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  1. #1
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    Tires too slick, need more chunk?

    Have been riding a Specialized Hardrock and loving it for the most part, except for the wash and slide this thing is giving.

    I feel I'm burning a lot more energy fighting the slip than I ever should be and I've had it suggested to me, and thought very much myself, that it's the tread and style of the tire in conjunction with the terrain I'm riding.

    Tires are
    Specialized Fast Trak Sport, 26"x2.0", wire bead, 40TPI with attached pics and I truly feel these are way too slick for the style of riding I'm doing.

    I live and ride in CO, which is known for heavy. hard and rigorous terrain that demands a lot of climbing, navigating and grip and it seems that for this terrain these tires just aren't cutting it.

    Now I will be the first to say it may not be entirely the tires to blame, a number of factors could account for this issue, but this is the most visible thing I can pinpoint.

    Anyone have any input, experience and suggestions for this issue?

    Images:
    http://crev.vo.llnwd.net/o42/mtbrevi...uct_415449.jpg

    http://www.maraton.si/cms/components...ff668c66d4.jpg

    Tires too slick, need more chunk?-camera-total-july-2013-010.jpg

  2. #2
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    first consider what you can do differently with your bike

    how much do you weigh and what is your tire pressure setting? you will get more grip with lower pressure but, especially if you are riding with tubes (go tubeless!), you risk denting your rim and pinch-flatting your tubes.

    weigh distribution and climbing technique. I used to spin out a lot too, then I learned how to cantilever more weight over my rear axle. it is awkward at first and some changes to your cockpit can make a big difference, but you need to learn how to get more weigh over the rear axle while you climb.

    otherwise, the Continental Mountain King and Kenda Nevegal tires come to mind when I think of uncompromised traction. they are slow tires, but they are not known to slip when used correctly!

  3. #3
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    Weight distribution is definitely key here when I say the tires are surely not entirely to blame. I am 6'2" 216lbs of mostly torso, so I know for a fact my frame carries a lot of weight and influence when riding.

    I have been working with a few different techniques while climbing involving both front and rear weight distribution. Most often I'm seated or riding hovered over the seat as I climb, though this proves exceptionally taxing over time. Today I tried a ride centered on pulling up out of the seat, hovering over the bars in line with the steering tube and using full weight support to follow the crank with every revolution, essentially creating a side to side bob with the bike and this yielded much more traction in front for good bite and less fatigue on climbs, but a few good slides from behind.

    I just ran into a guy at my LBS who specifically said Kenda Nevegals in front would offer the most grip for tough climbs and allow for more central weight distribution to get that back down. Also, tubless is definitely the project in the works right now, looking in a home mix several on here have suggested and tested.

  4. #4
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    It IS the tires. I have a Hardrock 29er that came with Fastracks and they are slippery. On clean hardpack, they're great. Any mud or sand or loose soil and it's slippin and slidin time. I replace mine with Kenda Nevegals. They are great. Some say they roll slow and I can't disagree with that but man they make muddy, sandy turns manageable. I love them. Trying one up front is a great idea. Less rolling speed compromise. But don't be afraid to go all in and put one in the back if you're still slipping.

  5. #5
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    Glad to hear from someone riding the same rig, always makes a difference. I am definitely going to try different tires and see how that feels (I didnt mention a friends Trek Mamba with Bontrager super tread tires have not had this issue for me). The Kenda Nevegals seem like the riders choice for grip, despite the groans of speed loss.

  6. #6
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    well not exactly the same, mine's a 29er but certainly very similar and pretty much the same tires. I did notice the slower rolling of the Nevegals at first but I don't notice it now. And like I said, the traction increase more than makes up the slower rolling - in my opinion and for the way I ride. I like the confidence they give.

    If I were you, I'd one just on the front first and see what that does for you. The two tires have two different jobs. I don't spin out on climbs with the Nevegal on the rear like I used to with the Fastracks though.

    Good luck!

  7. #7
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    Totally didn't realize I put 26"...definitely a 29er

  8. #8
    Formerly of Kent
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    What pressure are you running in your tires?

    Yes, it matters.

  9. #9
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    I do realize it matters greatly. I have actually been working on figuring out the "Right zone" for psi on these tires. I have tried low pressure for climbing, 10-20, and Ive also tried high pressure being 35-50. I've experienced several flats as well, so I definitely think I need to pin down the correct PSI

  10. #10
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    Tubeless helps, and you'll never get any traction out of these tires running them at 50psi. Or most other tires, for that matter.

    I'm significantly smaller than you are at 5'6", 145lbs, but I run 22f/24r, as measured using a presta-specific, digital gauge. And I run semi-slicks like the Specialized Renegade on the rear of my bike.

