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  1. #1
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    2.25 Rear AM tire--over thinking

    I am having trouble trying to determine a new rear tire for my knolly endorphin. For reference sake, I ride upstate NY technical trails and east coast enduros.

    Here is what I want out of my rear tire:

    2.25 width (to complement my 2.35 up front-bontrager XR4)
    effective sidewall protection for east coast rocks
    Decently fast rolling
    A tire that breaks free while cornering before the side knobs dig in
    Tubeless (on stans flow)
    800g'ish max

    This summer I went with a 2.3 Spec Purgatory, and although a good tire, I feel like I can improve. IMO it offered too much cornering grip for my riding style, I like to drift a bit before the side knobs dig in. Also, the sidewalls were not strong enough to run tubeless...I ended running a DH tube because I hate getting flats (especially Enduro racing).

    Tires I have considered include 2.35 maxxis HR and 2.25 Ardent, not sure if EXO or LUST would be better. A 2.2 bontrager XR4. Michelin Wild Race'r & grip'r.

    I have researched myself into indecisiveness so now I need the internet to tell me what to do!

  2. #2
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    I have used the Conti Trail King on both the front and the back of my endorphin. I really like it as a rear tire, it gives lost of traction and corners well (though I doubt im pushing it to the limit). Not sure if it has the breakaway characteristics you are looking for.

    You can get it in their Protection version which is tubeless ready, has reinforced sidewalls and is made with the black chili compound that works great on wet roots and the like.

  3. #3
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    I've been running a 2.26 Ardent EXO (650b) in the rear of my Mojo since early summer, riding in NY, MA, NH, VT. I was looking for something a little faster rolling than the Pacenti Neo-Moto it replaced. I've generally been pleased with it as an all-condition tire.

    Cornering knobs are smaller than what you have on the Purgatory. They break away a little more easily than the Neo-Motos, but that isn't surprising. I think they feel a little vague sometimes, but they do slide reasonably well.

    I run them tubeless at 24ish PSI on a 23mm internal/30mm external rim. I don't feel any sidewall squirliness (I'm about 175 geared). They've been durable on rocks so far.

  4. #4
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    Thanks for your insight guys. Lazarus, how is the sizing of the 2.25 ardent? I know that Maxxis run notoriously small. Is the 2.25 more like a 2.1?

    One tired I really enjoyed in the back was a 2.25 moto raptor once the center knobs got worn down.

  5. #5
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    Trail King

  6. #6
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    you gotta get the GRID model with spechy tires. i have this incredibly worn out spechy eskar grid and its my silver bullet rear tire for fast rolling and the right amount of cornering. and the grid is by far the most durable, foolproof UST design i have ever used

    if you had the grid purgatory, I would say all you'd have to do is wear down or cut away some knobs and you'd be golden

    mine has been on 3 different frames and has come out of retirement on several occasions

  7. #7
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    I'm running the 27.5x2.25 EXO Ardent and on a Flow EX rim it runs a tad oversize at 2.28" wide, I've found that newer Maxxis tires run very true to size. It rolls well and gets great climbing traction and straight line breaking traction. It holds a cornering line well and also comes around nicely when you want to drift it by getting rear brake involved. With the aggressive corner knobs of the HR and HR2 I would stay away if you like to drift. The Trail king is a great tire but IMO way to grippy since he likes to drift the rear.

  8. #8
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    Yeah, I think I purchased the basic Purgatory control. With the grid casing, which would I get for running on my flow rim? The Grid 2bliss ready, or GRID UST...I don't have a UST rim so I assume former.

    The 2.1 GRID ground control interests me, I wonder if running 2.35 F and 2.1 rear is too much disparity in size.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by ride the biscuit View Post
    you gotta get the GRID model with spechy tires. i have this incredibly worn out spechy eskar grid and its my silver bullet rear tire for fast rolling and the right amount of cornering. and the grid is by far the most durable, foolproof UST design i have ever used

    if you had the grid purgatory, I would say all you'd have to do is wear down or cut away some knobs and you'd be golden

    mine has been on 3 different frames and has come out of retirement on several occasions
    This. The Spec ground control 2.3 GRID UST is my go-to rear tire for my chilcotin. It is a little heavier but I will take it in a heartbeat compared to how many other rear tires I have ripped through, especially the sidewalls.

