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  1. #1
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    XX1 gearing: Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios

    I did a bunch of searching around to compare the gearing for my existing XX 2x10 with 24/38 in front and 11/36 in the rear in order to decide what would be the best gearing for the very steep bay area mountains for my XX upgrade. I was annoyed by the simple rounding that everyone was doing just to one decimal place which did not give an accurate comparison and a good sense for the gear spacing that is inherent to XX and XX1.

    As you can see in this chart the granny gear on my XX is equivalent to a .667 gear ratio so if I go with a 28 front chainring with XX1 I will get the exact same ratio for the lowest gear and be effectively at the same ratio as having my front chain ring at 38 and rear in the second gear which is roughly 13.78 ratio. So I only lose two very top end gears. You can play around with the assumptions to fit your style and specific geography.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails XX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-sram_gearing_xx_xx1.png  

    Last edited by drolling; 05-20-2013 at 10:36 AM.

  2. #2
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    I think I understand. If I wanted to go XX1 without loosing too many of my climbing gears and I currently run 39/26 up front and 11-36 rear I would have the same range minus 1 small cog by going with the 36t up front?
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    Yes, that is basically the conclusion I came to. You either lose one at the top end or one at the bottom end of the range. For the big hills we have in SF I am mostly coasting on the way down for the technical trails so don't need the high speed gear and would rather have a lower gear.

  4. #4
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    If you go with 36 up front with XX1 you would actually lose your two bottom low gears

    Here is a picture of your setup now and what it would look like. If you go with 36 up front with XX1 you would actually lose your two bottom low gears. 34 would be a little worse losing 1 and change of your climbing gears. A 32 would be a touch lower than your second lowest gear and 30 would be also a touch lower than your lowest gear. The chart that is attached should help you out.


    XX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-xx_26.39-11.36.png


    Quote Originally Posted by J3SSEB View Post
    I think I understand. If I wanted to go XX1 without loosing too many of my climbing gears and I currently run 39/26 up front and 11-36 rear I would have the same range minus 1 small cog by going with the 36t up front?
    Last edited by drolling; 05-21-2013 at 07:11 AM.

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    The nice thing is you can swap out the front chain ring quite easily. I have a 32 up front and for So Cal conditions it works well.

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    Chain ring length switching front cogs on xx1

    DeeZee: any idea if you have to adjust the chain lengths if you switch between cogs? Does that mean you have to buy a couple of chains for the different size front chains?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeZee View Post
    The nice thing is you can swap out the front chain ring quite easily. I have a 32 up front and for So Cal conditions it works well.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by drolling View Post
    Here is a picture of your setup now and what it would look like. If you go with 36 up front with XX1 you would actually lose your two bottom low gears. 34 would be a little worse losing 1 and change of your climbing gears. A 32 would be a touch lower than your second lowest gear and 30 would be also a touch lower than your lowest gear. The chart that is attached should help you out.


    Attachment 799327
    Cool. Thanks for doing this. I think I can manage loosing some small gears and tall ones. 34t up front sounds good. I may do that.
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    I have 2 chainrings and 2 chains. 32T for at home (Netherlands) and a 28T for in the Alps. In this way i have big gears for flat grounds and climbing gears in the Alps. Regarding the 28T i'm losing some big gears but that is no problem. When going downhill...just use the flow and stop pedaling.

    As far as i understand from SRAM you can go 1 size chainring bigger or smaller without changing the chain. Which should mean i could run 28T and 32T when i shorten my chain on a 30T. Nevertheless i have chosen to run 2 chains. Keeps the wear down also.

  9. #9
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    You can also play with gear ratios here...Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Gear Calculator

    SPP
    Rigid.

