Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    4

    Idea! Deciding on a new hardtail

    Hello fellow riders, I have come to the conclusion that my current bike needs to be replaced in the near future and have been looking into different options.

    I now ride a Radon ZR Team 7.0 with 29er wheels, and while it has performed rather well in every terrain I've thrown at it over these 15 months I've had it, the 'oompf' is still missing.

    I have been looking into hardcore hardtails like Bird Zero AM, On-One DeeDar & Nukeproof Scout Comp, and I'm having some great difficulties to make any kind of decision.

    I love the smooth rolling of the 29er, but the only option that offers 29ers from those four is Nukeproof. As I occasionally ride long distances between trails, sometimes on pavement, so I was wondering how much comfort would I be sacrificing by choosing 27.5" or even 27.5+ wheels? Mostly I will be riding somewhat technical trails with moderate amount of climbs, rocks and roots.

    There is also a debate between steel and aluminium and how much travel is too much.

    I now have 100mm RockShox Recon Silver and it has yet to bottom out entirely, but still I'm longing for more without sacrificing comfort on those long distances I sometimes take upon. I was thinking that I wouldn't go past 140mm , but for example the Bird Zero AM has 150mm of travel. Will this effect the ride quality on those 30km transitions?

    I have a budget of around 1600, any insight on the matter is warmly greeted.

    Here are the links to the bikes:

    Bird: https://www.bird.bike/product/zero-am-s1x/
    DeeDar: https://www.on-one.co.uk/c/q/bikes/m...n-bikes/deedar
    Commencal: https://www.commencal-store.co.uk/me...18-c2x22592110
    Nukeproof: Scout 275 Comp | Nukeproof

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    11,746
    You've been doing ok on a 100mm 69.5* XC hardtail with long chainstays and a short cockpit that weighs 13kg/28.5lbs. on skinny 20mm inner rim wheels.

    Many things can be changed to expand the performance.
    Slacker head tube angle for downhill and steeper seat tube angle for climbing.
    Shorter chainstays.
    Boost 148 rear and a Boost 15x110 fork. For more tire width clearance options. 2.4 or 2.6 x 29 rear and more for a front.
    Longer reach for more cockpit length.
    35 or more inner between the beads rim dimension for tire sidewall support, lower pressure and more traction from a bigger footprint.
    Your budget is the limiting factor for sure.


    The Meta comes with 27.5+ and can take 29s as an option. That would be my choice in your budget.
    https://singletrackworld.com/2017/10...t-am-hardtail/

    Out of budget a Stache carbon frame built with a Manitou Mattoc Pro fork.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    4
    The Meta surely seems like an amazing bike. Though I'm wondering that will the 160mm of travel be a bit overkill for my needs.

    With the 2.8 tyres and all I can't help but wonder that will I be sacrificing too much speed compared to 29er with narrower tyres and say like 130-140mm travel. This is me referring to those long stretches on the pavement, I would not like to be crawling my way from one point to another. I have no doubt that setup would be amazing on every trail I get to, even the XC'ish ones.

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    11,746
    I prefer less travel on my trails to keep things challenging.
    So I lean toward less travel but need wide rims and 2.35 or 2.6 tires for stability when cornering.
    https://nsmb.com/articles/manitou-mattoc-pro-fork/
    If you read that article you'll recognize the performance varietion you can get from a quality fork. Travel isn't the only metric.

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation: huckleberry hound's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    555
    You can change the air spring on the Yari fork to reduce the travel for about $30 on the Meta. That would be my choice too.
    Change begins by doing something different.

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation: targnik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    4,559
    They do make a Nukeproof Scout in 29er ^^

    Running 140mm up front on mine & it's more than enough for most trails I come across ;-)

    Mines a 2017 frame/model (custom build & non boost).

    2018 iteration has boost spacing, so running nice fat rubber 2.5 - 2.6 (maybe even 2.8!?) would help dampen down trail chatter.

    Not sure if it (Scout 29) meets your budget.

    A 27.5 Scout with 2.6 - 2.8 tires would be a trail slayer!!

    'Born to ride!'
    "Mountain biking: the under-rated and drug-free antidepressant"

  7. #7
    mbtr member
    Reputation: scottzg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,809
    Of the bikes you've listed the commencal and bird are similar and the deedar and scout are similar. The Deedar is almost 7 lbs for the frame alone (should be ~5) and is by far the shortest reach. I don't see much to recommend the deedar; the scout is a plain better choice. Similarly, between the bird and the commencal... the bird has a superior build kit, a few nicer design details, and the option to put a pike rct3 or Stage on.