    I got a good 7 months out of one rear GRID UST ground control with many, many bike park days as well as trail riding 3-4 times a week. I had 2 good weeks on a nobby nic pacestar before I popped a hole in the tread (between knobs) and then finished it with a 2 inch sidewall gash. $70 down the drain. I rode the GC just as hard if not harder than the NN. This has been and will be my go-to rear tire, but that being said I need to try a few more before I can count any other out. I ran minions for 4 years, I would like to give the HR2 a shot. The ardent was god awful POS...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaXCarp View Post
    Yeah, I think I purchased the basic Purgatory control. With the grid casing, which would I get for running on my flow rim? The Grid 2bliss ready, or GRID UST...I don't have a UST rim so I assume former.

    The 2.1 GRID ground control interests me, I wonder if running 2.35 F and 2.1 rear is too much disparity in size.
    i dont know the difference between 2bliss and ust. if you find out, tell me! pretty sure i have the ust; if I remember to check ill post up

    but i have owned UST/LUST/etc... from all most of the companies except for conit, and this GRID is the absolute bees knees

    it seals up with a floor pump on basically whatever rim you put it on ust or not (unlike all other UST tires ive tried), and i have NEVER had so much as a burp, flat, tear, puncture or single issue with it. ive used it on dt ex500s, flows (older model), and mavic en521 which are not UST and it has been flawless

    Funny thing is i have been running this tire for almost 3 YEARS on and off, ha, thats actually pretty funny but true....it is the holy grail as far as I can tell

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ride the biscuit View Post
    i dont know the difference between 2bliss and ust. if you find out, tell me! pretty sure i have the ust; if I remember to check ill post up
    UST = inside of tire fully lined with butyl so it can be run tubeless with no sealant.
    2bliss = same bead and shape as UST so it can be run tubeless, but no butyl lining, so it is lighter but sealant must be used to air up tubeless.

    GRID is ok, but expensive. I've torn a few GRID casings and for the price, I'm done with them. For the same cost I would get a Schwalbe Hans Dampf. But for less money you can get a Conti Mountain King II (get the 2.4, caus' the 2.2 is really small), or a 2.2 Trail King, or even a 2.4 X-King for super fast smooth terrain.

    I ride in the North East too, and am currently running and liking my 2.4 Mountain King II in ProTection, with Black Chili. I think the Hans Dampf is great when it's wet out, the sidewall is super durable (though the TrailStar compound will wear out quick, especially on the back) and relatively light, but it's $30 more than the Conti.

    When I rode the Killington Enduro in August, I swapped out my Conti for a DH-casing 2.35 60a High Roller that I ran in tubeless on my back wheel on a Flow EX. Despite being a little narrow, and slightly portly (at around 1000g), it's a solid, fast, dependable rear tire for when things get rough and fast. Like an Enduro Race.
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  12. #12
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    So my leader in the clubhouse is a 2.3 Spec Ground Control GRID UST. It comes in at 890g. I think the 2.1 version would just be too small for the demands I put on a bike. If it is not drifty enough for my liking, I could trim down the transition knobs.

    I figure all summer I was running a 685g purgatory with a 400g downhill tube so I still will lose 200g of weight out back with this big hunk of rubber.

    Unless someone sheds some serious light on the situation, I think im gonna pull the trigger on that. Plus my new endorphin is coming on Wed so I gotta get some shoes for it!

    Edit...either that or the 2.4 mountain king II, I told you all I was indecisive

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaXCarp View Post
    So my leader in the clubhouse is a 2.3 Spec Ground Control GRID UST. It comes in at 890g. I think the 2.1 version would just be too small for the demands I put on a bike. If it is not drifty enough for my liking, I could trim down the transition knobs.

    I figure all summer I was running a 685g purgatory with a 400g downhill tube so I still will lose 200g of weight out back with this big hunk of rubber.

    Unless someone sheds some serious light on the situation, I think im gonna pull the trigger on that. Plus my new endorphin is coming on Wed so I gotta get some shoes for it!

    Edit...either that or the 2.4 mountain king II, I told you all I was indecisive
    The non-UST bead types work better with Stan's rims.
    Last edited by Miker J; 11-06-2013 at 06:47 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaXCarp View Post
    Edit...either that or the 2.4 mountain king II, I told you all I was indecisive
    such a great topic to overthink though! I've definitely been way down this wormhole, myself.

    slyfink definitely threw a wrench into my suggestion since he basically named all the high end tires I havnt tried, but since the eskar has been discontinued I am sure I will pick up a Grid GC someday

    actually, I have a barely worn minion exo 2.5 if anyone wants to trade for any spechy grid tire...I have minions F & R on the big bike. Its my favorite front but just too slow rolling on rear

  15. #15
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    i will spend the money to run a Hans Dampf up front all day long, but in the rear 90 for a tire that doesnt last i cant justify the price. on the rear of my enduro i am running a 2.3 ground control with control casing at the moment, sliced it throught the tread, patched it with a park tire boot and super glue and still running strong. but when i replace it i will go with the Grid Tubliss Ready flavor. should be the same protection while still saving a bit of weight over the Grid UST even while still using sealant.
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  16. #16
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    I used to run hans dampf up front but I got fed up with its lack of durability. I also found that it broke free a little too easily once up to speed in the front. I switched to the bontrager Xr4 Team 2.35 and am digging that so far.