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    I'm a fan of this gear calculator. It allows you to compare to set ups at once and has lots of pre-made cassettes and chainring combos in it, including XX1.

    http://www.gear-calculator.com/#

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by drolling View Post
    DeeZee: any idea if you have to adjust the chain lengths if you switch between cogs? Does that mean you have to buy a couple of chains for the different size front chains?
    The rule of thumb is up or down one size you are ok. Two sizes and you need two chains. I don't know this for sure because the 32 seems to work fine for me and haven't had the need to change.

  12. #12
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    XX1 gearing: Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gea...

    DRolling, would love to see the ratios for the brand new Shimano xtr 11-40 cassette...can't find a calculator as clear and simple as yours...possible to do? Cog is 11-13-15-17-19-21-24-27-31-35-40. Curious to see various chain rings 28, 30, 32, 34. Thanks so much in advance if you can do it...not looking to create work for you!

    Edit: figured it out! Easy math.
    Last edited by MattMay; 04-14-2014 at 06:53 AM.

  13. #13
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    Shimano 1x11 comparison chart

    Here you go! Enjoy.

    XX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-shimano_1x11_comparison.jpgXX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-xx1-1x11-gearing-comparison.jpg
    Last edited by drolling; 04-14-2014 at 03:22 PM.

  14. #14
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    XX1 gearing: Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios

    Thank you!! Figured it out but yours is prettier!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Sorry Matt was in Vegas this weekend and didn't have access to a computer to get this done sooner for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ALS650L View Post
    I'm a fan of this gear calculator. It allows you to compare to set ups at once and has lots of pre-made cassettes and chainring combos in it, including XX1.

    http://www.gear-calculator.com/#
    Thanks for the link. That is the best gear calculator I've seen and I've tried a few. It provides a graphic/visual comparison of two gear ranges as well as providing ratios and gear inches.
    The trouble with having an open mind is that people will insist on trying to put things in it.

  17. #17
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    Ronnie,

    The problem with this and every other gear calculator is that you have to drag and drop a bunch of different gears and it does not allow you to quickly and easily compare what you have now and what you want to achieve. If you have a current set up most riders already know what gear they have to be along different segments of your favorite ride. So for me in my old 2x10 set up I knew that I needed at least the second lowest gear to climb any hill in the bay area and that an extra granny gear was also nice when I got tired. I also knew that I seldom ever used the very tallest gears so was willing to sacrifice 2-3 mph of top speed in exchange for better climbing gears. Everyone has a different preference and since I already did the work all you have to do is spot check your current set up and match it with what you want.

    No normal human being understands how many gear inches they are pulling nor is that a particularly relevant data set. What is relevant is what gear am I in now to keep up my cadence and if I switch gearing what will I need to meet 90% of my goals.

    I think all 1x11 set ups are significantly better. What you lose out in range you can easily make up for in losing half a pound of weight and the inherent maintenance and complexity associated with a front derailleur.

  18. #18
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    With all due respect, I have to disagree with you. That gear calculator, unlike most others, displays up to two totally separate drive trains. They are displayed one above the other in a linear fashion for direct comparison. You can also shift the chain rings to immediately see how it changes. Therefore it very much allows me to directly compare what I currently have with any possible drive train, lined up one against the other.

    Not only is gear inches important, it is perhaps the most important value. It is not very difficult to understand. Simply put it is the number of inches the wheel rotates with one revolution of the cranks. It is influenced by the wheel size and even tire size. In other words wheel diameter. If for example I was building a new 29" bike and my old bike was a 26", I can directly find out how the gearing compares by considering gear inches. Gear ratio doesn't tell me what the final drive would be like. The gear calculator inputs wheel size and tire size.

    By the way, I'm also in the Bay Area so I know some of the climbs around here can be brutal. I've considered an XX1 drive train but it just doesn't work for me. I've currently got a 29" bike with a nine speed 22/34T granny gear which is lower than the 28/42T on XX1. with a 32T ring I have better range than XX1, both top and bottom. I really don't care about a few ounces and will stick with a two ring crankset.
    The trouble with having an open mind is that people will insist on trying to put things in it.

