share info on freeride, but I doubt anybody cast you out of the discussions because you mentioned freeride.

    With the AM forum being new, there certainly has been a lot of lively debate about the term "All Mountain" and what it means. Perhaps in the heat of all this discussion, someone took a broadsword and cut your legs out from under you. Hopefully, the forum will settle in and the nonsense will die down.

    Just my 2 cents.

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  5. #5
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    I haven't noticed people be shunned for using the term freeride. I think the AM category should be big enough to include some freeriding, at least my idea of AM does.
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  6. #6
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    Seems like mountain riding is just that... mountains. Not ladder drops, huge gaps, or drops. That's not to say you can't talk about that here.. but I don't think it's really the focus of the forum. I certainly wouldn't "shun" anybody for it, it's just not what I happen to be into.

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    The only common ground here is that lycra is illegal in both [/QUOTE]


    Shiznits I must have missed that in the qualifications manual.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim311
    Seems like mountain riding is just that... mountains. Not ladder drops, huge gaps, or drops. That's not to say you can't talk about that here.. but I don't think it's really the focus of the forum. I certainly wouldn't "shun" anybody for it, it's just not what I happen to be into.
    Your logic only makes a little sense when your talking ladders, but last time I checked most mountains (not hills like most trails) have plenty of natural drops and gaps.

    All Mountain seems like it's bi-curious, likes to dabble in a little XC and a little FR but does not commit fully to either. Before everyone get's offended i'm not calling AM ghey, if you are rocking spandex then I think the term applies

  9. #9
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    Last time I checked, there are usually some pretty good drops in the mountains...

    If "freeriders" are going to be shuttled over to the DH/FR forum, then I guess "all mountain" is a marketing term. For now, I like to think of all-mountain as XC up, FR down (when options are available). Not all FR/DH riders shuttle all the time, and advice about equipment that is conducive to pedaling up is helpful.

  10. #10
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    I don't think ladder drops and road gaps are really "mountain" terrain, but this is a pretty subjective definition and riding niche anyway, so that's just MY opinion.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim311
    I don't think ladder drops and road gaps are really "mountain" terrain, but this is a pretty subjective definition and riding niche anyway, so that's just MY opinion.
    I have seen plenty of mountains with ladder drops and raod gaps. I don't see why these wouldn't be 'mountain terrian'. If you mean that man made stunts are not 'mountain terrain' then I still don't agree with that. Every trail we ride is man-made, unless you ride nothing but deer trails. The only difference is that the trails are made with shovels and dirt where as stunts are made with hammers and wood.
    I think if you are not hitting (or at least trying) these stunts (when availble), man made or not, then you are not 'all mountain' riding, you're simply XC riding. That, IMO, is what seperates AM form XC, the stunts and jumps (and probably the speed of the descent). Why else do you need a 5-6 inch travel bike?
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by KONA_in_SB
    I have seen plenty of mountains with ladder drops and raod gaps. I don't see why these wouldn't be 'mountain terrian'. If you mean that man made stunts are not 'mountain terrain' then I still don't agree with that. Every trail we ride is man-made, unless you ride nothing but deer trails. The only difference is that the trails are made with shovels and dirt where as stunts are made with hammers and wood.
    I think if you are not hitting (or at least trying) these stunts (when availble), man made or not, then you are not 'all mountain' riding, you're simply XC riding. That, IMO, is what seperates AM form XC, the stunts and jumps (and probably the speed of the descent). Why else do you need a 5-6 inch travel bike?

    My point exactly.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by KONA_in_SB
    I have seen plenty of mountains with ladder drops and raod gaps. I don't see why these wouldn't be 'mountain terrian'. If you mean that man made stunts are not 'mountain terrain' then I still don't agree with that. Every trail we ride is man-made, unless you ride nothing but deer trails. The only difference is that the trails are made with shovels and dirt where as stunts are made with hammers and wood.
    I think if you are not hitting (or at least trying) these stunts (when availble), man made or not, then you are not 'all mountain' riding, you're simply XC riding. That, IMO, is what seperates AM form XC, the stunts and jumps (and probably the speed of the descent). Why else do you need a 5-6 inch travel bike?