  11. #11
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    Fast Trak of that tread design is a good tire, however it is an fast rolling XC tire...and it looks like u have the cheapest version of it. That's ok though because that's how OEMs ship bikes.

    If u r 216lbs geared up and tubed, i'd say you would want to run no less than 30ish. You really have to pay attention to how close to bottoming out, if it seems too close then add more air.

  12. #12
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    Tried setting these up tubeless and got absolutely nowhere... Not sure what went wrong.

  13. #13
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    You are going to have to provide more detailed information. What method did you use, what went wrong, etc.

  14. #14
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    Guerrilla tape down the center of the rim, installed stem, taped over that and everything is air tight visually.

    Mounted the tire and filled it with some of the brew I made consisting of:
    Latex mold builder
    EG coolant
    Slime
    Glitter
    Water

    Bead appeared seated, no liquid leaking out
    Tried pumping and got absolutely nowhere from there. The bead doesn't appear to be holding at all, which I've heard others have issue with either because the tire isn't correct for this approach or pressure doesn't build fast enough to truly make a seal, much like a car tire where it has to be set instantly to hold the bead.

    The Flak Jackets have a lot of give and fold and I'm also wondering if this has anything to do with this issue too.

  15. #15
    MaverickMotoMedia.com
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    Try a WTB Bronson: it has aggressive side knobs, but is fast rolling. It will help make up for the lack of suspension comliance up front and deliver better grip.
    Maverick Moto Media Motorcycles, Mountain Biking & Social Media Mgt
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  16. #16
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    Try some specialized captains, they grip much better than the fast traks and are not as slow as the nevegals. My first "real" bike was a hardrock with those same tires, I went everywhere with it. The tires were definitely not the grippiest.

  17. #17
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    Use a compressor, or, barring that, use a tube and inflate the tire as you would normally.

    Then, pop the bead on ONE side. Remove tube, reinstall tubeless valve. Ditch the flak jackets. Make sure that the bead is still seated on that one side.

    Reinflate. You should hear a nice loud pop. Don't go over 35-40psi.

    If you can, find tubeless valves with removable valve cores. This helps get air into the tire, faster. Barring that, troll around the local shop, and ask if they have any old road tubes with removable cores in the trash from recent repairs. I'd bet they do. That's what I use for all of my tubeless wheels.

    Also, use a compressor, if available.

  18. #18
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    If u r rolling over loose stuff mostly then Fast Trak is not ideal as it is mostly for hardpack type stuff.

    Also the the first 2 images are of a different tread than the last image of the tire on the bike which is the current and better tread design.

    EDIT: Also Kulhavy won his olympic gold medal with a Fast Trak for a front tire so technically it is a legit tire :P. (Just a fun fact)

  19. #19
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    Another thing to consider if the compound of your tires. I am certain that the bike comes with the "sport" level tires that have a 70a compound. A majority of the specialized tires with the control casing have a 60a compound and the purgatory features two compounds. Twentynineinches.com reviewed the Purgatory as being dead solid on chunky stuff and rolling as well as the Ground Control tire. Just browsing forums and reviews, the Panaracer Rampage is said to be great on rocks, roll better than a Nevegal, and last longer. Even my LBS recommended the Rampage or Purgatory for very rocky terrain around Santa Barbara and having a Ground Control Rear.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Use a compressor, or, barring that, use a tube and inflate the tire as you would normally.

    Then, pop the bead on ONE side. Remove tube, reinstall tubeless valve. Ditch the flak jackets. Make sure that the bead is still seated on that one side.

    Reinflate. You should hear a nice loud pop. Don't go over 35-40psi.

    If you can, find tubeless valves with removable valve cores. This helps get air into the tire, faster. Barring that, troll around the local shop, and ask if they have any old road tubes with removable cores in the trash from recent repairs. I'd bet they do. That's what I use for all of my tubeless wheels.

    Also, use a compressor, if available.

    Went up to work today with the wheel setup and used our electronic compressor. It seated and the bead held. The air that was leaking has since visually stopped, though I'll give it 24 hours and dunk it to be sure. I have it set to 45 for this period to fill all possible sidewall space, but I'll drop it before riding.

    I will definitely hit my LBS for cores and even stems from trash, I'm sure they won't mind at all.

  21. #21
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    I have decided to go with a Nevegal in front as most of what I ride is steep, slow moving rock climbing, but I'll keep the fast trak in back for now and see how I like it.

    Side note, anyone use the CO2 quick fill chargers for tubeless? Wondering if the unfortunate event of blowout happens if those might be a safe bet.

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