  19. #19
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    Wondering if anyone on this thread could explain why my brand new XX1 cassette won't fit onto the following freebody that converted onto my DT swiss hub perfectly:

    Full Warranty DT Swiss XD 11 Speed 142x12mm thru Axle Freehub Body for XX1 | eBay

    The free body has one special male slot that is unlike the surrounding slots while the cassette has the same size female slots throughout. I guess I was duped somehow?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpjumper61 View Post
    Wondering if anyone on this thread could explain why my brand new XX1 cassette won't fit onto the following freebody that converted onto my DT swiss hub perfectly:

    Full Warranty DT Swiss XD 11 Speed 142x12mm thru Axle Freehub Body for XX1 | eBay

    The free body has one special male slot that is unlike the surrounding slots while the cassette has the same size female slots throughout. I guess I was duped somehow?
    I figured it out. This is why I should not wrench on bikes late at night. For those of you new to XX1/X01 you need to know something. When installing the cassette there is no separate nut that you screw on to hold the cassette on to the freehub. Normally you slide on the cassette and it seats all the way onto the free hub and THEN you install your nut and torque it down. Well, not anymore!! With the XX1/X01 you slide on the cassette but it does not seat all the way on the freehub, rather it stops flush with the keys approx 3/16 from all the way on.

    You then take your park cassette tightening tool and screw the cassette on, the nut is not a separate item but basically built in to the cassette to form a one piece system. When you tighten the cassette then seats all the way to the rear of the freehub.

    Hope this helps some newbees out there who won't be scratching their head like I did.

  21. #21
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    XX1 gearing: Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gea...

    Quote Originally Posted by drolling View Post
    Sorry Matt was in Vegas this weekend and didn't have access to a computer to get this done sooner for you.
    You were more than helpful. I found your chart most useful...three decimals vs one, and because most of us --who know how our gears feel, the cadence we like, which ones we use in which trails--really just need reference points. For me, ctual/absolute numbers aren't meaningful, just ability to know chain X cog=what I use on this/that trail, climb, etc). Big help, so thanks again!

    I built out a chart that's not designed as well as yours, but was able to decide that waiting for the new 11/40 Shimano and a 32 chain would be my sweet spot for so Cal when I convert from 2x10 to 1x11.

    You ride out Vegas way? Spent Thanksgiving there last year...some good trails.

    XX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-imageuploadedbytapatalk1397530568.196304.jpg

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    Matt,

    You are hitting the nail on the head here and this is exactly why I built the chart. People are adding in all kinds of crazy variables like switching out to custom cranks and rings and different size wheels. 90% of all people know what rough gear they use on what trails and sections. What people really need with a 1x11 setup is to find the lowest gear possible that will enable them to still comfortably climb the steepest hill. With a 1x11 setup the trade off is less range between gears and you are going to lose maybe 1 to 1.5 of your highest and/or lowest gears depending on what you are going after. Most people can live with that trade off given you lose half a pound and most importantly when taking a bike off road you are reducing a very large failure point which is the front derailleur. My bike with xx1 is now basically zero maintenance versus before when cables stretched, dirt got into the mechanics or if you crashed it was a delicate thing that was easily damaged. I also don't think SRAM is particularly good at making a front derailleur in either road or mtb formats. I know because I have had them all. I also love the simplicity of my cockpit with XX1.

    If you are firing an artillery weapon and want to know where the bullet should be aimed so it will land in the place you want it to there are two different methodologies.
    1) you spend a lot of time calculating variances in wind speed, weight of the shell, force of the propellant, heat of the shell at velocity, air temperature and density, wind resistance, and the list goes on and on.

    2) Another more intelligent and successful strategy is you just point the weapon and fire it and see where the shell lands. You then just adjust where you are pointing until it goes where you want it to. That term is called bore sighting and this is exactly what I was trying to do with this chart.