    To my mind that leaves the bird and the scout as the best options. The Bird has a ~35mm longer wheelbase, a dramatic difference- trail vs 'all mountain' hardtails. The bird will be happy at higher speeds than the scout and more forgiving of rider error. The scout will be more nimble and fun on flatter trails. Both are good.

    I haven't looked at component spec super super closely because frame/fork is so important and deore/gx/slx are all fine and bikes at this price point tend to come with unremarkable/functional wheels and cockpit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanceton View Post
    I now have 100mm RockShox Recon Silver
    That's having a massive influence on your riding experience. A good fork is way more important than wheel size or tire diameter or especially frame material, and a recon silver is not a good fork. The fork is half the bike and i wouldn't hesitate to put a TOTL fork on a bike otherwise built up with deore level bits. Personally, I'd spring for the mrp stage on the bird. Worth it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanceton View Post
    I was thinking that I wouldn't go past 140mm
    Meh. Fork travel doesn't impact the ride of a long travel hardtail as much as you'd think, provided it's a good fork that can be tuned to have a controlled ride. A bigger fork tends to be found on bikes with longer wheelbases and heavier build kits, and that's where you get a real difference in personality.




    IMO
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
    Mikhail Kalashnikov

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nauc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    2,908

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation: huckleberry hound's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    555
    Quote Originally Posted by nauc View Post
    Chain stays too long for me. 450mm is too long for today's bikes.
    Change begins by doing something different.

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nauc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    2,908
    as long as the ratios stay the same

    ex.. longer front center = longer chainstay

    otherwise the bike wont feel balanced

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation: huckleberry hound's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    555
    Quote Originally Posted by nauc View Post
    as long as the ratios stay the same

    ex.. longer front center = longer chainstay

    otherwise the bike wont feel balanced
    That would handle like a school bus. My 2018 Stache has very short chain stays with a longer reach than my Breezer Lightning 29. It is more nimble yet more stable due to the slacker head angle. Long chainstays + long reach makes for a long bike that will not be very nimble. Good luck with switchbacks.
    Change begins by doing something different.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nauc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    2,908
    its all about the wheelbase. long = schoolbus. short = nimble

    not JUST chainstay

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    4

    Bird Zero AM Boost sizing issues!

    Thank you all for the replies! I've decided to go with the Bird Zero AM but I'm puzzled by the sizing. I have messaged Bird and asked for advice, and they said that based on my measurements I should take the Medium-Long, but based on my current bike, the Medium-frame.

    Here are some of my measurements:

    Height: 175,5cm (5 feet and 9.09449)
    Torso: 61cm (2 feet and 0.01575)
    Inseam: 87cm (2 feet and 10.25197)
    Arm: 66cm (2 feet and 1.98425)
    Ape Index: -7.5

    I'm really at a loss which frame I should be getting, my current bike has very short reach (Radon ZR Team 7.0 (Geom: https://imgur.com/a/fQuyqv4 )) though I'm rather happy with the cockpit. I could be a tad bit roomier though. I have swapped the 100mm original stem for a 60mm as it felt a bit stretchy, I guess..

    Here is the geometry sheet for the Bird Zero AM Boost: https://www.bird.bike/wp-content/upl...Data-Sheet.pdf

    Though nothing suggests based on my current bike, that the Medium-frame would be too small, huh? Only thing I can notice being smaller than the Radon is the ST-lenght, which is 410mm. Completely different geometries so I guess it's pretty hard to compare.

    Any insight on the matter would be most helpful, I hope!

  14. #14
    TR
    TR is offline
    Angry bunny
    Reputation: TR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,945
    Nordest Bardino!!!!!!!!

    Deciding on a new hardtail-20180605_082903.jpg

Similar Threads

  1. Deciding on what Hardtail 29er I should get.
    By seangilbert in forum 29er Bikes
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 04-16-2013, 10:09 PM
  2. Deciding between a 26" FS and 29er hardtail
    By Stormwalker in forum Bike and Frame discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-05-2012, 06:45 PM
  3. Trouble Deciding - Steel Hardtail
    By dmgdmg in forum Bike and Frame discussion
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 03-20-2012, 09:36 AM
  4. help deciding on a hardtail
    By zardog in forum Clydesdales/Tall Riders
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 10-24-2011, 08:25 PM
  5. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 07-15-2011, 10:57 AM

Members who have read this thread: 114

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

mtbr.com and the ConsumerReview Network are business units of Invenda Corporation

(C) Copyright 1996-2018. All Rights Reserved.