    5-6 inches of travel makes nasty mountain descents a hell of a lot more bearable. The type of bike does not dictate the terrain traveled.. the rider does. Like I said.. this is merely MY opinion. XC riders aren't going to be hitting super steep rocky descents at high speed. The type of bike they happen to be riding is irrelevant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim311
    5-6 inches of travel makes nasty mountain descents a hell of a lot more bearable. The type of bike does not dictate the terrain traveled.. the rider does. Like I said.. this is merely MY opinion. XC riders aren't going to be hitting super steep rocky descents at high speed. The type of bike they happen to be riding is irrelevant.
    If the type of bike they are riding is irrelevant, why do you not see very many XC riders buying Banshee Screams or Demo 9's? How come the Red Bull guys aren't on carbon fiber hard tails with 80mm travel up front?

    All mountian in my opinion, is ALL mountain. If there are drops, an AM rider will hit them. If there is a section of twisty technical singletrack, an AM rider will hit that. If there are wooden stunts, long climbs, berms, fire roads, an AM rider will hit them too.

    AM riders are bascially terrain whores - they'll hit anything.

    Some equipment limits you more in this endeavour than other equipment, so what you are riding is not entirely irrelevant, even though your point about the distinction being primarily based in a riders attitude (and skill) is valid.
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  15. #15
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    Good post Techfreak. It got me thinking though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Techfreak
    If the type of bike they are riding is irrelevant, why do you not see very many XC riders buying Banshee Screams or Demo 9's? How come the Red Bull guys aren't on carbon fiber hard tails with 80mm travel up front?.
    This is a good point. However, aren't you blurring the distinction between AM & Freeride with this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Techfreak
    All mountian in my opinion, is ALL mountain. If there are drops, an AM rider will hit them. If there is a section of twisty technical singletrack, an AM rider will hit that. If there are wooden stunts, long climbs, berms, fire roads, an AM rider will hit them too.

    AM riders are bascially terrain whores - they'll hit anything.
    When you're a "Freerider" don't you do the same things? Don't those who freeride also do long climbs in a lot of areas to bomb downhill afterwards?

    I've set up my Heckler w/ beefy wheels and longer fork so I could hit the bike park (Diablo) this season. But I'll still ride the trails 10 minutes from my house. Am I an AM rider or a Freerider?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anshwa
    I've set up my Heckler w/ beefy wheels and longer fork so I could hit the bike park (Diablo) this season. But I'll still ride the trails 10 minutes from my house. Am I an AM rider or a Freerider?
    It comes down to how big you fork is... J/K

    But that is a very good question. I have some drops built in my yard but then I a lot of trail ridding. I believe AM has a lot of gray area. There are people on this forum who love to wear their lycra, and they call themselves AM riders, and there are people here who ride some pretty big bikes on the trails and they consider themselves to be AM riders too.

    So I think we should all be aware of the gray areas and know that AM is kind of all encompassing and not be negative to anyone who has fun on their bike.
    Last edited by Jekyll_Jockey; 05-10-2006 at 01:59 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Techfreak
    All mountian in my opinion, is ALL mountain. If there are drops, an AM rider will hit them. If there is a section of twisty technical singletrack, an AM rider will hit that. If there are wooden stunts, long climbs, berms, fire roads, an AM rider will hit them too.

    AM riders are bascially terrain whores - they'll hit anything.

    Some equipment limits you more in this endeavour than other equipment, so what you are riding is not entirely irrelevant, even though your point about the distinction being primarily based in a riders attitude (and skill) is valid.
    I could not agree more with this post.

    I do lots of fast XC, some DJ, a good bit of DH, some light-to-medium FR- all on the only mountain bike I own. This is what I think "all mountain" is, and should be.