    The people who keep on posting their silly gear calculators are getting caught up in the minutia and not realizing what a simple chart can do for you which is to get you riding the right gear ratios with the best tradeoffs.

  23. #23
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    Stumpjumper61

    I love working on my bike as well and have learned the same thing about working too late on bikes can cause a lack of sleep at best or frustration at worst.

    Glad you were able to figure it out. On XX1 the freehub body just pops off with hand pressure and you put it on with your hands and then wrench on the cassette. By the way if you have not tried Pedro's cassette tool designed by Lennard Zinn you are in for a real treat. It made playing around with my cassettes with my constant tinkering much less painful on my knuckles and hands from removing them with a traditional chain whip.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpjumper61 View Post
    I figured it out. This is why I should not wrench on bikes late at night. For those of you new to XX1/X01 you need to know something. When installing the cassette there is no separate nut that you screw on to hold the cassette on to the freehub. Normally you slide on the cassette and it seats all the way onto the free hub and THEN you install your nut and torque it down. Well, not anymore!! With the XX1/X01 you slide on the cassette but it does not seat all the way on the freehub, rather it stops flush with the keys approx 3/16 from all the way on.

    You then take your park cassette tightening tool and screw the cassette on, the nut is not a separate item but basically built in to the cassette to form a one piece system. When you tighten the cassette then seats all the way to the rear of the freehub.

    Hope this helps some newbees out there who won't be scratching their head like I did.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by drolling View Post
    The people who keep on posting their silly gear calculators are getting caught up in the minutia and not realizing what a simple chart can do for you which is to get you riding the right gear ratios with the best tradeoffs.

    I guess everyone operates differently because honestly I can't make heads or tails of your chart. The gear calculator that ALS650L posted looks interesting but also seems a little time consuming. For me nothing is simpler than this one- BikeCalc.com - Bicycle Gear Inches Chart

    Super easy and quick to change ratios around and if I want to compare one setup to another I just open another window and place them side by side. What is your problem with gear inches? For me one reference # is as good as another.

  25. #25
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    JB Weld:

    My chart is super simple to read. All you do is look on the left side and find your existing XX or XTR 2x10 lowest gear ratio that you can comfortably climb your steepest hill on whatever ride you like. Then you look on the right side for the XX1 or XTR 1x11 different front chain rings and match that number to roughly the same number you already picked on the left hand side of the chart.

    Easy peazey lemon squeezy as my daughter likes to say.


    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    I guess everyone operates differently because honestly I can't make heads or tails of your chart. The gear calculator that ALS650L posted looks interesting but also seems a little time consuming. For me nothing is simpler than this one- BikeCalc.com - Bicycle Gear Inches Chart

    Super easy and quick to change ratios around and if I want to compare one setup to another I just open another window and place them side by side. What is your problem with gear inches? For me one reference # is as good as another.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by drolling View Post
    My chart is super simple to read.

    I suppose so, I'll keep using my "silly" gear inch chart though. Even easier.

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    Oh yeah gear inches make about as much sense to normal people as calculating things in terms of british standard units. How many inches in a mile, how many teaspoons in a cup.

    From wikipedia:

    Gear inches express gear ratios in terms of the diameter of an equivalent directly driven wheel, and is calculated as follows:

    \text{gear inches} = \text{drive wheel diameter in inches}\times\frac{\text{number of teeth in front chainring}}{\text{number of teeth in rear sprocket}}
    This formula assumes that any hub gear is in direct drive. A further factor is needed for other gears (many online gear calculators have these factors built in for common hub gears).

    For simplicity, 'gear inches' is normally rounded to the nearest whole number.