    I did it, I've done it, I'll do it again...pulled the trigger on the Spec GC 2.3 GRID UST for the rear

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaXCarp View Post
    I used to run hans dampf up front but I got fed up with its lack of durability. I also found that it broke free a little too easily once up to speed in the front. I switched to the bontrager Xr4 Team 2.35 and am digging that so far.

    I did it, I've done it, I'll do it again...pulled the trigger on the Spec GC 2.3 GRID UST for the rear
    I have been running, and really like the 2.35 XR4 on the fronts of my bikes as well. The smaller size works quite well on the back, FWIW. Riding similar type of terrain and trail as what you've got, haven't had durability issues with it so far.

    Summertime, the Captain 2.2 UST has been great on the back, but once the leaves are down enough, it gets a bit too slippy. Great fast rolling and grippy summer tire for out here though. Pairs really well with that XR4 up front.
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  18. #18
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    Why did you get the UST version if you have flow rims ? I assume you're running sealant ? If so UST is not necessary and extra weight IMHO. I'm in NJ and run Conti trail king protection or TR Hans dampfs BTW.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    Why did you get the UST version if you have flow rims ? I assume you're running sealant ? If so UST is not necessary and extra weight IMHO. I'm in NJ and run Conti trail king protection or TR Hans dampfs BTW.
    I may have made a mistake there. I was under the impression that those have thicker/stronger sidewalls. Can I run these on stans rims w/o sealant or minimal sealant?

    I have plenty of experience w/ HD's but am fed up with their (lack of) durability and vagueness up front at speed.

  20. #20
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    The DHR II is a pretty under-rated tire. It's 780 grams for the 2.3 tubeless ready casing. It drifts a bit before connecting, as you say you like. I think it's better than the High Roller 2. Same side knobs as a DHF, and really excellent braking performance. Don't expect it to roll quick though.

  21. #21
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    I ride eastern Pa rock's, root's ect and use a Trailking 2.4 blackchili in back now. It works well and is slideable with the current leaf cover, without it stick's pretty damn hard though. If I was looking for something faster and slideable I'd probly head toward a X-king in black chili...
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  22. #22
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    You should have no prob running your GC UST grid w/o sealant. I only dip a paper towel in sealant and go around edge of tire and rim just to make mounting go quick

  23. #23
    Te mortuo heres tibi sim?
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    Why did you get the UST version if you have flow rims ? I assume you're running sealant ? If so UST is not necessary and extra weight IMHO. I'm in NJ and run Conti trail king protection or TR Hans dampfs BTW.
    I can't speak for the OP, but I prefer the extra beef for the rear tire. I'll take the little bit of weight hit if it means my tire doesn't get ganked up by some of our east coast rocks.

    Some of the newer "tubeless ready" tires are certainly tougher than they used to be, and I'm liking the couple I'm trying now, but i don't expect them to stand up to the same abuse as a full UST tire.

    When doing Gorilla tape tubeless in the past with regular tires, they all ended up tearing or getting sidewall punctures eventually.
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  24. #24
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    I'd never use regular tires and run them tubeless but since the tubeless ready style has come out I've been a big fan. I ride very rocky trails and knock on wood have been lucky. Maxxis Schwalbe Continental and WTB.

  25. #25
    Te mortuo heres tibi sim?
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    I'd never use regular tires and run them tubeless but since the tubeless ready style has come out I've been a big fan. I ride very rocky trails and knock on wood have been lucky. Maxxis Schwalbe Continental and WTB.
    Well, as I said, the regular tires setup tubeless was when I was doing it early on with the Gorilla tape ghetto conversion. Since swapping to UST/tubeless ready, it's not been an issue.

    I like the TR stuff for fronts, but don't have a problem with a little extra weight in a rear tire if it means not tearing a tire up. That said, the TR tires I'm trying on the back of all three bikes at the moment are doing okay so far...

    Plus, I've got a stock of full UST tires to use up anyhow - already own them, may as well use them up! A few extra grams is no big deal - it's not as if I'm earning a living riding bikes, and need to squeeze out every gram!
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