    Not saying you have to do all these things for your riding to be considered all mountain, but riders who DO dabble in all these, on one bike, shouldn't be excluded.

    If it's part of a trail, I'm damn well gonna try it- and some stuff that's not on a trail, too.

    I think that this is what "freeride" used to mean, and now freeride means "big stunt riding".
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jekyll_Jockey
    It comes down to how big you fork is... J/K
    I guess I have to keep upgrading the fork to be on the Freeride side... jk.

    I've read somewhere here in the forums a good description of what AM is. And it is that it is the name used for what we all used to ride when there wasn't any segregration of riding style... simply Mountain Biking.

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anshwa
    Good post Techfreak. It got me thinking though.


    This is a good point. However, aren't you blurring the distinction between AM & Freeride with this:

    When you're a "Freerider" don't you do the same things? Don't those who freeride also do long climbs in a lot of areas to bomb downhill afterwards?

    I've set up my Heckler w/ beefy wheels and longer fork so I could hit the bike park (Diablo) this season. But I'll still ride the trails 10 minutes from my house. Am I an AM rider or a Freerider?
    I think you are looking for a fine distinction between AM and FR but there is none. Same with AM and XC. AM is just a general term that descibes a riding style thats a little more gnarcore than XC but and liitle more 'lycra' than FR/DH.

    I actually think there should be two classes of AM. One that geared more for the XC bike/rider that is a little more burly and can hit some mild stunts and drops while on an XC ride. And a second catergory for the FR bike/rider that does some long rides but still cleans all the the stunts on the trails.
    The bikes are rider mentality are usally different for these types of AM.
    For instance Nomads, Intense 6.6, and SX Trails are designed for the latter (those are the bikes I am currently looking at to replace my Coiler) while lighter shorter travel bikes such as Dawgs, Five Spots, (what else) are for the former.

    I know some people can't seem to draw the distinction between these type of bike and riding but I think its pretty clear.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jekyll_Jockey
    Why is Free ride a no no word here?

    Why is it as soon as some one hits a jump or a drop the F word goes flying and people get shunned?
    I don't think it is a shunned word. As far as I am concerned, AM has FR aspects to it, (ladders included if you wish, though it's not my thing) so why not talk about it here?

    AM is about doing it all. Granted, FR on an 8x8 40 lb rig that you shuttle or push up a hill with armor and full face helmet is not the same as doing it on a 32 lb 6x6 bike made to pedal up a 2,500 ft climb with light protection at best, but becoming a better freerider will only make me get the most out of the mountain, and that's what AM is all about. At least that's what I'm all about.

    MY only problem with ladders and road gaps is that I don't have the balls to do them, but if and when I do, that will just become part of my AM experience, along with some xc riding to get there.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Techfreak

    All mountian in my opinion, is ALL mountain.

    AM riders are bascially terrain whores - they'll hit anything.
    Great post, but that is my favorite part!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anshwa
    Is that Voltron on your avatar?
    yes it sure is

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    Perhaps the main distinction between FR and AM is that you rarely pedal uphill in FR. A dedicated FR bike will be too heavy for efficient climbing, while an AM bike needs to be reasonably light to be considered true AM. I think it's much harder to make a distinction between FR and DH actually. What's the difference between a FR and DH bike?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by uktrailmonster
    Perhaps the main distinction between FR and AM is that you rarely pedal uphill in FR. A dedicated FR bike will be too heavy for efficient climbing, while an AM bike needs to be reasonably light to be considered true AM. I think it's much harder to make a distinction between FR and DH actually. What's the difference between a FR and DH bike?

    Seems like FR is dedicated more towards big hits, ladders, and stunts. I guess DH is oriented more towards riding rocky super steep terrain as fast as possible. In reality, I think the two might just be interchangeable

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jekyll_Jockey
    yes it sure is
    LOL! Gotta love those robot animations!

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