    For example, suppose the drive wheel is actually 26 inches in diameter. If the front chainring and rear sprocket have equal numbers of teeth, one turn of the pedals produces exactly one turn of the drive wheel, just as if the pedals were directly driving the drive wheel. That combination of gears and wheel is said to be "26 gear inches." If the front chainring has 48 teeth and the rear sprocket has 24 teeth, then each turn of the pedals produces two turns of the rear wheel. This is equivalent to doubling the size of the drive wheel; that is, it is like a directly driven bicycle with a 52-inch wheel. That gear is said to be "52 gear inches."

    A bicycle with a 26-inch wheel, a 48-tooth chainring, and a cassette with gears ranging from 11 to 34 teeth has a lowest gear of 26 × 48 / 34 = 37 gear inches and a highest gear of 26 × 48 / 11 = 113 gear inches.

    For bicycles with 700c wheels, some cyclists quote gear inches based on a nominal wheel diameter of 27 inches, corresponding to the old British tire size of 27 x 1¼" (ETRTO 630). Strictly speaking, the rolling diameter of a 700c wheel may be significantly higher or lower than 27", depending on the tire size, e.g. nearly 27.5" for a 700x38 tire, or just over 26" for a 700x20 tire. This can be the source of some confusion when comparing gears unless it is clear whether gear inches have been calculated using the actual wheel size or a conventionalised 27".

    One way to estimate wheel diameter is to add twice the nominal tyre cross-section to the rim diameter. For example, consider a 700c × 23 mm tire, which has a nominal cross-section of 23 mm. 700c wheels have a rim diameter of 622 mm. Hence the wheel diameter is (2 × 23 mm) + 622 mm = 668 mm which is equal to 26.3 inches (rounded to 1 decimal place). 26 inch mountain bicycle wheels have a rim diameter of 559 mm. This ignores factors that contribute to the actual rolling radius of the tyre and rim together: the vertical deflection of the tire above the contact patch and the difference between the manufacturer's stated size and the actual tire radius when mounted and inflated.

    Conversion from gear inches and cadence to speed is simple: gear inches multiplied by cadence divided by 336 equals miles per hour.

    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    I suppose so, I'll keep using my "silly" gear inch chart though. Even easier.

  28. #28
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    So what does .713 mean? I get it that it's a ratio but really for all practical purposes it's just a reference # and it's actual definition is meaningless, just like gear inches are. If you look at the chart I referenced you'll see that you can easily change wheel and tire size. You can change it to metric. You can check speed at cadence, or cadence at speed, etc., etc. You can even convert to ratios if that's your cup of tea. I know that right now my low gear is 29.2 gear inches and I can cross reference any combo of chainring and cog sizes to match that number in seconds.

    If your chart is easier for you and others that's great, for me the BikeCalc gear inch chart is more straightforward, quicker, and easier.

  29. #29
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    JB take that long definition on wikipedia of gear inches and compare it to a definition of a ratio. You take one ratio from one set of gears and then compare it to another set of gears and you will get what gears you should buy. Yes it appears that you got my point that a ratio is just a reference number but perhaps missed the point that it is a very easy reference number to understand. Gear inches 'is actually the diameter in inches of the drive wheel of a penny-farthing bicycle with equivalent gearing' which under no scenario is easy to understand

    Most people are not looking to mix variables of different tires or custom cranks while switching out gears. The online gear calculators are vastly more accurate and flexible for people such as yourself who are constantly changing very unusual set ups. That use case is the minority so knock yourself out. My chart was for people who just wanted to eyeball it and go for a ride.


    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    So what does .713 mean? I get it that it's a ratio but really for all practical purposes it's just a reference # and it's actual definition is meaningless, just like gear inches are. If you look at the chart I referenced you'll see that you can easily change wheel and tire size. You can change it to metric. You can check speed at cadence, or cadence at speed, etc., etc. You can even convert to ratios if that's your cup of tea. I know that right now my low gear is 29.2 gear inches and I can cross reference any combo of chainring and cog sizes to match that number in seconds.

    If your chart is easier for you and others that's great, for me the BikeCalc gear inch chart is more straightforward, quicker, and easier.

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    when is someone going to come out with bigger cogs for XX1/XO1? you can put a 42T on a 10 speed from a number of sources. I just can't see myself giving up the range of a 3X setup yet. say a 34T in front and then a 10-52 cassette...now that would be great.

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    Slowride. I have wondered the same question and am annoyed they use aluminum versus titanium for the final drive which is the gear that takes the most amount of torque given it is so large and thus prone to more wear.

    For me in the bay area I am using a 28 front chainring and am able to climb anything here. The trade off is I lose about 1-1.5 of my highest end gear which is about 2mph.
    The funny thing is that at high speed it really isnt much of a difference given how drag becomes a cubic function at speed. In other words at high speed differences in gearing become much less relevant. So your tallest gears might make you theoretically go faster but in reality the wind resistance is too much to overcome.

    If I were you I would try out a 28 if you have steep hills and my bet is you will love it.

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    I ride a 32x17 for my single speed when commuting and tried 32x20 on the trail. I run out of top end very easily with both of these ratios. I could try a 13T and see what it is like to compare to a 28x11.

    I guess I need to work on my finesse, since I found it hard to apply power out of the saddle and not loose traction with a 32x20 ratio on small climbs. I haven't even thought about climbing some of the places where I can't make it up with a 3X9 setup.

  33. #33
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    at least Shimano and I agree on one thing...2X10 is not going away anytime soon and regardless of all the 1X poop that we all read about, the 38-24t with a 11-36t on a 29er is still a very good fit for alot of folks
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails XX1 gearing:  Handy chart to see what front chain ring to buy based on XX gear ratios-dsc01888.jpg  

    2014 Nail Trail 29...

  34. #34
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    Question on an old 3X8 going to 2X8 .... is this a viable option ?

    I'm thinking about a change on an old 3X8 but not sure if it's realistic. My middle ring is slightly bent and with the newer trends about going simpler, maybe I can live with a shorter range and go two rings in front while still using the rear cog as is.
    Without spending money like going 9-10 or 11 on the back, it is appealing but I'm not sure if it's realistic.

    What teeth count should I consider up front?

    My bike is a 26" and this is the set up as new;

    Crankset Shimano FC-MC 20, 22/32/42 teeth
    Rear Cog 8-speed, 12 - 30 teeth
    Chain Shimano CN-IG31, 1/2 x 3/32"

    My goal is just to keep the bike rolling on the fun trails and paths, no racing or super techy bashing stuff, still want some granny gear for uphills and maybe the compromise will be loosing some big gear that would be for higher speed I can live without.
    I'm not riding fast, was just out yesterday and on the big ring front and middle of the rear cog-20- 21st gear maybe and rolling 15-18 mph on a path.

    Any thoughts or opinions are appreciated as this is a bit over my head.

  35. #35
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    I myself prefer comparing ratios if I am going to be changing gears. Gear inches is fine but in the end you are still comparing one number to another. Ratios are an easier calculation and tell you the same thing... That is gear is taller or shorter than that gear.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenDragoon View Post
    I myself prefer comparing ratios if I am going to be changing gears. Gear inches is fine but in the end you are still comparing one number to another. Ratios are an easier calculation and tell you the same thing... That is gear is taller or shorter than that gear.
    Well, if I did the math right and recall correctly, dividing tooth # and comparing, I came up with a 9% difference on the smaller front ring/granny gear cog as 30t on the back versus present 22t or swapping to 24t. It is now a 1.36 and would change to 1.25 ... ?

    Seems like 29" bikes with a good enough granny gear would be even lower on a 26" as per final drive ratio at the rear wheel so I might be able to use gearing info to compare. 26" vs 29" is approx that 9%.
    Last edited by bachman1961; 06-15-2014 at 12:06 AM. Reason: fixing math

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    Quote Originally Posted by bachman1961 View Post
    Well, if I did the math right and recall correctly, dividing tooth # and comparing, I came up with a 9% difference on the smaller front ring/granny gear cog as 30t on the back versus present 22t or swapping to 24t. It is now a 1.36 and would change to 1.25 ... ?

    Seems like 29" bikes with a good enough granny gear would be even lower on a 26" as per final drive ratio at the rear wheel so I might be able to use gearing info to compare. 26" vs 29" is approx that 9%.
    That is true. Smaller wheels make any ratio shorter however we are talking about changing ratios on an existing system, not comparing one wheel size to another. The point the OP was that when changing drivetrain configurations is you can compare what you have to what you want to change to and weigh up the pro's and cons.

    I personally agree with the OP in that you really need to consider your lower gears when making changes. We all enjoy the time on the bike so its important to consider your climbing gears. The last thing you want to be doing is walking your bike up a hill that you could be riding up. I run a 26t front with a X01 cassette to give me mega low gears for extended cat 4 hill climbing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenDragoon View Post
    I personally agree with the OP in that you really need to consider your lower gears when making changes. We all enjoy the time on the bike so its important to consider your climbing gears. The last thing you want to be doing is walking your bike up a hill that you could be riding up. I run a 26t front with a X01 cassette to give me mega low gears for extended cat 4 hill climbing.
    I agree and my focus is on the low range concern with using the 8 ring as is. Maybe the thing to do is put the bike in the gear that closly represents my thinking of the modified granny gear and go ride some steeps. I'd be adding two more teeth and be at 1.25 first gear.
    I was comparing wheel size to illistrate context; That a "modern bike" (hehe) like a 29er as a 2x10 or 3x9 in many cases comes as a low range of 1.50. That seems to be the 29" equal to the 26" 1.36 that I have now.

    I've seen plenty of feedback by riders who recently went to the newer size bikes and the newer drive-train gearing. Some are having to become stronger riders or claiming the bike doesn't climb as well from what they were used to. Def don't want to be in that situation although many riders going 1x or 2x from 3 rings are stepping up a bit to do so. The most common advice I see about those conversions is they are stronger riders (than before) and warn or advise others they will be too (or are inferring they need to be). That has to be the result of the plus side= simpler shifts and mechanics by way of less ratio options.
    If by design, you set it up to favor the low end for your riding terrain preference, that makes perfect sense. I'm going to see if I can reasonably compromise on both ends of the ratio extremes. I'm not too worried about the top speed. I need to prove to myself I can muster the will to climb in what might be my 2nd gear as the new granny range.

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    Does anyone know what the rules are with fitting the XX1 chain? How long should it be?

    Large cog to large cog plus 2 links?

    I've a Highball Hardtail so suspension isn't an issue.

    Many thanks in advance

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    Great info! Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by bachman1961 View Post

    I've seen plenty of feedback by riders who recently went to the newer size bikes and the newer drive-train gearing. Some are having to become stronger riders or claiming the bike doesn't climb as well from what they were used to. Def don't want to be in that situation although many riders going 1x or 2x from 3 rings are stepping up a bit to do so. The most common advice I see about those conversions is they are stronger riders (than before) and warn or advise others they will be too (or are inferring they need to be). That has to be the result of the plus side= simpler shifts and mechanics by way of less ratio options.
    If by design, you set it up to favor the low end for your riding terrain preference, that makes perfect sense. I'm going to see if I can reasonably compromise on both ends of the ratio extremes. I'm not too worried about the top speed. I need to prove to myself I can muster the will to climb in what might be my 2nd gear as the new granny range.
    Theres a youtube video I watched a week or two ago on how to improve your hill climbing strength....

    4 minutes basically saying adjust your rear drailleur screw outwards so you cant use your lowest (granny gear). If you have to stop and get off to walk try again next time, and soon you will increase your strength so that you can climb that hill...thanks for the insight genius, I was hoping for some insider piece of information!

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